Garage Planning, here's where we are......

[River19]

Thanks for all the suggestions over the past few days....spoke with my buddy/contractor last night with garage ideas.....

Quick bakground......northern VT build, for storage and workshop space....there is a budget.....

28x32'

Gambrel Style to maximize the upstairs finishing possibilities

2x6 walls

10' high walls

18x9' door........I was thinking 16x8, then you guys helped me think through 18' wide, and Sean (contractor) suggested 9' high. I asked about 9' door on 10' wall and he said low profile can do 9' in 10'....we'll see.

"car port/covered area" off one side away from the wind so we can park sleds, tractor etc. away from blowing snow.

Single "man door" 36" wide on the "carport" side....away from wind and covered....

Cement slab most likely (waiting on concrete pricing) 6"....once I get the price I will ask about upgrading to thicker

My lot that we are building it on has its own town water hookup....so I'm thinking a shop sink/dog washing station is in the future.....I'm thinking of a 1000 gallon tight tank....I don't want a second full septic

I would like a half bath or 3/4 bath at some point but no one will be living above this thing so I'm not worried about 1000 gallons and getting it pumped.

Board and Batten siding.....needs to look barn-ish

Getting pricing on metal roof vs. shingles.....one is more material less labor and one is the opposite....so we'll see.

Windows........since we used the higher end Andersens in green in the cabin we need to match them (I'm married hence "need"). I might frame out the upstairs windows and hold off on installing them for a couple years to stretch the budget.

I'm thinking higher horizontal transom windows on the bottom floor, I don't want peering eyes but want light.

I will be insulating this thing eventually and adding a wood stove to the shop.....

Full electric, 100 amp or 200amp? Thinking 200....

Hopefully we can come in the budget of $25-28K ish.....

We did 50% of our cabin build ourselves so some of this will probably be done by us.....but we'll see how much

Am I missing something? Any of these things seem obtuse?

Thanks

Steve

 

[TwinCharged RX-7]

I would just do 2 smaller doors instead of the big single.

 

[Want2race]

I like what you are doing. I'm a big fan of single vs 2 doors. I hate my twins!

Best of luck

 

[bczygan]

Big single door but header for additional future smaller one in a good location.

Depending on structure of carport area, if it is paved, and will ever get regular walls, make sure the slab has reinforced thickened edges or footings that may be required later.

 

[Onewolf]

Cement slab most likely (waiting on concrete pricing) 6"....once I get the price I will ask about upgrading to thicker

Why thicker than 6"? Why thicker than 4"? I didn't see a lift listed on your wish list.

I'm not sure I see the advantage of a 9' tall door versus 8' tall. 8' is tall enough for the largest pickup/suv. 9' is not tall enough for an RV.

 

[River19]

Why thicker than 6"? Why thicker than 4"? I didn't see a lift listed on your wish list.

I'm not sure I see the advantage of a 9' tall door versus 8' tall. 8' is tall enough for the largest pickup/suv. 9' is not tall enough for an RV.

My largest truck depending on the topper cap choice and possible Yakima Kayak rack on top would be tight at 8' tall right now with 35" tires........so the higher the better. I'm trying to make sure I'm prepared for anything, like a large trailer with a hobby tractor etc.who knows......if we can do it, might as well....but it is probably overkill.

I like the look of 2 single doors but 8' wide wouldn't do, and by the time you go 10' wide I might as well have done the 18' single......but nothing is set in stone yet.

The thought of framing out a header for a garage door or doorway on the carport side just in case isn't a bad one. Lumber is relatively cheap.

We are exploring the idea of the tight tank, if for nothing else other than a shop sink and dog wash station. When else will I have an excavator on site to dig.....already digging the foundation at that point.....might as well dig another hole.

Regarding the slab......again, I am an overkill kind of guy......if 6" in a very cold climate is fine and stable then I guess I can live with it. I was thinking if 8" was a nominal up-charge then maybe we entertain the idea. From what I know the slab will be thicker at the sides and have some type of perimeter footing, but I haven't gotten a quote or specs yet.

I appreciate all the ideas and thought provoking questions....and I am wide open to people challenging my thought process on this.....I have no ego with this stuff......I could be thinking about something wrong so feel free to call me out.....

Steve

 

[Cyberbear]

Larger doors provide better light and ventilation, especially when running the vehicle indoors for extended periods. I've always preferred steel roll-up doors, they take almost no room and are easy to install for the DIYer. No question, go with 200 amp service, not a major cost increase and allows for future expansion of the electrical system. Steel is cheaper than concrete, so use plenty to achieve the strength you want, 4" is plenty for vehicles, thicker is only needed around the base of lift legs.

 

[River19]

Larger doors provide better light and ventilation, especially when running the vehicle indoors for extended periods. I've always preferred steel roll-up doors, they take almost no room and are easy to install for the DIYer. No question, go with 200 amp service, not a major cost increase and allows for future expansion of the electrical system. Steel is cheaper than concrete, so use plenty to achieve the strength you want, 4" is plenty for vehicles, thicker is only needed around the base of lift legs.

Thanks, based on what I have read over the past few months on here.....you like to overbuild things as well

So if you think I would be fine with 6" then I appreciate the opinion.

 

[matt_i]

You could probably get by with 4" concrete unless you have big heavy equipment like forklifts or big machine shop stuff. Reinforce it with actual steel rebars, set it on chairs, and don't "pull it up" into the wet concrete. Set it where its supposed to be and pour around/over it.

On your question of 100A vs 200A service, it would be the amount of equipment you intend to have wired up inside of it that would make the difference. Lights, ceiling fans, 1 air compressor, go with 100A. If you want to run a 20hp CNC lathe, I'd go to the 200A service. The biggest influence is the amount of run you have from the transformer...if this is a separate service, the power company may dictate some terms to you.

 

[River19]

I think 200amp seems to be a no brainer on this one.

I'm thinking a permanent large compressor in one corner which could feed multiple wall regulators/plug-ins so I can plug a hose in anywhere along the perimeter and run an air tool or three.

Then any woodworking equipment will be on casters so I can roll it out into the center of the garage when I want to work on a project but then roll it back when I am done so I can get a vehicle in there. Chances are we wouldn't have more than one vehicle up there at a time, but we can park one under the car port as well.....heck we park 4-6 up at the cabin on the dirt driveway anyways.

Part of this project will be to staymat my large driveway.....900'+, right now it is fine dirt like baby powder during the summer and 10" deep mud in mud season. The top by the cabin is staymat and has held up well since 2009.

That will run me $4000-6000......

 

[gnpenning]

Good to see your going to do the 200 amp service. Most of your woodworking tools should be able to be wired either 110 or 220. I didn't see anything about a dust collector. Things that you may need to upgrade later are better to do now.

You can put a 9' door in a 10' wall. I'm a taller and wider the door the better. The LHR track put more strain on the door and they don't open as nice. The longer radius gives a smoother opening door. Once you are over 8' your considered commercial. Your opener will be the same up to a 10' high. Just because someone opened there 9' door with an 8' opener doesn't mean it is right. Give yourself some space, but doors can be ordered in 3" height increments. 8'3', 8'6' ,8'9" etc. This way you can get the height you need and a wider radius track the best of both worlds.

If your doing woodworking or metal work make sure you get a steel backed door. They clean up better and do not have shelves to catch dust that dumps on you everytime you open the door.

 

[River19]

Good to see your going to do the 200 amp service. Most of your woodworking tools should be able to be wired either 110 or 220. I didn't see anything about a dust collector. Things that you may need to upgrade later are better to do now.

You can put a 9' door in a 10' wall. I'm a taller and wider the door the better. The LHR track put more strain on the door and they don't open as nice. The longer radius gives a smoother opening door. Once you are over 8' your considered commercial. Your opener will be the same up to a 10' high. Just because someone opened there 9' door with an 8' opener doesn't mean it is right. Give yourself some space, but doors can be ordered in 3" height increments. 8'3', 8'6' ,8'9" etc. This way you can get the height you need and a wider radius track the best of both worlds.

If your doing woodworking or metal work make sure you get a steel backed door. They clean up better and do not have shelves to catch dust that dumps on you everytime you open the door.

Outstanding advice, thank you very much.

The dust collection system was in the back of my mind. I think when I retire I would love to do more woodworking so making sure we can install a system like that would be fantastic. Heck I am only 40 now so I have a few years before I can do that more than occasionally. But damn that is one system I need to plan for....thanks for the reminder.

For now the hunting dogs being able to be washed inside and possibly crash in the garage would be nice......right now when we have hunting buddies come we have up to 10 bird dogs in my 1200 sq ft log cabin....so some additional space for pups and a cleaning station would be nice......

Dust collection......officially on the "need to plan for" list.....

Great points on the garage door as well, thank you.

 

[rburke65]

I think you would begone at a 4" slab. Dont know what you are planning to park on it but there are MILLIONS of 4" floors out there.... even with two posts lifts on them. I think 8" is way over kill. So do 5" and spend the extra money elsewhere. I like my high widows....8' to the bottom of the sill n a 13' wall. Good luck!

 

[NUTTSGT]

For now the hunting dogs being able to be washed inside and possibly crash in the garage would be nice......right now when we have hunting buddies come we have up to 10 bird dogs in my 1200 sq ft log cabin....so some additional space for pups and a cleaning station would be nice......

All these dogs crashing in here you might have to name it "The Dog House."

 

[Adriel]

Have a couple thoughts. Since the second floor windows will be framed out for future windows, how about making a legal egress? With all those dogs and people, might be nice to have the loft storage as secondary bunk room. Also, if can be made living quarters by future owner, add value? My cousin was a hunting guide and had his home built with a huge room in the basement for the hunters. He sadly was a hot spot killed in a huge Utah fire.

For the transom windows, the closer to the ceiling, the more the ceiling can add to the amount of light. Think transoms are a great idea, be keeping with the vernacular architecture, and with them being hoppers vent the warm air out.

I especially like the idea of a dog bath! Keeps all the mess out of the home. This Old House had a great article on the subject. I might even have a copy if you can't find it.

Hope this helps...

 

[River19]

I have thought about the legal egress as well, ultimately I can see that upstairs having a simple 3/4 bath, small kitchenette and a pullout sofa for a friend or two to crash. We also can sleep a decent amount in our cabin, so that works nicely.

The "Dog House".....well there is a local dive bar named the same things....so......may or may not work out that well.

Good idea on the transoms working in conjunction with the ceiling, depending on the ceiling finish.

The ideas are coming together well here. The thing I like about it is that many of these ideas can be planned for with the initial build and completed over time so I can maximize the effectiveness of the original budget.

Adriel - BTW, sorry to hear about your cousin, that is tough.

 

[youwish2bme]

I have thought about the legal egress as well, ultimately I can see that upstairs having a simple 3/4 bath, small kitchenette and a pullout sofa for a friend or two to crash. We also can sleep a decent amount in our cabin, so that works nicely.

The "Dog House".....well there is a local dive bar named the same things....so......may or may not work out that well.

Good idea on the transoms working in conjunction with the ceiling, depending on the ceiling finish.

The ideas are coming together well here. The thing I like about it is that many of these ideas can be planned for with the initial build and completed over time so I can maximize the effectiveness of the original budget.

Adriel - BTW, sorry to hear about your cousin, that is tough.

Yeah the legal egress got me.. I built a 1 1/2 story with the stairs being entered from the garage. Only at Final did the inspector sprung on me that the upstairs needed it's own egress that is not thru the garage.


Hitch

 

[Kevin54]

Subscribed. I'll be interested in following this as I'm doing a 28' x 36' and basically the same as you. 10' walls, 2x6 studding.

 

[River19]

Subscribed. I'll be interested in following this as I'm doing a 28' x 36' and basically the same as you. 10' walls, 2x6 studding.

Fantastic.....hopefully we both make different small mistakes.....nothing too bad

Still waiting on the cement quote......but we also have a bunch of other stuff going on at the cabin from a burst pipe this winter.....fun stuff.