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First time mig welding...

OCD

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I bought a mig welder, now I need to learn how to use it and practice practice practice!! Lol!!

The machine all set up, just need to figure out the fine tuning of the gas flow and stuff...

I got it fired up tonight, and splattered down my first blobs!! Couldn't find any scrap steel at home, but I had some aluminum chunks, so I started with them!! .35 aluminum wire and 100% argon...

Managed to stick two pieces together!! Please give any tips on how I can run the beads better... Any technique or technical advise would help!!

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Engine

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Looks like you're off to a good start. You might find it easier to learn how mig weld if you work with steel for a while before you spend a lot of time on aluminum. Steel is just easier and more forgiving, IMHO. Keep us updated with your progress.:thumbup:
 

jp828108

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I second starting on steel. I had an old Indy car fabricator for my first fabrication class in tech school. He made us all get some time on the TIG machines, and he made us start with aluminum. It was very frustrating and a lot of us struggled to get decent welds. It did make it much easier to switch over and TIG steel though. Learning some fundamentals on TIG also made switching to MIG a breeze in the park. I am by no means a welder, but a I can fuse some metal together sometimes.

It appears that the Aluminum is cleaned up pretty good, but it was essential that all of the oxidation is gone from it. If I remember correctly the oxidation has a much higher melting point than the aluminum which if left would make it hard to get started, and then would cause blowouts of the material. the classes I took also stressed using the correct wire brushes to clean up the materials, and having brushes dedicated to each kind of material you plan to work with to avoid contamination.

There are also some really good youtube videos out there that cover the basics. Depending on your learning style it may help to check them out.
 
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OCD

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Thanks guys, I will find some scrap steel for the weekend!! I'm a sucker for learning the hard way though!! Lol..

Looks like I broke rule number one right out the gate, I never wire brushed the material until after welding, to get the black soot stuff off... From now on I will clean before welding too... Will check out some youtube vids also, I want to see how guys/girls hold the gun when welding!!

I will post my practice projects as I make them, and will have a lot of questions!!...
 

MoonRise

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Yeah, practice on some plain steel.

Welding aluminum is 'different' than steel. With aluminum, generally you have to go hot-n-fast. As well as get it really-really clean before attempting to weld it. Clean of anything that is not actually aluminum, such as grease, oil, dirt, aluminum oxide, that sort of stuff.

(with steel, you have to remove the grease, oil, dirt, and iron oxide in any of its forms such as mill scale or rust before welding.)

Because ANY weld will turn out better when you are just trying to weld bare shiny metal. And some welding processes (cough-cough-TIG-cough-cough) will 'tolerate' very little that is not clean bare shiny metal when trying to weld while some other processes (cough- stick aka SMAW-sough) may 'tolerate' more 'crud' and still produce acceptable welds.

And I'll go a bit harsh here, based on just a few pictures over the Net (decent pictures, btw). Your welds were way to cold and you didn't achieve any sort of adequate fusion or penetration into your plates. See how the 'edges' of the weld bead (the "toes") are very convex and look almost like a water bead sitting up on top of a nicely waxed car hood? That is usually a sign of the filler wire melting and just sitting on top of the plate without the arc actually melting -into- the plate. AKA cold lap, aka inadequate fusion, aka inadequate penetration. Notoriously easy to do with MIG because the filler will almost always melt but getting the arc and weld puddle to melt into the workpiece is not quite so easy.

Tip: Watch the puddle of molten metal, and not the bright arc itself. You want (and need) the puddle of the molten filler wire to achieve a Zen state of Oneness with the puddle of molten workpiece metal, so that when the molten metal solidifies you have actually made a weld and not just squirted filler metal on top of the workpiece. :D

It helps a bit to mention what machine you are using, and the settings you used, when asking for help about how the welds turned out. You mentioned 0.035 aluminum wire and 100% argon, but which alloy wire? 5356 or 4043? (with aluminum, it matters a bit as most 'small' wire feed machines can not adequately 'drive' 5356 wire because of the needed voltage-amperage characteristics).

For 'small' wire feed machines, the usual shielding gas flow rate is 20 CFH (cubic feet per HOUR). Which should all be in your manual, so RTFM. :D

Info about welding? Read up on the Lincoln and Miller and ESAB websites. Tons of info there.
 

kkroger

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Gas Flow. 15-20 CFH, Voltage and Wire Speed dependent on Material, should be a chart for your welder... ON the machine somewhere.
 

jimgood

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If you are wire brushing aluminum, the recommendation is to use a SS brush that you don't use for anything but aluminum.
 
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OCD

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Yeah, practice on some plain steel.

Welding aluminum is 'different' than steel. With aluminum, generally you have to go hot-n-fast. As well as get it really-really clean before attempting to weld it. Clean of anything that is not actually aluminum, such as grease, oil, dirt, aluminum oxide, that sort of stuff.

(with steel, you have to remove the grease, oil, dirt, and iron oxide in any of its forms such as mill scale or rust before welding.)

Because ANY weld will turn out better when you are just trying to weld bare shiny metal. And some welding processes (cough-cough-TIG-cough-cough) will 'tolerate' very little that is not clean bare shiny metal when trying to weld while some other processes (cough- stick aka SMAW-sough) may 'tolerate' more 'crud' and still produce acceptable welds.

And I'll go a bit harsh here, based on just a few pictures over the Net (decent pictures, btw). Your welds were way to cold and you didn't achieve any sort of adequate fusion or penetration into your plates. See how the 'edges' of the weld bead (the "toes") are very convex and look almost like a water bead sitting up on top of a nicely waxed car hood? That is usually a sign of the filler wire melting and just sitting on top of the plate without the arc actually melting -into- the plate. AKA cold lap, aka inadequate fusion, aka inadequate penetration. Notoriously easy to do with MIG because the filler will almost always melt but getting the arc and weld puddle to melt into the workpiece is not quite so easy.

Tip: Watch the puddle of molten metal, and not the bright arc itself. You want (and need) the puddle of the molten filler wire to achieve a Zen state of Oneness with the puddle of molten workpiece metal, so that when the molten metal solidifies you have actually made a weld and not just squirted filler metal on top of the workpiece. :D

It helps a bit to mention what machine you are using, and the settings you used, when asking for help about how the welds turned out. You mentioned 0.035 aluminum wire and 100% argon, but which alloy wire? 5356 or 4043? (with aluminum, it matters a bit as most 'small' wire feed machines can not adequately 'drive' 5356 wire because of the needed voltage-amperage characteristics).

For 'small' wire feed machines, the usual shielding gas flow rate is 20 CFH (cubic feet per HOUR). Which should all be in your manual, so RTFM. :D

Info about welding? Read up on the Lincoln and Miller and ESAB websites. Tons of info there.

That wasn't harsh at all MoonRise, I appreciate the honesty... That's the only way I am going to learn, thank you!!

I see what you mean about the water beading effect, I didn't think that looked correct!! Your tip was awesome!! I need to get comfortable with the gun, I am probably holding it to far away too!!

I kinda jumped the gun with this thread, but was so excited!! :lol:

The wire is 5356, a sample reel came with the machine... The manual calls for the gas to be between 20 - 30cfh, I have it set at 30...

Here's a pic of the machine,

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It's 230v 20 amps, output is 20 - 160 amps...

Setting it was on,

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A lot of the settings have built in parameters, you just dial in the material thickness and the welder compensates as you go... I figured it might be easier to learn on a machine that does half the work...

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One thing I really like is the auto darkening helmets... When young and dumb I had a couple stick arc flash hits, and to be honest that intimidated me from welding... I do need to get some good gloves today, and a welding hat, I have already singed some head hairs... :lol:
 
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OCD

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Gas Flow. 15-20 CFH, Voltage and Wire Speed dependent on Material, should be a chart for your welder... ON the machine somewhere.

I am going to turn the gas down a bit, had it at 30...

If you are wire brushing aluminum, the recommendation is to use a SS brush that you don't use for anything but aluminum.

Thank you for the tip!! I had no clue!!
 

cre73

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Looks pretty darn good for a first weld especially on aluminum. Been welding for 20 plus years and still **** at aluminum with a mig.
 
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OCD

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Thank you Cre!!

I watched a bunch of youtube vids last night... I have a lot to learn, but have the passion to do it!!

I picked up some brushes yesterday, going to take jimgood's advice and label them for different metals!!

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Also took the advice to start with steel, found some cut offs to practice with...

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It looks like I should just take some flat stock and run beads to watch and learn the "puddling", get a good feel for the gun and feed...
 
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OCD

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The extension for the welding cart showed up yesterday... Damaged, so it's getting swapped out, but I installed it for now...

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I got a great deal on the cart, and the work top is nice, but that's about it... The whole layout is kind of wonky for machine access... It is also made in China, and the quality shows it... Good from far, and far from good!!
 

larry_g

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Do some destructive testing. Take that piece you did and clamp 1/2 in the vise and fold it at the weld. If you have no penetration it will be obvious. When doing your test welds on the steel do some shorter pieces that will be easy to bend. If you can bend and not break the weld then your doing OK. If your weld bead is sitting on top of the joint is will break easily.

lg
no neat sig line
 

dbabicky

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I've got the same cart and was looking at getting the extension for mine as well. What was the part # of the extension if you don't mind. Wasn't there a door on the front of the extension as well or was that the "damaged" piece of it ?
Now that I see it I really like the extension.
 
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OCD

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Do some destructive testing. Take that piece you did and clamp 1/2 in the vise and fold it at the weld. If you have no penetration it will be obvious. When doing your test welds on the steel do some shorter pieces that will be easy to bend. If you can bend and not break the weld then your doing OK. If your weld bead is sitting on top of the joint is will break easily.

lg
no neat sig line

Well, that test was a hard landing back to reality!! :lol:

Failed like a cheap tent!! Way to cold and a non prepped surface...

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I am putting the aluminum away, for now!!

20170218_161704_1487523475917_resized.jpg
 
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OCD

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I've got the same cart and was looking at getting the extension for mine as well. What was the part # of the extension if you don't mind. Wasn't there a door on the front of the extension as well or was that the "damaged" piece of it ?
Now that I see it I really like the extension.


Part # KRBC60TEXT...

https://store.snapon.com/KRBC60T-Welding-Workstation-Welding-Cart-Side-Cabinet-P887976.aspx

There is no door on the extension!! The top had a big gouge in it and one of the back corners is bent...
 

LXCam

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Is that table top aluminum? Looking off a phone so it's hard to tell. And good luck on learning to weld. Like everyone suggested practice with steel first. Aluminum is a royal PITA with a mig, specially just starting out.
 
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OCD

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Is that table top aluminum? Looking off a phone so it's hard to tell. And good luck on learning to weld. Like everyone suggested practice with steel first. Aluminum is a royal PITA with a mig, specially just starting out.

The table top is steel!! It does look like aluminum but I stuck a magnet to it!!

What's the part number on the welder?

MIG160i
 
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larry_g

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Well, that test was a hard landing back to reality!! :lol:

Failed like a cheap tent!! Way to cold and a non prepped surface...

20170219_095553_1487523472492_resized.jpg


20170219_095602_1487523470710_resized.jpg



I am putting the aluminum away, for now!!

20170218_161704_1487523475917_resized.jpg

Well that shows well what a bad weld is. I'm not by any means an expert weldor but I do know that there are some materials in the AL family as well as the steel families that are not weldable. So in your scrap pile do what you can to identify what you have so your not trying to weld materials that don't take well to the process. I found it a great help get and study a welding textbook from the used book store.

lg
no neat sig line
 

dbabicky

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Part # KRBC60TEXT...

https://store.snapon.com/KRBC60T-Welding-Workstation-Welding-Cart-Side-Cabinet-P887976.aspx

There is no door on the extension!! The top had a big gouge in it and one of the back corners is bent...

Thanks !! If you don't mind, what did you have to give for the extension ? I know what the main KRBC60T box/table goes for and what SO is asking for the extension but I got my main box/table for $500+ below cost due to the fact that I ordered it in July/Aug of 2015 and didn't get it until Jan 2016.
I want to see what my driver can get it to me for.
 

jp828108

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Well, that test was a hard landing back to reality!! :lol:

Failed like a cheap tent!! Way to cold and a non prepped surface...

20170219_095553_1487523472492_resized.jpg


20170219_095602_1487523470710_resized.jpg



I am putting the aluminum away, for now!!

20170218_161704_1487523475917_resized.jpg

Sorry to see your weld failed, but at least you are staying at it and switching over to steel to practice on. Just keep that welder feeding wire, and you will be busting out some strong welds in no time. And keep posting up your welds no matter what they look like. I'm sure people will chime in with ways to improve them or things to do differently.

jp
 
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OCD

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Some steel welds,

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These are "uphill" welds I tried, but the gun would seem to sputter out at times... Not sure what I was doing wrong...

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Made this with different angles for destructive testing!!

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Some of the welds even passed, I will post the pics...
 
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OCD

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Sorry to see your weld failed, but at least you are staying at it and switching over to steel to practice on. Just keep that welder feeding wire, and you will be busting out some strong welds in no time. And keep posting up your welds no matter what they look like. I'm sure people will chime in with ways to improve them or things to do differently.

jp

Thanks jp!! I am not giving up on this!! It's way too awesome!! I am going to keep watching youtube vids, asking you guys questions, and practicing as much as I can!!
 
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OCD

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Few more pics,

20170220_222812_1487661850108_resized.jpg


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My tack melted some of the material away, too hot and long?

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I have tried just holding the gun straight, and also doing "U's"... I might try small "E's" also to find my rhythm...

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jp828108

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looks like things are going better. Did you find the steel to be a lot easier to weld? A project that was done in multiple welding classes I took was running beads along a piece of plate. Start at the bottom and run a bead across. Then run another bead just above that one all the way up the metal. It looks like you worked on that some, but you might tray filling up an entire piece by doing that. Give you opportunity to run beads and practice your speed, and fine tuning wire speed.
 

LXCam

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The way I do my vertical welds is top down dragging. It won't blob on you doing it that way. Also I'm sure you know this but figured I'd say something just in case you didn't know. Once you get your base settings adjusted, you want it to sound like a rattle snake when running your bead. So you're pretty close because I'm not seeing too much splatter but I think if you played with you wire speed settings a little more and listen to the weld you'll get better results.
 

kkroger

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The way I do my vertical welds is top down dragging. It won't blob on you doing it that way. Also I'm sure you know this but figured I'd say something just in case you didn't know. Once you get your base settings adjusted, you want it to sound like a rattle snake when running your bead. So you're pretty close because I'm not seeing too much splatter but I think if you played with you wire speed settings a little more and listen to the weld you'll get better results.

Depends on how thick but a J shape stroke on Vertical Up with a pause on the long side and a pause on the short side and kinda quick across the middle works on THICK material, on Thinner stock starting at the top and dragging radically DOWN will work, like a half inch stroke then bob up a quarter then down half etc until you get to the bottom... last I did that was on 16 ga...
For structural welds UP is generally preferred, though there is TONS of Vertical DOWN MIG out there... and it is pretty easy...
 
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OCD

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looks like things are going better. Did you find the steel to be a lot easier to weld? A project that was done in multiple welding classes I took was running beads along a piece of plate. Start at the bottom and run a bead across. Then run another bead just above that one all the way up the metal. It looks like you worked on that some, but you might tray filling up an entire piece by doing that. Give you opportunity to run beads and practice your speed, and fine tuning wire speed.


Yes, the steel seems easier to work with... I think the 3/8 flat stock I was using is a bit thick, so I got some thinner stuff...

Thank you for the tips, I really appreciate it!!
 
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OCD

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The way I do my vertical welds is top down dragging. It won't blob on you doing it that way. Also I'm sure you know this but figured I'd say something just in case you didn't know. Once you get your base settings adjusted, you want it to sound like a rattle snake when running your bead. So you're pretty close because I'm not seeing too much splatter but I think if you played with you wire speed settings a little more and listen to the weld you'll get better results.


I have had much better luck welding downhill!! I like the rattle snake comparison!! Mine can sure spit and hiss at me... I think I angered it...
 
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OCD

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I have a power cord question, need more length!!

The top plug is for the welder and plasma cutter... I put the ends on to match the wall plug I had for my lift...

The lower cable goes to the air compressor... What I want to do is hard wire about a 10 - 15 cable to the top box and then put 30 amp twist lock plugs on the end of it, and also the welder and plasma cutter...

20170219_150530_1487553291757_resized.jpg


Can I do that? I was thinking of using the same kind of cable I have for the air compressor, AWG 8, 300V FT1

20170219_150351_1487553296189_resized.jpg


GENPLUGKIT1_large.jpg
 

Cr0ck1

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I just started welding also. Its really not hard (mig) i found a couple good youtube vids snd self learned. Good luck.. heres some of my welds. Havent been welding long..fcd0ab01c2d4872492cc777120855c8a.jpg53e6c4fea83dd2db96111996f314eb2d.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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BreeStephany

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I have a power cord question, need more length!!
The lower cable goes to the air compressor... What I want to do is hard wire about a 10 - 15 cable to the top box and then put 30 amp twist lock plugs on the end of it, and also the welder and plasma cutter...

20170219_150530_1487553291757_resized.jpg


Can I do that? I was thinking of using the same kind of cable I have for the air compressor, AWG 8, 300V FT1

What is the rating of the circuit breaker which protects that circuit? Your conductors and plugs should be rated at or above the rating of the circuit protection.

You can do a hard wired cord, but is there a reason you don't just put a twist lock plug on the wall and then make up a cord?

For a cord, you should use flexible cord and not romex. SOOW or SJOOW are what I would recommend for making a cord. They are going to put up with use and abuse, whereas romex type cable is intended to be in protected spaces and is not intended to be used as flexible cable. The insulation just will not hold up.
 

racer-john

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Even with steel, where you are going to be welding, the material should be free of rust (shiny metal) top and bottom and edge. After grinding all the surfaces, some recommend using acetone to wipe down the surface prior to welding.
Keep practising. I like to hear the sound of bacon frying for proper set-up of the torch. Don't like snakes at all. Lol.
 
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