Flaring stainless brake lines

[pancho400cid]

Long story short... bought pre-bent stainless brake lines for the rear end of a 78 Trans Am which didn't fit right even with two attempts. These go from the hose to the two wheels and mount in clips welded to the differential housing.

I re-formed one of the "long" lines to make a short one. It fits pretty good but now trying to flare it, my cheapie double flaring tool - which has served me well in the past - won't flare the stuff. It's stainless steel, 3/16" OD, with a fairly thick wall. Do not know exact grade or exact wall thickness.

When I try the first "barrel shaped" flair the wedge just pushes the tube out without swaging it. What have you used successfully?

 

[ransil]

Get a better flaring kit, i have one of the hydraulic ones it does say not for stainless but i have done it.
Throw stainless away and get nickle copper line way easier to work with.

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[isb cornbinder]

Get a better flaring kit, i have one of the hydraulic ones it does say not for stainless but i have done it.
Throw stainless away and get nickle copper line way easier to work with.

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I have to agree. I never use stainless for brake lines because of the difficulty of forming. I do not know for sure, but I suspect the stainless will fail if subjected to vibration.

 

[CraigStu]

Get a better flaring kit, i have one of the hydraulic ones it does say not for stainless but i have done it.
Throw stainless away and get nickle copper line way easier to work with.

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Ni-copp from Advance or Autozone.

 

[bwringer]

Yep, you're either going to need to spend some long green on a high-end flaring tool, or switch to NiCopp. That stuff is soooooo easy to work with compared to steel or stainless. The normal manual flaring tool won't touch it.




And man, I hate it so much when people sell parts that don't fit right. Just a real ***-chapping moment.

 

[pancho400cid]

I'm thinking GM assembly quality may be part of the issue as in the clips and/or bracket that holds the central hose may be welded a little out of place.

Was mostly going with stainless for looks. I poked around and found some info on the HAMB and seems like high-dollar flaring tools are required as said.

The SS I've got bends easy enough, but the flare tool I have is no where near flaring it. I measured and the wall thickness is about .030".

Thanks for the input guys. Gotta weigh options.

 

[DGersic]

NiCop + stainless steel “spring” armor.



Made this one on Saturday for the drivers side of a 78 Malibu rear end. Probably about the same as what you’re working on, complete with the clip retainer things on the axle.



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[bad_idea]

I used inlinetube.com for my 79 Camaro. The lines fit great. Been in place for 10 years and going strong.

I would suggest you find a local hose shop and have them flare it for you. A shop that makes lines for heavy equipment.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Yep, you're either going to need to spend some long green on a high-end flaring tool, or switch to NiCopp.

Concur !

Eastwood carries some non-typical brake flare tools. I'll bet their $200 bench tool will handle it.

Their $44 "on vehicle" tool MIGHT work !

 

[6768rogues]

Try using a file and file down the end of the brake line just a little bit so the outside has a slight taper. It is stainless, so I doubt that you can flare it with a cheapie tool anyway. I never use stainless because it is too hard to work with and too hard to get it to seal. I like copper nickel.

 

[snyder]

When you flare stainless tube dont you just do a single flare?

 

[Firebrick43]

Number one with stainless is to NEVER use a tubing cutter to cut SS tubing, use a cut off wheel in a die grinder or something similar. Stainless work hardens bad and a tubing cutter really doesn't cut, it swages the tubing apart. Use a file to square up and as 6867rogues stated use a file to chamfer the out side edge. Also use a Weldon style chamfering tool in a drill to chamfer the inside.

Second, cheap flairing tools should not be used on any thing. The only good double flare tool I have used are the master cool hydraulic and the eastwood/fed-hill flaring tools. On single flares ridgid 377/345 and imperial rol flare are very good. I would personally use JIC/AN fitting with ferrules and single flares if you are stuck on stainless.

Third, as many have said, even as much SS tubing (industrial) that I have run, I use cunifer(coppernickle) for my vehicles, its a dream to bend(although I still use benders as hand bend look hinky)

 

[metlmunchr]

Listen to what firebrick says. Cutting SS with a tube cutter absolutely does work harden it, so you've got an uphill battle before you even start with the flaring tool. Typical SS brake line tubing is type 304 and its among the worst common stainless steels for work hardening.

While I use nickel copper tubing now, I have done one car in the past with SS. I used a Blackhawk (NAPA) double flaring tool I've had since the 60's. But, I used a Bernzomatic propane torch and annealed the last half inch or so of the tubing once it was cut. Needs to be heated to near white hot and then dunked in cold water. Austenitic SS does not harden from quenching. Then, once the first step is done, which forms the bubble on the end of the tube, I annealed it again before completing the flare. The tube is annealed before the first step of flaring because the tubing may or may not be fully annealed during the manufacturing process. Annealing does not weaken the tubing but rather just gets rid of the strain hardening induced from any forming operation including the initial manufacture of the tube itself.

I've built a lot of dies for manufacturing SS weld fittings and have spent a lot of time in the customer's plant. Basically, the fittings go thru multiple annealing cycles because each step of the forming process work hardens the material. Some of these fittings are formed in a 1000 ton hydraulic press, and depending on the severity of forming, some of them will form partially and then stop the ram. At that point, they go thru an anneal cycle in a giant gas fired furnace and then the forming is completed. SS is mean stuff to deal with any time you're basically trying to change its shape by mashing it into some different shape.

 

[pancho400cid]

DGersic - I literally think that line you made is the one I need - Looks good. A Bodies and F bodies have the same rear end I think? Why not send me that one and you can make another - LOL!

I already pulled the spring cover off the unusable stainless line and made sure I could pull it over the tube I bent up like you did apparently.

The pre-bent lines I bought are double-flared.

I have a Swagelock bender and agree the bends look much better than doing them by hand.

The flaring tool I have is OEM brand, and on cars where I was not worried about looks, I have bent a number of steel lines with good results.... But the"threads" in the clamping block won't take a bite in the SS like they do in mild steel lines... guess the block is too soft.

Oh, and I did use a tubing cutter. Never thought about work hardening, but have seen that from multiple sources now. I can switch to a cut-off whell.... one place recommended a hacksaw, which I could do as well.

Thanks a lot for the feedback all!

 

[rsanter]

I love stainless tubing but it can be a ***** to deal with sometimes.
I have made a bunch of stainless lines for cars and have broken MAC and SNAP ON flaring tools more than once.
I sold those off and upgraded to a hydrolic flaring tool and it works great.
I looked at the Eastwood bench one and I liked it but the hydrolic one could be used at the car and the Eastwood one cannot be

 

[SILVERPLATE]

The Eastwood bench flaring tool will flar stainless very nicely.

 

[DGersic]

DGersic - I literally think that line you made is the one I need - Looks good. A Bodies and F bodies have the same rear end I think? Why not send me that one and you can make another - LOL!


I already pulled the spring cover off the unusable stainless line and made sure I could pull it over the tube I bent up like you did apparently.

A lot of GM stuff interchanges. The rear end is 78 Malibu, under the back of a 37 Chevy, using a 69 Camaro rubber line between the frame and axle.

The stainless armor saved me on this one. Lost an exhaust hanger bolt somewhere along the Power Tour route. The exhaust was bouncing on this line. Armor got beat up, and the line got slightly oval shaped, but it didn’t get crushed.

Sure, I’ll make you one. You wait right over there, and I’ll let you know wh3n it’s done. ;-)





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[minytrker]

I had some cheap flaring tools and other brake line tools, re-plumbed a whole race car and every flare leaked when we turned up the pressure. Got mad and spent $1,000 on brake line tools and a hydraulic flare tool and was the best money I spent. Wow what a huge difference high quality benders, cutters, and flare tools make.

 

[c39er]

I've done quite a bit of stainless 3/16 to 5/16 using the Mastercool hydraulic set.
I always carefully trim and debur inside and out... a little Sil-Glyde lube.. never a leak.

 

[d.mcfarland]

NiCop + stainless steel “spring” armor.



Made this one on Saturday for the drivers side of a 78 Malibu rear end. Probably about the same as what you’re working on, complete with the clip retainer things on the axle.

That's nice. Good work.

 

[hotcargo]

...... the trick with flaring and double flaring stainless steel tubing of any size ....it must be annealed......I have been flaring stainless brake lines for well over 40 years , I use 304 22 gauge x 3/16 and use a Sykes Pickavant 027000 Flarer


cheers Steve in Oz