mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I think he meant that no meter spec'd without considering a generator will be able to have one added. Of course meters exist, but you will need to replace the existing one.
Generators..........
- Thread starter D45
- Start date
I think he meant that no meter spec'd without considering a generator will be able to have one added. Of course meters exist, but you will need to replace the existing one.
4 FN 27
ALLIANCE MEMBER
6768rogues
Banned
Our power seldom goes out and when it does it is usually short term. Maybe every 8 to 10 years we will have a longer outage. That, in my mind, does not justify a huge cost automatic generator and transfer switch. I have a quality portable 5500 watt generator and a bunch of extension cords with multiple plugs on the female ends. I can run the heat, refrigerator, freezer, sump pump, lights, TV and sometimes a computer. It will run 8 or more hours on a tank of gas. If a storm is coming, I fill a couple of gas cans and fill all my cars. I have a good siphon hose. That gives me 50 to 60 gallons of safely stored gas. If the storm does not get here, I use the cans for the lawn mower or dump them in my truck later.
I would make a decision based on the long term reliability of the power grid in your area.
I would make a decision based on the long term reliability of the power grid in your area.
prostreetamx
Well-known member
I picked up 2 used generators so far. One from Craigslist and one recently after a neighbor passed. When I wired my current house I set it up for a generator by putting all the circuits I wanted to feed from a future generator in one 100a sub panel. I can feed this panel with a set of mini cams and a breaker lockout. I live in Las Vegas and my original gas portable generator was not big enough to run my 3 ton A/C compressor, which is why I purchased a second one just for that. I have 2, 3 ton units but can survive if only one has power. If I don't need cooling than one generator will work just fine for me with lots of LED lighting and newer model refrigerators. I have other options for cooking if needed. Where I lived previously, the power went out every time the wind blew hard but so far in the 15 years at my new house, no such issues. It doesn't hurt to have a backup. No sump pumps or wells. Another water supply is in the works as soon as my new garage is finished.
Re: Natural gas.
Post-deregulation many natural gas compressor stations are electric. When the "big one" happens and you rrally want to run your generator, there may be no gas to run it with.
The Feb 2011 dual cascading grid failure in the Southwest being a prime example.
Post-deregulation many natural gas compressor stations are electric. When the "big one" happens and you rrally want to run your generator, there may be no gas to run it with.
The Feb 2011 dual cascading grid failure in the Southwest being a prime example.
Firebrick43
Well-known member
Yep, 3512. They can be set up on several different pressures, even variable and low quality gas directly from a well or landfill gas. There are even dual fuel models now that can burn diesel or NG or a mixture of both.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
It is not about pressure, it is about VOLUME. Worst case, they would have to install a second, possibly larger diameter line from the street.
86turbodsl
Well-known member
Depends on your level of paranoia. I'm pretty paranoid, so i have a Detroit Diesel 2-71 and a whole house switch. My house is all electric (heat pump) so i wanted to be able to stay alive in an extended outage. No nat gas here, or i might have gone that way. At least diesel doesn't go bad very fast.
Exactly my thoughts...........we might lose power 3-5 times per year.
Some of these 3-5 times might just be a flash and off for under a minute, but rarely will it go longer than an hour
With that being said, whole house permanent generators are $5,000 installed...........that is just not happening, nor is it cost effective
$200-$400 for a portable generator, rated 5000-7500 watts are all over Craigslist in my area
A 10,000W generator with a 20hp motor has my eye, for $400
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Just an example of propane:
5500W
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...el-rv-ready-portable-generator-with-wheel-kit
Run time of up to 8 hours on a full tank of gasoline or 6.5 hours on a 20 lb. propane tank at 50% load
or
7500W
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...-fuel-electric-start-generator-carb-compliant
Operates at 74 dBA from 23 ft. and has a run time of up to 8 hours on a full tank of gasoline or 5.5 hours on a 20 lb. propane tank at 50% load
5500W
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...el-rv-ready-portable-generator-with-wheel-kit
Run time of up to 8 hours on a full tank of gasoline or 6.5 hours on a 20 lb. propane tank at 50% load
or
7500W
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...-fuel-electric-start-generator-carb-compliant
Operates at 74 dBA from 23 ft. and has a run time of up to 8 hours on a full tank of gasoline or 5.5 hours on a 20 lb. propane tank at 50% load
7000W
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsma...-Start-Portable-Generator-GEN7000LP/202222975
This generator boasts an engine runtime of 8 hours at 50% on a common 20 lb. gas grill-type cylinder
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsma...-Start-Portable-Generator-GEN7000LP/202222975
This generator boasts an engine runtime of 8 hours at 50% on a common 20 lb. gas grill-type cylinder
Smaller 5250W Pulsar from Costco:
https://www.costco.com/Pulsar-5250-...-and-Propane-Generator.product.100350153.html
One 4 gallon tank of gasoline or 20 lb liquid propane tank provides operation for up to 12 hours at half load
https://www.costco.com/Pulsar-5250-...-and-Propane-Generator.product.100350153.html
One 4 gallon tank of gasoline or 20 lb liquid propane tank provides operation for up to 12 hours at half load
willys55
Member
this is what works for me 12000 watts, runs the whole house, had an electrician wire in the panel and plug on the side of the garage....and when I need it elsewhere on the property I just wheel it there.....thing is awesome.
I forgot to mention that it is dual fuel...gas or propane
I forgot to mention that it is dual fuel...gas or propane
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
86turbodsl
Well-known member
I think your level of need for a generator has to be determined by your risk. In my case, my risk was i live in an area that can be out of power for days at a time in a bad event. I'm on the end of a single phase line. We are always the last to be repaired. My house is all electric and if we have a bad ice storm where the power is out, my family could freeze. Especially if I'm not around. Nobody else could hook up a portable even if they tried. I'm covered. But i didn't spend that much either. My DD 2-71 was $300 and i installed the whole house transfer myself for $1200. It's probably not worth 5K to me if i had to pay somebody else.
Stuart in MN
Well-known member
Support your local Indiana economy and get one of these
Nah, that's not big enough...you need a setup like this.
(This is one of my boss's projects from a few years back, five 3516's and 12.5 MW.)floridafarmer
Well-known member
When we lose power it's usually hurricane/storm related and the power companies priority is the number of customers that are restored by each fix so since I'm alone on my feeder, you need some power usually for a few days...
There were a bunch of whole house units that couldn't take the stress of 5-6 days of constant service so I got a back up for my backup....
There were a bunch of whole house units that couldn't take the stress of 5-6 days of constant service so I got a back up for my backup....
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Nice! Specs? Cost?
floridafarmer
Well-known member
15KW 3Phase with a Lister Petter diesel from the UK. Guy in North Florida builds them from military surplus - goes thru everything - this one had 280 hours. He mounts on the trailer and adds an 80 gallon external tank (in front). I bought at the height of hurricane paranoia last year when we were expecting a rather hard hit. Paid around 5K
I bought a 7000 continous Champion that runs on gasoline. It carries 2 fridges, well pump, washer and dryer, cieling fans, TVs, computers no problem I never tried to run the central AC. They have conversion kits that convert many popular generators to natural gas and propane and make it tri fuel but you will lose some performance. Permanent is really nice, diesel permanent is best but even bigger bucks.
Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
6768rogues
Banned
I think your situation justifies an automatic standby generator that has a fuel supply adequate for the typical outage and some reserve.
This year we had an outage for 3 days, being the first outage for more than a day since 1991,. Other than that, it has only been out long enough to drag out the portable generator a few times. In fact, this reminds me that I have not used it in a while so I will get it out and run some gas through it and service it.
On the fuel choice, something to think about id the reason for the power loss.
A CA earthquake or an East Coast hurricane is going to cover a large area with major problems.
NG lines are one of the first things the emergency guys want turned off due to fire danger.
If you do not have control over your fuel supply then you have no power no matter what is behind the garage.
My choice is a correctly sized tri-fuel.
Run on NG if possible, propane after that, and gas as a last resort.
A CA earthquake or an East Coast hurricane is going to cover a large area with major problems.
NG lines are one of the first things the emergency guys want turned off due to fire danger.
If you do not have control over your fuel supply then you have no power no matter what is behind the garage.
My choice is a correctly sized tri-fuel.
Run on NG if possible, propane after that, and gas as a last resort.
Running , or rated watts are the continuous watts needed to keep items running. Starting watts ( aka surge) are extra watts needed for two to three seconds to start motor-driven products like a refrigerator, AC units or circular saw, this is the maximum wattage the generator can produce. Starting usually applies to devices with motors.
TractorJeff
Well-known member
I've been preaching the lack of NG after a disaster for a long time!
But half of these guys are discussing sporadic power outages. The other half reference disasters(hurricane). You see there is a plus to having an NG unit, as long as it is understood that it is derated from its gasoline output capabilities.
Support your local Indiana economy and get one of these
Should run the whole block.
Falcon67
Well-known member
I found a store, somewhat local, that carries factory reconditioned generators
They have a Troy-Bilt 7000W/10500W Generator for $575
Powered by a Briggs & Stratton 420CC 2100 Series OHV engine
Not an electric start, but the price seems good
http://www.troybilt.com/equipment/troybilt/xp-series-7000-watt-portable-generator-0304781
They have a Troy-Bilt 7000W/10500W Generator for $575
Powered by a Briggs & Stratton 420CC 2100 Series OHV engine
Not an electric start, but the price seems good
http://www.troybilt.com/equipment/troybilt/xp-series-7000-watt-portable-generator-0304781
So, as I look more and more into generators.........I am researching more about wiring
Here is the inside of my Square D 200 load center
So, from my search I have found 3 ways to remotely power a generator:
1) Transfer Switch
2) Panel Interlock
3) Very small 4-6 circuit panel located next to the main panel
Here is the inside of my Square D 200 load center
So, from my search I have found 3 ways to remotely power a generator:
1) Transfer Switch
2) Panel Interlock
3) Very small 4-6 circuit panel located next to the main panel
Looks like this is the correct Interlock Kit for my panel:
http://www.interlockkit.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=K-5410
However, how I do overcome the fact that my panel is full and the upper right hand breaker slot is used?
The transfer switch seems like a rock solid idea, but also the most expensive option
What about buying a small 4-6 circuit subpanel and using this solely for the generator?
http://www.interlockkit.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=K-5410
However, how I do overcome the fact that my panel is full and the upper right hand breaker slot is used?
The transfer switch seems like a rock solid idea, but also the most expensive option
What about buying a small 4-6 circuit subpanel and using this solely for the generator?
LS6 Tommy
Well-known member
https://www.ebay.com/p/Sd-200va-Squ...mp-Qo-Panel-Listed/518496908?iid=291947596670
Looks to be a cheaper interlock option.
You would need to use a couple tandems to make room for the two pole breaker, not all slots can accept them on some panels so you need to verify that they can be used in your panel.
Looks to be a cheaper interlock option.
You would need to use a couple tandems to make room for the two pole breaker, not all slots can accept them on some panels so you need to verify that they can be used in your panel.
mrobins297aaa
Well-known member
here's what I did, I spent a total of $1678 for the generator, the inter lock switch and #8 wire. The generator sits just inside the garage. I only have to wheel it just out side the door of the garage. I have a plug on the outside wall of the garage that connects to a 30 amp breaker in my panel. (you can see the plug in the background of the photo of the generator). I probably could have run #10 wire but my panel is on the other side of the house which is a long way.
It will run every thing in the house except my elec dryer and AC.
Make sure you get one that will run threw the night without having to be re-fueled that's very important. Unless you like getting up in the middle of the night.
I also added a couple things after that I didn't realize I needed. One is called a power back, it let's you know when the power is back on. It sets off a alarm when the power is restored to the panel. Because during the day I was not able to tell when the power was restored my neighbors are not very close......so I needed that. it's that little white box attached to the up right hand side of the panel.
I also bought a baby monitor because I could not hear the alarm from the up stairs.
all in all when the power goes out in fifteen minutes I'm up and running.
the main reason for getting the generator was to run my well pump, one of the worst things about no power when you have a well is no water........I was tried of getting water in a five gallon bucket from the sump in the basement to flush the toilets.
It will run every thing in the house except my elec dryer and AC.
Make sure you get one that will run threw the night without having to be re-fueled that's very important. Unless you like getting up in the middle of the night.
I also added a couple things after that I didn't realize I needed. One is called a power back, it let's you know when the power is back on. It sets off a alarm when the power is restored to the panel. Because during the day I was not able to tell when the power was restored my neighbors are not very close......so I needed that. it's that little white box attached to the up right hand side of the panel.
I also bought a baby monitor because I could not hear the alarm from the up stairs.
all in all when the power goes out in fifteen minutes I'm up and running.
the main reason for getting the generator was to run my well pump, one of the worst things about no power when you have a well is no water........I was tried of getting water in a five gallon bucket from the sump in the basement to flush the toilets.
Attachments
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mrobins297aaa
Well-known member
It runs everything I need, 240v well pump, sump pump, furnace, 2 frig's, freezer, computers, etc
I've had it 3 years and have no complaints.
I've had it 3 years and have no complaints.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
CJ7VFR
Well-known member
So, as I look more and more into generators.........I am researching more about wiring
Here is the inside of my Square D 200 load center
So, from my search I have found 3 ways to remotely power a generator:
1) Transfer Switch
2) Panel Interlock
3) Very small 4-6 circuit panel located next to the main panel
In order for you to be able to use an Interlock kit, you first have to find out whether or not you can use tandem breakers in your load center.
You have one shown down near the bottom right of the panel, but you have to find out if you can add any more in order to free up two spaces at the top. If you can't add any more tandem breakers, then you can't add the Interlock kit to your load center without first removing two breakers in order to free up the space for the Interlocks 30 amp breaker.
That would mean you would either loose two circuits in your house, or you would have to add a small sub-panel next to the main load center and move some of the breakers over to that in order to free up some space.
Normally, the paper instruction sheet that is applied to the inside of the load center door will show you a schematic type diagram of the bus bars and breaker locations. If it can take tandem breakers, it will show you which positions the tandems can go in, how many can be used, and the part numbers for the tandems. If your load centers instruction sheet does not show any of this information, you can look up the load centers part number online, and that will tell you. The load center part number should be located either at the top or bottom of the sheet near one of the corners of the sheet.
Looking at the age of the panel and space between the main power breaker and the other breakers, I have a feeling that they might not make an Interlock kit for your panel. That distance between there is pretty big, and I have never seen an interlock kit with the sliding pieces of metal that were that long. But you never know!
Jim
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