Freeing Frozen Engine

[alabamavolvos]

I need some advice on getting this engine to break free. Background – Dragged a 74 Scout II out of a yard in 06 replaced plugs, wires , points and condenser, changed fluids and with a new battery it ran. #3 cylinder had burnt valves. Pulled head in sometime 2007 and had it rebuilt by local head shop. Started putting the head back on and the house move started. Fixed up and sold the old house, lived in a crack house for 8 months before buying 18 acres and a nice little house. Spent the last 3 years fixing the property for my wife to board horses and teach lessons . Now it’s time to get back to my projects. Pulled the Scout out of the back field where it has been sitting for several years. Seems I put the head on and new fluids but I didn’t put the spark plugs in the head.
Pulled the Scout this weekend put it all together and the motor (AMC L6 258) is frozen. Pulled behind a tractor and engaging the drive train would not break the motor free, just ended up dragging locked wheels every time the clutch was engaged. This is the first time I’ve run into a locked up motor and looking for methods to get it rotating again.

 

[bazzateer]

Pour diesel down the plug holes and leave a day or two. Then put a socket on the crank nut and a long lever and try turning it.

 

[nsmith01tx]

Yep, the way we used to do it amounts to the same thing ... mix oil and gas and pour it into the plug holes, let it soak, and turn it manually. Just be sure to drain the oil and refill before running the engine.

Pour diesel down the plug holes and leave a day or two. Then put a socket on the crank nut and a long lever and try turning it.

 

[cranejon]

a mixture of 50% automatic trans fluid and 50% acetone is a pretty good lubricator for freeing stuck metals. Shake well and pour in liberally.

 

[Cardboard Man]

Yes to all of the above, and make sure it's in neutral when you turn it over manually.

 

[dirttracker18]

I like crane's idea, I have just used ATF poured down the plug holes. Let it sit and try a manual turn over (socket and breaker bar on balancer).

Good luck and go slow on this.

 

[Capt Chrysler]

Good Luck!!!


I un-froze a flathead ford 35 years ago with spray 5-56.

Now I have a 271 hipo SBF stuck in my Mustang. I filled the cylinder up with ATF. Hell I filled the cylinders and intake up to the carb with ATF. After 4 years shes still stuck TIGHT! I still try once a month to turn her. But she won't.

Capt. Chrysler

 

[MGMatt]

Just like every one said use the rust penetrating lube of your choice, let it soak in. When you start to try and turn the crank, go slow. Rock it back and forth slowly don't force anything.
I had a similar situation last fall with a Giant Vac leaf loader. (6 years old with only 300 hours on the 4cyl kubota diesel) The cover/flap on the exhaust pipe rusted in the up position allowing rain water down the exhaust manifold into the cylinders. I pulled the glow plugs and filled the cylinders with PB Blaster and ATF and let it sit over the weekend. Worked it back nice and slow and now the machine runs like new.

 

[Aberdale]

All of the above are good starters and will work if the rust in the cylinder is light. If the Scout has a manual transmission, it might not hurt to put in in high gear and apply a load on it (such as parking it on a hill, or hooking a come-along to it to keep tension on the drive wheels while the penetrant is working.) If the penetrating lube doesn't do it within a few weeks of soaking, there are two other alternatives.

First, make a zerk attachment that fits the spark plug hole. I made one by cutting the top off a spark plug and tapping a pipe thread in the end to fit a zerk. Find a cylinder on the engine that is close to TDC. Install the zerk attachment and pump the cylinder full of grease. A grease gun generates about 20,000 lbs of hydraulic force, but does it in very small increments, so it will slowly drive the piston down, rotating the crank. Be careful to choose a cylinder at TDC, not the top of the exhaust stroke, or it will shoot grease into the intake as the piston goes down and valve opens during the intake stroke.

Then remove the zerk attachment and crank the engine over by hand to expel the grease back out the spark plug hole.

Option number 2 . . .
Remove the heads, clean the exposed part of the cylinder as best you can, and use a 4x4 and a sledge hammer, or a hydraulic press to drive the cylinder down.

I've used all of the above options on farm tractor engines that have been stuck for years. Most of it comes down to how much patience you have. I don't have much patience, and I plan to rebuild a stuck engine anyway, so I often end up with the options described above.

Dale

 

[alabamavolvos]

Thanks for the replys. I squirted PB Blaster in the spark plug holes last night and will try a breaker bar on the engine this evening. If not free I'll mix up something stronger. I'm hoping that the rust is light since the motor has been under a closed hood just no plug or carb for the last 3 years.

 

[Mikie]

All of the above are good starters and will work if the rust in the cylinder is light. If the Scout has a manual transmission, it might not hurt to put in in high gear and apply a load on it (such as parking it on a hill, or hooking a come-along to it to keep tension on the drive wheels while the penetrant is working.) If the penetrating lube doesn't do it within a few weeks of soaking, there are two other alternatives.

First, make a zerk attachment that fits the spark plug hole. I made one by cutting the top off a spark plug and tapping a pipe thread in the end to fit a zerk. Find a cylinder on the engine that is close to TDC. Install the zerk attachment and pump the cylinder full of grease. A grease gun generates about 20,000 lbs of hydraulic force, but does it in very small increments, so it will slowly drive the piston down, rotating the crank. Be careful to choose a cylinder at TDC, not the top of the exhaust stroke, or it will shoot grease into the intake as the piston goes down and valve opens during the intake stroke.

Then remove the zerk attachment and crank the engine over by hand to expel the grease back out the spark plug hole.I've used all of the above options on farm tractor engines that have been stuck for years. Most of it comes down to how much patience you have. I don't have much patience, and I plan to rebuild a stuck engine anyway, so I often end up with the options described above.

Dale

Sheer genius! I like it...

 

[rockchucker]

The best Penetrating Fluid I have found to date is Aero-Kroil.

Here...


http://kanolabs.com/


Pumping the Cylinder full of Grease is a method I have never heard of! I would have to agree 100% that this could work very well. What a mess to clean up but to each his own. Whatever works!

I still am looking for one of these for the removal of the Pilot Bushings/Bearings./ Same idea with Hydraulic Pressure and Grease...

 

[J Persons]

I still am looking for one of these for the removal of the Pilot Bushings/Bearings./ Same idea with Hydraulic Pressure and Grease...

Anyone that carries Leslie tools can get it for you.
http://www.lislecorp.com/divisions/products/?product=351

 

[rockchucker]

Thank you good Sir!

 

[boarderline]

try kerosene and diesel tipped into the bores leave a week ..works everytime

 

[freeskier]

have used the 4x4 and sledge on more than a couple motors with sucess

 

[oltruckag]

The best Penetrating Fluid I have found to date is Aero-Kroil.

Here...


http://kanolabs.com/


Pumping the Cylinder full of Grease is a method I have never heard of! I would have to agree 100% that this could work very well. What a mess to clean up but to each his own. Whatever works!

I still am looking for one of these for the removal of the Pilot Bushings/Bearings./ Same idea with Hydraulic Pressure and Grease...

AeroKroil is AWESOME stuff - dare I even call it magic. It's pretty cool to spray it on one side of a fastener and see it weep out of the other side. I buy it by the case for our mechanics at work


As for the pilot bushings/bearings - pack the end of the crank full of grease and use a wooden dowel with the same diameter as the ID of the bushing/bearing. A few taps with a hammer it's out.

 

[mikeceli]

Wait till late at night. Attach a strong chain to the Scout and your tow vehicle. Tow it on the highway, with your buddy in the Scout.

Once you hit 80 MPH, your buddy should put it in 2nd gear and "pop" the clutch. This works best after consuming alcoholic beverages.
















JUST KIDDING!

 

[ihredo4]

I have used all of the above and got varied results from them. I have also used Coke to break down the rust and have even had to light diesel/acetone mix on fire followed by a wood plug just smaller than the bore and a big sledge. For the antique tractors I will fill the cylinder with a concoction and hang a bucket of water on the hand crank handle to apply pressure to the crank. Sometimes one will work and at other times it takes all of them to work.

I would be more concerned about what the mice have taken into the engine at this point. You know the damage that they can do.

Good luck

 

[sstruckguy]

The best Penetrating Fluid I have found to date is Aero-Kroil.

Here...


http://kanolabs.com/


Pumping the Cylinder full of Grease is a method I have never heard of! I would have to agree 100% that this could work very well. What a mess to clean up but to each his own. Whatever works!

I still am looking for one of these for the removal of the Pilot Bushings/Bearings./ Same idea with Hydraulic Pressure and Grease...

I have always used a proper size punch, grease and a hammer for pilot bushing/bearing removal.

Anyway, back to the problem at hand, if I had machine work invested in an engine, and had this issue, I would pull the head again and "see" what has it locked and attack it from there.

 

[tdkkart]

For the antique tractors I will fill the cylinder with a concoction and hang a bucket of water on the hand crank handle to apply pressure to the crank.

Dad's neighbors used to play with 2 cylinder JD's. Whne they got one that was stuck they'd fill the cylinders full of diesel fuel or other favorite concoction and let it sit there outside the shop door in high gear. Every day when they walked by it they'd grab the rear wheel and rock it back and forth a few times. Eventually it would come undone, I never saw one that sat there very long.

 

[bookman51]

I would think it not stuck badly but never know. Pulling it as you did is an invitation to damage the clutch. Fill it with about any of the above mentioned fluids and let sit. An oak 4x4 and hammer can work, and so can the grease zerk trick. Still, I would bet on it not being stuck bad, so fluid and patience. If those does not work, take off the head and see what it looks like before proceeding. Good luck. Nice to save one of those old Scouts.

Bookman

 

[RPH]

Brake fluid, just don't get it on the paint.

 

[justanengineer]

Stuck engines? My FAVORITE thing to do, and have done plenty. The above suggestions are good, but may prove futile. Pulling it is a good idea, but likely you forgot a simple step, to tow it in REVERSE. Many engines wont budge in forward gear being pulled forward, but they will break free in reverse being pulled forward due to the position that that the crank is in when it froze. Basically you are trying to rotate the engine opposite its normal rotation. I wont go into the physics of it, but its definitely worth a try. Make sure you pull all spark plugs first to lower the compression/make it easier to break free.

I would NEVER pump grease into an engine, and if you have to beat the pistons out, be sure to replace pistons and do cylinder work if its an engine you care about.

 

[tcianci]

It's interesting that no one has even considered other things that could cause an engine to appear frozen such as stuck belt-driven accessories or stuck valves. Even if the main "stuckage" of your engine is a piston, you can't rule out bending push rods or putting a hung up valve in the way of an approaching piston just because you have been able to ovepower the biggest frozen part. Make attempts to not only lubricate the bores but also the valve train and work at the thing gingerly.

 

[Capt Chrysler]

Wait till late at night. Attach a strong chain to the Scout and your tow vehicle. Tow it on the highway, with your buddy in the Scout.

Once you hit 80 MPH, your buddy should put it in 2nd gear and "pop" the clutch. This works best after consuming alcoholic beverages.
















JUST KIDDING!

Note to self: If you have added fluid to the cylinders remove the spark plugs, before towing!!

 

[compman25]

You could get a 24 volt charger and after soaking cylinders with some type of lube hook it up to starter. Has worked for me in the past.

 

[kbs2244]

The Redneck solution has always been Coke.
And it works.
We used it on a Ford 390 in a station wagon
It had an auto trans so we couldn't push or tow it.
We pulled the plugs, filled each cylinder with Coke and came back next week.
The starter cranked it over.
There was Coke all over the place.
Some well placed rags in advaance of cranking would have helped,
but I don't think anyone expacted it to work.

 

[Moose-LandTran]

Now I have a 271 hipo SBF stuck in my Mustang. I filled the cylinder up with ATF. Hell I filled the cylinders and intake up to the carb with ATF. After 4 years shes still stuck TIGHT! I still try once a month to turn her. But she won't.

Don't take this the wrong way, but isn't it possible that one (or two?) cylinder is stuck and on the compression stroke so no valves are open so no ATF in the cylinder? (If the valves are sealing well enough to prevent any ATF seeping through.

 

[BigE]

The best Penetrating Fluid I have found to date is Aero-Kroil.

Here...


http://kanolabs.com/


Pumping the Cylinder full of Grease is a method I have never heard of! I would have to agree 100% that this could work very well. What a mess to clean up but to each his own. Whatever works!

I still am looking for one of these for the removal of the Pilot Bushings/Bearings./ Same idea with Hydraulic Pressure and Grease...

Be careful using that trick on pilot bushings and bearings. Some cranks have plugs that can be forced into the oil pan that way. Then you're pulling an engine to fix it.

 

[stafford]

Ya gott a just be really patient and don't expect the any penetrating oil to do the trick over night. eventually it'll give way. On the pilot bushing, if it's a bronze type bushing you can screw a 5/8 tap into it and keep turning the tap it'll pull it right out.

 

[Capt Chrysler]

Moose-LandTran


I pulled the plugs first and topped them off. I was goofing around at the building one day and had an open bottle of ATF, sooooooooo down the Holley it went!

Capt. Chrysler

Might just have to tug on it this week end! After 25 years in automotive. I'm betting she's STUCK For GOOD!

 

[alabamavolvos]

Update - Engine broke free last night. Now it is time to drain all of the fluids that I've been pouring into the engine over the last several days. Add some fresh oil and see if it will start.

1st day PB Blaster
2nd - 3rd day Mix of ATF and Acetone
4th day Coke

Back has been bothering me so I installed the battery and would give it a turn evey evening after work. If it didn't budge another round of fluids.
Thanks for all of the input in helping me with my problem. Back to lurking until my next issue (which will probably be coming up shortly).

 

[Okie Pete]

I have used the grease gun method on a Maytag single cylinder engine. It is a headless engine and it worked great.
Glad to hear things are unstuck for you.

 

[MBfreak]

I have had good luck on a couple of frozen V8´s by using a hot water hose attached to the one side of the water cooling circuit on the engine and just letting real hot water flush thru for 30 minutes. This will expand the cylinder bores slghtly and it has helped. A hard pull on the crankshaft pulley bolt with a 1 meter breaker bar and voila!
There is ALWAYS a risk of frozen/damaged rings though on an engine that has been rusted up. Go carefully once you can turn it over and you might be lucky "honing" the cylinders with the piston rings.

Ola

 

[70redbee]

Marvels Mystery Oil.

 

[39 chevy]

PB Blaster works for me everytime, go slow, takes about 2 weeks, turn manually about every 3 days, always worked for me.