Furnance blower wheel replacement

[zmaxmotorsports]

I don't believe that's the correct PN, as it's bigger at 12" diameter x 12" long, but it is interesting that anyone can buy that part on Amazon for less than "wholesale"---$114 delivered.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00XBUAG1Y/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Are you getting an oem part or a chinese knockoff on amazon?

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

It happened last sunday at 6am. He came in sunday at 3pm, took old blower wheel out in 30 minutes. You are right Sir, he had to remove circuit board, drain trap, blower housing, motor, bunch of wires etc. He came back monday at 7pm, and finished everything by 8pm. His travel time is about 20-30 minutes each way. This furnance was installed in 2007.

He must not be as good as the guy who said he changed his own in 20 mins.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

The point I was trying to make is that the pricing for furnace parts is all over the map. You say $122 is "wholesale", yet it is even higher than Amazon, and you suggest the "retail" is $200. And you want nearly 2 hrs of expensive labor to order it and go pick it up. Isn't the cost of ordering it part of the markup? And don't those distributers have delivery men?

In reality, your true cost of that part is more likely somewhat less than $100, so you are making nearly $300 on just one part. Sure, time is money, but why should a consumer expect to pay you $100/hr to order a part and drive a van to the store?

This whole industry of punitive pricing based on how much can be squeezed out of a customer will eventually be its own demise, and yet another industry will be dominated by immigrants willing to work for a fair income. It's no wonder that so many customers are buying from big box stores that offer fixed pricing for most standard installations.

Okay lets say the part costs $100.00 just to make it simple.If the guy has to drive across town and try to find a replacement to fit and he ends up eating up an hr and a half between traveling and getting the part figuring most hvac shops are getting $100 an hr for labor depending on location,youre up to $250.00 at least in the motor not including the actual labor of finding the problem and fixing it.
The meter is running from the time the guy gets to your door till the time he leaves,that includes going to get your stuff.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Lowes charged me $150 to install a new water heater. That price included delivery of the new heater, removal/disposal of the old, plus the city permit. The installation was flawless---even the city inspector (who was a former plumber that installed over 1000 heaters) said he has seen no better. My wife said it took the installer about an hr start/finish, and he hauled that old 50 gallon away ALONE.

I had priced local plumbing shops and they all wanted over $500 (plus permit) for the same job. I don't know how Lowes can do it, but somehow it works.

Yeah those lowes installers are the cream of the crop! Gotta love those flex water lines and plasztic drip legs.
I had lowes and the homeless depot both soliciting my shop to do installs for them in the past before I retired.
They tell you what junk materials you get to use and what you get to charge,I told them both Id rather flip burgers at rotten rons before Id lower my standards to their level to have my guys do any installs for those hacks!

 

[Mike007]

@$400 you got off cheap....

After looking at the $480 in my flat rate book, Ive decided to add a 1/2 hour of labor into my price next time I update the book. It's based on 1-1/2 hours labor to acquire the wheel and replace it. I rarely travel less then 1/2 hour each way to get a part and I'm typically at the supply house a minimum of 15 minutes. There's almost no way I could pull all that off in 1-1/2 hours and be out the door.

 

[crabjoe]

I'm not in the business, but my parents were small business owners and I've got many friends that are in the HVAC, electrical and plumbing business... And I think you got a fair price. Like others that have already stated, there's way more to keeping a business a float vs what a consumer might think is a fair price.

BTW, I've helped some of my friends on jobs and sometimes, I tell them what their charged wasn't enough. It's not because of the actual problem being fixed but the working conditions... I hate going into some basements or crawlspaces ... even some homes ... to run wiring or pipe ... it's a freakin health hazard!

 

[Brian_WK]

Theres a big differance between a real service guy and an installer that just knows how to sell new equipment.
There are crooks in every trade.
Ive been doing this for a while,I dont remember ever seeing a flue is too congested code.

Its 4 fast and 6 slow.... Right after the 4 fast 5 slow for change the batteries in your thermostat code.

Brian

 

[exmaxima1]

If you can change out a squirrel cage and reinstall everything in 20 mins youre the fastest hvac guy Ive ever seen!

Yeah, well not every furnace is difficult to work on. My blower slides out on rails for maintenance (cleaning and lube), and has a plug. Not a big deal to swap a squirrel cage.

 

[exmaxima1]

Are you getting an oem part or a chinese knockoff on amazon?

Read the ad on Amazon: OEM OEM OEM

Remember that Trane/Carrier/etc don't make their own blowers, they buy them and have them packaged with their name on the box. In many cases you can buy a better part that fits the same role. Same way with the motor, capacitors, switches....

In my experience, the local HVAC guy installs whatever usable part he has on his truck whenever he can. He knows that many parts are interchangeable between brands.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

A repairman can't charge someone extra just because: 1) they don't know which part to carry.

2) their company doesn't equip them with enough/the correct parts

3) ie, they have to go and get parts and come back the next day just so they can charge someone double. That is unacceptable.

Companies like ADT, DIRECTV, TIME WARNER, SEARS, etc. have a set charge for a service call. Mostly $100.00 whether it is for an hour or five hours. Sears may be a little different but the last time it was $100.00 for the first hour.

This is why people need to ask a company about the bill when they call. The company should also be smart enough to ask for a motor type, serial number, model number, etc. at the initial call to get what information they can. If a company can't tell how much the labor is going to be from the start, the customer should call someone else.




$400.00 is way too much

HVAC service companies do not work that way. There is an upfront charge for the service call. It usually includes a set amount of time for troubleshooting. If the problem is not found in that time, there is an additional troubleshooting charge. Once the problem is found, there is the cost of the part and whatever the labor rate is per unit to make the repair. Going to the supply house for a part not on the truck is billed at service labor rate. If that means coming back at another date there is normally no additional service charge, but you still pay the labor rate. Some charge time to pick the part up if they're returning at a later date, some don't. It's about 50/50.

There is no truck on the planet big enough to carry all the basic parts you need.

Tommy

 

[exmaxima1]

Okay lets say the part costs $100.00 just to make it simple.If the guy has to drive across town and try to find a replacement to fit and he ends up eating up an hr and a half between traveling and getting the part figuring most hvac shops are getting $100 an hr for labor depending on location,youre up to $250.00 at least in the motor not including the actual labor of finding the problem and fixing it.
The meter is running from the time the guy gets to your door till the time he leaves,that includes going to get your stuff.

Clearly the guy is not an authorized service technician if he carries no parts and needs to go to an HVAC distributer to "find a replacement". The fault is on the customer that called the wrong guy to service his furnace.

 

[exmaxima1]

Yeah those lowes installers are the cream of the crop! Gotta love those flex water lines and plasztic drip legs.
I had lowes and the homeless depot both soliciting my shop to do installs for them in the past before I retired.
They tell you what junk materials you get to use and what you get to charge,I told them both Id rather flip burgers at rotten rons before Id lower my standards to their level to have my guys do any installs for those hacks!

No flex lines on my water heater. Pipes were perfectly aligned, and sweat joints were cleanly soldered. I can appreciate that a guy that specializes in water heaters would have the practice and skills to do this quickly and routinely. He had everything he needed on his truck, including the appropriate fittings, and even a stair climber hand cart to haul the old water heater out of my basement by himself. Of course it helps that I purposely ordered the same size water heater as my old one, but the installer still had to make some adjustments and he did an awesome job.

 

[exmaxima1]

Theres a big differance between a real service guy and an installer that just knows how to sell new equipment.
There are crooks in every trade.
Ive been doing this for a while,I dont remember ever seeing a flue is too congested code.

I tried to use a description rather than an actual code term. It's whatever it's called when the furnace turns on the flue fan and checks the back pressure before it activates the burner. You know what it's called, but are trying to make fixing furnaces sound like it's rocket science. You know better.

 

[Lassen Forge]

He had to order the right part, make sure it was the right part, install it correctly so it either didn't wobble or disintegrate when it was fired up, make 2 trips, have all the tools, etc. etc... You *might* have been able to do all that but not with the speed and efficiency (and knowledge of these units) that the tech has.

The question is this - if it was done wrong, or by someone who was not versed in the nuances of that machine, without the manuals to get it apart and back together and tested / adjusted, and it came a part and borked your HVAC system... would it have been worth it? If you had done it and accidentally stripped out a mounting bolt, and had to replace the now-broken part, who would have paid for the damage?

 

[exmaxima1]

The question is this - if it was done wrong, or by someone who was not versed in the nuances of that machine, without the manuals to get it apart and back together and tested / adjusted, and it came a part and borked your HVAC system... would it have been worth it? If you had done it and accidentally stripped out a mounting bolt, and had to replace the now-broken part, who would have paid for the damage?

Jeez, it's a blower motor on a furnace, not a Mercedes transmission or a heart implant. The things were built to be readily serviced or replaced. And if the service guy stripped/broke a bolt you'd never know the difference---until a few years later and he's not coming back.

My neighbor had the AC portion of his 12 year old HVAC system replaced recently. He paid nearly $4K and was very happy until a few years later when the A-coil sprung a leak. He quickly learned that the A-coil was NOT replaced when the guys installed the "new" AC unit, though he had contracted for a completely new AC system. Called the installers and they refused to cover it under warranty. It's hard to trust this industry when **** like that happens virtually every day.

 

[crabjoe]

Why isn't anyone complaining about a burger and fries that can be made at home for under a $1, costing more then $8 at the store? Shoot, they're not even delivering it for $8!

Dang it, McD shouldn't be charging close to $2 for a fountain drink, when I can get a 2 liter bottle for just over a $1!!

I got ripped off today.. Got a lunch special fried rice and it was $6+... I could have made it at home for under a buck!!

Business ... they need to pay for over head and still make a profit.... If not, you won't be having these discussions ... You'll be asking why you can't find someone to come and fix the problem. It's that simple..

 

[nadogail]

In addition to all the good arguments and comments posted here, please keep in mind that there are those who are trying to raise the minimum wage to $15, for anybody working for your service and parts provider. Also, add the overhead costs for the business.

Some of us have learned it is beneficial to learn some skills so that we can avoid having to drop our drawers and bend over every time something hiccups.

 

[Brian_WK]

I tried to use a description rather than an actual code term. It's whatever it's called when the furnace turns on the flue fan and checks the back pressure before it activates the burner. You know what it's called, but are trying to make fixing furnaces sound like it's rocket science. You know better.

Older furnaces aren't too complicated. But then again you can count the parts on them on two hands and feet. New stuff is getting beyond complicated. When I did the training for Carrier infinity Furnaces and Heat Pumps it was 4 days long 8 hour days. I left there with 3 specialty tools specifically for diagnostics on these. This training was open to anyone who had $6000 to spend.
HVAC is just like cars You can be mechanically inclined and get somewhere but if you aren't working on them day to day you will only get so far. The newer it is the more complicated they get. Also if the OP or any other person who said they feel like they over paid for a service that they feel like they could have done them selves for X amount of dollars then why didn't they? Yes there are Crooked HVAC guys out there along with Car Mechanics Concrete guys and General contractors and Bankers etc.

The OP was asking if he got ripped off some feel that that was a fair price. No need to bash on the industry as a general if you disagree.

Brian

 

[Mike007]

It's hard to trust this industry when **** like that happens virtually every day.

And what industry can be trusted? The bottom line is, most people are dishonest and "most people" work in every industry.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Clearly the guy is not an authorized service technician if he carries no parts and needs to go to an HVAC distributer to "find a replacement". The fault is on the customer that called the wrong guy to service his furnace.

The fault is not on the customer nor the servicing company. No one said he didn't carry any parts, just that he didn't have the one the unit called for. I don't mean to sound insulting, but I don't think you have a realistic idea of the variation in just ONE part from brand to brand or even from model to model within a single brand. Most companies do not service only ONE brand. There is absolutely no way to keep all the blower wheels, much less even a an "assortment" on your truck for just one brand of furnace or air handler. Authorized service company or not.

You also have to realize the service companies do not keep huge parts stock because they have to pay taxes on it.

Tommy

 

[volaredon]

the draft blower pooped the bed in my old furnace. i disconnected the wire harness & the 3 bolts that held it to the furnace, then started calling around to buy the part. no one would sell me the draft blower, as i didn't have a hvac license; had to go through licensed tech, who charged me $150 for the part & $175 for the "labor" (he was in & out of my house in 15 minutes).

total screwjob.

I agree. Why is HVAC like this while anyone can buy brake parts for a car, whether they know how to properly replace them or not???
HVAC industry pisses me off how they refuse to sell parts to anyone but "their own".... I had a long thrrad on here about that very thing back when my board quit and then 6 months later when my draft motor quit.

 

[Chevy-SS]

Hi guys.
Last week my traine xe90 start making horrible noise, because blower wheel broke down in 2 pieces. Anyway, I called hvac guy. He replace it for me for $400 part and labor. He didnt had part in his truck, so he came back next day with new part. Now, my question is: did he charge
me too much for this kind of repair? Blower wheel is 11" wide and 10 inches diametr. I think this part should be around $100, but I might be wrong.
Looking for your comments guys!

Sounds like you are somewhat knowledgeable and handy. This would have been a very easy DIY job.

So, your really had two choices:
A) DIY it for the ~$100, or,
B) Pay someone and fully expect to pay lots more

You obviously chose option B, whatever, good luck with it, it's fixed, life goes on.......

-

 

[mygarageone]

A repairman can't charge someone extra just because: 1) they don't know which part to carry.

2) their company doesn't equip them with enough/the correct parts

3) ie, they have to go and get parts and come back the next day just so they can charge someone double. That is unacceptable.

Companies like ADT, DIRECTV, TIME WARNER, SEARS, etc. have a set charge for a service call. Mostly $100.00 whether it is for an hour or five hours. Sears may be a little different but the last time it was $100.00 for the first hour.

This is why people need to ask a company about the bill when they call. The company should also be smart enough to ask for a motor type, serial number, model number, etc. at the initial call to get what information they can. If a company can't tell how much the labor is going to be from the start, the customer should call someone else.




$400.00 is way too much

And you know this because your a handyman and not a lic professional ?

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Yeah, well not every furnace is difficult to work on. My blower slides out on rails for maintenance (cleaning and lube), and has a plug. Not a big deal to swap a squirrel cage.

Wait till you get one thats been on there for many years and doesnt want to come off,Or one that bob homeowner mushrumed the end of the shaft on with a hammer before he decided to call ya .

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Read the ad on Amazon: OEM OEM OEM

Remember that Trane/Carrier/etc don't make their own blowers, they buy them and have them packaged with their name on the box. In many cases you can buy a better part that fits the same role. Same way with the motor, capacitors, switches....

In my experience, the local HVAC guy installs whatever usable part he has on his truck whenever he can. He knows that many parts are interchangeable between brands.

Most parts are bought in bulk period,no matter what the brand name.
Parts are not always built to the same spec though,thats why you shouldnt always buy based on price.
I prefer to buy parts from a local supplier,that way If theres a problem I can take it back to my supplier to deal with it fast. Indonesia is a long ways away when you have a warranty issue!

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Clearly the guy is not an authorized service technician if he carries no parts and needs to go to an HVAC distributer to "find a replacement". The fault is on the customer that called the wrong guy to service his furnace.

You show me a service guy in the electrical/hvac or plumbing trades that has every part for every job that pops up in the middle of the night.
I carry more stuff on my van than most contractors I know and I still dont have everything.
I could fill a full freaking service with nothing but boards for lennox furnaces,but then what do I do when somebody needs parts for a trane wreck?
Youre living in a fantasy world.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

No flex lines on my water heater. Pipes were perfectly aligned, and sweat joints were cleanly soldered. I can appreciate that a guy that specializes in water heaters would have the practice and skills to do this quickly and routinely. He had everything he needed on his truck, including the appropriate fittings, and even a stair climber hand cart to haul the old water heater out of my basement by himself. Of course it helps that I purposely ordered the same size water heater as my old one, but the installer still had to make some adjustments and he did an awesome job.

The lowes and hd installers around here use flex lines for installs.
Water heater sizes are differant than they were even a couple of years ,getting the same dimensions isnt very likely these days.
That lowes guy who specializes in water heaters also specializes in dw installs,toilets and disposal installs depending on what lowes is selling that morning.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

I tried to use a description rather than an actual code term. It's whatever it's called when the furnace turns on the flue fan and checks the back pressure before it activates the burner. You know what it's called, but are trying to make fixing furnaces sound like it's rocket science. You know better.

Fixing furnaces is a whole hell of a lot easier than it used to be before we had fault codes.
My guess would be that it would come up as an open pressure switch.
Theres no rocket science involved in fixing the majority of hvac issues,thats pretty obvious from some of the hack artists that Ive met over the years in the trade who somehow manage to get a mechanical contractors license in the city of omaha.
But theres a big differance between an installer who just knows how to bang tin together and an actual service guy who knows how to fix stuff at 2:00 in the morning.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Jeez, it's a blower motor on a furnace, not a Mercedes transmission or a heart implant. The things were built to be readily serviced or replaced. And if the service guy stripped/broke a bolt you'd never know the difference---until a few years later and he's not coming back.

My neighbor had the AC portion of his 12 year old HVAC system replaced recently. He paid nearly $4K and was very happy until a few years later when the A-coil sprung a leak. He quickly learned that the A-coil was NOT replaced when the guys installed the "new" AC unit, though he had contracted for a completely new AC system. Called the installers and they refused to cover it under warranty. It's hard to trust this industry when **** like that happens virtually every day.

And the same thing happens with plumbers/electricians/carpenters/roofers/mechanics/lawyers/doctors and every other profession under the sun.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

In addition to all the good arguments and comments posted here, please keep in mind that there are those who are trying to raise the minimum wage to $15, for anybody working for your service and parts provider. Also, add the overhead costs for the business.

Some of us have learned it is beneficial to learn some skills so that we can avoid having to drop our drawers and bend over every time something hiccups.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Older furnaces aren't too complicated. But then again you can count the parts on them on two hands and feet. New stuff is getting beyond complicated. When I did the training for Carrier infinity Furnaces and Heat Pumps it was 4 days long 8 hour days. I left there with 3 specialty tools specifically for diagnostics on these. This training was open to anyone who had $6000 to spend.
HVAC is just like cars You can be mechanically inclined and get somewhere but if you aren't working on them day to day you will only get so far. The newer it is the more complicated they get. Also if the OP or any other person who said they feel like they over paid for a service that they feel like they could have done them selves for X amount of dollars then why didn't they? Yes there are Crooked HVAC guys out there along with Car Mechanics Concrete guys and General contractors and Bankers etc.

The OP was asking if he got ripped off some feel that that was a fair price. No need to bash on the industry as a general if you disagree.

Brian

 

[crabjoe]

Ok.. Let's move onto a different subject...

I'm thinking I might want to increase my blower speed since I'm planning on adding a few new supply and returns.. (Plan on finishing off basement this coming year). My current blower is set for 1200 CFMs, and I'm thinking going to 1400 CFMs, which happens to be where my heat pump is most efficient (based on AHRI).

So what do you give think about me swapping out my current blower motor to a Rescue motor to get a bit more blower power? I know I need to make sure my duct work can handle it, but I'm not worried about that because I only need to increase the size on a small section of the main trunk ... furnace and new supply/returns are all in the basement..

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

And what industry can be trusted? The bottom line is, most people are dishonest and "most people" work in every industry.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Ok.. Let's move onto a different subject...

I'm thinking I might want to increase my blower speed since I'm planning on adding a few new supply and returns.. (Plan on finishing off basement this coming year). My current blower is set for 1200 CFMs, and I'm thinking going to 1400 CFMs, which happens to be where my heat pump is most efficient (based on AHRI).

So what do you give think about me swapping out my current blower motor to a Rescue motor to get a bit more blower power? I know I need to make sure my duct work can handle it, but I'm not worried about that because I only need to increase the size on a small section of the main trunk ... furnace and new supply/returns are all in the basement..

Are you trying to speed up the heating side or the cooling side? The furnace will only put out so much heat when its running.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I agree. Why is HVAC like this while anyone can buy brake parts for a car, whether they know how to properly replace them or not???
HVAC industry pisses me off how they refuse to sell parts to anyone but "their own".... I had a long thrrad on here about that very thing back when my board quit and then 6 months later when my draft motor quit.

It's not a "closed" industry. You can walk into Johnstone Supply any day of the week and order whatever you like.

The issue you ran into was going to a wholesaler that will not sell to the public. Any wholesaler for any other trade would treat you the same way unless you are a contractor or at least file a business license number with them.

Tommy

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Ok.. Let's move onto a different subject...

I'm thinking I might want to increase my blower speed since I'm planning on adding a few new supply and returns.. (Plan on finishing off basement this coming year). My current blower is set for 1200 CFMs, and I'm thinking going to 1400 CFMs, which happens to be where my heat pump is most efficient (based on AHRI).

So what do you give think about me swapping out my current blower motor to a Rescue motor to get a bit more blower power? I know I need to make sure my duct work can handle it, but I'm not worried about that because I only need to increase the size on a small section of the main trunk ... furnace and new supply/returns are all in the basement..

Most furnace motors are multi speed. You might be able to just use the next higher speed on your existing motor.

Tommy

 

[truckman5000]

Lowes charged me $150 to install a new water heater. That price included delivery of the new heater, removal/disposal of the old, plus the city permit. The installation was flawless---even the city inspector (who was a former plumber that installed over 1000 heaters) said he has seen no better. My wife said it took the installer about an hr start/finish, and he hauled that old 50 gallon away ALONE.

I had priced local plumbing shops and they all wanted over $500 (plus permit) for the same job. I don't know how Lowes can do it, but somehow it works.

Glad to here you got a good one.
The HD/ Lowes around here, have 100s of "open permitted jobs".
The cheapest people do the work.
You usually get what you pay for.

I do know what you mean, on what you have said before.
I always thought, this industry is a 70% overhead...Its more like 110% with this health care **** lol.

We get offended, because theirs tons of licences, you need 4 different ones.
Continuing education every year, fee's up the ***.
Treating your employee's like American's, all the ****..adds up.
Its kinda not worth it

 

[mygarageone]

Glad to here you got a good one.
The HD/ Lowes around here, have 100s of "open permitted jobs".
The cheapest people do the work.
You usually get what you pay for.

I do know what you mean, on what you have said before.
I always thought, this industry is a 70% overhead...Its more like 110% with this health care **** lol.

We get offended, because theirs tons of licences, you need 4 different ones.
Continuing education every year, fee's up the ***.
Treating your employee's like American's, all the ****..adds up.
Its kinda not worth it

All correct .

And now Michigan has some average home owners doing undercover work for them.
When they need some plbg work done , the home owner rates the plbg company and submits it to the state.

 

[crabjoe]

Are you trying to speed up the heating side or the cooling side? The furnace will only put out so much heat when its running.

I guess you can say speed up, but I'm not really thinking of it in those terms. I just want more air coming out of the registers.. I'm thinking if I add 4 more registers and a return in the basement, it's going to slow the air circulation. And being that the delta T is up in the high 20's, when on AC, I don't care if the split drops because of more air moving over the coil. Even in heat more, my split is like 20 degs when it's in the low 30s outside.

 

[truckman5000]

Depending on the year of the furnace.
You can increase the heating output.
Factory is Low speed on the blower motor control (red wire usually, or look at wire dia.)
You will have acouple other wire's on "park" terminals. Blue/ black/ yellow *depends)
You can put the blue wire (it will say blower heating med. speed)
So switch the red wire for the blue color.

Look at wire diagram on the back of the furnace door, for the color wires that do what. Its easy. Turn the power off 1st