You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Foundation suggestions
- Thread starter Ron Shaw
- Start date
Its been longer than 2days. About 3weeks actually.Its been 2 days. What communication and response do you have from your contractor?
I don't know if its right, but I`ve been letting the head building department guy coordinate whats gotta be done between the GC and my engineer.
I don't think I`m a high priority? But the weather in Michigan has been lousy. If I don't hear from the building dept. guy by next week I`ll have to deal directly with my GC and engineer.
Its been longer than 2days. About 3weeks actually.
I don't know if its right, but I`ve been letting the head building department guy coordinate whats gotta be done between the GC and my engineer.
I don't think I`m a high priority? But the weather in Michigan has been lousy. If I don't hear from the building dept. guy by next week I`ll have to deal directly with my GC and engineer.
Having the building department involved is a good thing, seems they would want to make it right to cover their asses too.
That was my hope?Having the building department involved is a good thing, seems they would want to make it right to cover their asses too.
Update on my nightmare garage. I`m meeting with my GC and inspector tomorrow. The building department boss arranged the meeting. My GC has agreed already to pour and pin an additional 8in of footings. (per code and plans) He still is placing blame on me for the footing -block wall moving due to no back fill of 2ft below the top of the footing.
I think the site wasn't prepped (forms still on walls and top soil still needs removed)
So I may still have to take Legal action? I also decided (curiosity) to dig a trench to make sure the depth of the footing was correct. Michigan code is 42in.
The trench measured only 30in. I also have a soil compaction company doing a soil test at the same time as my meeting with the GC. Wish me Luck!
I think the site wasn't prepped (forms still on walls and top soil still needs removed)
So I may still have to take Legal action? I also decided (curiosity) to dig a trench to make sure the depth of the footing was correct. Michigan code is 42in.
The trench measured only 30in. I also have a soil compaction company doing a soil test at the same time as my meeting with the GC. Wish me Luck!
jack stand
Well-known member
Good luck Ron.
Sounds like a real mess starting at step #1 in the whole process.
Digging a footing with a walk behind ditch witch? WOW. I'd be surprised if a walk behind will even do 42".
Sounds like a real mess starting at step #1 in the whole process.
Digging a footing with a walk behind ditch witch? WOW. I'd be surprised if a walk behind will even do 42".
Good luck and hopefully the right fix is done. It’s empty brick so pushing it straight might be tough. Pouring a footing with a ditch witch is a joke. Even on good soil our footing is min 30” wide and 10” thick. More if you need the support.
With a footing that is too shallow and no real way that I can see to underpin properly I would be wanting it properly excavated and replaced. No half *** attempts. If your at all bothered by it and even if your not, don’t agree till your engineer is behind you.
With a footing that is too shallow and no real way that I can see to underpin properly I would be wanting it properly excavated and replaced. No half *** attempts. If your at all bothered by it and even if your not, don’t agree till your engineer is behind you.
Orionrising
Well-known member
Was the inspector refrece a public employee or a private guy you hired?
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
steveo1o9
Well-known member
Good luck Ron.
Sounds like a real mess starting at step #1 in the whole process.
Digging a footing with a walk behind ditch witch? WOW. I'd be surprised if a walk behind will even do 42".
apparently it can't as the OP only measured 30"...
It sounds like the contractor cut quite a few corners by coming up short with the excavation and footing width, both areas never to be seen again by the customer. Hopefully you have enough evidence in you favor to point fingers back at the contractor.
The inspector is employed by the township. But through a contract service.Was the inspector refrece a public employee or a private guy you hired?
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
The head building director is employed through the township.
I hope so. I have pics and home security video. Plus the inspector gave his approval? So I may have to go after the township also?apparently it can't as the OP only measured 30"...
It sounds like the contractor cut quite a few corners by coming up short with the excavation and footing width, both areas never to be seen again by the customer. Hopefully you have enough evidence in you favor to point fingers back at the contractor.
Orionrising
Well-known member
General the public inspectors are immune (maybe not in all states) contract inspectir could be liable maybe....
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
Update: The GC and inspector just left. Looks like I'm goin to court.
My GC refused to take any responsibility even after the building dept boss said that he and the GC agreed to repair the foundation per the engineers recommendations.
Plus when I pointed out that the footing was only 30in. deep, the inspector said it will be when you add dirt for your grade. I hadn't planned on adding grade since I have plenty of drop off and the style of split face cinder block isn't recommended to be below grade. Plus that didn't help over the winter when the footing was only 30in and it moved.
My GC refused to take any responsibility even after the building dept boss said that he and the GC agreed to repair the foundation per the engineers recommendations.
Plus when I pointed out that the footing was only 30in. deep, the inspector said it will be when you add dirt for your grade. I hadn't planned on adding grade since I have plenty of drop off and the style of split face cinder block isn't recommended to be below grade. Plus that didn't help over the winter when the footing was only 30in and it moved.
ard
Well-known member
In this case the plans said 42" deep footings. If the town inspector approved the excavations with the depth at 30", this isnt a minor little 'anyone coulda missed it' quibble....
OP, hope you are getting good legal advice.
OP, hope you are getting good legal advice.
I talked to a Lawyer. He suggested I get an estimate on getting the foundation fixed and/or replaced. He also suggested getting another structural engineer to give a recommendation of repair, that's willing to go to court. (first engineer will not go to court) I have found another engineer.Anymore updates?
Once I have the foundation estimate, give the GC one last opportunity to fix the foundation per the engineers recommendations. If the CG refuses, then I can proceed with repairs and take GC to court to get re-embersed.
The plans only called for 12' wide footing. The GC did 8inIn this case the plans said 42" deep footings. If the town inspector approved the excavations with the depth at 30", this isnt a minor little 'anyone coulda missed it' quibble....
OP, hope you are getting good legal advice.
The code is 12' wide x 42" deep. The GC did 30"
The plans only called for 12' wide footing. The GC did 8in
The code is 12' wide x 42" deep. The GC did 30"
Good luck in your fight. I would be tearing the foundation out and having a proper one dug. They would be paying for it. Not a bunch of underpinned bs. Make sure you report this to a better business bureau or similar and do what you can to make sure people do not use him.
Is this a fact or opinion?the inspector is never at fault, the fault would be the builder
If its not partially the inspectors fault, why is his boss (building director) trying to help mediate this?
Thanks. I have the paperwork from the state to revoke his builders license.Good luck in your fight. I would be tearing the foundation out and having a proper one dug. They would be paying for it. Not a bunch of underpinned bs. Make sure you report this to a better business bureau or similar and do what you can to make sure people do not use him.
I!m going to use it as leverage (hopefully) to get this resolved.
Is this a fact or opinion?
If its not partially the inspectors fault, why is his boss (building director) trying to help mediate this?
because that his job, he there to document that it meets code, he not there to design or ramrod your job. he independent so he out of the loop of responsibility. City inspectors never take responsibility
Thanks. I have the paperwork from the state to revoke his builders license.
I!m going to use it as leverage (hopefully) to get this resolved.
Good for you. As a small contractor I hate to see this sh!t and always pisses me off when you see hacks doing bad work.
Really sorry to hear about all this. Just want to throw out a possibility to discuss with the engineer in case he doesn't suggest it. Seeing as how you have a high water table (so do I) and given the additional challenge of fixing a footing that isn't below frost depth, I think a Frost Protected Shallow Foundation (FPSF), is something to consider to solve the foundation depth issue. It really wouldn't require anything more than insulation. It does nothing to resolve the foundation size or soil problem, but it can solve the freezing problem. Best of luck on this.
jack stand
Well-known member
Thanks. I have the paperwork from the state to revoke his builders license.
I!m going to use it as leverage (hopefully) to get this resolved.
This is a bad deal for all, esp you.
I wouldn't be happy but settling for the engineer's recommended fix may be a better bet (actually happening) than going for a complete "do over".
A pic of this sure would be nice.
ard
Well-known member
1. There **may** be situations where the inspector bears legal responsibility. Usually both the local government agency AND the inspector are shielded- but there CAN be situations where they act in a manner that creates legal responsibility. (like the inspector took a bribe, or the boss guy took a bribe and forced the inspector to OK it.) your attorney should be able to answer this in 5 minutes- or less.
2.
I assume you mean "to begin the long process that might end, eventually, in a revocation of his license."
If a new tear out and rebuild is $20k, this guy will just fight fight fiight. In the end he knows that a year from now, when this is finally adjudicated, he can settle- and retain his license. He isnt gonna pay NOW, just to keep his license clean.
Just my opinion- hope Im wrong
You may wind up 'investing' your own money, and fight for it over the next 1-2 years.
*****
2.
Thanks. I have the paperwork from the state to revoke his builders license..
I assume you mean "to begin the long process that might end, eventually, in a revocation of his license."
If a new tear out and rebuild is $20k, this guy will just fight fight fiight. In the end he knows that a year from now, when this is finally adjudicated, he can settle- and retain his license. He isnt gonna pay NOW, just to keep his license clean.
Just my opinion- hope Im wrong
You may wind up 'investing' your own money, and fight for it over the next 1-2 years.
*****
So if it dose not meet code, what is the inspectors next step?because that his job, he there to document that it meets code, he not there to design or ramrod your job. he independent so he out of the loop of responsibility. City inspectors never take responsibility
In responce to #11. There **may** be situations where the inspector bears legal responsibility. Usually both the local government agency AND the inspector are shielded- but there CAN be situations where they act in a manner that creates legal responsibility. (like the inspector took a bribe, or the boss guy took a bribe and forced the inspector to OK it.) your attorney should be able to answer this in 5 minutes- or less.
2.
I assume you mean "to begin the long process that might end, eventually, in a revocation of his license."
If a new tear out and rebuild is $20k, this guy will just fight fight fiight. In the end he knows that a year from now, when this is finally adjudicated, he can settle- and retain his license. He isnt gonna pay NOW, just to keep his license clean.
Just my opinion- hope Im wrong
You may wind up 'investing' your own money, and fight for it over the next 1-2 years.
*****
The GC and inspector are "buddys" and the inspector has his own builders license. They have done work for each other. (conflict of interest)
ConCretin
Well-known member
So if it dose not meet code, what is the inspectors next step?
They will probably issue YOU a stop work order and if the work is not brought into compliance, the town could take further action against you. It's great if the inspector is trying to be helpful but his role is not to protect your interests.
In the town's eyes you are ultimately responsible the owner of the property for compliance with building codes. You can delegate that responsibility to a contractor and seek redress if they fail in their obligations as laid out in a contract.
I agree with others who have said you don't have much of a case against the town but you certainly seem to have a case against your contractor. Seek good legal advice but be prepared for a long and costly fight that may or may not be worth it in the end.
if the structral not to code, the city wont issue a certificate of occupied, so you have a sore thumb in the yard. power company wont hook power to it, Insurance company wont issure, when you sell you wont be able to sell.
builder, if he doesnt care about his reputation, he just walk away and claim bankrupt. If you take his license or try too, he just claim bankrupt
You can fire him and replace, but more money. who gc the job, you, then your fault, Contractor, he can claim bankrupt. so what do you do
engineer of record, see what will work, but it sounds like, start over
builder, if he doesnt care about his reputation, he just walk away and claim bankrupt. If you take his license or try too, he just claim bankrupt
You can fire him and replace, but more money. who gc the job, you, then your fault, Contractor, he can claim bankrupt. so what do you do
engineer of record, see what will work, but it sounds like, start over