Genius Tools

[_brian_]

I understand Genius Tools is a member here, so maybe one of their representatives watches the forums and might participate.

My query here is very general, what are your thoughts on Genius Tools? I have only recently acquired tools from the brand, including some bit socket sets, random one piece bit sockets and standard hex sockets and some extensions. My overall opinion is they are good tools and I personally like the stain / non shin chrome finish. However....

Warranty- My biggest issue is warranty. They offer a lifetime warranty but require you to pay shipping and provide receipt. This in most cases makes the warranty financially useless. I have not broken a Genus tool, have others? Do you feel that the pricing is such that there is no concern of warranty? When I look at other options for the tools I have from them, even a brand like Gearwrench does not require receipt or return of the tool, and in the cases they want the tool returned, they provide a shipping label at their expense. I say this from experience.

Since my first purchase from the brand, I have with hesitations expanded, since I personally like the finish. I also find the quality of tool, such as the fit, to be good quality. I am interested in the opinions of others here, what tools have you used and what were your thoughts? I have purchased all of my Genius tools from Amazon, if that makes a difference to anyone.

 

[dnschmidt]

I have personally never broken a hand tool of any type so warrantee means nothing to me. As to Genius tools they're quite good and an excellent value per dollar. If warrantee concerns you so much you have a choice to make. 1) Buy a very good tool at a good price without a meaningful warrantee In your opinion or 2) Pay more for a tool with a better warrantee.

 

[_brian_]

I have personally never broken a hand tool of any type so warrantee means nothing to me. As to Genius tools they're quite good and an excellent value per dollar. If warrantee concerns you so much you have a choice to make. 1) Buy a very good tool at a good price without a meaningful warrantee In your opinion or 2) Pay more for a tool with a better warrantee.

I would not say warranty means so much to me. I have purchased Genius tools and just did again knowing the issue I presented. I have a few brands that trying to claim warranty would be very hard for me. Examples, Vessel (although they are improving on that), BGS, Sealey, Wiha, Wera, etc. Warranty is not an end all, but a factor. I know for example that some Craftsman tools are the same as Duratech, but I will pay the bit extra to get the warranty on them in some cases, but not all.

 

[werkzeug-keller]

Non-Warranty:

• Due to the nature of the product, the following products are not covered by any warranty: Reducing Adapters, Thin Wall Sockets, Swivel/Universal Sockets, Stud Bolt Sockets, Universal Joints, Wobble Extension Bars, Flexible Wrenches, Cutting Tools, Extractors, Files, Picks, Punches, Chisels, Spanner Bits, Magnetics, Batteries, wood/plastic/rubber-made materials, items that are 6.35mm in size and under and discontinued items. For more information on discontinued items, please see Return & Exchange Policy section.

http://www.geniustools.net/warranty-information/#1503548971003-baaedc07-8e18

 

[_brian_]

Non-Warranty:

• Due to the nature of the product, the following products are not covered by any warranty: Reducing Adapters, Thin Wall Sockets, Swivel/Universal Sockets, Stud Bolt Sockets, Universal Joints, Wobble Extension Bars, Flexible Wrenches, Cutting Tools, Extractors, Files, Picks, Punches, Chisels, Spanner Bits, Magnetics, Batteries, wood/plastic/rubber-made materials, items that are 6.35mm in size and under and discontinued items. For more information on discontinued items, please see Return & Exchange Policy section.

http://www.geniustools.net/warranty-information/#1503548971003-baaedc07-8e18

Could you add some context as to the reason of this post? I am aware of the fine print, but I think you had intention to point something out in specific.

 

[Fedwrench]

you want to buy tools online at a decent price with excellent warranty service, buy Tekton. A lifetime warranty gives you a lifetime of failed tools
As for Genius tools, you have to judge each tool on its own merits. They have some winners like their semi deep 1/2 drive metric sockets and their XL zero offset metric wrenches. They also have mediocre tools like many of their round head ratchets.

 

[_brian_]

you want to buy tools online at a decent price with excellent warranty service, buy Tekton. A lifetime warranty gives you a lifetime of failed tools
As for Genius tools, you have to judge each tool on its own merits. They have some winners like their semi deep 1/2 drive metric sockets and their XL zero offset metric wrenches. They also have mediocre tools like many of their round head ratchets.

Yeah, Tekton is sort of taking a top spot in the market, at least in the US. The best warranty though is the one you never need to use. However, a company that offers a hassle free warranty puts their money where their mouth is. If they really stand behind their tool, they will not make it cost prohibitive to get warranty service. I am not opposed to tools without warranty, I just like to know what I am buying. Asking others for input I find as a great way to do that.

Examples:
- Vessel - do not care about warranty, dont need it
- Gearwrench - need warranty, too many personal bad experiences, but sale prices win them sales
- Craftsman - new stuff, warranty is an absolute requirement or not even consideration
- Ko-Ken - no warranty concern, the one tool I have from them will not break, I have proven that
- Tekton - great warranty but used only once due to a product flaw, so unfair ruling
- Snap-On - needed to use warranty once, what a PIA. Three months later, got a replacement socket. Only buy when it is needed.

My query is not just on warranty, but brand opinion in general.

 

[qqzj]

Overly easy Warranty actually sacrifices normal tool users’ interest to benefit users who use tools a lot, and dumb users who simply use wrong tools to save time or money. In that account, maybe the Genius tools’ policy is actually good and fair.

 

[four.cycle]

two cents:

About six years ago, I bought a big full-blown 3/8" drive deep-well metric impact socket set for a buddy of mine. He didn't own an 18mm to work on my Ranger, so I just bought the whole set. I think it was like.... 10mm to about ... 32mm ?? (that sound about right?) had a mess of sockets in it. blue plastic blow-mold box.
I didn't know it at the time, but he didn't own a 3/8" impact.
He said "What the hell am I gonna do with this?!?"
I just smiled and we went on... we were down at IJ's shop... it was his birthday.

Couple months went by. He calls me in the middle of the night.
"Thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you!" he says on the phone.
I guess he must have found or bought a 3/8" gun, and he said that set saved his life and got the job done.
He's been pounding the hell of them since.
I haven't heard any complaints about them.

YMMV

 

[KnurledNut]

They are an Alliance vendor here. Might benefit some.

 

[_brian_]

Overly easy Warranty actually sacrifices normal tool users’ interest to benefit users who use tools a lot, and dumb users who simply use wrong tools to save time or money. In that account, maybe the Genius tools’ policy is actually good and fair.

I can agree with your point made here. I do 100% agree, especially with the YouTube channels boasting about how they destroy tools and see how the warranty process is. To be clear, I do not agree with this, and this is not my intent. Where I disagree is that the warranty offered is not worth using, for anyone. If it costs me $5 to buy a replacement, but it costs me $5 to ship there, $5 to ship back + the time and effort to do so... I will just replace it myself. That means no warranty. This can and could be ok.

While the warranty is only a part of my query, does that seem ok to others, given the price? I do agree with an eval, at least with picture. If I see an oil filter wrench torn to shreds, I might suspect something is off there. No brand should blindly warranty tools. That is probably why those that complain on this complain, there is no warranty for such things. I have also listed examples of brand I purchase that I do not expect warranty from, as it is just too hard to get. Use Vessel for example. I would like to have a warranty, although I never needed one. When I compare the price to the quality of product, I don't care about warranty. I will happily buy a new driver should I ever break one.

 

[_brian_]

They are an Alliance vendor here. Might benefit some.

This is the exact reason I wanted to ask this, here. I purchased my first Genius tool because they were a member here. So I thought it proper to seek answers to questions here as well. Aside from the staff speaking mostly French with intermediate English (which can be difficult for me at times), I have no issues with the brand, and as I stated, still buy their ptoducts. Just received a 3/8 drive E11 socket today.

 

[Rusted Nut]

I needed a #3 and #4 Philips bit impact sockets to remove some screws. The only place I found these was at Genius Tool, so I bought one of each. The tip on the #4 shattered on the tenth screw. I send an email to warranty - no reply. Send a second email - nothing. I send an email to customer service, they replied promptly and told me send in a return authorization request - which I did and never got a reply. Emailed customer service and told them about the no reply. Never heard anything back. A week or so later I got a replacement bit in the mail. I was a bit surprised since I had not had replies from Genius.

So, glad Genius Tool stood behind their product, but a little more communication would have been nice.

 

[_brian_]

I needed a #3 and #4 Philips bit impact sockets to remove some screws. The only place I found these was at Genius Tool, so I bought one of each. The tip on the #4 shattered on the tenth screw. I send an email to warranty - no reply. Send a second email - nothing. I send an email to customer service, they replied promptly and told me send in a return authorization request - which I did and never got a reply. Emailed customer service and told them about the no reply. Never heard anything back. A week or so later I got a replacement bit in the mail. I was a bit surprised since I had not had replies from Genius.

So, glad Genius Tool stood behind their product, but a little more communication would have been nice.

I must admit, I have never claimed warranty service on any loose bits, on any brand. Your experience though, thanks for sharing.

 

[qqzj]

This is the exact reason I wanted to ask this, here. I purchased my first Genius tool because they were a member here. So I thought it proper to seek answers to questions here as well. Aside from the staff speaking mostly French with intermediate English (which can be difficult for me at times), I have no issues with the brand, and as I stated, still buy their ptoducts. Just received a 3/8 drive E11 socket today.

Nothing is free. You said many times that you don't warranty much. So for you the best is to buy tools without warranty and use them appropriately. Otherwise, you just prepaid other people's warranty expenditure.

 

[Steiger9]

I have a Genius 3/8 set, 1/2 metric and sae, roto head ratchets, and their spark plug sockets. I find them to be quite nice except, as another member noted, their round head ratchets a pretty meh. The 1/4" roto ratchet did fail on me (started skipping teeth). I emailed for warranty and explained where I bought it but had no receipt. They said to send it in and they would warranty. I forgot to and that was two years ago, so the offer might be off the table.

I like the satin, or dual tone, finish. And I like that their cases maximize storage space, unlike some other tool brands *cough Proto *cough Craftsman

So aside from the mediocre ratchets, the sockets have held up quite well to farm use.

 

[_brian_]

Nothing is free. You said many times that you don't warranty much. So for you the best is to buy tools without warranty and use them appropriately. Otherwise, you just prepaid other people's warranty expenditure.

Yes, I do agree with you. I grew up on Craftsman USA at Sears. So that meant all my tools had a warranty that was no questions asked, drop it at the counter and go to the shelf and get a new one. This was 30 years ago....

Today, I have expanded beyond that mindset. Craftsman as I knew it is gone, and Craftsman no longer stands as the brand I prefer to buy for every tool. It is hard to change something that has become normal, but I am trying. In talks with a rep at Vessel, I learned that the tool warranty is a US thing, and they are trying different ways to work within that system.

Whether I use the warranty or not... a few things stand true. First, a tool that comes with a warranty, cost being the same, is giving you more for your dollar. I might question though if less of that dollar is in the tool, as the warranty does come at a cost to the business. Second is the brand itself. If you offer a warranty and expect the customer to pay more than replacement cost to use the warranty, that is no warranty, and can imply that the warranty is fluff. I Can sell you the worst quality tool and offer you a lifetime warranty, while also making sure that very few, if not no one at all, uses it by making it cost prohibitive.

My Genius Tools I have are great. I really like them, which is why I am still buying them today. While it makes little difference, I really like the finish on them. I also found that their design of the wobble extensions utilize more of the known better Snap-On design, which I find interesting and soon will be grabbing a set to try them out. In all honesty, I would opt to trade a Craftsman USA socket set of mine for a Genius socket set of the same sizes. My point is that I am not hating on the brand, just discussing.

 

[KnurledNut]

Good quality made in Taiwan option. From experience.

 

[RedneckWelder]

Overly easy Warranty actually sacrifices normal tool users’ interest to benefit users who use tools a lot, and dumb users who simply use wrong tools to save time or money. In that account, maybe the Genius tools’ policy is actually good and fair.

No it doesn’t.

This board’s attitude towards warranty is crazy. If a company offers a warranty it should be fairly painless and easy to use it, just like walking into Sears was to replace a Craftsman tool. And no, I don’t want to hear the ******** idea that easy warranty bankrupted Sears.

If a company doesn’t want to do that then don’t offer a warranty at all.

I pay enough for my tools as it is. Buying a tool twice because a company doesn’t want to do what they say they offer does nothing but piss me off. I expect an easy, simple, warranty process since just about everything I buy has a lifetime warranty for hand tools.

 

[qqzj]

No it doesn’t.

This board’s attitude towards warranty is crazy. If a company offers a warranty it should be fairly painless and easy to use it, just like walking into Sears was to replace a Craftsman tool. And no, I don’t want to hear the ******** idea that easy warranty bankrupted Sears.

If a company doesn’t want to do that then don’t offer a warranty at all.

I pay enough for my tools as it is. Buying a tool twice because a company doesn’t want to do what they say they offer does nothing but piss me off. I expect an easy, simple, warranty process since just about everything I buy has a lifetime warranty for hand tools.

It takes an analytical mindset and some modeling skills to anticipate that a warranty program with some cost could best serve both manufacturers and customers. Most people won’t bother.

 

[matthew]

There’s a few cases where I’ve warrantied tools (not Genius). Two, maybe three things I can think of in total.

Craftsman really successfully marketed the warranty. It really said “buy with confidence.”

I have no issues with buying a tool that doesn’t have a warranty. But I need to know it’s good. Vessel, sure. Unknown new brand from the internet I can’t look at first - not so much. I think that’s psychology more than reality that makes me say that. Genius isn’t all that well known, but seems to have a decent reputation. Every purchase is taking a chance to some extent, a company that’s been around a while and is consistent with what it does is less risk than a new brand or one that changes strategy and offers a warranty that may be here today and different tomorrow.

 

[rcbk00]

When I was younger, I had no reservations about abusing Craftsman hand tools because I could swap them out for free if they broke. Needless to say, I broke my fair share.

Now that I'm older, I'm a lot better about using the right tool for the job. Because of this, I rarely break tools.

I have a lot of Gearwrench ratcheting stuff. All of it is "lifetime warranty", but because I know their warranty often requires sending the tool back, I don't abuse it like I did Craftsman back in the day. I haven't broken any Gearwrench stuff yet.

I used to think a lifetime warranty was a huge deal. Nowadays, not so much.

 

[Shelbylex]

Warranty is a relative thing. As long as companies are consistent and do not change their policies about lifetime warranties (like Snap On did), I think it's a fair deal (as long as it is not defective straight out of the box)
Tools might cost a little less without warranty.
Choose what you prefer.
Just think about it this way: If compared to another brand you have a chance to buy 2 or 3 products for the same price - that's your warranty...

 

[_brian_]

When I was younger, I had no reservations about abusing Craftsman hand tools because I could swap them out for free if they broke. Needless to say, I broke my fair share.

Now that I'm older, I'm a lot better about using the right tool for the job. Because of this, I rarely break tools.

I have a lot of Gearwrench ratcheting stuff. All of it is "lifetime warranty", but because I know their warranty often requires sending the tool back, I don't abuse it like I did Craftsman back in the day. I haven't broken any Gearwrench stuff yet.

I used to think a lifetime warranty was a huge deal. Nowadays, not so much.

I have never been asked to send a Gearwrench ratcheting wrench back, except for one time. However, that one time, they provided me a return shipping label, so the shipping was not at my expense. That has no impact on my use though, I know that in the end, warranty abuse will increase the prices of future tools. Warranty cost is a factor in the pricing structure and if the cost of warranty rises, it is likely the cost of the tools will rise. This became well known with Bain Capital and the purchase of Gearwrench. The "look at all these profits" turned into "look at all these warranty claims". As a result, we have a lesser quality Gearwrench tool at the same or higher price. To me, Gearwrench no longer has the tool I once preferred, now, it is just a tool like all others in the mid market. This is based on my personal experience, having old and new ratcheting wrenches. Differences are clear, and so is the timing of changes.

I did not intend for this to be about warranty, but it for sure an interesting collection of opinions. I agree with some of the statements on tool abuse. I see a lot of negative tool reviews on Amazon claiming junk tools when it is quite obvious that it is a matter of user error, not tool error. There are even examples of reviews with complete false statements, showing there is not even an understanding of how the tool works. I find this to be a different problem. Tools are trade tools, they expect a certain level of knowledge to use. With places like Amazon making them available to all people, this also makes them available to those who have no idea what they are doing and still opt to be the mechanic. I also laugh when I see questions like "will this work on my ____", "do I need these wrenches or can I just use sockets", "is this magnetic".... these questions show the asking party is not likely qualified to use the tool and get a good and safe result. For example, if I do not know the hex size of my spark plugs, I should probably at least do some research before buying tools and doing a repair.

On the side I believe we here are all on, we know what the tools we use are and the concepts of how they are intended to be used. We often ask for tips and tricks, but we are not wondering why a spark plug socket has this pesky piece of rubber in it or why a thin wrench broke when I put a cheater pipe on it.

There’s a few cases where I’ve warrantied tools (not Genius). Two, maybe three things I can think of in total.

Craftsman really successfully marketed the warranty. It really said “buy with confidence.”

I have no issues with buying a tool that doesn’t have a warranty. But I need to know it’s good. Vessel, sure. Unknown new brand from the internet I can’t look at first - not so much. I think that’s psychology more than reality that makes me say that. Genius isn’t all that well known, but seems to have a decent reputation. Every purchase is taking a chance to some extent, a company that’s been around a while and is consistent with what it does is less risk than a new brand or one that changes strategy and offers a warranty that may be here today and different tomorrow.

I agree with this mentality. It is rare that proper use results in a broken tool, unless it is the first 1-2 uses. Manufacturer defect can and do happen, and will often show in the initial use. I have kept a list of all the tools I have used warranty service on, yes, I truly do this. Without making this post longer than it needs to be, over 50% of my warranty claims are manufacturer defect and with Gearwrench. The defect found on first use, finding a lot of handles that are not straight, binding ratcheting mechanism, etc. Yes, Apex replaced those under warranty vs return to the retailer. I have a Craftsman 1/2 drive ratchet, the old RP 36 tooth, that I had replaced twice under warranty years ago, when it was Sears and USA made. I replaced an older Taiwan Gearwrench ratcheting wrench where the mechanism seized up on me, no misuse, but pulling hard for sure. Replaced with a China version which I do not even use due to its poor design and increased size.

I find as I stated prior, that the best warranty is the one I never need to use. A tool without warranty is fine, as long as I have a level of trust that the tool is quality. This is hard, such as with Gearwrench. The quality has changed enough that I would not buy one of their products without warranty. Same with Craftsman, no warranty, no buy. Vessel, no need for warranty. I also purchase tools from brands like Wiha, Wera, BGS, Sealey, Eklind, Lisle, etc that have warranty, but I do not expect to ever need the service. I also have brands (as a non professional) from Snap-On, Matco and Mac, and from my experience, Snap-On has the worst lifetime warranty I have ever experienced. OEMTools is another where it seems time has changed their style of customer interactions, I still buy OEMTools products, but when I see lifetime warranty, I see marketing fluff. That is a brand that I buy dismissing their warranty claims, so I am selective on what I buy.

My query on Genius Tools is one more asking for the user experience. Does the assumption of quality that never requires service go with the brand, in the opinions of others that have and use their tools. I admit that the warranty concerns seems to be a US customer thing. I am trying to break that core mentality, which is not easy. I really like the responses I received from speaking with a Vessel representative. The level of confidence in their tools really gave me ease and time of use has proven it true. I was told outright.... "what if the tool breaks, is there warranty?" .. "you wont break it, dont worry". My initial thought was wow, how arrogant. Years later, I eat my thoughts (words).

 

[dnschmidt]

Believe it or not back in the 1960's Mercedes Benz did not have an official warrantee. Their official stance was: "Our **** doesn't break." or the German translation of that. HOW TIMES HAVE CHANGED. Benz along with BMW are now modern day Hugos.

 

[M6erfan]

I use tools within their limits, probably sometimes even above their limits. I've never broken a hand tool. I buy good quality tools. I couldn't care less about hand tool warranty.

I don't live in the rust belt, I'm not a pro mechanic.

 

[wrenchr]

I have bought a few things from Genius through amazon and I like the tool line, I'm not pro but I do live in the rust belt south of Detroit Michigan. Stuff does break..........usually fasteners on the car your working on.

 

[qqzj]

I have never been asked to send a Gearwrench ratcheting wrench back, except for one time. However, that one time, they provided me a return shipping label, so the shipping was not at my expense. That has no impact on my use though, I know that in the end, warranty abuse will increase the prices of future tools. Warranty cost is a factor in the pricing structure and if the cost of warranty rises, it is likely the cost of the tools will rise. This became well known with Bain Capital and the purchase of Gearwrench. The "look at all these profits" turned into "look at all these warranty claims". As a result, we have a lesser quality Gearwrench tool at the same or higher price. To me, Gearwrench no longer has the tool I once preferred, now, it is just a tool like all others in the mid market. This is based on my personal experience, having old and new ratcheting wrenches. Differences are clear, and so is the timing of changes.

I did not intend for this to be about warranty, but it for sure an interesting collection of opinions. I agree with some of the statements on tool abuse. I see a lot of negative tool reviews on Amazon claiming junk tools when it is quite obvious that it is a matter of user error, not tool error. There are even examples of reviews with complete false statements, showing there is not even an understanding of how the tool works. I find this to be a different problem. Tools are trade tools, they expect a certain level of knowledge to use. With places like Amazon making them available to all people, this also makes them available to those who have no idea what they are doing and still opt to be the mechanic. I also laugh when I see questions like "will this work on my ____", "do I need these wrenches or can I just use sockets", "is this magnetic".... these questions show the asking party is not likely qualified to use the tool and get a good and safe result. For example, if I do not know the hex size of my spark plugs, I should probably at least do some research before buying tools and doing a repair.

On the side I believe we here are all on, we know what the tools we use are and the concepts of how they are intended to be used. We often ask for tips and tricks, but we are not wondering why a spark plug socket has this pesky piece of rubber in it or why a thin wrench broke when I put a cheater pipe on it.


I agree with this mentality. It is rare that proper use results in a broken tool, unless it is the first 1-2 uses. Manufacturer defect can and do happen, and will often show in the initial use. I have kept a list of all the tools I have used warranty service on, yes, I truly do this. Without making this post longer than it needs to be, over 50% of my warranty claims are manufacturer defect and with Gearwrench. The defect found on first use, finding a lot of handles that are not straight, binding ratcheting mechanism, etc. Yes, Apex replaced those under warranty vs return to the retailer. I have a Craftsman 1/2 drive ratchet, the old RP 36 tooth, that I had replaced twice under warranty years ago, when it was Sears and USA made. I replaced an older Taiwan Gearwrench ratcheting wrench where the mechanism seized up on me, no misuse, but pulling hard for sure. Replaced with a China version which I do not even use due to its poor design and increased size.

I find as I stated prior, that the best warranty is the one I never need to use. A tool without warranty is fine, as long as I have a level of trust that the tool is quality. This is hard, such as with Gearwrench. The quality has changed enough that I would not buy one of their products without warranty. Same with Craftsman, no warranty, no buy. Vessel, no need for warranty. I also purchase tools from brands like Wiha, Wera, BGS, Sealey, Eklind, Lisle, etc that have warranty, but I do not expect to ever need the service. I also have brands (as a non professional) from Snap-On, Matco and Mac, and from my experience, Snap-On has the worst lifetime warranty I have ever experienced. OEMTools is another where it seems time has changed their style of customer interactions, I still buy OEMTools products, but when I see lifetime warranty, I see marketing fluff. That is a brand that I buy dismissing their warranty claims, so I am selective on what I buy.

My query on Genius Tools is one more asking for the user experience. Does the assumption of quality that never requires service go with the brand, in the opinions of others that have and use their tools. I admit that the warranty concerns seems to be a US customer thing. I am trying to break that core mentality, which is not easy. I really like the responses I received from speaking with a Vessel representative. The level of confidence in their tools really gave me ease and time of use has proven it true. I was told outright.... "what if the tool breaks, is there warranty?" .. "you wont break it, dont worry". My initial thought was wow, how arrogant. Years later, I eat my thoughts (words).

I don't think your evaluation of GearWrench is fair. Most people have no way to objectively evaluate tools. So they just follow internet forums like this and generate some opinions. However, those sometimes cannot be further away from truth. The following video shows that GW ratchet is near the very top in every single department. Relative to GW, it is embarrassing to see how SK is trying to justify its lofty price.

 

[_brian_]

I don't think your evaluation of GearWrench is fair. Most people have no way to objectively evaluate tools. So they just follow internet forums like this and generate some opinions. However, those sometimes cannot be further away from truth. The following video shows that GW ratchet is near the very top in every single department. Relative to GW, it is embarrassing to see how SK is trying to justify its lofty price.

Could I ask why you do not think my Gearwrench opinion is fair? My opinion is based only on my experience with the tools I own and use or have used. I agree that many YouTube tests are not really valid. There are videos that do torture tests, and while they are interesting, do not test what would be considered common tool use. YouTube is for entertainment to me, and I take all videos I watch there at that. For every video you see giving a tool praise there is another who says it is junk. For the GW ratchets specifically, I think they are ok. I wont pay extra for them over any other brand though, the ones I have were purchased on a sale or deal. So my logic of opinion there is having options, which tools to I grab? I grab the GW ratcheting wrenches as that is the only brand of those I have. I do not grab GW ratchets though, they sit in my main box and are never even seen on my roll cart. Note that I hear good on the 120XP ratchets, but I do not have any of those, will not spend the money given my experience with the others I have. If there is some quality in them, it is not one I have fond, or since I do have some, I would use them. Obviously that is an opinion and everyone's preferences and views are different. I can only speak to my experience.

In short, Gearwrench is not my #1 tool brand in my boxes, but is by far the #1 brand where warranty has been needed, mostly by poor manufacturing and quality control. I have a set of metric Taiwan made ratcheting wrenches, and a new larger set of metric and SAE, regular and stubby, that are China made. The difference is clear. First, the size of the tool is easily seen. The Taiwan made ones have a slimmer profile all around, the China ones are bulky, especially the smaller sizes, the open ends are just way oversized. If you use them vs just looking, you will notice fast that the ratcheting of the Taiwan ones are smoother than the China ones.

But this is about Genius Tools, and in that sense, none of the issues I have with Gearwrench appear to me with Genius, although I do not have any Genius ratcheting tools. One thing I can say is that the style of the Genius sockets shows they are not HF duplicates like the Gearwrench sockets. A bit of joking there, but we know they are made in the same place and at least share parts of the manufacturing process. I hope that the Genius Tool quality sits above Gearwrench, maybe those who use them can provide some input. I like to know about the tools I use. Not that it is used as a primary buying factor, but I like to know stuff and it does give insight about the tools and their respective quality.

 

[_brian_]

Believe it or not back in the 1960's Mercedes Benz did not have an official warrantee. Their official stance was: "Our **** doesn't break." or the German translation of that. HOW TIMES HAVE CHANGED. Benz along with BMW are now modern day Hugos.

This is the exact message I was given from Vessel.

I use tools within their limits, probably sometimes even above their limits. I've never broken a hand tool. I buy good quality tools. I couldn't care less about hand tool warranty.

I don't live in the rust belt, I'm not a pro mechanic.

assuming you are speaking about Genius Tools, and

I have bought a few things from Genius through amazon and I like the tool line, I'm not pro but I do live in the rust belt south of Detroit Michigan. Stuff does break..........usually fasteners on the car your working on.

This is great feedback. I am also in the rust belt, and I agree that it is rare to break good tools. It is that experience that gives me the better feeling of basically having no warranty. In my short and limited experience with Genius, I have seen no issues. I have also purchased only certain types of tools, sticking in the socket, bit socket and socket accessory area. IT is sounding like in general, warranty should not be a worry with proper use.

 

[_brian_]

I just today learned another example on warranty, and to the extent that warranty is a concern. I know that Grey Pneumatic also has this policy, but I found that Ko-ken also requires purchases to be made through an authorized distributor or warranty service and claims will be denied. I was looking at their 3 piece set of wheel nut sockets (17/19/21) when I discovered this, and learning this removed all my interest in that specific product.

The problem is maybe only so bad for non professionals, maybe a professional can comment. The issue for me is that the company wants me to buy from certain places only, keep the receipt of purchase, etc. I have a LOT of tools, and expecting me to track where each was purchased and retain a receipt is something that I find unrealistic, and thus something I will not do. Even with a professional, I know that tool truck drivers change and at times a new driver will deny warranty as you have not been buying from THEM. The whole authorized distributor concept to me is just another scam, misleading people with the warranty they state. Using Grey Pneumatic as example, I hear from many, especially on YouTube, boasting their quality and lifetime warranty, as thy promote buying the product on Amazon, which according to GP directly, a purchase on Amazon will not come with any warranty as Amazon is not authorized.

This shows more of my issue with Genius and the warranty. It is more that it is misleading, as there really is no warranty. The idea of a warranty is that is a tool breaks under proper use (generalizing), it is replaced free of charge. If I need to pay the same or more than the tool is worth to get it replaced, there is no actual warranty. Unless again in the case you might have a truck driver or other similar type of distributor that all your tools come from and they handle the warranty, allowing you to avoid all the nonsense required of the user. I am not sure that the intent is to screw the user, but the intent might be that they cater to commercial customers and have no real interest in the consumer market. These are things I like to know if I intend to buy more than the random tool from a brand. If I buy a tool with a proper understanding of what to expect, there is not much room to be disappointed and provide a negative experience. The negative experience comes when you expect something that ends up not being delivered, which is really unfortunate for both sides.

I just yesterday ordered a wobble set of 3/8 extensions from Genius, so please do understand I do not judge a brand on a single factor. In the case of Genius, at this time I have the mentality that the tools I buy are at face value. The quality they provide is all you get. If I am ok with that, I have no problem making the purchase. This is what I ask for the opinions of others on their tool quality, so I can better judge the tool quality. Will I buy a Genius ratchet, probably not. Bit sockets? Well, yes and I have already, but the reason is because I consider the bit to be disposable, so if one breaks and they will not replace it, I will (I also posted a thread about where to obtain proper bits, if there is such a thing or if any bit works).

 

[carmantl]

I have a bunch of MAC, Matco, and Snap-on impact sockets, mostly bought as one-offs as I had the need over the last 30 years. I am not loyal to any one brand. I use what is most cost-efficient to my company. I'm a structural steel erection foreman. We beat on impacts hard. Last week I happened to be having my work truck aligned and lo and behold this huge MAC truck pulled in to service their mechanics. Driver said sure but he had to order the socket. About a week later I finally had to chase him down about 30 miles away to warrant an 1&1/4 shallow socket that I have owned over a decade. He is new to the area but used to work east coast. He told me that structural steel jobsites were some of his best customers. NO TOOL TRUCKS HAVE EVER SHOWN UP ON MY JOBSITES IN TN IN THE LAST 30 YEARS. I didn't expect him to warranty it but he did. His number is now in my phone and we will give him a lot of new business. That socket had impacted over 100,000 bolts. I almost felt bad about warrantying it, but it's a $40 socket.

 

[Steve_P]

I understand Genius Tools is a member here, so maybe one of their representatives watches the forums and might participate.

My query here is very general, what are your thoughts on Genius Tools? I have only recently acquired tools from the brand, including some bit socket sets, random one piece bit sockets and standard hex sockets and some extensions. My overall opinion is they are good tools and I personally like the stain / non shin chrome finish. However....

Warranty- My biggest issue is warranty.

If your biggest issue is warranty, then you should buy Snap On. Any tool can be broken thru abuse, or worn out from normal use over time. If you expect a new one when this happens, then Snap On is your brand. Of course, since you're debating Genius Tools, you don't want to pay the Snap On premium, which includes warranty in their initial cost. Like many here, you want to pay import pricing and receive a Snap On warranty. Good luck.

 

[930dreamer]

Buy everything used and have a few extras on hand- or ten.

 

[_brian_]

If your biggest issue is warranty, then you should buy Snap On. Any tool can be broken thru abuse, or worn out from normal use over time. If you expect a new one when this happens, then Snap On is your brand. Of course, since you're debating Genius Tools, you don't want to pay the Snap On premium, which includes warranty in their initial cost. Like many here, you want to pay import pricing and receive a Snap On warranty. Good luck.

First, as stated in the progression of the thread, warranty is not the biggest issue, just an issue.

Regarding Snap-On, I have no interest in that ****. If I want a good warranty and that is my only concern, I will buy Tekton, not Snap-On. I have personally dealt with both companies and their warranty, and Snap-On sits near the bottom. I do not have a truck driver though, so that might make a difference to those who think otherwise.

The warranty cost is always included in the price of the tool. Astro, Sunex, Craftsman, Gearwrench, Tekton, etc all make that happen without charging the "premium" of Snap-On. You are clearly a Snap-On person, which is fine. I personally prefer to spend $1000 on a set of tools that help me do work vs just one wrench that I can polish and talk about. To each their own, but please don't make assumptions. I have no interest in Snap-On warranty, I have some Snap-On tools and I have used their warranty. It *****.

EDIT: I had a side job offer a while back... a retired mechanic. He wanted to pay me in used Snap-On tools. His tools looked great, nice and shiny and in fancy organizers, but I said no, and he also declined service. Monopoly money does not let you provide life for you and your family. A tool is a good, and a good is only worth what someone is willing to pay. That means there is no "real" value in said good, just a perceived value.

Edit 2, not wanting to create extra posts.... I just placed an order with my local Snap-On driver, he will stop at my home upon request. I needed to order what I needed, basic tools, but still need to wait. If these were warranty concerns, there is more wait, if they would even be covered unless purchased from him. If I want a warranty, I will buy Tekton, not Snap-On. Snap-On makes a good tool, but we should not kid ourselves my thinking 1) they make the best quality tool and 2) they have the best warranty. Neither of those is true. I have Snap-On screwdrivers, they sit in a drawer, I use Vessel. No comparison. Warranty, if you spend your check with your driver, it might be good, if not, see things from those who live in the other reality. My 2 cents, from experience.

 

[Hytekrednek]

I purchased 2 genius tools. Neither get used as they are poorly made. I have a 1/4'' rorohead ratchet and a stubby ratcheting bit driver. I would like them both, they have great handles, but both have such gritty and rough gears that they go unused. The ratchet also has very stiff backdrag, plus is rough as a cobb. After these 2, I do not consider buying Genius tools anymore.

 

[dnschmidt]

I purchased 2 genius tools. Neither get used as they are poorly made. I have a 1/4'' rorohead ratchet and a stubby ratcheting bit driver. I would like them both, they have great handles, but both have such gritty and rough gears that they go unused. The ratchet also has very stiff backdrag, plus is rough as a cobb. After these 2, I do not consider buying Genius tools anymore.

The two tools your purchased were already mentioned above by Fedwrench and another commenter as being the worst tools Genus makes. Other than their ratchets, which admittedly ****, I find their other tools to be fine. TOPTUL has a similar problem as they outsource their ratchets to William Tool. Decent, but nothing to write home about.

 

[KnurledNut]

I purchased 2 genius tools. Neither get used as they are poorly made. I have a 1/4'' rorohead ratchet and a stubby ratcheting bit driver. I would like them both, they have great handles, but both have such gritty and rough gears that they go unused. The ratchet also has very stiff backdrag, plus is rough as a cobb. After these 2, I do not consider buying Genius tools anymore.

Their roundheads are strong but have a long break-in period. Lube helps initially. Once they get some use, they are much nicer. Could possibly induce wear spinning with a drill. This mechanism shines on their 1/2 extra long flex ratchet.

 

[ecotec]

Buy everything used and have a few extras on hand- or ten.

Once your bases are covered… this is simple and perfect advice.

I started with 1990 Craftsman tools. I upgraded with a mix of garage/estate sale tools and new tools (usually on sale).

If you have no timeline… this method will be a chance at having far better tools than you can often justify or afford. In quantities that you could never justify or afford at retail… on a long enough timeline… stupid quantities of the best of the best…

I made no effort to do this until my (now) wife took me to the estate sale of a man who had a collision shop.

I was able to buy about 2/3rds of a 5 gallon bucket of truck and industrial brand sockets (Snap-on, MAC, Matco, Cornwell, Proto, Armstrong, Bonney, SK…).

I was off to the races… hooked…

There is a point where you there are diminishing returns. At some point, you will have more than enough of the common tools, and the hunt is not mathematically worthwhile anymore. The things that you are just not finding, are the things that you should open your wallet for…

Another thing that nobody mentions… about the garage/estate sale hobby… you are often picking the bones of people dead, dying, in dire straits… so be respectful.

At that first sale, the family brought the homeowner to the sale while I was there. He had bad dementia, had just lost his wife (also dementia), and perceived the estate sale as us taking his things. It was my first honey hole. I got so much stuff there… for cheap… but it was also a lesson, that I badly needed, about estate sales.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I just today learned another example on warranty, and to the extent that warranty is a concern. I know that Grey Pneumatic also has this policy, but I found that Ko-ken also requires purchases to be made through an authorized distributor or warranty service and claims will be denied. I was looking at their 3 piece set of wheel nut sockets (17/19/21) when I discovered this, and learning this removed all my interest in that specific product.

The problem is maybe only so bad for non professionals, maybe a professional can comment. The issue for me is that the company wants me to buy from certain places only, keep the receipt of purchase, etc. I have a LOT of tools, and expecting me to track where each was purchased and retain a receipt is something that I find unrealistic, and thus something I will not do. Even with a professional, I know that tool truck drivers change and at times a new driver will deny warranty as you have not been buying from THEM. The whole authorized distributor concept to me is just another scam, misleading people with the warranty they state. Using Grey Pneumatic as example, I hear from many, especially on YouTube, boasting their quality and lifetime warranty, as thy promote buying the product on Amazon, which according to GP directly, a purchase on Amazon will not come with any warranty as Amazon is not authorized.

This shows more of my issue with Genius and the warranty. It is more that it is misleading, as there really is no warranty. The idea of a warranty is that is a tool breaks under proper use (generalizing), it is replaced free of charge. If I need to pay the same or more than the tool is worth to get it replaced, there is no actual warranty. Unless again in the case you might have a truck driver or other similar type of distributor that all your tools come from and they handle the warranty, allowing you to avoid all the nonsense required of the user. I am not sure that the intent is to screw the user, but the intent might be that they cater to commercial customers and have no real interest in the consumer market. These are things I like to know if I intend to buy more than the random tool from a brand. If I buy a tool with a proper understanding of what to expect, there is not much room to be disappointed and provide a negative experience. The negative experience comes when you expect something that ends up not being delivered, which is really unfortunate for both sides.

I just yesterday ordered a wobble set of 3/8 extensions from Genius, so please do understand I do not judge a brand on a single factor. In the case of Genius, at this time I have the mentality that the tools I buy are at face value. The quality they provide is all you get. If I am ok with that, I have no problem making the purchase. This is what I ask for the opinions of others on their tool quality, so I can better judge the tool quality. Will I buy a Genius ratchet, probably not. Bit sockets? Well, yes and I have already, but the reason is because I consider the bit to be disposable, so if one breaks and they will not replace it, I will (I also posted a thread about where to obtain proper bits, if there is such a thing or if any bit works).

I don't play the "authorized retailer" game for hand tools. Warranty it or don't, I don't play games. IDGAF if it's from Koken USA, or Koken Japan. It says "Koken" on the side, you're the authorized rep in this market, handle it. That's like saying if you go to the dealer for a warranty on a previous repair, it doesn't apply because the tech that did the work doesn't work there anymore. I don't care how they run the books, split markets, the tool in question is $40 retail, ******* fix it.

I have a 28x70 socket drawer, plus my cart with like 200 sockets, and another 2 drawers. I don't have time for receipt scanning. Stuff breaks, if the warranty is defects only it aught to make it a couple months. After that it's on me to replace.

If a truck driver refused to warranty stuff I bought from them, despite it being in their franchise agreement, LOL at me buying anything. Yes, I know they need to float the warranty cost, and are out the time to do so. Doing a rotted out exhaust manifold and every single manifold stud snaps coming out? ***** to be me. It's in the game.