Gas line questions

[Rabbit929]

So we found our main gas line, and our main service cable in our house are zip tied together laying across the floor along the corner of the room. Needless to say I aim to correct both, but the electrical I haven’t been able to get a contractor to come back after seeing it.

Anyway, when I plumb new gas line in to go to the basement, 1 1/4 natural gas line, how do you know if you need a regulator, and how much?
I also intend to add a line to the garage, (literally right next to my gas meter) for a future 30-50k btu heater.

I have a pipe threader I just am not entirely sure where screens or regulators are needed.

 

[naturalgas]

The gas will be regulated at the service line before the meter.the only regulator you’ll need after that will be at each appliance, usually built into gas valve. Commercial elevated pressure is different ballgame.


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[59 wagon man]

did you just buy this house? if i was the plumber you called seeing that i would run also unless you agreed to a total repipe of the gas system. thank your friendly lawyer for that

 

[iced98lx]

Take a look at better advice below

 

[Rabbit929]

Yep, that seems to be what all of them are doing. So I’m stuck doing it myself.
I can handle the pipe work, just unsure if every appliance needs a regulator because as of now, not a single on has one.

 

[naturalgas]

If you don’t have any stand alone regulators on the appliance service line, they are built into the gas valve as most modern day appliance are.


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[Rabbit929]

Cool cool so I’m good to just run the lines as necessary?
Everything I got on natural gas is
Boiler
Water heater
30k btu indoor Williams space heater
And I eventually plan to hook up a 40k (or so) garage heater.

 

[HoosierBuddy]

Just jumping in here to correct the misinformation.

Standard Natural Gas delivery pressure in the U.S. is generally 7 inches
water column (if your altitude is not too high above sea level) or about 0.25 PSI. Most natural gas appliances require an inlet pressure in the range-ish of, say, 5 to 14 inches water column (less than 0.5 PSI) in order to operate and the gas valve in the appliance then regulates down the small amount necessary for proper combustion.

Anything over about 1/2 PSI will require the customer regulate at some point in front of the appliance. This could be at a manifold in the house, at each appliance, etc....but in no case should the pressure be higher than the appliances maximum inlet pressure rating (as noted in your appliance's owner's manual) at the appliance's gas valve (OR) it may damage the gas valve or the appliance may overfire, which could damage it and will create a safety hazard.

Some residential customers have asked their gas company to supply pressure at more than 1/4 PSI. The majority of these are 2 PSI setups where the customer has CSST piping (or some other issue piping issue) where they want 8 times the normal delivery pressure. These customers (as stated before) must regulate that pressure down somewhere before the appliance.

The only way I would know for sure what pressure the OP is receiving would be to go to his house and install a gauge in his piping and read it. I could look at a picture of his gas pressure regulator at his gas meter and hazard a guess BUT...regulators are typically adjustable to some degree as to outlet pressure, most if not all of them can be equipped with stiffer or lighter springs to change the output pressure range off of what the regulator was originally stamped....and SOME customers in the U.S. don't even have pressure regulators at their meters because the regulation is done by the gas company prior to their service line (low pressure systems).

So...not sure where the guys above got some of the info posted....but thought I'd try to clear it up.

Phil

 

[ljhhontx]

Just jumping in here to correct the misinformation.

Standard Natural Gas delivery pressure in the U.S. is generally 7 inches
water column (if your altitude is not too high above sea level) or about 0.25 PSI. Most natural gas appliances require an inlet pressure in the range-ish of, say, 5 to 14 inches water column (less than 0.5 PSI) in order to operate and the gas valve in the appliance then regulates down the small amount necessary for proper combustion.

Anything over about 1/2 PSI will require the customer regulate at some point in front of the appliance. This could be at a manifold in the house, at each appliance, etc....but in no case should the pressure be higher than the appliances maximum inlet pressure rating (as noted in your appliance's owner's manual) at the appliance's gas valve (OR) it may damage the gas valve or the appliance may overfire, which could damage it and will create a safety hazard.

Some residential customers have asked their gas company to supply pressure at more than 1/4 PSI. The majority of these are 2 PSI setups where the customer has CSST piping (or some other issue piping issue) where they want 8 times the normal delivery pressure. These customers (as stated before) must regulate that pressure down somewhere before the appliance.

The only way I would know for sure what pressure the OP is receiving would be to go to his house and install a gauge in his piping and read it. I could look at a picture of his gas pressure regulator at his gas meter and hazard a guess BUT...regulators are typically adjustable to some degree as to outlet pressure, most if not all of them can be equipped with stiffer or lighter springs to change the output pressure range off of what the regulator was originally stamped....and SOME customers in the U.S. don't even have pressure regulators at their meters because the regulation is done by the gas company prior to their service line (low pressure systems).

So...not sure where the guys above got some of the info posted....but thought I'd try to clear it up.

Phil

As a 32yr gas tech I'd say you hit it on the head, only thing I would add is that the 2# and higher output regs we install generally have a red cap on the adjustment cone.

 

[HoosierBuddy]

As a 32yr gas tech I'd say you hit it on the head, only thing I would add is that the 2# and higher output regs we install generally have a red cap on the adjustment cone.

Had a new tech one time grab a 2 PSI regulator off the shelf on a new customer that had converted his appliances from propane... for the new NG meter set. Fortunately he didn't do a turn on, he just set the meter and left it locked off.

30 year tech gets called out a week later to do the turn on and light. He doesn't catch the regulator issue. The homeowner was standing next to him in the house when he cycled the furnace for the first time and it went "KA WAHMPH!!!" and the flame rolled out, about taking his eyebrows off. The customer yelled, "GAWD DAMN! That ain't going to happen every time is it?"

He he. Good times. The older tech has 40 years in now and we still laugh about that one. The young tech found a different company to work for.

 

[BD1]

Call your Natural Gas utilitity company for what they are supplying.
Incoming pressure will vary by location .


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[naturalgas]

Call your Natural Gas utilitity company for what they are supplying.
Incoming pressure will vary by location .


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Best advice. In North Dakota you don’t need a plumbing or gas fitter license to run fuel lines and have it inspected? I’m a retired service tech/ gas fitter 36 years and I wouldn’t add or replace any gas lines in my house without pulling a permit and inspection for insurance co. reasons.


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[75gmck25]

I'm in Northern Virginia, just outside DC, and I can pull a permit and run gas lines in my own home. I don't need any license if its my own house.

We moved gas lines around for the fireplace and water heater during my last renovation and the inspection was almost trivial. We had the pressure gauge installed and were ready to show that it did not leak, and he just glanced at the gauge. I also explained to him about the B-vent we used for the boiler vs. the Duravent Direct Vent we used for the fireplace and he just nodded.

Bruce