Garage plans

[whall]

First post here but I have browsed this forum for a while.

I plan to have built a separate garage building on property I already own. I have been studying county permit requirements for a while and believe my next step is to generate the building plans that can be used for the permit application.

One way to do this is to have an architect draw up some sort of rough plans and then have a licensed engineer "redline" the plans.
The county permit requires specific places for the licensed engineer sign off on items such as roof snow load and foundation requirements.

What I am thinking of doing is instead of finding an architect to draw up the plans, just purchase the plans from this internet site

Plan 68500VR: Lift-Friendly Modern RV Garage Plan

This spacious garage plan comes with a tandem bay for two automobiles and a large RV bay.The slanted roof line gives the garage a contemporary appearance.Related Plans: Add a front door with garage plan 68579VR. Get loft space above with garage plans 68491VR, 68448VR and 68596VR.

www.architecturaldesigns.com

These plans are stick built. I could live with pole barn but since the plans I can purchase are stick built (which I believe makes the garage a little more flexible for future enhancements), stick built is fine even if there might be some additional cost.

This is the building I want, except that I want the garage 45 ft deep rather than 40 and they will modify the plans for some additional $$.

These plans do not have any specs on snow load or foundation, they simply "meet or exceed the IRC for the year they were drawn up".

I talked to the engineer about purchasing the plans linked above and then he would redline them to county building codes. Engineer said he has never done it this way.

Any feedback on using the web site in the link for the architecture plans and then having a local engineer red line the plans according to county permit specs? Has anyone used the web site for plans and did it save time and cost or...

 

[CraigStu]

I tried to read between the lines a bit and am not sure whether or not you have been in to talk in person to someone in your county permit office. If you haven't I suggest you do this first. Although he can probably pull up the info on his PC I would get a plat of your property and print 6-8 copies so you can work them over in pencil. The last time I did that I had two locations that I thought would work well for a detached 2 bay garage. One was too close to the well to house connection pipe, and moving it some would have put it too close the septic drain field. The other was underneath a power line. Ok, so how about adding an oversized single car bay to the existing garage? He gave me a few pointers and I went back to my plat w/ my pencil and ruler. A quick look at my next plan and he said that would work so now we need real drawings. Then I found a builder who did his own plans and we worked them out. Later my builder said he wished all his jobs went so well. He put in for the permit and happened to get the same guy I had been meeting with. He looked at the plans, saw my name, said yep these are exactly what I have been working with him on. Boom, here is your permit.

 

[whall]

I have a plat map but you brought up something I need to check into. The lots in the this subdivision have a shared well and each house has its own septic/leach field. I know where the septic/ leach field is located and also know where the natural gas and electrical power come in. But.. I realized I dont know where the underground water pipe is located. I better find out before doing anything. Thanks!

 

[HUSTLESTUFF]

Craig is on the right track. I built my 36 x 80 shop with hand drawn plans. For the foundation I had a soils test and the county actually had pre- approved drawings for the foundation that I used. On my house I had an engineer design the foundation. As for a stick built, I used trusses and the truss company did the calcs the county required. Draw up some plans based on the above designs and a plot plan and go talk to the county or city. Good luck

 

[whall]

Next snag in building this garage.. The house on this lot was built in 1993 and its in a subdivision with its own HOA run water well. I have now checked with the county and the HOA and the only record they have of the water is the underground pipe that runs along the street. I dont think there is any record of where the water pipe runs from the street to the house. County guy checked the permit.. not in there.

I asked the county permit guy if they would still let me build the garage (stick with concrete foundation) without knowing where the water line is (since it appears there is no records) and he they would.

I of course have to locate all the other underground utility lines (electric, natural gas) and septic/ leach but these are no problem. I understand the county would NOT let me build over either the electric of gas lines.

What I believe my risk will be not knowing where the water line is will be damaging the water line while digging the garage foundation. If this happens, we will then know where the water line is and move/ repair it. There will be some chance that the foundation could be built over the water line without knowing its there or disturbing it. But if the water line was disturbed either during building or broke later after the foundation was in place, I believe I could have the leak found by a hydrogen gas test like this https://schoonoverinc.com/vacuum-ma...ydrogen-leak-detector/underground-line-leaks/ If the failure was under the foundation, I would just have to then go through the extra hassle and cost to re-route the water pipe. I understand the hydrogen test will only find leaks. Im not aware of any method to find the whole length water line if its not leaking.

At least I believe this is the option I have.

 

[CraigStu]

I think you can get a good idea of where the line is by finding where it enters your house. Then look for the shortest straightest route to get to the road pipe. If there are any trees in the area old enough to have been there since the house was built you can be sure they avoided the roots. You can try the dowsing method yourself and although I have never used them, I am pretty sure that there are sensors that could find it also. Is there a shutoff valve near the road?

 

[cliffcharb]

Personally I would source a local draftsmen to create plans. #1 you can get exactly what you want, #2 local typically knows the municipality requirements, #3 digital copies are easily obtainable.

In my case I needed both digital and paper copies for site engineers, the city, surveyors etc. A simple phone call or email and they were delivered.

A couple things I wish I knew before selecting the draftsman for my plans were to have detailed wall layouts and a lumber take-off (material list) supplied.

 

[whall]

Update.. I used 811 to locate underground services which included gas, electric, phone and fortunately have no problem with these services. No problem also for the septic and leach field.

Im still left with the issue of not knowing where the water line is and as far as I can tell, there is no record of where it is. There is a meter and shut off valve on the street and I know where the water line enters the house and if I draw a straight line, the water line would go under where I want to build the garage. However, there is about equal chance that the water line was run along the property boundary to a metal pole marker before turning towards the house in which case I would not have any issue.

I found out that you actually can find out where a water line runs. The service has to disconnect the water line at cut off and run an electrical wire through the pipe. They then put some sort of electrical signal on the wire and use a detector above ground to map out the pipe run.

Something Im wondering about. In this area, the frost line is 3 ft deep so Im assuming that the water pipe is burried at least three foot deep. The likely construction for the garage will be stick buiit with a concrete foundation (which requires a licensed engineer approval for the permit application).

So if the water line is burried at least three foot deep, will the foundation excavation "find" and of course damage the water line?

Im leaning towards not worrying about the water line unless I find it during excavation in which case it will have to be re-routed around the foundation. The county does not require that I know where the water line is before digging (at least that is what I was told when I visited the permitting office and talked to someone). I did get a "clear" from the 811 exercise which I think is all the county cares about.

 

[duneslider]

I have had to move waterlines for projects before. As long as you are aware of the possibility and plan for the added expense there is no issue with it.

I would be very surprised if the water line doesn't run fairly straight from the meter/shutoff at the street to where it enters the house. I personally wouldn't want to build a structure over a water line. Others may be fine with this but my feeling is if you have an excavator there already to dig a foundation just dig a trench around the structure for a new water line and then you know you won't have any issues. The cost of replacing a waterline is the excavator. Poly waterline is fairly cheap and with a garage that big are you planning for water and a drain for the garage anyway? The plumber will need to be coming by for that also.

As for plans, the internet plans are fine. We have used them in the past and have a local engineer that runs calcs and stamps them for us. We also have a local that will draw plans for us and then we have an engineer stamp it. None of the architects I know would want to do a small garage, not saying none would but none that I know would want to.

I wouldn't hesitate on internet plans for a garage.

 

[whall]

are you planning for water and a drain for the garage anyway?

No plans for water or sewer for the garage building, just electrical power. I understand that you typically do not get a 100 percent return on the investment when building a detached garage. So, Im only building exactly what I want which is mainly extra storage space. To some extent, I dont want to take the devaluation hit for things that would be nice (and help sell the house) for the next owner. Also considering property tax and insurance cost increases. Water and sewer really complicate things as I have a septic and leach field and also can find no records with the county on what exactly was built. FYI, this is Ouray county Colorado and whomever kept records back in 1993 must have been spending too much time skiing or in the mountains or something LOL.

I dont know if lumber futures are any indication of what a garage will cost now but I have been watching this https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/lumber

Thanks for all the feedback, its been useful to me!!!

 

[dcg9381]

I think the way my GC does it is he draws "architect" plans and then submits those plans to a lumber supplier (ProBuilt). Part of the lumber "package" is someone that actually does the engineering for spans, joists, etc - it's part of building the lumber package.