bww_mnm
Well-known member
that's a heck of a stable!
Garage Overhaul Using Rust Bullet for the Floor
- Thread starter EMC2
- Start date
faltu.name
New member
- Joined
- Feb 4, 2016
- Messages
- 1
Your garage looks absolutely gorgeous.
Did you use any clear top coat to protect the base layers?
Did you use any clear top coat to protect the base layers?
Thanks guys - apologies for the delayed reply. I hadn't visited for a while.
I did not use any clear coat and my rationale was:
1) I didn't feel I needed any additional gloss or protection
2) If for example, in 10 years time I felt like adding another coat or two, I did not want to deal with having to strip all the clear coat. I figured this way I could just scuff the surface a little and recoat when I needed to spruce things up.
The floor is holding up perfectly so I won't get to test this theory anytime soon.
55cadillacking
Well-known member
^ It's through an eBay retailer.
The link to the Sign retailer was earlier in the thread.
here it is again - I'll try and add it to the first page also;
http://stores.ebay.com/enthusiworks/
here it is again - I'll try and add it to the first page also;
http://stores.ebay.com/enthusiworks/
55cadillacking
Well-known member
He and I collaborated on a custom "Trek" sign as a casual deal for using photos of my garage in his eBay ads. I thought that was pretty cool of him. He does good work.
How are the Porsches? Don't hear much these days. Too busy keeping them clean?
Beautiful garage and even nicer cars!! I don't know how you keep your black cars so clean. I have a 2009 Basalt Black 911 turbo Cab - no matter how much I wash/wax - never seems as clean as your cars.
Well done!! Enjoy them in good health!
Well done!! Enjoy them in good health!
marty_p
Well-known member
You mean something like this(see before and after pics below)
I had my car up on 4 jackstands for about 10 days while my wheels were being painted. You can see a reasonable closeup of the floor afterwards. No issues. The only thing to be cautious of is stone grit dragged in by the tires, getting stuck under the floor jack wheels when you move it around. These can sometimes cause small scratches if the wheels lock up. I've done it a few times but they really aren't very noticeable unless you look for them.
I also did the Cayenne brakes (pads and rotors) and installed coilovers about a year ago. This involved a LOT of jacking up and down s I did a lot of fine tuning of the suspension. Again no issues at all.
Jack stands did not leave any marks? I recently installed RB in my garage (four coats) and gave it a week to cure. Recently tested to see how easily it can be scratched, and in my case it seems quite easy. I took a wrench and dragged it across the floor with medium pressure which left plenty of marks. I can only image that a jack or jack stands would severely mark up/scratch the coating...
Jano4
My response was in reply to a specific question (see original post http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5486044&postcount=278):
The question was did the jack stands leave any marks after jacking up the car for an extended period. My answer to this is a definite no. There are no marks or indentations left due to extended jacking.
Now to your point about dragging things across the surface; in that same post I mentioned that I have to be careful as grit trapped under the jack wheels will cause scratches. This is something that will always be an issue if you don't have a clear coat. Whilst a clear coat will also get scratched, it is better at hiding them.
However typical dragging or sliding around of tools like wrenches does not cause a problem.
How long after applying did you do that test with the wrench?
Thanks Monty. Great choice owning a Turbo, that power is definitely intoxicating. Whilst the standard black looks amazing right after detailing, up close it begins to show any dust very quickly. Basalt is a great color as I think it probably gives a few more days worth of "just detailed" appearance.
Irrespective, any black car needs a lot of effort
Thanks MartyDitto!
Hi Rick,
Yes work + cars + everything else has made for a busy year.
Even drove me environMENTAL (excuse the pun)
I just traded the Panamera GTS for a Cayenne SE Hybrid (it was an offer I simply couldn't refuse). Pics to follow soon...
I was aware of that reply but felt the answer needed clarification. In my personal experience, the jack stands left indents and even a small crack after only 1 hour of holding the vehicle in the air. The floor may have 'no issues' with chemical resistance but isn't as tough as I expected.
Grit (assuming rocks) being dragged will cause scratches but a metal object, like a jack-stand or wheels on a jack, will not? I had the same thoughts on the clear coat hiding visible marks better.
This was done four weeks after the coating had been applied. Most recently the plastic wheels from my snowblower instilled some minor scratching as well. I've talked with a few other members and will eventually make a dedicated post on my experience with RB's durability once I have closer to a year on it.
Very interesting. Do you feel like you lay it down thin or thick? I know it's tough to quantify or measure, but I'm just wondering if it went down too thick if you're getting indentations 4 months after painting? I can say 100% for certain that I get zero indentations from floor jack use. Even with the Cayenne which is a heavy vehicle. I don't recall how long I waited before I first used jacks on the surface, but I will go through my records and let you know.
Also to clarify: a floor jack will definitely cause fine scratches if there is grit (small stone/ sand particles) stuck under the wheels and causing the wheels on the jack not to turn as you drag it. These are actions that I suspect would also scratch metal surfaces due to the concentrated force and again I think it is is more noticeable due to the metallic type finish of the RB and lack of clear coat.
69bigblok
Well-known member
Hey EMC2! Hope you are doing well. I had the chance to enjoy scrolling through all your thread pictures again. Love your Porsche lineup and glad you are still enjoying them! They are beautiful and the garage looks clean as always.
Dave, the floor is holding up brilliantly - the floor is incredible - Zero issues 3 years on now.
The pics above were taken around August and nothing has changed, except that I far preferred the weather in August
I'll be sure to post some new pics again soon.
Bump.
It's now been 6.5 years...how's that floor holding up?
Hi Dave
Actually I took some pics over Christmas for that exact purpose - just never got around to posting them.
The paint still looks excellent. I'll post the pics this weekend.
Hi 69bigblok sorry I missed your post - been away for a while - thanks for the compliment and hope you are doing well. Still loving the garage and the cars - just not getting quite as much time in them as I'd like these days.
Very glad to hear it's holding up well. Obviously, I've been following this for a while. I remember dribbling a few drops of POR-15 on a shop floor many moons ago, and it was NOT coming off. So this idea hit home right away with me. And now the finish has been down long enough, and seen enough use, to be a real meaningful test of Rust Bullets durability.
I look forward to seeing those pictures.
I look forward to seeing those pictures.
Dick in Wisconsin
Well-known member
I put four coats (IIRC) of Rust Bullet and NO clear on my 1,000sf race shop floor during the summer of 2015. The floor had been poured during the summer of 2014 and the concrete guy had put a sealer on it. Following instructions from the RB dealer I bought it from, I ground the floor with a machine from Home Depot and a diamond wheel. Lots of work, what a mess, but it had to be done. I washed and vacuumed the floor five times after that and let it dry. That got the job done.
I agree 100% with what EMC2 said about Rust Bullet's sensitive to any moisture (like a drop of sweat). Used the same 3M respirator. As friend is a chemist at a Milwaukee based "coatings company". I asked her to look at RB for me. The first thing she came back with was USE A RESPIRATOR. RB would be nothing like I'd ever used before because of what kind of a coating it is. Said it appeared to be "top notch".
This was my very first experience with large scale painting. My career was in home mortgages and banking. I race vintage NASCAR and ARCA stock cars as a hobby.
I used the same rollers that EMC2 used. I did each coat 1000sf by myself; which was a mistake. I should have had help, or did it in 500sf sections. The RB starts to cure quickly. I had a five gallon pail of it. I think the RB in the roller pan started to cure and by the time I was at the end of 1000sf it was getting "thick". RB had sent me additional solvent to "thin it", but it took me a while to figure out how to use it. I have roller marks.
EMC2's floor looks smaller than 1000sf, which is why I think his job was better than mine.
I did end up with "little pimples" in some areas of the floor. I called RB and they said it was probably "off gasing" of the product, maybe should have stirred more solvent in as the product sat in the pail. I think it was curing faster than I could put it down.
In the end, I am very happy with Rust Bullet. My floor isn't perfect, but this was my first attempt at a floor with a unique product that isn't like brushing cheap paint on a 2x4. My first attempt at a large scale paint project.
I stole EMC2's picture because it shows exactly how the RB floor in my race shop looks like (and the plywood floor in my enclosed Bravo race trailer that I put five coats of RB on).
It cured with just a very slight amount of texture, which has a great benefit. Rust Bullet isn't slippery when wet. Whether I put water on the floor, or snow gets dragged in from the snowblower, or my feet are wet ... the floor is not slippery. This really, really surprised me. I have in-floor hydronic heating so the water evaporates off in a short period of time.
Someone mentioned jack stands making marks. I put the 3400# Cup and ARCA cars on jack stands for months on end and I don't think I've seen any marks from the jack stand feet.
The first winter I did leave some heavy boxes on the floor and a 12 volt battery from the trailer on the floor. When I moved them in the spring, the floor where those sat was darker than the rest of the floor. I tried cleaning the dark spots with degreaser, brake cleaner, etc. and nothing would change the dark color. This is reminiscent of what the guy with the bags of fertilizer said.
I can slide metal stuff across the floor that isn't too heavy without scratching. But if I slide heavy metal across the floor it can leave a scratch through one layer. Sometimes I drop a tool without leaving a mark, sometimes the RB is chipped. I think the RB coated floor or more resilient to scratches, chips, and divots than a bare concrete floor.
Where the floor jack moves back and forth to lift the race cars, I can see some darkening of the RB. The top layer isn't wearing off, it isn't scratched, maybe just dirty and I need to rub harder with the brake clean.
I used red RB to mark four 12"x12" squares to park the race car tires on so I know when the cars are centered. Had trouble getting the red RB to adhere after roughing up the fourth coat of original RB. My retailer had a RB chemist contact me. She asked for pictures, had a detailed phone discussion about what was happening, batch number on the can, etc. She had me rough the red up again, some places down to the original RB, FedEx'd me a new can of red RB from a different batch on her nickel. I put on four or five coats of the new RB red. Better, but not perfect.
I found the RB to be easy to kneel on when I'm wearing shorts or raise myself up on my elbow with a short sleeve shirt. Maybe epoxy has the same surface feel, I don't know. But it feels "soft".
Using a fine bristled push broom, anything on the floor really cleans up easy with one pass.
I've had brake fluid drip on the floor and sit there for a few days to a week or two and I see NO impact on the RB. I can have brake clean drip on the floor that doesn't get cleaned up for a few hours, NO impact on the RB. I clean grease, oil, gear lube, etc. up with brake clean with NO impact on the RB.
All in all, I'm very happy with my Rust Bullet race shop floor and trailer floor. I learned somethings about applying it and I think if I used it again I'd have a "more perfect" result.
Probably what RB needs to do is make a list of the experiences we've had and make a YouTube video to help the newbies apply it.
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Great information ****! Thanks for sharing your experiences with RB.
So with the boxes...you are saying you can't leave RB covered for long periods of time? So if I had a may in front of my bench, or at the service door, I can expect it to darken under those mats?
So with the boxes...you are saying you can't leave RB covered for long periods of time? So if I had a may in front of my bench, or at the service door, I can expect it to darken under those mats?
Dick in Wisconsin
Well-known member
Its kinda weird. Since I found the original "dark spots", I've had lots of boxes, some heavy, sitting for long periods of time without any apparent change in the color of the RB. I'm not home tonight, but Monday I'll look under the heavy WeatherTech door maps that are just inside each man door and look for color change.
I'm thinking the color change came just during the initial year or so of curing by the RB.
That's great feedback ****. Thanks for sharing.
I'm about to post some updates from Dec 2018 below.
Here are the pics from Dec 2018 (6 years after installation):
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https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=6964&pictureid=93909
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Thanks ****. No hurry...just a curious behavior for a product not exposed to a lot of UV.
EMC2, those pictures look like the day you put the product down. Aging very well from what I can see.
Good to see no tire lifting, especially given the performance tires being parked on it. Have you done anything special in that regard? Parking on carpet squares, letting tires cool a few hours outside the shop before parking, etc.?
EMC2, those pictures look like the day you put the product down. Aging very well from what I can see.
Good to see no tire lifting, especially given the performance tires being parked on it. Have you done anything special in that regard? Parking on carpet squares, letting tires cool a few hours outside the shop before parking, etc.?
Hi Dave,
I never worry at all about the tire temps - definitely no carpets or special treatment like that
(which is one of the key reasons I decided on Rust Bullet all those years ago). Fortunately the product delivered on my expectations. Each of the 3 spots has had a combination of 911, Cayenne's and Panamera's over the majority of the last 6 years and there has been zero lifting or wear from tires. There have definitely been some hot tires on there more than just a few times 
Dick in Wisconsin
Well-known member
Here are some pictures of the floor. First two are the WeatherTech mat at the man door and how the RB reacted underneath it.
The second two show "stains" on the RB from something (I can't remember) that was in a spray bottle that sat on the floor probably over winter and the 12 volt deep discharge battery that said over a winter.
This afternoon I tried to "clean" the "stains" off with brake cleaner and neither the stains nor the RB were touched by the brake cleaner.
But as I said before, I now regularly set boxes and heavy stuff on the RB and there is no apparent change in the color.
I never drive cars from the street into the garage, just race cars in and out of the trailer so I can't opine on whether hot tires impact the RB.
Keep the questions coming!
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Thanks EMC2. That's what I thought, but wanted to be sure.
And thanks again ****. I see what you're saying. I guess if the stuff wears like iron, and a few discolored spots occur on occasion, I'll take that over pealing any day.
And thanks again ****. I see what you're saying. I guess if the stuff wears like iron, and a few discolored spots occur on occasion, I'll take that over pealing any day.
Dick in Wisconsin
Well-known member
I don't know what would happen if I had a bus barn with Rust Bullet on the floor, drove the 48,000# Prevost on it, and then tried to turn the steer tires lock to lock.
I wish I'd kept what I took out of the roller tray when I did the application.
I used the large Home Depot orange trays. One tray for each application, I didn't try to clean and reuse them. When I was done with the project, the left over RB in the roller trays had hardened. I was going to toss the trays until I "flexed" one of the trays and the left over RB popped out in a large single sheet. It was really metallic. I was able to pop out almost all the cured RB from other other trays, some of it stayed in the trays and I couldn't remove it.
A few more thoughts about Rust Bullet:
1. If you get it on your hands, try taking it off with the RB solvent immediately; I emphasis "try". I had RB on my hands and legs for a few weeks after I was done with the project. I was able to "chip" some of it off, but the rest had a loosen and wear off over time.
2. If you accidentally get the RB on something, like a door handle, unless you hit it with RB solvent right away ... its on permanently. Forever.
3. I used disposable gloves. Buy lots of them. I didn't take time during coats to reglove as once in a while the gloves tore and I had RB on my hands.
4. Whatever shoes and socks you use for the project, plan on tossing them out at the end. Make sure the shoes don't have holes in the bottom. Don't walk in the house with the project shoes and socks on.
5. Have plenty of large pieces of cardboard to set the RB bucket on for mixing and transfer to a small pail to empty into the roller tray. Shaded place like a garage would be nice.
6. Get more than enough rollers, frames, and trays. I did 1,000sf shop. In retrospect I should have used two or three rollers for each coat rather than one. The RB in the roller and in the ends of it will cure from the first time you dip it in the RB. So at the end of the the coat you'll be trying to apply partially cured RB; I think this degrades the finished product a little bit. You can always return the unused things to Home Depot or where ever you got them.
7. The RB starts to cure the instant it is exposed to air. It actually cures quickly. If I remember correctly I could walk on it in 45 minutes and was doing the next coat in four hours (all this is in the instructions). I wanted to move the shop stuff and race car back into the shop quickly, so I discussed the cure time with the RB chemist and she told me when the RB would be fully cured ... wasn't very long. IIRC 72hours.
8. The subsequent coats must be put on quickly, before the RB cures too far otherwise there might not be good adhesion. I think the limit was 12 hours (????), but again this is in the instructions.
9. Have a good sized garbage can with a heavy liner to put the used rollers and frames into.
10. Think about how big of an area you're covering, how much manpower you have, and if you should break the application up into stages. I think 1,000sf is on the cusp of too big for one person. Knowing what I know now, I would NOT tackle 1,100 or 1,200sf or more with one person. I think 750sf by one person is doable. I think I would have had a better finished product had I done my shop in as two 500sf sections. Although maybe 1,000sf would be OK now because I understand how RB applies and most importantly how it cures. If doing 1,000sf I would certainly use a new roller, frame, and tray every 500sf and work harder to keep the RB can lid secure because it cures whenever its exposed to air.
11. The higher the humidity, the faster the RB cures. Low humidity is best time apply.
12. Plan your bathroom breaks!
I bought my Rust Bullet from Justin at Garage Flooring in Grand Junction, Colorado. If you're on the fence about it, order a small can, and try it on a corner of your garage. I just looked back and it appears I did five coats.