Garage Do's and Don'ts

[gmontess]

Hi All,

Finally going to build a garage, have't started any of the design plans yet. Looking at about a 30'x 30' but could go a little longer. Looking to store an F250 an Avalon and a Nova SS, would like to add a lift in down the line. Planning for heat, 100 Amp and maybe water?

Looking for feedback for ideas to makes the most of the build/design/space.

Things you wish you had thought off or spent the extra $$ on. Things you did spend the extra money on and couldn't be happier with.

Trying to avoid having any regrets, and looking for a bit more insight then 'build it bigger' haha

thanks,
Scott

 

[Old Man Roger]

Consider the lift when deciding on a garage door, door opener, and the concrete floor where the lift will be.

 

[larry_g]

One is getting the OH door to close to the sidewall. To close and you either bang the wall with opening the car door or you have no room for any storage along that wall, or both. At minimum 3-4' from the edge of the door to the sidewall. If you plan to have 3 rigs side by side in 30' your going to have to be quite tight and no room for a lift.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Jlbc212]

12 foot wide doors and a minimum of 8 ft high, preferably higher.

 

[BillK]

Scott,
Do you have all three vehicles right now ? If so take them to a parking lot together and put them side by side and see how much room you feel comfortable with. Think about a work bench and some tools etc. I don't think 30' is enough width for three cars. My attached garage is 22 x 22 and it is tight with my Tahoe and my Wife's Riviera parked next to each other. My detached is 24 x 24 and I have my Chevelle in there by itself. I have had 2 cars parked in it but it really does not leave much room for work.

 

[b-boy]

I'd go bigger. I'd say 30'x40'. Make sure to go with high ceilings (12-ft minimum) and scissor trusses for maximum headroom. I built a 12-ft ceiling. I'd do 14-ft if I were doing it again.

Determining placement of the lift is important, because it will impact where your doors need to go. I didn't do that, and if/when I add a lift I'll have limited options.

I have an 8x8 door and a 16x9 door. The 16x9 was really expensive because it was an non-standard size. You might want to look at pricing before you build. I had the building built with just the rough openings, then added the garage doors. I got a little sticker shock when I found out what they would cost me.

Think about your windows/man doors. I added 4 windows. They're nice, but they break up the walls, and limit options for hanging ladders and running cabinets/shelves. I think I'd probably have eliminated them on the longer wall runs.

Map out your utilities in advance. Figure out where they will enter the building. Mine all enter in the same location, which has made it a little challenging running water, gas lines, and vents. There's not a lot of room to work with. Also, get some quotes on running the lines. Running mine cost way more than I thought they would.

 

[gmontess]

Thanks for all the info, it'll really be helpful. Im following some other threads too for some insights. I think getting all the cars out and fitting them next to each other is a great way for me to think about size. I originally was thinking I could not fit all three cars, and it isn't a necessity but would be awesome.

I see a lot of people adding floor heating and it sounds like that is in place of other heating methods. will that put off enough heat to work comfortably in here on projects in the winter?

 

[sennister]

I would consider more power. We are upgrading our service to the house from 150A to 400A and sending 200A to the house and 200A to my new garage. My situation is a bit different in that I am feeding a pole barn, full hookups for a 5th wheel camper (when my In-laws are around in the summer) and ours if we are prepping it to head out for the weekend or just came back. Cost wise it means adding a bigger panel and some heavier gauge wire but I have plenty of power to run a couple chargers for Electric Vehicles should I go that route in the future. Run the shop in the pole barn (welders, 220v compressor) and not have to worry about power like I do today. At least consider it. If I don't do it now to add it later will mean ripping up the patio we are also pouring and a huge headache.

We are also going 30x40 with 3 overhead doors. I was planning on 9x9 but people here are starting to convince me to bump it to 10' wide. I need to look at the plans. If you want a lift, consider what you are using for an opener as well. I am going with the Liftmaster 8500W which mounts to the wall not the ceiling. Need to know this when doing power because you need outlets next to the door not the ceiling. You are in Mass so I would at a minimum put PEX in the floor and insulate it for in floor heat even if you don't install it now. Also spend time on the little stuff. If an access door swings to the right or left costs the same when you are doing the plans. Think about where you want the light switches because to change it later costs money. Find out what your local codes are for floor drains. Some places you can have them. We can if they drain to daylight (surface of the ground), some let you tie into sewer or septic and other flat out ban them.

 

[Sevenhills1952]

A few mistakes I made was I should have insulated everything first before bringing anything in.
I would have run maybe two PVC pipes underground to run water line and wires through. So easy if you need to run something else in future. Same with inside PVC buried one side of garage to the other.

Sent from my SM-S320VL using Tapatalk

 

[ghnl]

Floor heat can definitely provide plenty of heat and make it comfortable to work in the garage during the winter. But it likely won't be able to quickly heat up the garage (large mass of concrete to heat up and then radiate the heat). Were you planning on keeping it heated all winter? But the idea of installing the heat pipe during the build is a good one - that would give you the option of adding the heat source later.

High ceilings allow for raising a vehicle high enough to walk underneath. With a four post lift you can easily put one vehicle up and park another underneath. Along with high ceilings & a lift, consider raising the door tracks and a jack shaft door opener - to avoid having the door & opener in the way of a car up on the lift.

When planning the wiring/lighting put the lights on a circuit separate from the outlets. This way a tripped circuit breaker from a tool won't kill the lights. (this may be the way electrical codes are written but I've seen some garages with everything on the same circuit...)

 

[firebirdparts]

if you really put 3 cars in a 30 by 30, with the doors all on one side, then all the layout advice given here won't apply. Basically everybody will just be saying "don't". You can see the problems, I hope. One side is all doors, nothing to hold the building up, and so a 20 by 30 section of the shop will be really stuffed with cars.

You can let some of the pressure off by turning one of the cars sideways, but if you didn't want to do that to begin with, better to just widen the building a little bit.

 

[sennister]

Floor heat can definitely provide plenty of heat and make it comfortable to work in the garage during the winter. But it likely won't be able to quickly heat up the garage (large mass of concrete to heat up and then radiate the heat). Were you planning on keeping it heated all winter? But the idea of installing the heat pipe during the build is a good one - that would give you the option of adding the heat source later.

That is a good point that I didn't clarify.

My pole barn/shop, I am not out there on a daily basis. I heat that with a wood stove/forced air NG. I have seen some people use in floor radiant heat to maintain lets say 40F to keep the snow melted off vehicles. It is pretty efficient at that because you have a large thermal mass in the slab. Meaning you open the garage door and your heat escapes, as soon as you close it you are back to 40F pretty quick. If you want to bump the heat to 60F to work out there on something on a random evening. Well you can but you may need to plan that the day before and turn up the heat. This is because it takes a lot of time and energy to change the temp of that thermal mass. That is where forced air comes in. Some people will use that radiant system to maintain the 40F but then have a forced air system that the thermostat is set at 35F so it never kicks in but it is there to quickly bump the heat to 60F if they are working out there on a random night.

It really is a case where you need to evaluate how the space is being used. Not only today but long term plans. Maybe now you have a job and have kids now so you only get out there on weekends or an hour or two here and there. However you are retiring soon and have no plans on moving and now your use of the area might shift to a wood working shop. You will kick yourself for not having infloor heat if you skip it now. That is why I said I would at a minimum insulate and install the PEX now. You can always add the boiler later at that point. It just gives options. Or it is a selling point for the next people.

 

[HoosierBuddy]

My only mistake was using 9-foot wide doors rather than 10. It doesn't really give enough room to comfortably back out a modern full size pickup, as the mirrors are so large I only have a couple inches clearance on each side.

Of course, you can't fit 3 10 foot wide doors in 30 feet...so you'd have to go bigger.

The good things I did included:

13 foot tall ceiling so my lift fit easily.

Floor Drains (luckily I didn't have to fight an inspector and was able to get good drains for not a lot of money).

2 X 6 construction. Fully insulated.

T1-11 interior siding below with #2 steel above and on the ceiling for lots of reflectivity

10-foot tall doors work well with taller ceiling.

Plenty of lights (mine are fluorescent...but I built before LED's came in. I'd use LED's now)

Lots and lots of electrical outlets.

A garage sink.

Piping for compressed air.

In floor heating.

Air conditioning.

Extra deep to allow work benches, cabinets and machine tools in front of the vehicle parking area.

High quality door operators.

Consider your power needs as well. I did not have any 230 Volt recepticals installed..but it would have come in handy. Commercial sized motors often require 230 Volts and the plasma cutter I'm currently lusting after needs it as well. I could add it easily enough...but all my current wiring is behind the T1-11. Any wiring I add will likely be installed in conduit.

Phil

 

[PelicanPines]

More outlets... More outlets... More outlets... at different heights.

More lighting...

A window... seriously... being able to look outside is important.

Garage doors with one way windows (don't want people looking in)

A nook to sit in... you will use a recliner often if you have a location for it... next to a small fridge or beer tap.

Minimum 6 inch walls for extra insulation... don't skip on ceiling insulation either.

STURDY doors both overhead and side.

 

[gmontess]

30 is the absolute widest I can go. I have a spot behind the garage for all my trailers, toys and my camper. I'll need the space to drive them down plus that's at the minimum setback anyways.

I am thinking the Nova can be on the lifted over my wifes Avalon (likely to upgrade to a 4runner in a few years). Or we can park two of them front to back since I know 3 across is impossible unless I want tiny *** doors.

I do have the option to go longer. After some of the advice here thinking Maybe stay at the 30' wide with two 12' wide doors 12'-14' ceilings and add 10 feet of length at the back.

I was thinking of a second floor but wife is against it. she thinks we won't get much use out of it.

So much more to think about then I realized, some of these suggestions are really valuable. Many are even low cost with theis kind of foresight. Glad I found this website. thanks to all for their input and advice

 

[HoosierBuddy]

was thinking of a second floor but wife is against it. she thinks we won't get much use out of it.

We have a bonus room above our garage addition that is our family room/office space/guest quarters (includes a full bath). We use it all the time. The key though was putting the access stairs so they come from inside the house, NOT a deal where you have to walk out to the garage and then up stairs into the bonus room.

If it was not a connected garage, or if you had to go into the garage and then walk up...we'd likely only use it for storage.

Phil

 

[MrSurly]

My advice: Bigger. As bigger as you can do.

I built a 30x40x14, have been wishing it was at least 30x60 since before I was done.

 

[Copymutt]

A dedicated room for that noisey compressor. Either a kick out or sound deadening partition will make your life more enjoyable and you won’t have to live w/ ear protection as often.
I lucked out on taking advantage of great passive solar. Orient the OH doors to the south and pop in removable glazing. Also pays dividends on the light bill.
Establish a charging station for all things battery powered, just helps keep your life organized.
This one is just me. I don’t have height for a lift so a pit it is, more comfortable than a creeper and gives cooler storage for aging homebrew.

 

[CombatNinja]

Think about a work bench and some tools etc. I don't think 30' is enough width for three cars.

I second this. You are never getting those 3 cars in 30' width if you plan on ever opening a door. And that is if you leave the side walls slick with nothing on them.

 

[thammel]

Here's what I did and what I would do differently:

Mine is 32 wide and 28 deep with 12'ceilings and a second walk up floor for a man cave up there. I used 2x6 for walls and everything is fully insulated. I put insulation board down and put down pex for a heated floor. I have NOT connected up the floor system yet as I have a reznor propane heater in the garage and separate mini split heat pumps for the garage and attic. The heating systems I have now work perfectly and I wonder if I'll ever connect up the heated floor.

With a stairway at one side of the 28', this is just a large 2 car garage. 30' wide is not wide enough for 3 vehicles.

I put in 10' wide by 8' high doors - two of them and this size is great for me.

I have epoxied the floor and love this. All is drywalled and painted and I have tons of led lighting on the first floor. Here are what I would do differently:

1) As they all say - make it larger. 36x32 would have been nice. There are cost limits for us all however.

2) I have a half bath - wish I'd added a shower too.

3) Configured the top of the stairway with a door so in the summer all the cooled air would not flow down the stairway. I now rig up sheets of insulation board to close it off in the summer; a real hassle.

Everything else is just about perfect.

Good luck!
Tom

 

[Jazz1]

In my 24x30 I used to put my ‘68 firebird on skates and push against back wall for winter storage. That left room to park 2 more vehicles in garage. Not much room to work, I just wanted to see how it all fit. I never ark in garage, only to work or store a hotrod

 

[Augus7us]

Unless money is not a factor, do not wonder to yourself "what all can I do to make my garage awesome", then come searching this site for ideas...

You may laugh, but remember in a year from now I warned you.

 

[sixty4]

If I had to do it again, all my windows would be higher leaving me more room for shelving! As others have mentioned more outlets and I thought I had more than enough.

 

[WaterBoyz]

My thoughts...........

Install a floor based urinal. May have to get creative if the local codes force you to add huge $$$$$.

Scissor trusses cost the same as flat ceiling trusses. If planning to add storage in the flat trusses, they will have to be engineered for that. If you plan to actually have a room/office/man-cave upstairs, remember, as you get older stairs will be your enemy.

Have a separately switched lighting circuit that can be used for minimal lighting. No need to light up the entire place to find a screwdriver.

As mentioned, use a jackshaft door opener and plan room for it on the wall for mounting and electricity. And have high-lift tracks that follow the roof pitch. Get the high-cycle torsion springs and commercial duty spring shaft bearings and the better door rollers.

Plan for storage, short term and long term. Consider places for 4x8 and 2x8 rivet style racking and simple movable plastic shelving units.

Internet connections and a place to hang a larger tv/monitor.

Placing the air compressor in its' own place outside is ideal. If not, then a space walled with Roxul Safe-n-Sound for noise control.

As someone mentioned, get upgraded power like 200a for garage and 200a for home. You can have them on their own meter (i.e. her money -- his money HA HA). You can never have too much power, besides, it costs waaaay more to upgrade later as compared to during the build.

Take LOTS and LOTS of pics during the build. Especially of the slab so you will know where to drill and not to drill. I have even stretched out a large measuring tape to include in the pic for reference.

There are building blueprints and there are "as built" blueprints. The "as built" are the most important ones.

Remember:
Some things have to be installed during the build.
Some things can be prepped for installation later.
Some things can be installed later with no building prep.

A garage is like a hardware store.....this is never one too big.

 

[ToolPolisher]

With new construction think of things like in ceiling speakers to save wall/shelf space. Sometimes it's the little things. Radiant floor heating will warm up a garage AND prevent you feel/knees from staying perpetually cold if you plan any work during the winter.

Plan for expansion: if you don't have a welder now, wire for one anyway. This forum will have you buying one before too long. More power and outlets, as mentioned before, are never a bad thing. You can only have too few outlets.

If any project cars are in your future, consider expansion items like a blasting cabinet, spare/loose parts racking, etc. In-wall or on-wall air lines: decide before you close in any walls.

An in ground scissor lift will save valuable parking square footage: pricey but worth it if one works for your project plans.

 

[rburke65]

If you are planning for a lift, you’d better have AT LEAST 12’ 6” of ceiling. 100 Amp. is a lot of power. If you’re not running a multi person commercial shop, I thing you will be fine with only a 100 Amp. You may want....need....at least a 24 circuit panel, if not bigger. Ditto on the 12’ x 8’ doors. I love mine. From my breaker panel, I ran, under the floor, 3/4” conduits, to the far corners of the shop and to wall areas between the garage doors, then I pulled THHN....stranded, single conductor wire to 4” square, deep boxes. This way, I didn’t have to drill 9,000 holes in my studs and pull wire up through the attic, as I have 13’5” ceilings. The conduit also provides a future raceway, if you wanted to pull....add....and extra circuit. Trust me...pvc is inexpensive insurance. Also, using screws to attach your paneling, is insurance also, should you need to remove it to gain access to wall cavity. I installed insulation and pen tubing in my floor for radiant heat later.....you can’t add pex later. 2x6” studs. Insulate. LED lighting. Build it high .... out of the water. Nothing worse then having water flowing into your new garage. Feeds for outside lighting. I have my windows 8’ up to the sills. Non operative. ....just for ambient light. Hope this helps. Good luck.

 

[Juiced06GTO]

Where in Mass? I am in the Worc area. I am trying to finally get going on mine this year. I am shooting for 30x40 at a minimum, might be able to squeeze in a 40x60 but not sure the funds are there yet...

 

[gtcs]

Allow me to speak blasphemy for a moment...

Everybody here says build it bigger, that is my regret. I had a 24x24 at my last house, and it was tight but manageable. My new building is 30x40, if I had built it 30x30 I could have had some money to finish it better (I also overbuilt my slab, but I don't regret that yet). This bigger is always better nonsense is the easiest of all advice to avoid. Build your shop the size you want, have enough money to buy that lift and get good doors. Install a skylight and/or window.

Then, 2 years later, when someone else makes a request for advise, you can say build it bigger... because that will be your only regret.

Best of luck on your build.

 

[Jlbc212]

Allow me to speak blasphemy for a moment...

Everybody here says build it bigger, that is my regret. I had a 24x24 at my last house, and it was tight but manageable. My new building is 30x40, if I had built it 30x30 I could have had some money to finish it better (I also overbuilt my slab, but I don't regret that yet). This bigger is always better nonsense is the easiest of all advice to avoid. Build your shop the size you want, have enough money to buy that lift and get good doors. Install a skylight and/or window.

Then, 2 years later, when someone else makes a request for advise, you can say build it bigger... because that will be your only regret.

Best of luck on your build.

^^^ While there never seems to be enough room in our garages and we wish we built it bigger, we also need to make it affordable. Fuel and electricity to keep the space reasonably warm or cool and bright is not cheap and then there's property taxes. Many communities base the property tax on square footage of the lot and the size of the buildings on that lot.

 

[LocoCoco]

Sounds like you're on your way to a well thought-out garage.

I didn't build my shop, but the previous owner was wise planning ahead with comparatively cheap additions:

- ran in-floor tubing just in case he wanted it later
- plumbed a toilet/bathroom drain into the slab
- buried a waterline to the house alongside the electrical
- wired three 240V outlets (one front wall, one middle, one rear)
- added a 30 amp RV outlet outside
- what I wish he had done was run compressed air lines through the walls


Dimensionally-speaking, if I had to choose, I'd rather go 22.5x40 than 30x30 (if square footage had to remain the same, otherwise 30x40 would kick ***). That way the garage can be broken up into four quadrants. Front two for parking the dailys (that make a mess on the floor), back two for the Nova on one side and work area on the other (where the floor can remain spotless).

Hope this helps! Good luck!

 

[Wes Tex]

I have a 30x40 all metal shop/garage with a roll-up door on the north and south side. The cross breeze in the summer is great. I have 7 windows mounted as high as I could get them with 4 on the east, 1 on the north, and 2 on the west. This puts the bottom of the windows 10 feet off the ground. I did this to get light in the daytime with no skylights and to maximize wall space. I have never regretted this decision. And this prevents anyone from viewing what is inside when I am not working with the doors open. This may give you something else to consider.

 

[Dragfluid]

Insulate!!
And by that I mean real insulation. Not bubble wrap ****.
You can't have too much. Look at my build thread for tips.

 

[120mm]

I'm also going to tag team on the "bigger is better" thing.

First, there is such a thing as aesthetics. I know, that is true blasphemy in McMansion Hell many live in.

Second, smaller forces you to be clever instead of using size to get what you want. I know that when I am given space, I fill it with junk. (I currently have 3, 2 1/2 car garages on my property, and I am having a heck of a time managing the space.

Now, back to spending someone elses' money. BTW, you can fit 3 cars in a 30x30 by adding a third garage door up front and parking one car transverse to the others. You are welcome.

 

[ramsdell_]

As with most comments your are better with bigger but you should be fine with 30 wide. Defiantly go with 40 long if you can. My shop is 36x36 and can park my 3 vehicles side by side. With 40 long you will should have no problem parking your wife's vehicle behind the Nova.

The only thing I wish I would have done was run conduit for internet. I can't get wifi from the house when the building is shut up.

 

[ramsdell_]

This photo should give you a better idea of space. Again mine is 36x36x16

https://photos.app.goo.gl/EyoUijePcys8iG1y5

 

[mc1984ss]

More outlets... More outlets... More outlets...





The last two shops I built I out in tons of outletS and everyone laughed at me. I have never said I have to many outlets and at least one of the people that laughed said he wishes he had my amount of outlet!

 

[jhastain]

Thank you everyone - I'm grabbing good ideas from here as well!

 

[mrcole]

I am working on my 24'x40' two story at the moment. I wanted to go as big as I could with garage doors so landed on two 10'x10' doors. One thing I wasn't thinking about was the space needed to land jack-shaft openers on the shaft (clearance to rotate and fit the opener on the shaft). I ended up splicing some bicycle chains together and found that the jack-shaft style openers could be installed/operated with very little clearance. As others have stated, I'd recommend these for ease of installation and they are very quiet while operating.

 

[Ing3018]

Just for reference: I stored 3 vehicles in a 26' x 26' garage this past winter (Honda Accord, Ford Explorer, Honda Civic). This garage has a refrigerator and steps on one side. This was just for winter storage and not for daily parking. It was tight, and would definitely not be okay for an everyday situation.