garage door opener questions

[volaredon]

I built my 30x36 garage back in 2006, I have 2, 9X8 doors plus a man door.
Up til now I have been the "garage door opener". but the strip of grass between the house and garage gets quite muddy, last fall's dig-up to bury a gas line and last week's till-up and grass replant doesn't help. I want to be able to enter/exit the garage thru the overhead doors so I do not have to go down the side of the garage when it's muddy or snow packed by the man door.

have had a couple of brand new openers in the attic now for too long.
They are both Chamberlain 1/2 HP chain drive "Security+" but not the same model as each other. I bought them at 2 different times, 2 different places.

The 1st one I got at an estate sale, I guess the seller died before he could get the opener installed, it sat around a while new in the box before the estate sale.

the 2nd one I got from a small hardware chain, box was full of dust and quite faded from being in stock so long. They had 2 and I thought about buying both that they had but I thought they were the same as the one I had at home so I figured there was no reason... the hardware store one was also not the "latest model" either. The newer ones have more of a "aero" design, rounded corners on the motorhousing, the 2 that I have are both square corners and an older looking "Chamberlain" logo...

Well they are not the same. I went and bought 2, 8' extension kits from Menards since these openers were designed for 7' tall doors.
I went to put them up yesterday and then discovered a big difference in them when I opened the boxes.

I 1st was going to put up the auction one. I opened it all up and then opened the extension kit, just to find out that the auction sourced opener is a T rail setup and the extension kit was a square tube design.
so I opened the hardware store one and found that it is a sq. tube design, so I had at least 1 usable opener.
The motor assy looks the same between them.
I found the part number for the extension for the T rail in its instruction manual. I then looked online and found that the extension rail kit for the T rail is discontinued. Great.
There is a rail kit on CL right now, not that expensive, not far away that looks to have the trolley kit and everything included, looks to be a square rail setup. IF I cold use a square rail on the T rail motor, that would solve my problem. Can I?
OR, does anyone know where I can get the T rail style 8' door extension kit? (found 2 part numbers, either 1704 CB or 7704 CB) The extension kit I have for the square rail style rail is 7708 CB

My other choice is to buy another newer model opener that I can use the square style rail extension kit with and sell/trade the T rail style opener to someone that has a "standard" 7' tall door....

It's a garage.... I do not care if both of my openers match, as long as they work. I mean they can't be seen from the road! so who else would know?
If one breaks down the road I'm not gonna buy 2 new openers to replace them, just gonna replace the one that dies at that time.... (even though the ones I have are 15-20 years old they are brand new so I am hoping that will be a long time off, anyhow LOL)

 

[Ponchoguy]

If it helps, Chamberlain typically made the Sears Craftsman garage door openers under the "139" model prefix. I have two of them from 1979 and I do not plan to change them, but hook them back up when the two new doors are complete on my garages .

 

[volaredon]

yeah I have seen a couple of used openers on Craigslist, looking there not caring about the motor (I'd use my brand new one) but for the rail systems, I see a couple of T rail setups (incl with used openers) but most are a bit far away to be worth the ride, none indicate (except for a Genie which I do not think is compatible) that they are anything other than a standard 7' opener... if that is the case I'll just buy a new opener that I can use the readily available square tube style extension kit.

Most "rail kits" are just that... the rail. the one rail kit that I see listed nearby looks to be the whole thing, the rail, trolley and a few other extras. like they bought a new opener and only used the motor assy from it with their old rail and such... I know the trolley and mount bracket to the motor are different between the 2.

If I have to go to Menards, Home Depot etc it appears it would cost more to buy just the rail and associated hardware that is compatible, than to buy a whole new opener.

I mainly need to know if I can use a sqaure tube rail setup on motor that came with a T rail. (as long as I stay with Chamberlain, of course)
If so, I'll have the T rail and its associated components to get rid of.

 

[upndown]

Unfortunately the t-rail and box rail set ups are not compatible! Different mounting configuration at the motor head. I would try calling a local Door co and see if they may have something laying around.

I never used extension kits, always used 7' or 8' solid rails.
Good luck finding one!

 

[volaredon]

Unfortunately the t-rail and box rail set ups are not compatible! Different mounting configuration at the motor head. I would try calling a local Door co and see if they may have something laying around.

I never used extension kits, always used 7' or 8' solid rails.
Good luck finding one!

really? Measuring the bolt spacing on top of the 2 motors, the distance to the sprocket from all edges of the housing, all measure out to be identical. It looks like I could bolt the bracket from the tube style right to the T rail motor head. Same bolt stagger, same size thread and all.
I THINK (not sure that's why I came here to ask) that if I use EVERYTHING for a square tube design rail besides the motor head, that it would bolt up and work fine, judging by what I see comparing the 2 side by side.

OK I just went out to the garage; the "bought from auction" unit is model 4200 built in 11/2000
the "hardware store" one is a CG40D built in 10/05.
I bought the auction one about 3 years ago and the hardware store one about a year ago.

I see you say "good luck finding one" -- regarding a solid rail. That was gonna be my next Q; where to get one. I suppose I could go to the metal sales place and find a square tube that length and drill the needed holes, cut the window for the cable pulley and use that but that doesnt give me the trolley or the other misc hardware pieces I'd need.

The Angle bracket they supply with the opener to hang the motor from sure is chincey! I mean paper thin. I just went and bought me some 1/16X3/4" flat stock that I will use for hanger material.

 

[gnpenning]

I have been able to upgrade box rails with 1 piece T rails for customers that have had problems. The 1 piece T is the way to go. Liftmaster sales the 1 piece rails in the 7',8',10' that work with your powers heads.

If have can find used ones that works too. You just need to adjust the travel limits for the height of door you are using it on.

What color are the learn buttons on the back of the openers? What color are the buttons on your remotes?

The square design openers in those years should be contractors grade openers. Just a lower price point. Most likely a model 13 something. Like a 1345, 1355.

 

[upndown]

volaredon, sorry bout that! Before I replied, I went and looked at a box rail I replaced a couple weeks ago and then grabbed an old t-rail I had laying around, I save some for various projects around the shop. I measured it, not even close. I just checked the rail again and realized it was off an old Allister opener, same type T-rail just narrower...My Bad sorry!

 

[volaredon]

volaredon, sorry bout that! Before I replied, I went and looked at a box rail I replaced a couple weeks ago and then grabbed an old t-rail I had laying around, I save some for various projects around the shop. I measured it, not even close. I just checked the rail again and realized it was off an old Allister opener, same type T-rail just narrower...My Bad sorry!

no big deal. I thought maybe there was a "up to/after" date involved there.

and gnpenning, I put the model numbers that I found on the boxes and in the respective manuals that came with each opener in an earlier post, is there a different "model" number I should be looking for? I'll have to go look. I have the square rail opener hung, but not yet plugged into power or wired. I see in the book that came with about the adjustments you speak of. I will have to look at the colors of the learn buttons and such that you ask for. I did pick up some different remotes when I bought the hardware store one, along with it that will open up to 3 doors (I only have 2 at the moment unless I decide to add openers to the attached garage doors too) Everything I have on hand, related to the door openers is Chamberlain.

I have a call into someone that I know locally that has worked for every garage door outfit in the county at one time or another to see what he may have laying around....
I would not be at all against going with a 1 pc setup, whether T rail or square tube which ever I can come up with. Just tried doing this project with what ever came in the boxes...

IF I do go with a 1 pc, I will still need the longer chain that comes in the "extension kits" unless I can get that longer chain seperately.

"Cheaper price point"; does that mean cheaper made/won't last as long before I start having problems? With tools trucks tractors and most everything else I deal with older production seems to be better; more durable, less troublesome and basically better built. Are garage door openers an exception to that?

I have installed a handful of openers over the years, but it's one today, another a couple years down the road, the next a few years after that, certainly not enough of them close enough to the last one to get "good" or "fast" at it... but I have never had trouble getting one to work, yet....but those were always for someone else.. these 2 are the 1st I have ever installed in my own garage, for "me". and if I can come up with all the components for this one I feel I will have the same result....

 

[gnpenning]

don't worry about the model numbers. That info was just about the type of opener you may have. The T rails will fit pretty much any chain drive opener that liftmaster and chamberlain have made for years. Many of the craftsman openers I've seen are made by chamberlain as well and will inter change.

The button colors will tell me if you can use the same remotes for both doors with out buying MQ stuff. Also if you can buy one keyless entry for both doors. I am amazed at how many "pro's" put a keyless for each door.

When I code three button remotes I use the large button on the primary door and the other outside for the other door. Makes it harder to hit the wrong button. If you clear the codes on one you can do both remotes this way.


The door adjustment is easy. Just have your remote with you as you do it. Make sure you check your up and down tension adjustments. This whole set up is as easy as it get's for the DIY's.

 

[upndown]

Yes you will need to lengthen that chain by 1' using a mater link. That's all they use to connect the chain to the front of the carriage.

 

[volaredon]

ok on lengthening the chain. The opener I have up (square rail) that I was able to use the extender kit for, came with a whole new chain not just an extender piece.
and if the rail is 1' longer, wouldn't the chain need to be 2' longer?

button colors/ 1 red and 1 purple on back of motor unit.
antenna wires purple and gray.

didn't look at the remotes that came with the opener but the extra ones I have (also chamberlain brand, work up to 3 doors) say on pkg that they work with purple but do not say whether they would work with any other. I also have a keyless button pad for it that I bought separately with the hardware store bought unit. One that would mount in the door jamb. I didn't think to look on its package for compatibility...

 

[gnpenning]

Yea what I thought on the learn buttons. different freq for the openers. The purple button remote should have black buttons. The red will be the tan button remote.

The extender kit should have had the correct length chain.

You didn't say but are your doors still balanced? If so get it done and enjoy.

 

[Ponchoguy]

don't worry about the model numbers. That info was just about the type of opener you may have. The T rails will fit pretty much any chain drive opener that liftmaster and chamberlain have made for years. Many of the craftsman openers I've seen are made by chamberlain as well and will inter change.

The button colors will tell me if you can use the same remotes for both doors with out buying MQ stuff. Also if you can buy one keyless entry for both doors. I am amazed at how many "pro's" put a keyless for each door.

When I code three button remotes I use the large button on the primary door and the other outside for the other door. Makes it harder to hit the wrong button. If you clear the codes on one you can do both remotes this way.


The door adjustment is easy. Just have your remote with you as you do it. Make sure you check your up and down tension adjustments. This whole set up is as easy as it get's for the DIY's.

Yes, a Sears Craftsman door opener with a model prefix of "139" means that Liftmaster/Chamberlain made it for Sears. Such is the case with my 1979 models and my neighbor's earlier 70's model.

 

[kbs2244]

I do not know if this applies to your problem…
But…..
When I had to extend the lift range of a tube/chain type opener many years ago I found that the tube was an exact match for EMT (Electrical Metal Tube) and the chain for common bicycle chain.
It was not much of a job to extend both the tube and the chain..

I would guess square tube models would not be much different.

They sell the original kits and extension kits in short lengths for shipping reasons.
I even bought the EMT in the same big box store as the opener.
(Admittedly the two departments were about 200 feet apart.)

With square tube you may have to fine a steel supplier.

 

[volaredon]

Yea what I thought on the learn buttons. different freq for the openers. The purple button remote should have black buttons. The red will be the tan button remote.

The extender kit should have had the correct length chain.

You didn't say but are your doors still balanced? If so get it done and enjoy.

I thought I'd mentioned that, the extender kit did come with the right length chain, but again my issue is that I have one each of a tube style and a T rail style, I bought 2 extender kits before I knew what I had, I cannot find a T rail style extender they are discontinued. so I need either the square tube rail setup or someone that may have a T rail extension collecting dust.
I like the idea of a solid rail, which ever style I can come up with 1st.

 

[volaredon]

UPDATE all taken care of... got ahold of my buddy that used to do garage doors for a living, who sent me to one of his ex employers. got a solid T rail made for the 8' door with the chain and trolley for $85. Brand new setup in the box. Looks like a much better setup than the newer square tube piece together setup on my other opener, I may go back n get another one and do that one up the same way....
seems like it is still common fare on Chamberlain's "Lift Master" division's openers.