Garage Door Life Expectancy

[BrandonV]

What should I expect to get out of a builder grade steel garage door? My house has the original door from 1993 and it's starting to sag pretty significantly in the middle while open. There are also a few cracks on the exterior where you'd expect the lifting force from an opener.

Just the other day I noticed the bottom fixtures are bending at the cable attachment point which has me worried. I was thinking about tackling all of these issues (repairing the cracks, reinforcing the door, and putting on new bottom fixtures) but maybe it's just time for a new door?

 

[TurnipTruck]

After you repair/reinforce/insulate/stiffen/replace the springs&cables&rollers, you will then have to buy a new door sometime in the near future anyway after the old door fatigues in half.

 

[BrandonV]

After you repair/reinforce/insulate/stiffen/replace the springs&cables&rollers, you will then have to buy a new door sometime in the near anyway after the old door fatigues in half.

Yup. I'm leaning in this direction. I'm used to so many wood doors in Arizona lasting forever that I guess my expectations for a cheap Wayne Dalton are too high.

 

[Montauket]

I agree. I think you got your moneys worth out of it. Not worth the investment at this point In my opinion.

 

[loganb]

30 yrs old? Yeah time for new

Springs are rated between 5k and 10k cycles I belive depending on type.

I just had 2 new R18 Raynors installed, a single and a double for $5,500 which I thought was reasonable.

 

[rcktsled]

My house was built in 1990. I replaced the wood garage doors with Stanley steel doors that year. I have replaced springs, cable, hinges and rollers. The doors have stress cracks and bent edges. It is time to replace. I think I got my money's worth after 34 years.

 

[BrandonV]

My house was built in 1990. I replaced the wood garage doors with Stanley steel doors that year. I have replaced springs, cable, hinges and rollers. The doors have stress cracks and bent edges. It is time to replace. I think I got my money's worth after 34 years.

Was what the rationale if you don't mind me asking for getting rid of the wood door? I've seen doors from the 50s that look in fantastic shape.

 

[Firebrick43]

Wayne daltons are pretty low quality doors with piss poor design choices, especially in the joints.

I have seen a lot of wood doors fall apart, sag, and therefore need replace/rebuilt when I lived in the high desert? I would speculate that many had been rebuilt over the years. The fact that the homeowner could rebuild them is one plus.

They are heavy as well and especially don't do well on big double car openings. Biggest problem is the old style extension springs and corresponding hardware.

 

[BrandonV]

Instead of starting a new thread, maybe some folks here can help.

I'm guessing most doors these days use dual torsion springs. I don't see any need (or want) to go with proprietary spring setups. Regarding openers, is Liftmaster still considered good? All their consumer belt-driven models seem to have cameras now, which I'm not interested in. I was looking at the ATSW (which is chain), but is a light-duty commercial opener.

Are there any other things to consider when getting new doors (door, rails, etc.)? I plan on trying to get a single piece rail.

 

[rcktsled]

Was what the rationale if you don't mind me asking for getting rid of the wood door?

Here in SoCal most houses (including mine) had one-piece, flip-up plywood garage doors that were ugly and cheap looking. Thankfully, builders stopped installing those monstrosities around the turn of the 21st century.

 

[firebirdparts]

Fatigue issues are too “subjective” to set a lifetime. The springs have a cycle lifetime but most of the door would last forever if you had adequate opener installation

 

[69charged]

I replaced a sagging insulated 18’ wide garage door in our last house. Of course just before we sold it!!
Just like yours, the hinges were worn, the cable attachment points were bent up, the shaft where the torsion springs go on was bent, and the door opener looked like it was from the 70’s.
I had the company install the new door for me ( charged me a 100 more) and I didn’t expect that much difference. It was awesome to have a nice, quiet door that didn’t bang every time you opened it. I wasn’t happy with how they installed it, but that wasn’t the doors fault.
Up here in Canada, that insulated clopay door was 6600 bucks all said and done.

 

[BrandonV]

Fatigue issues are too “subjective” to set a lifetime. The springs have a cycle lifetime but most of the door would last forever if you had adequate opener installation

That is my suspicion partly. I didn't install the opener it's been on the door since 1993. I understand if the geometry isn't ideal there can be undo stress put on the door.

I really just didn't know how long people keep the absolute builder grade junk that comes with a tract home. I'm sure they used the absolute cheapest thing they could during construction.

 

[bwringer]

Upgrade to a better new door, no question.

Whoever installed the cheapest possible garage door on my house just before we bought it didn't bother to set the closing/reversing force (just cranked it to max and left), so one day it caught the edge of a trash can and bent itself. I managed to reinforce it for a while, but it was never the same again.

It was a single layer uninsulated absolute pile of garbage. I insulated it with lightweight foam glued to the inside, which made a huge difference inside the garage and even to our household energy bills.

Eventually, we had to replace it, and we installed a proper insulated 3-layer door, which made an even bigger difference to comfort inside the garage and to our energy usage.

I, for one, can't tell much difference in garage door openers these days. We used a basic Chamberlain, since that's what Menard's sells, and it's... fine. It has some sort of wifi nonsense I've never bothered with. I push the button on the wall or on the remote, and yup, it opens and closes. I really DGAF about the fancy-schmancy stuff. I added a keychain remote to carry on my motorcycles, and a keypad.

I can say that many (Or most? All?) garage doors now come with a winding mechanism that you spin with a drill, and this is FAR safer and easier than monkeying with the old winding bars of death.

Overall, upgrading was worth every penny. When we removed the old door, it was obvious that it was complete junk and absolutely trashed. I'm amazed we didn't have some sort of disaster with the poor thing, honestly.

 

[BrandonV]

Upgrade to a better new door, no question.

Whoever installed the cheapest possible garage door on my house just before we bought it didn't bother to set the closing/reversing force (just cranked it to max and left), so one day it caught the edge of a trash can and bent itself. I managed to reinforce it for a while, but it was never the same again.

It was a single layer uninsulated absolute pile of garbage. I insulated it with lightweight foam glued to the inside, which made a huge difference inside the garage and even to our household energy bills.

Eventually, we had to replace it, and we installed a proper insulated 3-layer door, which made an even bigger difference to comfort inside the garage and to our energy usage.

I, for one, can't tell much difference in garage door openers these days. We used a basic Chamberlain, since that's what Menard's sells, and it's... fine. It has some sort of wifi nonsense I've never bothered with. I push the button on the wall or on the remote, and yup, it opens and closes. I really DGAF about the fancy-schmancy stuff. I added a keychain remote to carry on my motorcycles, and a keypad.

I can say that many (Or most? All?) garage doors now come with a winding mechanism that you spin with a drill, and this is FAR safer and easier than monkeying with the old winding bars of death.

Overall, upgrading was worth every penny. When we removed the old door, it was obvious that it was complete junk and absolutely trashed. I'm amazed we didn't have some sort of disaster with the poor thing, honestly.

I'm guessing its normal for them to replace the track as well as part of a new door installation? I have the Liftmaster opener and all I think picked out and will probably go with a decent Amarr door.

Really just waiting for the Arizona heat to die off a little bit so I can run new control and electric cable for the new opener so the installers don't have to crawl around in the attic.

 

[loganb]

I'm guessing most doors these days use dual torsion springs. I don't see any need (or want) to go with proprietary spring setups. Regarding openers, is Liftmaster still considered good?

Spring type will default based on door weight. My just replaced 8 x 7 for the single door was linear extension springs as default, I opted to upgrade it when ordering to torsion spring(just 1 spring) to make installing a side mount/jackshaft type opener easier

The dealer I got my doors from carries a number of brands, when discussing the sidemount style openers it pained the sales guy(as a Liftmaster fan) to recommend the Genie over the Liftmaster for side mount applications. Said just had fewer issues with the Genie over the last several years, but not enough to drop the Liftmaster as it's got a strong following and lots of people had great experiences. The installer I had installing the doors preferred the Liftmaster though....so not sure what I'll do yet

I'm guessing its normal for them to replace the track as well as part of a new door installation? I have the Liftmaster opener and all I think picked out and will probably go with a decent Amarr door.

Yes, new tracks/rollers etc should all come with a new door unless it's a very recently installed door with panel only damage from hail/car hit etc. Total install time on a 16 x 8 and a 8 x 7 Raynor units for me last week with a 2 person install crew was about 6 hours. These were heavier panels as they were the 2" thick/R18 insulation value so lighter panels probably would've gone faster. The mfg shipped the wrong single panel door(right size, but wrong panel embossments) so they have to come back and swap that still. They said for just panel swap it'll be 30 or 45 minutes.

 

[bwringer]

I'm guessing its normal for them to replace the track as well as part of a new door installation? I have the Liftmaster opener and all I think picked out and will probably go with a decent Amarr door.

Really just waiting for the Arizona heat to die off a little bit so I can run new control and electric cable for the new opener so the installers don't have to crawl around in the attic.

Yes, all new tracks, rollers, etc. come with the new door. I've skipped the new track before, TBH, when the old track is identical and in good shape, but that was pure laziness and we were moving out soon anyway.

On our current door, the track was a little different, but we managed to re-use some of the hanger setup for the tracks and the opener, although we also reinforced everything quite a bit; this reduced noise and rattling and wobbling quite a bit. The company that installed the old door did somewhat less than the absolute bare minimum, and it showed.

Protip: the rollers that usually come with new doors are the most abysmal cheap plastic junk you've ever seen. Ball bearing rollers with urethane rollers are quite cheap, more durable, and reduce noise a bit, and they're pretty easy to install.

 

[BrandonV]

Protip: the rollers that usually come with new doors are the most abysmal cheap plastic junk you've ever seen. Ball bearing rollers with urethane rollers are quite cheap, more durable, and reduce noise a bit, and they're pretty easy to install.

Good point. I just installed the highest quality new rollers I could source in the old door. I'll make sure they put the same quality rollers in with the new door. I had a hell of a time bending the track to get them in. Luckily I had one of the track shaping tools to hammer it back into shape.

 

[BrandonV]

Yes, all new tracks, rollers, etc. come with the new door. I've skipped the new track before, TBH, when the old track is identical and in good shape, but that was pure laziness and we were moving out soon anyway.

I'll probably get new track if I can. I kid you not the other door from 1993 has been opened probably 2 times in its entire life. Everything is original and it works great.

 

[ybnormal]

we moved into our 11 yr old home in '95 with a 16x8 door. I noticed a crack in the sheetmetal where the door opener attached, you could see where it had been flexing and starting to tear. I got another 10 yrs out of it by putting some large pieces of steel (fender washers) over the holes to spread the load out. when we finally replaced the door, I noticed that attachment point on the new door was built heavier and designed differently. on average I open that door once every 30 days.
biggest issue I have is the door opener, just keeping it greased so it doesn't scream when opening.

 

[BrandonV]

we moved into our 11 yr old home in '95 with a 16x8 door. I noticed a crack in the sheetmetal where the door opener attached, you could see where it had been flexing and starting to tear. I got another 10 yrs out of it by putting some large pieces of steel (fender washers) over the holes to spread the load out. when we finally replaced the door, I noticed that attachment point on the new door was built heavier and designed differently. on average I open that door once every 30 days.
biggest issue I have is the door opener, just keeping it greased so it doesn't scream when opening.

The opener that prompted this is a Genie screw drive (consumer model) from 1993. Over the past year or two, I've noticed a significant shake in the rail as it moves up and down, which has gradually worsened. The door was quite noisy, so I replaced all the rollers, which reduced the noise a bit, but the shake persisted. The torsion spring and balance are good, and I've used a quality dry lubricant on all the hinges and rollers. Although the opener was likely neglected in terms of lubrication, adding grease hasn't made much difference. Replacing the original trolley assembly further quieted it down.

A couple of weeks ago, the unit started humming and wouldn't start in either the up or down position. I replaced the capacitor with one from Amazon but still had occasional issues. So, I bought the proper capacitor from Genie, and it's been working okay so far (knock on wood).

Realistically, considering the bend in the door, and everyone's opinion I think it's just gradually getting worse. All of this equipment seems to have exceeded a reasonable life expectancy, so I'm planning to have a reputable company come in and install a new door and commercial opener in the Fall.

 

[ybnormal]

The opener that prompted this is a Genie screw drive (consumer model) from 1993. Over the past year or two, I've noticed a significant shake in the rail as it moves up and down, which has gradually worsened. The door was quite noisy, so I replaced all the rollers, which reduced the noise a bit, but the shake persisted. The torsion spring and balance are good, and I've used a quality dry lubricant on all the hinges and rollers. Although the opener was likely neglected in terms of lubrication, adding grease hasn't made much difference. Replacing the original trolley assembly further quieted it down.

A couple of weeks ago, the unit started humming and wouldn't start in either the up or down position. I replaced the capacitor with one from Amazon but still had occasional issues. So, I bought the proper capacitor from Genie, and it's been working okay so far (knock on wood).

Realistically, considering the bend in the door, and everyone's opinion I think it's just gradually getting worse. All of this equipment seems to have exceeded a reasonable life expectancy, so I'm planning to have a reputable company come in and install a new door and commercial opener in the Fall.

yep, I installed the same replacement opener myself but I made it solid mount, no flex. used some heavy slotted angle-iron mounted to the ceiling with lag screws. then attached some flat-plate slotted bars in a V-shape to hold the opener at the right height and make sure no torqueing or twisting.
for the 2-piece screw mechanism, I use white lithium grease in a tube. I've noticed the carrier that moves back and forth is plastic so don't know if that is the cause of the "shakes and screeches". have not had a garage door company out to inspect or service in 20 yrs. I have noticed that the screeching seems to be more during the winter.
our 20 yr old door is still in great shape. I'm sure the original was cheap since it was thin sheetmetal.

 

[BrandonV]

yep, I installed the same replacement opener myself but I made it solid mount, no flex. used some heavy slotted angle-iron mounted to the ceiling with lag screws. then attached some flat-plate slotted bars in a V-shape to hold the opener at the right height and make sure no torqueing or twisting.
for the 2-piece screw mechanism, I use white lithium grease in a tube. I've noticed the carrier that moves back and forth is plastic so don't know if that is the cause of the "shakes and screeches". have not had a garage door company out to inspect or service in 20 yrs. I have noticed that the screeching seems to be more during the winter.
our 20 yr old door is still in great shape. I'm sure the original was cheap since it was thin sheetmetal.

Yup. I was thinking about doing something similar with angle when the new opener comes. The existing one is held up with fairly rigid angle right now and the opener is rock solid (no movement at either end just in the middle). The new one is probably going to be quite a bit bigger so I'll probably rig something beefier up when they come to install the door.

I've found that the trolley/carriage with the screw drive openers really only contacts inside where the worm of the opener meshes with the worm of the trolley/carriage. What I did notice was that the trolley/carriage portion seems to be made out of a very soft steel. I'm guessing the idea is over time the trolley/carriage will wear away while keeping the opener screw intact.

I use Super Lube on the screw which has a viscosity NLGI of 2 which may be the wrong grease since the factory Genie white lithium lubricant is a NLGI 1. I'm guessing in a cold climate that could be a problem. I figure in Arizona it's never cold enough for a thicker grease to cause issues.

 

[ybnormal]

Yup. I was thinking about doing something similar with angle when the new opener comes. The existing one is held up with fairly rigid angle right now and the opener is rock solid (no movement at either end just in the middle). The new one is probably going to be quite a bit bigger so I'll probably rig something beefier up when they come to install the door.

I've found that the trolley/carriage with the screw drive openers really only contacts inside where the worm of the opener meshes with the worm of the trolley/carriage. What I did notice was that the trolley/carriage portion seems to be made out of a very soft steel. I'm guessing the idea is over time the trolley/carriage will wear away while keeping the opener screw intact.

I use Super Lube on the screw which has a viscosity NLGI of 2 which may be the wrong grease since the factory Genie white lithium lubricant is a NLGI 1. I'm guessing in a cold climate that could be a problem. I figure in Arizona it's never cold enough for a thicker grease to cause issues.

I'm more concerned with it getting too hot and the grease liquifying and dripping out of the space where the worm rail rotates. doesn't seem to have happened but to me it's like "WTH were they thinking when they designed it?"

 

[BrandonV]

I'm more concerned with it getting too hot and the grease liquifying and dripping out of the space where the worm rail rotates. doesn't seem to have happened but to me it's like "WTH were they thinking when they designed it?"

I used to hear from a garage door guy that you could tell which homes had a screw drive opener because they had a nice black track going down the outside of the garage door.

 

[engineer2]

I just replaced my original 1992 garage door. It was OK until a couple of years ago when the spring broke. The opener bent the top 2 panels trying to open the door with no spring. Pushed them back into shape and replaced the spring.
Last year I went to a shaft drive opener with a phone app and love it.
Just found new garage door panels with no hardware for $500 at Menards. Perfect for what I needed. It's a really nice insulated door. Easy to install.