Garage Computers....Is it too cold?

[robs400]

I recently got my old computer back up and running after the power supply failed a while back. I had since picked up a laptop so I figured its new home can be out in the garage. I live in New England tho, where below freezing temps are common this time of year.

Every person I mentioned this too said isnt it too cold out there? But none of them were able to give me a reason.

I did some brief searching on google and it looks like its not recommended, but it should be okay as long as there is not a lot of moisture.

Any good or bad experiences with cold temps and computers? Thanks!

 

[54FordPanel]

I keep a old iMac in the garage, couldn't do without it. I need Pandora!
It gets cold out there, but inside my garage it never freezes. I've had no problems with it.

If it's your new "old" computer, go for it.

I don't know if I would put a $2000 computer out there.

 

[YZ Rider]

I have kept a laptop out in my barn for awhile and it always runs fine, but if your worried about it breaking why dont you just carry it inside for the night if its cold?

 

[tncatadjuster]

If ambient is below 45º I turn a electric heater on and place it facing the side of the computer for a minute or two before booting up. Once started I remove it.

 

[robs400]

I have kept a laptop out in my barn for awhile and it always runs fine, but if your worried about it breaking why dont you just carry it inside for the night if its cold?

The computer I am talking about is not a laptop. This is an old desktop I built a few years back that rather than sit inside and serve no purpose I figured I could use it out in the garage. Carrying a desktop in and out is just one more thing to do that I dont want to do.

 

[Bender78]

I've kept an old laptop in my garage for a couple of years now with no problems. I don't run the heat much during the week and it sometimes does get below freezing in there.

 

[Rockerbox1]

if you keep the computer running all the time, no big deal. the problem comes in when a computer is left in a cold area (off) for a while then started up before giving it time to reach a warm air temp.
circuit boards etc are hard and cold, turn the computer on and it starts heating up which causes what???
that's right, condensation
moisture building up on sensitive computer components is not a good thing

 

[dmeadow]

My electrical engineer grandfather told me once that you need not worry about electronics getting cold. Heat is more likely to cause damage.

There are some mechanical devices your computer-- at least one fan, for example and a hard drive with a spinning disc, etc. These may be potentially damaged by condensation caused by temperature changes. However, if your computer is an old one that you wouldn't otherwise have a use for, just use it and if it dies, so what. Let us know how long it lasts.

I'm putting an old computer in my garage soon, as well. I'm more concerned about dust and flying metal particles getting in it than temperature changes.

 

[LEVE]

Don't forget the possibility of humidity and condensation build up inside the monitor and computer box. This may, or may not be dissipated during a warm up period. But it will, sometime, take a toll.

 

[nathank]

I've had a comp out in the shop for years. Although we usually only see mid 20s here for an absolute low in the winter.

I always leave it on. One time I came out and it was beeping like crazy. I think the keyboard decided it was too cold. I plugged in a diff keyboard and rebooted and the world was fine again.

 

[Rockerbox1]

Don't forget the possibility of humidity and condensation build up inside the monitor and computer box. This may, or may not be dissipated during a warm up period. But it will, sometime, take a toll.

my point exactly

 

[robs400]

if you keep the computer running all the time, no big deal. the problem comes in when a computer is left in a cold area (off) for a while then started up before giving it time to reach a warm air temp.
circuit boards etc are hard and cold, turn the computer on and it starts heating up which causes what???
that's right, condensation
moisture building up on sensitive computer components is not a good thing

I thought it was the cooling down of warm moist air that squeezes moisture out causing condensation? The computer heating up would help remove any liquid moisture present if I understand things correctly.

 

[dicaeala]

We keep tons of our computers in unheated buildings, and dust and dirt are bigger problems. The only concern we had was with flat screens and the cold, which hasn't been as a big a problem as we thought. That said, the manufacturer should be able to provide the minimum temperature the equipment is rated to run at.

 

[unpredictable1]

Even before the furnace, I have a PC in the garage that's several years old, that I never turn of - it used to run out there without issue when it was well into the negative temps.

I was sure to have a CRT monitor though.

 

[Chris Adams]

On computers in 'cold'.
As has been posted, cold is no problem, moisture in the air is.

ATX computers (everything made in many years) stay 'warm' all the time, even when they are shut off. There is a small trickle of power to the motherboard as long as it is plugged in, and power is available.
Ditto monitors.

I've had no problem down into the 20's.


For a heat source, rather than an expensive to operate heater, try a incandescent spot light, pointed more or less at what you want to keep warm.
Even a 75 watt will keep a target pretty warm over cold nights.

I leave a 100 watt spotlight pointed at my shop floor when the weather goes below freezing and it makes several degrees of temperature increase in a 672 square foot shop.

 

[vlpronj]

A few thoughts...

A CRT is probably your best bet.

Keep an eye on cables and vents - the heat generated may attract mice and insects.

Consider allowing your PC to shut down (Hibernate)or go to low power mode (Sleep) when not in use. Even if it isn't a laptop, you may find this in your Power setting in the Control Panel. This will save wear and tear on your hard drive from miscellaneous housekeeping duties.

If you have a network connection, you can even use a webcam to keep an eye on your garage when you're not there. This will pretty much rule out the previous suggestion, though. You can even use VLC or LogMeIn to control the PC (and view the webcam) without the hassle of setting up an IP address. Just leave Dorgem or some other webcam app running on your desktop, and view it remotely.

 

[tcianci]

if you keep the computer running all the time, no big deal. the problem comes in when a computer is left in a cold area (off) for a while then started up before giving it time to reach a warm air temp.
circuit boards etc are hard and cold, turn the computer on and it starts heating up which causes what???
that's right, condensation
moisture building up on sensitive computer components is not a good thing

Time for a quick stop by your old high school science book...moisture in the air does not condense on surfaces when you heat them up...it condenses on surfaces as they COOL. The reality is that every computer made has been specified for a storage and operating environment. The storage parameters are often much more forgiving than the operational ones. Somewhere in the puiblished specification for your machine, there are these numbers. Your very best bet is to put the thing out there, let it run. This computer I'm using right now hasn't seen a normally heated space in YEARS. It just sits out here in the garage, on the floor running. I would say than between the winter, nightly heat and summer temperatures, the machine is subjected to probably70-80 degree temperature swings. Also, a hard drive is a hermetically sealed unit and could care less about humidity. The things associated with a computer than can act up on you would be any drives with removable media i.e. floppy and cd drives. They are subject to dust and humidity changes. And if the amount of bondo, old paint dust, overspray and just general **** in this garage is any sort of an indicator, it takes a boat load of that stuff to bother the machine as well.
Set it up, let it run, you will be fine.

 

[LEVE]

VLC or LogMeIn

There's an even better program out there called TeamViewer.

It's free for non-commercial use and lets you have full control of the remote desktop as well as file transfers back and forth between machines. I'd used LogMeIn, VNC and RDP for years before I stumbled on this program. I dropped LogMeIn in a heartbeat.

CLICK HERE =>

 

[LEVE]

Yeah... I screwed that one up and re-did the URL... Sorry! I don't drink coffee... that's my excuse!

 

[mustangmccance]

I have a computer in my garage as said above and it works fine. leave it on all the time with a screen saver and the lcd will stay warm enough. at least I have had no issues with mine.
as I understand the issues with condensation they are the same as the ones inside my garage. when the garage is cold and you heat it up the air warms up hits a cold surface like my skylights and then it rains in my garage. you can see the same thing in a computer box differential heating. one area is warming up and the warm air hits the cold box and the water condenses. If you keep it heated you have less problems with condensation. dust on the other hand is a problem so you have to open it up and blow it out with a little compressed air occasionally.

this has been my experience anyway.

 

[tolken4]

As stated above: Cold surface/air meeting a warm (relativly high in moisture) air mass will cause the moisture to condense.

Warming up a device in a cold space will not cause this issue. However, leaving a laptop in a cold car over night and bringing it into a building will cause the issue others were worried about. This is still unlikely to cause any issues as internal PC power is DC and less likely to pop due to moisture. The converter on laptops is in the plug and I have never really seen this be an issue. IMHO

Moisture asside, computers love the cold. The heat of the summer is more likely to cause an issue as someone said. 20+ years in IT

 

[Rockerbox1]

ok, everyone wants to flame me for saying that they can condinstae... go for it, do what you want, but I have seen it happen.
not everything heats up evenly inside a tower, so as one component heats up upon starting the computer, and it cuses an idle component close by to condensate a bit, and then short out.... well don't say I didn't warn you

and please answer me this, if items condinsate on cool down only and not on warm up, why is it when I fire up the heater in my cold garage, my motorcycles all start to form condensation? they are all cold and as they start to heat up they condinsate.......

 

[Jononon]

on never turning it off. It's not the cold that will kill it, it's the transition from cold to warm.

 

[spongerich]

Heat and moisture are the enemies. Leave it running all the time to keep the temp constant and you'll be just fine.

I'd worry more about dust than cold, even in the house, I'm amazed how much dust ends up in my laptop. It's worth opening it up and blowing out the dust bunnies a couple times a year.

 

[lowbucktruck]

Humidity in your shop is probably helping to keep the static electricity discharges down. (one of the number one killers for computers) Computers like the cold.

Dust is more of a problem for computer systems. You can get and install dust filters for the air inlet vent on the front of your system, that will help. A computer acts like a small vacuum cleaner and ***** up all sorts of dust, dirt and pet hair.
The power supply probably failed because A) it was old... or B) drops in power to the computer while running power tools/equipment on the same circuit took their toll on the power supply. A small UPS (battery backup system) will help prevent that. If you have your computer plugged into its own clean circuit, less likely to be a problem.
Computer systems are generally fairly hardy and can run in less than ideal environments. I generally do not have a computer in my shop, except the laptop (which doesn't stay in there long).

 

[PSYKO_Inc]

One thing i would recommend is installing foam filters on any fans or case vents to keep out dust and debris. You can get pre-made ones for the case fans at most any computer parts store, or a website like newegg.

 

[willy3486]

A lot will depend on your location,temps,humidity,etc. Is there high moisture content in your area? How cold does it get in your shop? Something as simple as a light bulb over it could help. As far as my shop goes it sometimes does get below 32 but it has to be cold outside for a while. As far as my shop goes I unplug it even. All I use it for is to play mp3s. I have the mp3s backed up inside so if the shop computer goes I have a backup.

I have worked on computers for over 20 years. I have stored computers and parts out there a lot. I have no problems. If I was concerned about it I would probably leave it on constantly.They will create their own heat. I also live in TN so I don't usually see the cold you have. As far as mine I don't worry about it. All it does out there is be a music jukebox. So if it dies I just get another old junk used one, which I usually have a couple hanging around. Most of the time its easier to find a good used one under 50 bucks even than to repair one for the use I have. As far as computers goes they are a box of electronics,just like radios and TVs. So they will have the same issues probably. Yes the computer is more hi tech and sensitive but they still use electricity. With this in mind how has your radios,tvs and other electronics held up? Have you had them to die quickly out there?

And like others say the heat is what is the most damaging over cold. Another thing that may cause a issue as far as cold is the hard drive. One of the old tricks I use to get data off is to put a hard drive in the freezer overnight. I then get it the next morning and try to get data off. I have done this and I have seen frost form on the board of the drive,but it worked for a few minutes to get the data off. Sometimes it works to get data off a dying drive . What happens is that the disks in the drives will warp. The cold will cause them to shrink and flatten out. When they flatten the info can be read sometimes. What can happen in the shop if its off is that the cold will shrink the the drives and the constant turning on and cutting off can cause a "shrink and expand" effect on the drive. It can cause the drive to die sooner from this as compared to the computer left on in the shop all the time. As far as cold goes I think most server rooms I have worked in keep it from 55 to 65 degrees.

 

[robs400]

This is great! I never get this much feed back so quickly ha.

The power supply failed on my computer for other reasons...nothing to do with temps as when it failed it was inside my house. I then let it take up room for a year and recently decided it was time to try and fix it cheap (New power Supply) and repurpose it out in the garage so I can use it for music and searching the web.

I dont feel keeping it on all the time is practical, as I am not out there much this time of year..so I may just take my chances with it. As mentioned above, I'll just run it when I need it till I have an issue with it. I have some small filters on it for the fans and its easy enough to blow it out with some dry air every now and then.

RockerBox - not trying to flame you...we are just saying that condensation occurs when warm air that contains water vapor is cooled, the vapor becomes a liquid and forms condensate. An example of this is how your toilet tank will sweat on a warm humid day. The water in the tank is cool, and cools the adjacent warm moist air, and cools it enough that the vapor becomes a liquid.

In your case, the heater you are using is most likely producing moisture that is not seen until it hits something cold, where it will then do what has been described above.

Back on track - thanks for all the help guys

 

[jmh21586]

Put a heating pad on it if you're worried.

 

[m.james]

Probably fine where they are now.

 

[GMCAMARO]

Cold for the computer will cause no problems. It will however kill the battery quickly. It will also do no favors to the LCD screen. A CRT screen is fine.

 

[jduffle]

There's an even better program out there called TeamViewer.

It's free for non-commercial use and lets you have full control of the remote desktop as well as file transfers back and forth between machines. I'd used LogMeIn, VNC and RDP for years before I stumbled on this program. I dropped LogMeIn in a heartbeat.

CLICK HERE =>

Team Viewer is cool, I use it between my desktop, laptop, and net book at home. There is always that one file that you need and its on the "other" computer!

 

[jduffle]

This is great! I never get this much feed back so quickly ha.

The power supply failed on my computer for other reasons...nothing to do with temps as when it failed it was inside my house. I then let it take up room for a year and recently decided it was time to try and fix it cheap (New power Supply) and repurpose it out in the garage so I can use it for music and searching the web.

I dont feel keeping it on all the time is practical, as I am not out there much this time of year..so I may just take my chances with it. As mentioned above, I'll just run it when I need it till I have an issue with it. I have some small filters on it for the fans and its easy enough to blow it out with some dry air every now and then.

RockerBox - not trying to flame you...we are just saying that condensation occurs when warm air that contains water vapor is cooled, the vapor becomes a liquid and forms condensate. An example of this is how your toilet tank will sweat on a warm humid day. The water in the tank is cool, and cools the adjacent warm moist air, and cools it enough that the vapor becomes a liquid.

In your case, the heater you are using is most likely producing moisture that is not seen until it hits something cold, where it will then do what has been described above.

Back on track - thanks for all the help guys

Get you a handful of those silicagel packs that are in just about everything( since it comes across the big waters) and lay in the bottom of the computer case...Moisture problem solved! The company i retired from got automotive fans from an oversea company, there were silica packs as big as bean bags in the crate! i put them in my tool box in my metal storage building....moisture problem solved!

 

[Davi]

The only two problems come from grease in the HDD getting too thick or from condensation. I cant see it being too much of problem apart from the condensation as those with carputers aren't usually badly affected.

 

[tcianci]

ok, everyone wants to flame me for saying that they can condinstae... go for it, do what you want, but I have seen it happen.
not everything heats up evenly inside a tower, so as one component heats up upon starting the computer, and it cuses an idle component close by to condensate a bit, and then short out.... well don't say I didn't warn you

and please answer me this, if items condinsate on cool down only and not on warm up, why is it when I fire up the heater in my cold garage, my motorcycles all start to form condensation? they are all cold and as they start to heat up they condinsate.......

The reason the condensation froms on your bikes is that even though you're running the heat, they're still colder than the air you have heated. This is especially evident when you're using a non-sealed combustion type heater such as a typical un vented propane heater. Again, go back to the old science books. The by-products of good combustion are carbon dixode and WATER. Moisture laden air hitting a cool surface (like a motorcycle, for instance) will condense like a *******. If your understanding of the mechanism that causes condensation were true, your windshield would only get more and more foggy as you run your defroster.
Things do not condensate on cool down as you have stated, condensation forms on any surface that is cool enough for the moisture in the air surrounding it to condense out of it. That's why you have condensate drains on AC coils, as the air is cooled , it's ability to hold moisture is decreased. That's why everyone on here runs about 3 zillion feet of metal piping on their compressed air systems, cool the air and the moisture condenses out of it.

Although I in no way mean to single you out, this seems to be as good a time as any to take stock and try to get a little inventory in our heads about what the hell it is we really understand. A good 60% of the stuff people post on here ranges from badly skewed to dead wrong when it comes to science. Yet so many of us will post and say what a "help" the information on this board has been. That's just plain freakin scary.

Oh wait, I forgot... once we post, it's on the internet. If you read it on the internet, it's gotta be true! Duh! Stupid me.

 

[brianh]

I keep a computer in my woodworking shop for the CNC router, when it is not in use it is off and the building is not heated I actually shut the power to the building when I am not using it.

Computers been fine for the last 5 years.

 

[peelman]

Colder air will tend to be dryer anyway, drop a pack of silica in the bottom of the case and run with it.

Also, protip, head to Lowes or Menards and pick up a roll of fiberglass filter, the cut-to-fit stuff, should be near the furnace filters. Cut out and duct tape some anywhere air gets drawn into the case; sidevents, front air intakes, anyplace a fan is sucking air into the machine (don't worry about the outputs). I ran two servers (one high-end desktop-turned VM Server and a big file server) and a switch, all on a UPS, in my garage for over a year, due to space and cooling constraints in the house. worked great. I did a write up on my blog a long time ago, pics are at the bottom.

 

[darkk]

I've been in the computer/electronics repair field forever...I haven't seen any cold related problems. I would be more concerned about dust and dirt. Just blow out the insides once a month and go for it...

 

[Rick Laviolette]

Laptops and base units will work fine in the garage. Just short of water dripping on it, most laptops run windows 7 and sleep when you close the cover. This in itself will keep condensation off of it while charging the battery releases heat. For practical purposes, Lay a plastic cover over it if the area is really damp.
I would be more concerned with dust. Body work tends to produce ample amounts of the stuff and clogs the vent fan. Still a cover helps with this too.

 

[Ford12508]

You can run a computer at basically any temperature thats cold. Ever seen a liquid nitrogen cooled computer?

Yes thats frost on it.