Frickin city codes.....GGRR

[97CV]

I have a schedule that DOESNT permit me to go the city building dept. I have searched their site online and got nothing.

Can anyone provide me with a few guidelines to follow in the planning stage. I live in SE Michigan. I am mostly concerned with the foundation/footings. I would like to get concrete quotes and cant with out these dimensions and or drawings. I am more right brain than left if you have diagrams of whatever advice you offer I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[zj96sc]

I have a schedule that DOESNT permit me to go the city building dept.

wtf does that say?

 

[67 455 Bird ragtop]

First you need to have a rough idea of what you want to build. Obviously you have a computer. There are plenty of good programs available, some for free, online that wil allow you to draw out your design so youi can take it to a plans firm to have it fully engineered. Then you can atart planning your project.

Do you have time to use a phone ??? Most places will gladly talk to you about your project. Tell you where to find forms online and such. Also, I'd recommend talking to a plans examiner to get feedback on the process in your area. This would also be a good time to discuss your project with a plans examiner to make sure what you want to do acceptable. They can also give you tips on how to avoid delays. At least my building department did.

And to be a little on the blunt side. If a project is important enough you will have to find time to take care of these details if you want a successful completeion. And if you can't the time you can always pay a GC to do all the leg work for you. But count on adding anywhere from 35-50% to the cost of your project.

Good luck ...

 

[Kevin54]

I would like to get concrete quotes and cant with out these dimensions and or drawings.

To get a concrete quote for footers all you should have to do is get in touch with the concrete company of your choice, tell them the size of the garage that you are going to build, and they can fill YOU in with the details. Most if not all can tell you how deep to go for the frost line (be sure to ask if that is at the top or bottom of the concrete footer) then thay can tell you how wide the footer has to be and the depth has to be. Before I was thinking 12" wide for a footer but it may be 16" wide x 8" deep for the concrete. They can also tell you whether the footer can be dirt formed or board formed. Also any concrete contractor can give you that info. As far as a permit for the foundation, the last time I did it, I gave a detailed drawing (I used to be a draftsman) but all that was necessary was a sketch (hand drawn) with the basics showing how deep you were going, whether it was dirt or board formed, and the size of the footer, along with the height of the block on top, and what the top block consisted of. Some blocks are cored blocks filled with concrete and other places recommend termite blocks. Termite blocks are factory made solid top blocks. A simple CAD program that you can download for a 30 day trial is DeltaCad. It's plain and very easy to use. If you need any help on something like that, drop me a PM and I'll help ya out. I am also a Tool Designer and Tool & Die Maker, so I could sketch you up something a little more professional looking that just a hand drawing.

 

[toxicz28]

Can anyone provide me with a few guidelines to follow in the planning stage.

Guideline #1 Make the time to go to the local building department.
Gudeline #2 See Guideline #1

 

[700jfm]

Thats what I did I found a good concrete contractor and we used a stick in the sand to get it started, and I'm more then happy about how it turned out. I sat down and made a hand drawing later, and a permit what's that just kidding. But he knew what was needed for the slab in my area or zone.

 

[kbs2244]

It can pay in the end to hire a pro.

 

[boiler7904]

What town or county will have jurisdiction?

SE Michigan takes into account a big chunk of the state.

 

[97CV]

Romulus.MI.

thanks toxic..youre the 2nd most unhelpful person on the net.

hiring a pro to do much of this will take away from the building fund...I have lots of good people to help...I just need to do the leg work first.

Kevin54- Thank you for your offer.When I can actually use you I will differently PM you

 

[ni[x]it]

97cv, you can't have it your way every time.

Either you take the time to persue the city planning department yourself, or you hire a someone to do it for you.

I also find it very unlikely that you cannot make a phone call to the city, take a long lunch, or otherwise take the time to take your project seriously.

I find your signature oddly ironic.

Good luck with your project.

 

[700jfm]

I found it ironic also.

 

[PAToyota]

I have to agree with Toxic...

He put it pretty bluntly, but either you make the time to go find out what the codes and requirements are before you start the project or end up fighting your way through the rest of the process.

Unless someone on here is in the same town as you and has very similar conditions, basing your plans on their experiences is still likely to encounter differences that could affect the outcome. An hour to go down to the building department, get a copy of the codes, and talk to the building inspector for a bit is going to be well worth the time and money spent compared to ending up doing something wrong and paying for the mistakes.

 

[97CV]

Damn it...Alright...It's not like I was NEVER gonna get there I was just looking for a few guidelines think FIRST. know they make the laws and I have to build what they say I can.

The frustrating part is the lack of info on the web.....Ah medium/small town tech lag.

 

[67 455 Bird ragtop]

The very first thing you REALLY need to do is simply draw a rough floor plan of whet you want to build. Then call the building department and discuss your ideas with them to find any special "local" rules. The go from there in getting engineered plans drawn up. From there you can get good solid estiamtes from subs for various steps of the project. Once you decide if the plans are with in your budget apply for permits and go for it.

Trust me. It will take some time out of your normal schedule. I have been building my garage since just after thanksgiving. Doing some of the work myself. But saving $$ along the way. I'm in a holding pattern since I just had rotator cuff surgery last Thiursday. So heavy stuff is still several weeks out. But I hope to get back to painting in a cpl of weeks. I still doubt if my project will be "complete" by June. But I'm hopeful.

 

[toxicz28]

thanks toxic..youre the 2nd most unhelpful person on the net.

Sorry I couldn't the most unhelpful person on the net. I'll have to try harder next time.

I have to agree with Toxic...

Thanks PA!

 

[cdrewferd]

Damn it...Alright...It's not like I was NEVER gonna get there I was just looking for a few guidelines think FIRST. know they make the laws and I have to build what they say I can.

The frustrating part is the lack of info on the web.....Ah medium/small town tech lag.

You come on here asking what you should do first in planning your build. People tell you to figure out what kind of building you want and to then go talk to the building department and you get UPSET that people aren't helping you?

The only person that can help you come up with what you want to build is you. We can answer questions once you get started, but everything to get started is up to you.

 

[zj96sc]

ahh, i see what you meant now.

Well, there's no free lunch man. You need to go to home depot/lowes/whatever and buy some basic construction books, figure out what you want, what its going to take to build it, and then come up with some numbers.

You don't need to be getting any concrete quotes until your permit is approved anyway, unless if you know you're going to meet the codes, which I dont think you've got any grasp on.

If you're in over your head, there is a reason people pay other people to build stuff for them. If you want to go the DIY route, you're going to need to put in the mental energy and time to learn how.

 

[97CV]

I think what I meant to say and what was heard are 2 different things.

I have every intention of doing this in this order.

1 Go to city and see what they will let me build ( distance from property line,foundation type and depth )

2 Search lumber yards for ideas/packages on garages.

3 Decide on what I want it to look like and how big.

4 Aquire plans and costs of materials.

5 Pull permits and more leg work with materials and such

6 Now I have concrete needs in mind ( foundations and footprint ) Go for concrete bids for delivery.

Now I have NO intention of doing this half-assed. Im not looking for a substitute for real information. Im just looking for best guesses or previous experience on foundations and footings.

What did you need ? How did you do it ?

I can go to the DOB later I would like to have a ROUGH GENERAL idea on what I will need concrete wise for the foundation.

Can you have a pour only ? Does it have to be cinder block ? You know stuff like that.

I appreciate everyones input even if I dont like it.

 

[SteveU]

Start thinking about all potential uses of the building such as would you will ever want to put a lift in because it will have some effect on what you build in the way of slab thickness and ceiling height. When I bought my place it had a 100'x40'x14' pole barn which collapsed from snow load in 2000. I thought of rebuilding it with a lower ceiling to make it easier to heat but kept it at 14' instead even though at the time I didn't have a clue I'd ever have a lift in there and am glad I did. High ceilings will help also if you get into woodworking because you can pick up a 8' sheet of plywood & don't have to worry about hitting your lights with it. Standard garage packages will not be able to accomodate these things since they are mainly designed just to store cars in.

 

[toxicz28]

I can go to the DOB later I would like to have a ROUGH GENERAL idea on what I will need concrete wise for the foundation.

I hope this is less helpful than my first reply:
How do you know what you need if you don't know what you can put?


Go to the building department and ask them what you're allowed to have, what you need to do,and what is required to get a building permit. Unless there are Romulan Building Inspectors or Romulan homeowners who built garages lurking on the board, there is nobody here that can give you the answers you need. They are all in the Romulan Government center.

 

[carcruse]

Most building depts. in your area have handouts addressing the questions you are asking. you need to find time to go here. New code here now requires 42" footings for garages. Something other than blocks can be used above grade. I used forms above grade to accomplish the same thing the blocks do but with solid concrete poured as a part of the footing. You need to get the bottom of the walls above the ground some. Check with Carter Lumber in Monroe for package kits, they have good prices. If you were about 5 miles southeast, with my job, Iwould be able to tell you exactly what your city required.

 

[97CV]

Right right right...Carter was the name I couldnt think of.

Thanks.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Can you have a pour only ? Does it have to be cinder block ? You know stuff like that.

There are many different types of foundation/slab combinations you can do. Largely it depends on (1)You local building codes office, (2)the type of building you are planning on doing, metal, stick, etc., and most importantly (3) the types of soil in your area and the frost line.

Google is your friend here. try such things as "building foundation types" "monolithic slab" "poured building walls" and other building foundation types. You will get lots of information to help you in future decisions. Your contractor will have a preference and that will be based on his local experiences and successes and less than success cases (they worked, but not as good as he would have liked)

Charles

 

[97CV]

I have ...ugh...clay. Lots of it too. I dug a hole in the backyard 3' deep and still hit clay...My yard doesnt dry up til May.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

I have ...ugh...clay. Lots of it too. I dug a hole in the backyard 3' deep and still hit clay...My yard doesnt dry up til May.

Excellent base for a slab, much better than the organic soil many folks are stuck with building on.

Charles

 

[BooUrns!]

6 Now I have concrete needs in mind ( foundations and footprint ) Go for concrete bids for delivery.

Now I have NO intention of doing this half-assed. Im not looking for a substitute for real information. Im just looking for best guesses or previous experience on foundations and footings.

What did you need ? How did you do it ?

Can you have a pour only ? Does it have to be cinder block ? You know stuff like that.

I'm not sure where you are or what are the common building practices in your area. You mention cinder block so I presume you are in a temperate zone in the mid-lower US. Up here we typically build detached garages two ways: floating slab or grade beam on piles.
If settling due to soft clay soils are an issue then you could consider drilling and pouring concrete piles and pouring a grade beam on them with void form underneath to address frost heaving. That takes care of your footing, the rest comes down to slab and framing issues. Garage lumber packages are available from plces like HomeDepot etc. There are online concrete calculators that can help you figure out your total requirements if you decide on your dimensions. Call a local concrete supplier for prices.

Site coverage is typically the main issue regarding permits. What percentage of land does your regional authority allow you to cover up with your house and garage? What are the minimum setbacks from the laneway? From the abutting side yard line? Mnimum distance from house? Maximum height?Answer these things and you can figure out your maximum garage dimensions (see my thread on standard garage dimensions for recommended minimums) based upon the total size of your lot.

 

[97CV]

Can you shoot me a link ? That would be great.

 

[BooUrns!]

Google 'concrete calculator' ...