First brake flush ever (Unintentional!!!)

[tcianci]

Just wanted to pass this on to anyone who gets sidetracked while doing an important job:

I got a call from my middle kid the other day, seems she lost her brakes in a panic stop. She says the guy in front of her stopped short and she hit her brakes but they went to the floor. She says at the last minute the brakes "caught" again and she stopped without hitting anything! (I'm chaulking this one up to her guardian angles!)
So, I left my job and took one of the guys with me and went down to where she parked her car. She had already called her sister for wheels since it was her intention to be undeterred from her shopping trip. It turns out she lost a rear brake line. So, I drive her car home and the guy follows in my truck.
That night, I put the car up on a jack and some stands and hit everything with Kroil and then say a little prayer, (it's a 16 YO olds so I'm working against years of Massachusetts winters). The brake lines spun right off, so I measured stuff and headed to Advance auto parts (It's 8 PM by now) and proceed to buy 3/16 inverted flare lines because the lines measured .187 and the fittings measured .560, so I thought I was dealing with standard threads and the like.
The guy at the parts store didn't seem to know his *** from his elbow, so I went with my selection of lines. Well, I get the lines home and put my glasses on and discover that they are 3/16 lines but they are bubble flare, so back to the store. The guy says not only are they supposed to be bubble flare but they're metric too. I questioned having a metric fitting on an American sized line but I have been more wrong than that before. So the guy tells me what I need ( I even brought a fitting with me to match up the threads and I didn't like the way the original fitting felt in the new bubble flare union but the guy assured me I had the right stuff now)
Well, first I was wrong, now it was his turn... The lines were right but the fittings on them were wrong and cross threaded as soon as I tried to make them up. I was ticked at myself and the guy by now, plus it was raining and it was getting late.
Fast forward to the AM, I went to a real NAPA store and the guy immediatly had the right lines, so that night I re assembled the car (I'm into this for about 2 hours so far). Well since it was getting late again and all my family was either asleep or slaving to their social schedules, I called it a night.
NOW, on night 3, I decide I will bleed the brakes, of course between the age of the lines and my crappy (no doubt Chinese) bleeder wrench, I end up buggering up the bleeder before I get it out, so I throw in the towel and call it a night. (Oh yeah, I think this was the night everyone wanted me to take them out for ice cream so, I was sidetracked again but it did taste good)
The next morning, I head to NAPA again and ask for either bleeder screws or wheel cylinders, by this time I wasn't fussy. So I get some bleeders and Today I decide to finish the job. Lo and behold the Kroil worked it's magic on the other bleeder so I left it there. I got my middle kid to do the pumping and started bleeding. Something wasn't right and I was chaulking it up to her rookie status as a brake pumper. I couldnt get a pedal and by now I had pretty much used up the Dot 3 I had. I stand up to think about things and see a nice puddle of brake fluid right below one of the flare fittings. Dumbo here forgot to make that one up! NOW that meant another trip out to get some juice. I didn't have the guts to show my face again at the NAPA for fear of looking like a total jerk instead of just a harried Dad/husband/business owner and weekend wrench. Off to Wally world, got the juice and completed the job without incedent. I can't remember when a simple thing like this ever fouled me up for so long, I thought I was going to have to turn in my man card and padlock the tool chest!
So, as some of you have read in my other posts, I don't believe in brake flushes but it seems like I've done my first one!

Moral of the story: Pay attention, stay focused, use a good parts store and ditch any left over parts before your wife asks about them.

 

[srmofo]

brake fluid is hygroscopic. Im gonna leave it at that. Im sure your couple of years of experience beats out all the knowledge of the guys that engineer brake systems and their fluids.

 

[tcianci]

brake fluid is hygroscopic. Im gonna leave it at that. Im sure your couple of years of experience beats out all the knowledge of the guys that engineer brake systems and their fluids.

C'mon, I don't want to go there... I have been to school, I know what hygroscopic means, I know that nowhere in my service manuals do they publish a specification for brake fluid changeout on any of my vehicles, I know that the line rusted from the outside and I know that the fluid that came out was as clean looking as what I put in, And If I'm a pretty good judge of age, I know that I was repairing, maintaining and hot rodding cars while you were still in diapers. (Didn't you read the part about me having to go back and look at the lines with my GLASSES on!) So, although I don't have the eyesight you may have, I have a few years on you and the experience to go with it.

Either you peddle brake flushes for a living, or just drank the kool-aide but you know, that's fine with me. All I know is that all the brake flushes in the world wouldn't have prevented the failure that this car experienced.

There's no doubt that automobiles are becoming more complex and stuff that used to pass the muster on old iron wouldn't fly on some of todays cars. I'm just maintaining that knowing what to frig with is just as important as what to leave alone.
Have a nice day.

 

[ptschram]

I used to agree with you on the topic of brake fluid flushes. Then, I went to work at a dealership where it was part of the every 60K service. What changed my opinion was the number of vehicles coming on for 240K mile service with original calipers.

Then I went to work at an indie Mercedes shop where I saw numerous examples of those cars with more than 250K miles and all original brake components.

The vehicles that I work on benefit greatly from brake fluid flushes due to the exposed surface of the pistons, flushing helps (doesn't eliminate) the corrosion on the inside.

Brake lines, should at the very least be painted if you expect them to last.

 

[Red Leader]

Turn in your man card? Most men probably don't even know how to replace a brake line - I don't. But I'll probably learn some day

I think you turn in that card if you ever refuse to keep learning.

It's always the boneheaded ones that somehow end up taking the longest. Been there done that

Kudos on the job

 

[banzaitoyota]

Having 40 year old Mazda's I have a real brake line tool, made by Fedhill; thay also make excellant lines.

 

[nhmercracer]

I think "ya done a good job there!".

 

[brownbagg]

I had a brake line rust in half on a three year old vehicle and it had never been in snow, never been in a city that had snow, never been north enough for snow ever to happen

 

[skeletonizer]

That sounds about like every project I attempt.

No plan survives first contact intact.

 

[cowboy73]

I've had to repair 4 brake lines on 3 vehicles in the past 6 months. I had to replace wheel cylinders on two of them. Damn bleeder screws.

 

[Mechtech]

Sounds like my day today.

Been getting a brake warning light in the Ion so decided to do an all around check, replace the pads, and paint the calipers. Two down in short order and take the wheel off for the third and find the leak. It's a seal for the E-brake and can't be fixed at home. So off to the store for a new caliper, hop in my Dodge Ram 4x4 and get ready to leave. Stop at the end of the driveway to check traffic and the pedal hits the floor. Put it in park and check underneath and there is brake fluid pouring off the front engine mount. Look under the hood and find that two of the three lines from the master cylinder have failed from corrosion. Great now I've got two cars with no brakes. Get one of the motorcycles out and get my part (finally). Now I just need to spend tomorrow bleeding the Ion and next weekend working on the Ram.

Brake jobs ****.

 

[Ric in Richmond]

I can do a brake flush in less time than it takes to get the wheels off.

Get one of these:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JFJM14/?tag=atomicindus08-20

and this:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000M6035O/?tag=atomicindus08-20

**** out the reservoir, fill with new fluid, I alternate between ate blue and regular. Start sucking until you get new fluid making sure mc never goes dry.

Done.

Then you can change your oil with the mity vac too....or **** the oil out of your diff, or lots of other uses.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I always wondered why brake lines were not stainless. I'm sure making a flare on stainless is a lot harder, but if they were stainless I'll bet there would be a lot less of them replaced.

 

[HICKS]

Willing to bet the line let go because of the old fluid (16 years?). It's not an opinion if brake fluid needs to be replaced with some type of schedule, it's a fact. Do you what you want, but thank God your daughter didn't hurt/kill anyone, or you for that matter.

Not trying to be a **** or 'go there' but you did say "So, as some of you have read in my other posts, I don't believe in brake flushes..." Maybe you learned something?

Heres a good read about brake fluid StopTech : Balanced Brake Upgrades

Heres the best thing since sliced bread for bleeding brakes. Bleeders / Single Adapter Bleeders -- Motive Products Online Store

 

[rodm1]

Use http://www.cunifer.com/ you will never have to replace them do to corrosion.

 

[PassnThru]

Internet forum rule #3492 - your thread has a 16% chance of heading in the direction you initially envisioned

 

[srmofo]

I have a few years on you and the experience to go with it.

unless you work on anywhere from 5-15 different cars, makes and models 6 days a week you most likely dont have the experience I do. Ive seen it all and heard it all from the naysayers. Have you ever seen green brake fluid? do you know why it turns green? Have you ever had a customer come in complaining of a soft spongy pedal even though they havent had any recent brake work done? Sure there are multiple things that can cause a spongy pedal, but I have fixed many spongy pedals simple by changing the ****** fluid out.

Its one of those things, do you wait until you have a problem and then pray that the bleeders open? or do you simple unscrew them every so often and change the fluid. Its cheap easy preventative maintenance that takes just a few minutes.

Im not trying to start a flame war with ya, just trying to help you see the light, but I know most of you old timers are stubborn in your ways though(rib jab)

oh yeah, good job on the repair. Personally I hate doing brake lines for some damn reason.

 

[galute]

My bikes all have a regular schedule of changing the brake fluid. It says in the manual flush every two years. I'm a little on the lazy side and don't always do it right on time but I do change it. It always improves pedal feel.

 

[justanengineer]

Internet forum rule #3492 - your thread has a 16% chance of heading in the direction you initially envisioned

Isnt that the truth! Congratulations on finally getting the job done, and I can completely understand how the small things can be painful. Popped brake lines can be a way of life in the Northeastern salt and I have seen my share on others' vehicles. Its the reason why I pressure wash the underside of my vehicles religiously year round, and luckily Ive never had a problem with any of my vehicles.

Regarding changing brake fluid, I can completely agree with your policy of not changing. After the thread a few weeks ago on this topic I pulled a sample out of the right rear of my truck and had one of our techs compare it to a new bottle sample in the lab. The results - 130k and 12 years had absolutely no effect on the fluid. Ive never so much as had to top off, nor have I had to bleed the brakes on either of my vehicles, and the fluid in the reservoirs and in that sample still looked new from the factory.

 

[PassnThru]

Internet forum rule #3493 - 16% is an overly optimistic number. Your actual percentage will be much less.
You will, in the end, wonder why you even tried.

 

[HICKS]

I can guarantee that your 12 year old 130k mile brake fluid is NOT the same as new. How did he (the "tech") compare new to old?

Brake fluids absorb water by design......Please do yourself, and the others around you a favor, and read up on brake fluid.

What kind of engineer are you btw?

 

[tcianci]

Great to see most of you got the intent of my post...how simple things can turn into a multi day cluster @%*&! I know the thread went where I didn't want it to go and I want to make one more point. There was a post where the guy said he had ancient brake fluid checked against new and found no deterioration. You can believe it if you want, I tend to believe it, but at least the guy had a "control" that is to say some sort of criteria by which to judge his sample. Other posts mention the benefit of fluid changes because they have seen many cars go 200,000 plus miles with original brake parts and attribute that to fluid changes. In their example, there is no control, there is no identical car, subjected to identical conditions other than the lack of brake flushes, to compare to. So it is not a reliable or scientific observation. Could it be possible that an identical car subjected to identical conditions could last just as long without the brake fluid flushes, Sure it could, but that assertion is just as unscientific as that of the folks who attribute longevity of brake components to fluid flushes.
So, while I may never "see the light", I'm pretty comfortable doing things they way I have always done them and getting the results I expect. And to the poster who wondered if the line would have failed, had I "properly" maintained my brakes through flushing, Like I said, the line was rusted beyond recognition in the area where it failed, it just looked like **** and if anything I should have caught it through a visual inspection of the brake line. That's why I replaced both rear lines while I had it up and inspected the remaining lines under the body of the car. Tomorrow, I will take a close look at the lines up front.

 

[WRX/Z28]

The simple truth is this:

Brake fluid DOES attract and absorb moisture. Absorbed moisture DOES lower the boiling point of brake fluid. Boiled fluid DOES create gas bubbles in your brakes. Gas bubbles DO compress when pressure is applied. This under best case scenario will cause a mushy pedal, under worst case scenario can cause brakes that fade and require much more foot power to apply the same stopping force as they heat up. This reduces stopping distance, and even more so will reduce EXPECTED stopping distance.

If you are the type of person that says "Eh, the car slows when I push the pedal down, it's good enough." I hope i'm never the guy in front of you in a panic stop.

I'm the guy that says good brakes could be the difference between collision damage and no collision damage, or worse yet, hitting someone or not hitting someone, especially in a panic stop.

What does flushing your brakes cost you really? $10-20 in fluid and a couple hours of your time? Is that really what you're trying to save? Especially when it's a car that someone you love drives?

You may think we (or I) are being dramatic, but facts can't be disputed.

Mac tools just had a special on a brake fluid tester that specifically tests for moisture content. It's a far more common problem than you might think.

Just because you can get from point A to point B on bald tires without crashing, doesn't mean bald tires aren't a safety issue. Contaminated brake fluid is no different.


*** BTW, what kind of "deterioration" was the guy looking for? Hydraulic fluid doesn't "deteriorate" like motor oil... it simply absorbs moisture, dirt and other contaminents. The blue car in my signature just got a flush and the fluid had a black tinge to it on the passenger side from it eating the rubber brake line over 20 years or so. The car only has 54k on it... I promptly replaced the line and caliper just for piece of mind. Fluid, Caliper and Brake line cost me $35 total, and took an hour and a half to do with beer breaks in between, and more BSing with my buddy than actual working...

 

[WRX/Z28]

Regarding changing brake fluid, I can completely agree with your policy of not changing. After the thread a few weeks ago on this topic I pulled a sample out of the right rear of my truck and had one of our techs compare it to a new bottle sample in the lab. The results - 130k and 12 years had absolutely no effect on the fluid. Ive never so much as had to top off, nor have I had to bleed the brakes on either of my vehicles, and the fluid in the reservoirs and in that sample still looked new from the factory.

Compared how? In what lab, running what tests? Care to divulge the details of testing? Did you boil the fluid while monitoring the temperature to ensure that the boiling point was in spec?

My BS 'O meter got pegged off the scale on this one...

 

[tcianci]

The simple truth is this:

Brake fluid DOES attract and absorb moisture. Absorbed moisture DOES lower the boiling point of brake fluid. Boiled fluid DOES create gas bubbles in your brakes. Gas bubbles DO compress when pressure is applied. This under best case scenario will cause a mushy pedal, under worst case scenario can cause brakes that fade and require much more foot power to apply the same stopping force as they heat up. This reduces stopping distance, and even more so will reduce EXPECTED stopping distance.

If you are the type of person that says "Eh, the car slows when I push the pedal down, it's good enough." I hope i'm never the guy in front of you in a panic stop.

I'm the guy that says good brakes could be the difference between collision damage and no collision damage, or worse yet, hitting someone or not hitting someone, especially in a panic stop.

What does flushing your brakes cost you really? $10-20 in fluid and a couple hours of your time? Is that really what you're trying to save? Especially when it's a car that someone you love drives?

You may think we (or I) are being dramatic, but facts can't be disputed.

Mac tools just had a special on a brake fluid tester that specifically tests for moisture content. It's a far more common problem than you might think.

Just because you can get from point A to point B on bald tires without crashing, doesn't mean bald tires aren't a safety issue. Contaminated brake fluid is no different.

You're barkin up the wrong tree, This post was about how I flubbed up a simple job not to argue folks maintenance views. Although I would be interested in seeing any information published by an automobile manufacturer specifying the fluid flush intervals for any of the following vehicles: '86 Ford Ranger, 96 GMC Jimmy, 96 Olds 88, 2000 GMC Sierra, 2007 GMC Yukon. I can't find it in my service publications.
Additionally, if you're operating a car with anti-lock brakes and you can routinely get the antilock brakes to operate on a dry road, you're generating more than enough force with the brake system to lock the wheels, then the antilock system takes over to counter the wheel lock up and provide additional directional control of the car at the expense of stopping distance. If you can cause the vehicle to do this, it doesn't make any difference if you have virgin brake fluid or cat piss in the lines. It's working. If you're ******* are in a knot because someone takes issue with your pseudo-science, so be it. So calm down, and go flush you're brake fluid again.

 

[Skin]

So it is not a reliable or scientific observation. Could it be possible that an identical car subjected to identical conditions could last just as long without the brake fluid flushes, Sure it could, but that assertion is just as unscientific as that of the folks who attribute longevity of brake components to fluid flushes. So, while I may never "see the light", I'm pretty comfortable doing things they way I have always done them and getting the results I expect.

Not to jump on the pig pile but what more do you need than the vehicle manufacturers recommending fluid changes? I think GM is the one exception to this rule but Ford, Suburu, BMW, Honda etc... all recommend a fluid change once every ~30k or so.

 

[WRX/Z28]

You're barkin up the wrong tree, This post was about how I flubbed up a simple job not to argue folks maintenance views. Although I would be interested in seeing any information published by an automobile manufacturer specifying the fluid flush intervals for any of the following vehicles: '86 Ford Ranger, 96 GMC Jimmy, 96 Olds 88, 2000 GMC Sierra, 2007 GMC Yukon. I can't find it in my service publications.
Additionally, if you're operating a car with anti-lock brakes and you can routinely get the antilock brakes to operate on a dry road, you're generating more than enough force with the brake system to lock the wheels, then the antilock system takes over to counter the wheel lock up and provide additional control of the car at the expense of stopping distance. If you can cause the vehicle to do this, it doesn't make any difference if you have virgin brake fluid or cat piss in the lines. It's working. If you're ******* are in a knot because someone takes issue with your pseudo-science, so be it. So calm down, and go flush you're brake fluid again.

That's the craziest bit of backyard science rationalization I've ever heard.

There are no intervals because if you test your fluid properly, and it comes up ok, there is no need to change it. It's generally cheaper to purchase the fluid, and flush it, than to buy the tester though.

If you started the thread with, "I test my fluid regularly with XYZ brake fluid tester, so I know I don't have to flush it." It would be a whole different thread right now.

Anti-lock brakes locking on a dry road often indicate a much bigger problem than contaminated brake fluid. This typically indicates improper tire wear, and poor traction capabilitys, possibly due to under/over inflation or suspension/alignment issues.


**** Normally I wouldn't jump on a pile like this, but there are potentially hundreds of thousands to millions of people that can read this, and the last rumor i'd like to see on any forum such as this one is "You don't need to flush or check your brake fluid at all"

Especially with such scientific statements as: I can get my ABS to kick on, so my brakes work fine, and "I had a lab test my fluid, and there was no deterioration at all"

 

[WRX/Z28]

Great to see most of you got the intent of my post...how simple things can turn into a multi day cluster @%*&!l

BTW, where did you think this thread was going to go with a title like that.

Notice your thread title doesn't say "I had a heck of a time repairing some brakes on my daughters car" or "I hate doing brake lines and brake jobs"

 

[bradweingartner]

crappy (no doubt Chinese) bleeder wrench

Emphasis mine. What is a bleeder wrench?

I'll assume you mean a flare nut wrench? I've noticed it a few times on this forum, people using flare wrenches on bleeders. I don't understand it. I've always broken them free with a 6-point socket and other than the occasional sheering off, never buggered any of them up. Once they are loose I'll go back to the flare nut wrench or just a box end for obvious reasons. Perhaps this is because I've never owned top-shelf flare nut wrenches? Either way, it's been working for me.

Also, if I know I'm going to be replacing a line, I just cut the damn thing off and use a 6-point socket on the fitting too.

But I'll tell you, old cruddy brake lines have to be one of my least favorite things to do, hands down. Especially up here in the salty rust belt.

 

[WRX/Z28]

Emphasis mine. What is a bleeder wrench?

I'll assume you mean a flare nut wrench? I've noticed it a few times on this forum, people using flare wrenches on bleeders. I don't understand it. I've always broken them free with a 6-point socket and other than the occasional sheering off, never buggered any of them up. Once they are loose I'll go back to the flare nut wrench or just a box end for obvious reasons. Perhaps this is because I've never owned top-shelf flare nut wrenches? Either way, it's been working for me.

Also, if I know I'm going to be replacing a line, I just cut the damn thing off and use a 6-point socket on the fitting too.

But I'll tell you, old cruddy brake lines have to be one of my least favorite things to do, hands down. Especially up here in the salty rust belt.

Some people have crazy shaped "bleeder wrenchs" to get to screws that are located somewhere the engineer didn't care if you could reach once everything was reassembled...

I have a few, but I rarely need them...

 

[tcianci]

Yeah my "bleeder" wrench is just a cheap 5/16 box wrench that I modified years ago with a little kink in the handle. It has been re- bent as needed over the years to get at various bleeder screws. You're right though, if it's possible the best bet to break them loose is a nice 6 point socket.

 

[Stick]

Although I would be interested in seeing any information published by an automobile manufacturer specifying the fluid flush intervals for any of the following vehicles: '86 Ford Ranger, 96 GMC Jimmy, 96 Olds 88, 2000 GMC Sierra, 2007 GMC Yukon. I can't find it in my service publications.

You aren't going to find a dedicated brake fluid service interval for any of those vehicles. I believe it falls under "Periodic Maintenance", ie. something that isn't on a dedicated schedule but still needs attention at some point. A lot of this has to do with local climates and other variables that can affect how often the maintenance is needed. A vehicle driven in Arizona is going to have vastly different maintenance needs than one driven in Michigan winters, or Pacific Northwest rainy seasons. By the same note, a vehicle that is driven on the track is going to have different maintenance needs than one driven to church and the store once a week by grandma.

It also has to do with making the manufacturer look good in studies like Consumer Reports, where total cost of ownership plays a factor in how well the vehicle scores. The more you can pawn off on a periodic maintenance schedule (ie. as needed) instead of scheduled maintenance, the lower the apparent total cost of ownership.

On a side note, I found this over on iATN a while back, and it seems especially relevant here:

An interesting note, I worked on the tech line for Bendix for 8 yrs, we tracked hydraulic complaints by vehicle make and then separated them by manufacturers that recommend fluid changes and those who say it lasts forever. Over 2000 hyd complaints, 1890 of them where attributed to automakers who say fluid lasts forever!

I don't know about you, but to me that says a lot...

 

[Camshaftcarb]

Brake lines do ****. Congrats on getting her done though.

And lots of domestic cars have been using metric threading all over for a very long time. A bit more convenient when it comes to nuts and bolts IMO.

 

[LawnDart79]

I see all the brake fluid flush "kool-aid" drinkers are out in full force sidetracking the thread. Next thing you know, we'll be getting a lecture on the importance of power steering flushes too!

To the OP, I usually have a similar experience as yours when I attempt plumbing repairs. It never seems to fail that nothing goes the way it should.

 

[srmofo]

I see all the PROFESSIONAL MECHANICS are out in full force sidetracking the thread. Next thing you know, we'll be getting a lecture on the importance of power steering flushes too!

meh, I only recommend those when the fluid is black and metallic looking. Personally I could give a rats *** if you have to replace a pump or rack for several hundred dollars because you left particulates floating around in it. Thats called job security.

Coolant,oil and trans fluid probably isnt important to change either. Diff fluid? Huge waste of money changing that **** too. /sarcasm off/Why is it important to to replace all the other fluids in your vehicle, but brake fluid and to a lesser extent, power steering fluid are not important?

Ill give you the benefit of the doubt and say if you look down in the brake fluid and its the normal color and theres nothing floating in it and then you check it for moisture, then I will agree with you. Yes there is nothing to be gained by changing it. But, I think the biggest thing you guys are missing is you are only comparing it to a very small selection of cars where you obviously keep an eye on things. Most drivers are not this way. Ill will start taking some pictures of bad fluid and start a new thread on it when I get enough. Maybe then you will see how bad brake fluid can and will get. Ill make it fun and post a poll too. My guess is you guys have never seen really bad fluid.

To the OP , this thread is kinda like your line repair job. Ironic, no?

 

[WRX/Z28]

Yup, us brake flush "kool aid drinkers" are right up there with those oil change and coolant flush kool aid drinkers...

So where did we sidetrack off the threads topic of "First brake flush ever (Unintentional!!!)"

 

[99LeCouch]

I flushed the brake fluid on our 2.5 year old Honda yesterday. It stops very quickly now, and the pedal is more easily modulated. MityVac 7201 made it a fairly quick 1-man operation.

Been there, had that happen to me with a broken brake line. Fortunately the line let go before I got out of Park. It was a long weekend piecing together new lines.

 

[Sureshot]

My observation from it is that I cannot believe how dead set against it some are.

It is an easy DIY job done at your convenience. Maybe get you under the car and notice another impending problem. Maybe use it for a little family bonding/teaching time.

Problems always seem to crop up at the worst possible time constrained places in our lives. I see that kind of tinkering as preventative.

Having a hoist in the shop has been awesome for myself. Hoist it up and observe, check for loose bolts, and future "issues". Much recomended if you can swing it.

 

[treasureseeker]

I have never seen water in brake fluid but have had to replace frozen calipers that have rusted which means the fluid did have water in it. I am studying for the brake ASE test at the moment and it has some interesting information. According to the Motor study guide the containments and moisture reside in the calipers and when pushing the caliper piston in to make room for new pads to open the bleeder first to not send the containments into the hydraulic system. I have seen lots of containments in master cylinder reservoirs. I think brake lines rust from the outside.

 

[Daedalus]

The blue car in my signature just got a flush and the fluid had a black tinge to it on the passenger side from it eating the rubber brake line over 20 years or so. The car only has 54k on it...

Been there, done that. First car I could afford had 175k. When I flushed the brake fluid it came out looking like something from a swamp. Just nasty. Minor leak in the seals. Later inspection showed pitted pistons too. I don't mess around with this stuff. I have the MityVac bleeder too and I use it.