Generator Wiring

[ste6168]

All, with the possible storm headed toward Eastern NC, I am starting to think. First, I DO NOT think this storm will affect my area, but, I would rather be somewhat prepared. Anyway, I purchased a Home last August with a well, and well pump. First home with a well... I have a cheap Champion 3500(4000peak) watt generator that I have used for outages in the past to run fridge/freezer and cell chargers. I never had to worry about water, as it was previously supplied by the utility company.

My genny has a 240v outlet, and my pump is wired for 240v, problem is, the pump is in my garage, and the cord is like 3' long. I would not want the generator running in my garage, so can I rig up or do they make a 240v extension cord? I would run the generator just outside the garage, so it would need to be approximately 25/30' long. Obviously, this is not a long term solution, but would simply be to get us through a day or three of no power.

FWIW, pump is 1hp, 7.1 amp @ 240v

Thanks in advance. Hoping Joaquin tracks to the East and stays away, and this thread is irrelevant until next time.

 

[Rookie2]

What I have done is make a 50' extension (#10-3 w ground) with a good matching plug for the generator end and then After switching off the main breaker in the main power panel then remove the panel cover and backfeed the panel thru a 30 amp 2 pole breaker. Now this is only if you have no power company service , they frown on this ! Emergency Only.

 

[pattenp]

Generator cords are available but the problem is the socket end will most likely not match the plug on your pump. I'm sure the pump does not use the neutral and only has a three prong 250V plug, whereas the generator should have a 4 prong outlet that's 125/250V.

 

[ste6168]

What I have done is make a 50' extension (#10-3 w ground) with a good matching plug for the generator end and then After switching off the main breaker in the main power panel then remove the panel cover and backfeed the panel thru a 30 amp 2 pole breaker. Now this is only if you have no power company service , they frown on this ! Emergency Only.

I would rather not backfeed the panel, and just plug the pump directly into the generator. If I go the backfeeding of the panel route, isn't it possible to backfeed through the 220v dryer outlet? I am a pretty handy person overall, an experienced woodworker, but I don't necessarily enjoy working with electricity. The last thing I want to do it pull the cover and hook up/unhook wires

 

[ste6168]

Generator cords are available but the problem is the socket end will most likely not match the plug on your pump. I'm sure the pump does not use the neutral and only has a three prong 250V plug, whereas the generator should have a 4 prong outlet that's 125/250V.

Correct. I believe, but will have to double check, that my pump has a twist-lock style 4 prong plug. I think it would plug directly into my generator if it were close enough, unfortunately, that is not an option.

Here is a link to a similar generator, though I do not have wheels:
http://www.cabelas.com/product/Champion-Watt-Generator-Weekender-Package/909433.uts

 

[mytimeyet]

Something like this might work... As an example:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_545867-24212-6387.0_1z0x2n7__?productId=50088152&pl=1

 

[MTW]

The link you provided shows a generator with 120V outlets only, not sure if that applies here?

Look at the outlets and chord attachments to see if they are marked with the NEMA style numbers. If not look at one of these charts to match up what you have on each end, then you will have the required types to make or buy the proper chord.

https://www.google.com/search?q=nema+plug+chart&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CB0QsARqFQoTCMK_2vDOn8gCFUzMgAodojEIbQ&biw=1360&bih=608

MTW Ω

 

[pattenp]

The gen outlet should be a L14-30 125/250V

 

[theoldwizard1]

Buy 12/4 SJOOW or SOOW cord on eBay (yeah, kind of late for your storm). Then buy the correct ends. If they are 4 wire twits lock, it is likely a L14-20 or L14-30 from this chart.

12 gauge portable cordage is only rated for 15 amps, but that is all your generator will put out anyway.

If you want a cord that is up to the rating of the plug, then buy 10/4 SJOOW or SOOW.

 

[johnbennetch]

I work with generators full time. If we go to an emergency situation we will snip the seal on the meter and remove it and lay it on the ground before backfeeding the panel. In most cases the lineman are glad to pop the new seal on for you because they know you had their safety in mind.

 

[ste6168]

The link you provided shows a generator with 120V outlets only, not sure if that applies here?

Look at the outlets and chord attachments to see if they are marked with the NEMA style numbers. If not look at one of these charts to match up what you have on each end, then you will have the required types to make or buy the proper chord.

https://www.google.com/search?q=nema+plug+chart&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CB0QsARqFQoTCMK_2vDOn8gCFUzMgAodojEIbQ&biw=1360&bih=608

MTW Ω

Correct, this is the generator I have. I simply did a quick search, and linked to the first on that looked similar, without referring to spec. Thanks.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/champion-power-equipment-3500w-4000w-portable-generator

 

[ste6168]

I should've planned sooner. Here is my plan: Hope and pray this storm misses me, but should it, have several gallons of water on hand (luckily, along with woodworking, I brew beer as a hobby, so I have several carboys on hand that I will fill and cap w/ an airlock). Then I won't have to rush and scrape together what I need. I am going to continue this research, and use those NEMA charts to figure out the adapters, and do a "test run" at the house. That way, I can be prepared for the future.

This was some poor planning. At least I didn't wait to buy a generator until the power goes out

 

[nadogail]

"" I am going to continue this research, and use those NEMA charts to figure out the adapters, and do a "test run" at the house. Be prepared for the future. ""

Sounds Good to me, good luck and I hope your adapter gets covered with dust from not being used.

Next, you need to consider fuel. Gas stations are always closed during power outages.

Buy a fuel preservative, like Stabil, so your gas will not turn to junk.

 

[sberry]

Your well is not 120/240. It is 240, it needs 2 hots and a ground.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

That generator has an L14-30r. So u need an L14-30p some 10-3 cordage and a 6-30p or 6-20p, depending ln what your pump has.

 

[ste6168]

Your well is not 120/240. It is 240, it needs 2 hots and a ground.

Nope. Just like several other 1 to 2hp induction motors, my well is in fact 120/240. However, it is currently wired for 240, so yes, it needs 2 hots and a ground. I could re-wire the pump, and run it on 120 if I chose to do so.

Anyway, nowhere in any of my posts, except for the one above, did I mention my well pump being 120/240, so I am uncertain where this even came from?

 

[brewchief]

I would buy a premade generator cord with the proper end that fits your generator and then build a short adapter cord to power the well pump from that. This way you have a cord ready to go if you want to add a transfer panel or breaker interlock later. Home depot does have some plug adapters for generators and you might get lucky and be able to buy everything off the shelf depending on what plug your pump has.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[Charles (in GA)]

You can buy generator extension cords all day long with L14-30 ends like your generator has. You can either make an adapter or buy and adapter (HD has a variety of them) to connect to the well pump.

I made my generator cords, because I was able to get the materials cheaper but time is of the essence here.

Edit: looks like Brewchief and I are on the "same page" here!

Charles

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Buy a fuel preservative, like Stabil, so your gas will not turn to junk.

That and buy ethanol free gas too. We have a number of stations around here that sell it. The local Valero stations have midgrade that is ethanol free.

Charles

 

[ste6168]

That and buy ethanol free gas too. We have a number of stations around here that sell it. The local Valero stations have midgrade that is ethanol free.

Charles

Yes, I only run non-ethanol in everything but my cars. Boat, chainsaw, mower, blower, trimmer, generator, etc. I still don't like to keep it for long. I usually have 10gallons at the house (2x 5 gallon cans). I use blue painters tape to mark the fill up date, and every quarter I use them to fill up the truck, and refill.

This storm track is starting to focus more on the souther VA area, but Eastern NC will still be affected at that, even if just heavy rain. Leaving work at noon, going to get the boat off the lift and onto the trailer, making sure generator and chainsaw startup, re-filling fuel cans and vehicles, and cleaning up any junk in the yard. Hopefully, get that out of the way early and spend the rest of the afternoon in the woodshop.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I wish we had ethanol free gas out here in California. All the stations here blend gasoline with ethanol. And the blended gas *****!

 

[bczygan]

I wish we had ethanol free gas out here in California. All the stations here blend gasoline with ethanol. And the blended gas *****!

There are actually 19 ethanol free gas locations in CA.

http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=CA

Bill

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Im aware of that. I shouldve Said that differently. Theres none near me

 

[nadogail]

BCZYGAN, Thanks for the info, there are two within a reasonable distance from my home.

I had considered asking a pilot to buy 100 octane low lead, from an aviation fuel dealer.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I'm going to probably throw a monkey wrench into this whole question. FYI, a generator does not work quite like utility power.

Your generator is rated at a 1.0 Power factor, meaning for a load like a space heater, resistive loads, incandescent lighting. An electric motor is an inductive load, it's at a lower PF (power factor), we're not even going to go into Capacitive loads. You're going to notice when that motor/pump goes to start the generator is going to take a nosedive on startup, Hz (RPM) is going to drop, voltage probably is going with it, Pump motor windings start heating from low voltage, this equals amp draw is going up. Your generator might just die. Now let's ASSUME it does start and run...it's running at now a .8 PF, not a 1.0 PF. You're now building heat in the generator end and it's possible to cook the generator end and never open the breaker on the generator as the generator end is before the breaker.

Utility power has a whole a lot bigger generator on their end to handle resistive/inductive/capacitive loads, keep that in mind.

Now, for the fun of it, check your L-L, L-N, L- Grd on your generator and see what you have, you may have a generator with a floating Neutral.

I'm just giving you something to think about.

 

[ste6168]

I'm going to probably throw a monkey wrench into this whole question. FYI, a generator does not work quite like utility power.

Your generator is rated at a 1.0 Power factor, meaning for a load like a space heater, resistive loads, incandescent lighting. An electric motor is an inductive load, it's at a lower PF (power factor), we're not even going to go into Capacitive loads. You're going to notice when that motor/pump goes to start the generator is going to take a nosedive on startup, Hz (RPM) is going to drop, voltage probably is going with it, Pump motor windings start heating from low voltage, this equals amp draw is going up. Your generator might just die. Now let's ASSUME it does start and run...it's running at now a .8 PF, not a 1.0 PF. You're now building heat in the generator end and it's possible to cook the generator end and never open the breaker on the generator as the generator end is before the breaker.

Utility power has a whole a lot bigger generator on their end to handle resistive/inductive/capacitive loads, keep that in mind.

Now, for the fun of it, check your L-L, L-N, L- Grd on your generator and see what you have, you may have a generator with a floating Neutral.

I'm just giving you something to think about.

I appreciate this post, but I do think it is somewhat over my head. Just for giggles, I have ran both my table saw and miter saw off the generator in the past, however, like you said, upon start up on the saw, you certainly hear a difference in the generator, like she is running hard. From what I am reading, this could be damaging the generator? FWIW, the miter saw is a 15 amp universal motor, and the table saw is a 2hp induction motor, wired for 120v. I would think the well pump would be no worse than the table saw, but I could be wrong? Also, the generator does in fact have a floating neutral, as it is written on the front, but I am not sure what that means either?

I took the time yesterday, and pulled the cover to look at the well pump. The plug on the pump is a 6-20 plug. It looks like the best way to do this, would be to get a 25' L14-30 extension cord, then make (or buy, not sure which is cheaper) an L14-30 male to 6-20 receptacle. That way, the extension cord could be used for other things in the future, and not be limited to the water pump only, should the need arise. This whole second part, is based on the answers from the first part, btw. I am thinking, it may be more practical to only run the well pump for short periods of time, to refill the pressure tank and fill a few containers of water, if needed.

Thanks yall. For being a low post member, there has been much help on this topic.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

It's been a while sinse I've done Power factor calc, so this may be wrong, I'm not going to try looking it up to be sure. But I think at a .8 PF running a motor, I would not load the generator over 16 amps at 120V. Maybe someone else with more technical knowledge will chime in.

BTW, I don't think the generator rated at 100% load/duty cycle for an extended time.

 

[sberry]

If its got the poop to start the motor it will probably run it just fine.

 

[Vince1955]

Whether you connect your generator (using a safety lockout) or don't use the generator, consider filling your bathtub with water. In the event of lost power, this will allow you to flush toilets or rinse something in the sink. Best of luck.