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Getting closer to starting...

onthefence777

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Feb 19, 2012
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404
I have spent some serious time over the last couple of days working on my garage addition plan materials list and budget. It isn't the simplest of builds, being an L shape; but I think its definately doable. Here a screen shot of a sample floor plan:



Yes I know it will be a way tight fit if it works this way. I'm good with vehicular tetris nowadays. I am not planning for this parking to be usual while work is being done on a vehicle - more like if I am going on vacation etc. I am leaving an extra 4' behind the garage, beyond the 5 ft required setback, to allow for a driveway all the way down the side of my property, a full 120' stretch once I move some plants/take down some trees for plenty of parking. Main bay will hopefully have 16' walls, and small square of the L will be 14x17x8 for each story. If I can squeeze two cars wide parking w/climbing through window on last one, great. If not, no worries. I think the 3rd car on the left is more doable if I do center the lift anyhow. I would only hope to get my smallest car back there - a turbo 300zx 2 seater. Its my future autocross car, so I wouldn't have to tetris it in or out all that often. Again, it wouldn't break my heart if it wont fit back there, just trying to make the most out of what I do have. I could always just partition it off and make the small room a work area until I could get a small bay door that opens to the alley @ the front right fender of the truck. Either way I could definately use every bit of space possible. And most likely, there would usually only be one car on the lift, and one below. If its too much of a squeeze, and only one car wide would work, then thats how it is. Beats having this 2 post sitting useless. I am just limited to 19' wide because of setbacks and a variance fee of $3000 that I just can't afford to ask for the 5' setback to the fence to be lifted. That and I don't want to knock down my finished small garage/office.

The man door would actually connect to the back of my existing tiny garage. Hope for a 16' wide (maybe 14' wide if required for structure strength) by 14' high bay door. No opener, at least for now. The stairs on the side of the L would be contingent on the fact that my budget will allow for the engineering of a 2nd story up there. I wonder though, even with engineering, if it is possible to have most of that entire wall open where the sides of the L meet, especially with the 2nd floor above. I expect for stub walls to be needed and a large header beam for the opening, just didn't draw those in.

So where I am at:

Verified that planning will allow for this addition, all requirements (Lot coverage, setbacks, height, etc) will all be met. No permit yet - need survey for site plan and engineering for building drawings.

Budgeting mostly accounted for/estimated, although need a few quotes yet - foundation, new attic truss quote since plan has changed a bit, bay door quoted, engineering costs added up, any special beams/structural components needed(budgeted $1000 as guess), and stucco cost (may have to do vinyl siding instead). All basic building materials priced and quantities estimated for framing, exterior, roof.

Budget: Hoped to keep under $25k. Currently looking at $25,600 on paper (will change I'm sure; key is I am in the ballpark) with a few guesstimates and NO FINISHING inside besides simple electrical, few lights, power to lift and couple outlets. Finishing with more wiring, HVAC, insulation, drywall, wish lists etc come to about $8k. I will work on that over time with any money that I have left over monthly. I just need guts now.

Survey: ~$1000 ????
Foundation ( ~15 yds + footer): ~$5500 ???? Southwest so no frostline. 6" under lift, 4" elsewhere, rebar. Plan to do all prep work leading up to pour, so hope I can bring this number down....
Clearance Pole and moving meter(Power): $1500 [Going to try to get powerco to pay if possible, but seems unlikely...]
Permits: Just over $1000
Doors including bay door: ~$2300
New electrical panel, underground to backfeed existing panel ~10ft away on house, couple lights/ outlets: $2000
Trusses: $2500
Roofing sheating/paper/shingles etc: $2000
Engineering: $1200 ???? Expect it to maybe go up for second story??? Setting up meeting for this week to discuss/estimate
Vinyl siding: $1300. Would like stucco but expect too much $$$$ at this time.
Framing Lumber: $2000
Exterior Sheathing - 19/32" OSB:$800
House Wrap: $250
CL Framing nailer: ~$150
Nails/Screws: $500 Guesstimate
Gutters: Cost unknown, sub $1k???

Only thing not in budget at all that I can think of, is the stairs because I am not at all sure what that will take. Expect help from engineer and maybe contractor help.

So, I guess I just wanted to run this all by you guys, to see if something screams out at you that I am missing, or way off on the estimate with. I am very excited to get going with this overdue project, but want to do it right the first time. I do hope to break ground ASAP to allow plenty of time to have it dried in by fall though. My budget is assuming that I will do all work except actual pour of foundation, the actual lifting of the walls and any big structural beams/etc required. I have been approved for the $25k loan, and actually even more, just don't want to have to use much more.

So, what do you guys think about my plan as it sits now?
 
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Steevo

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Having built a shop from the ground up in the last couple of years, I can make a couple of comments that you can take any way you like.
1. You may be able to find a local contractor who can put together all of the individual elements you are pricing and save you a few dollars, just because he can buy at his costs.
Add up all of your estimates and then ask a couple of good local contractors for a bid on the complete finished job.
2. Gutters cost more than you expect them to. Especially if you want nice color-matched ones with matching downspouts . . .
3. (ok, I couldn't stop at two) How much can you do yourself in the way of labor, electrical work, roofing, etc. This could be a good way to have a contractor provide his skills, and resources as needed, but use you where possible to reduce costs.
4. (I am on a roll, what can I say?) I think 19' wide will prove to be too narrow for a 2-post lift AND a parking bay next to it.
 
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waggie

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Aug 3, 2010
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Location
Upland, ca
building a garage from ground up and you still have to perform vehicular tetris? is this for long term vehicle storage? if you're gonna work on cars, i think it'd be a pain in the neck.

I understand if you are limited by regulation, or existing structure... but 19 feet wide for what looks like a full size truck next to a sedan just doesn't seem like it will work. That's the inner width. your door is gotta be 17 feet wide at best. I'd find an empty parking lot, and run some duct-tape 19 feet apart and park both of your cars within the line. see if you can exit the vehicles. I think you'll have to perform some human body tetris... or i hope your truck and sedan come with sun roofs.
 
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onthefence777

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Feb 19, 2012
Messages
404
building a garage from ground up and you still have to perform vehicular tetris? is this for long term vehicle storage? if you're gonna work on cars, i think it'd be a pain in the neck.

I understand if you are limited by regulation, or existing structure... but 19 feet wide for what looks like a full size truck next to a sedan just doesn't seem like it will work. That's the inner width. your door is gotta be 17 feet wide at best. I'd find an empty parking lot, and run some duct-tape 19 feet apart and park both of your cars within the line. see if you can exit the vehicles. I think you'll have to perform some human body tetris... or i hope your truck and sedan come with sun roofs.


Haha. Yeah I know I could do the human tetris. More I been thinking about it, its probably best to just center the lift in the bay anyhow. Yeah, 19' is less than optimal, but I really just need a bay I can actually work on a car or truck in. Like I said in the post, car storage isn't a priority - I just didn't want to cut out a bay if I didn't have to. With the door on the side wall, I will at least have that second bay anyhow though.

Hmmm...maybe I should just shell out the 3K and hope they grant me the variance...24' wide would be a big difference....



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

heres the other way I had placed it all out. Now, if I did have the 5' width more, do you think that would be enough to pull off 2 bays? Maybe even a 4 post next to the 2 post?
 
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onthefence777

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Joined
Feb 19, 2012
Messages
404
Having built a shop from the ground up in the last couple of years, I can make a couple of comments that you can take any way you like.
1. You may be able to find a local contractor who can put together all of the individual elements you are pricing and save you a few dollars, just because he can buy at his costs.
Add up all of your estimates and then ask a couple of good local contractors for a bid on the complete finished job.
2. Gutters cost more than you expect them to. Especially if you want nice color-matched ones with matching downspouts . . .
3. (ok, I couldn't stop at two) How much can you do yourself in the way of labor, electrical work, roofing, etc. This could be a good way to have a contractor provide his skills, and resources as needed, but use you where possible to reduce costs.
4. (I am on a roll, what can I say?) I think 19' wide will prove to be too narrow for a 2-post lift AND a parking bay next to it.

Just now read your 2 latest points.

I actually plan to do most everything that I can myself. I'm no pro builder but I do have a fair bit of experience and am generally handy. With just a little help I am confident I can do it. For instance, I already spoke with an electrician about having him just run over what I wire, to ensure a smooth inspection there. I know enough that I think I will do a good job.
 
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SGKent

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Feb 12, 2010
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It just happens that our garage is 19' on the inside. Then you subtract the wings walls at the opening which leaves 17'. With the Acura RL nose to the left and the VW bus nose to the right there is enough room to walk thru but if I really want to work on one other than check the fluids I pull one out and center the one left. I cannot imagine a truck with wide mirrors and the RL. It was the same when we put the RL and the Sable Wagon in. 19' may seem like a lot but put 4' between the wall and car to get in and out with your tools, a 60" wide car and 4' on the other side and you have 13 feet already. Add 4 on the far side of the truck and now you are taking space from somewhere else. Park your cars 3' apart and start dragging some tools and a jack between them - you will be cussing in no time. Also - the L may look good on paper but everytime you want to move that car you will be moving the other two first. Try that on a rainy windy day when you have just washed them the day before....
 

darkk

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Dec 24, 2009
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Willimantic, Ct.
3K just for the Zone Varience meeting or is that a gaurantee of varience. Just a zoning meeting for 3K would prompt me to hire a cheap lawyer to check into this...actually 3K for any of it would make me pissy........****! I have nothing to do with this and I'm getting all pissy anyways....that's Big Brother for you!
 

kert

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May 31, 2009
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Location
Franklin, MI
Haha. Yeah I know I could do the human tetris. More I been thinking about it, its probably best to just center the lift in the bay anyhow. Yeah, 19' is less than optimal, but I really just need a bay I can actually work on a car or truck in. Like I said in the post, car storage isn't a priority - I just didn't want to cut out a bay if I didn't have to. With the door on the side wall, I will at least have that second bay anyhow though.

Hmmm...maybe I should just shell out the 3K and hope they grant me the variance...24' wide would be a big difference....



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

heres the other way I had placed it all out. Now, if I did have the 5' width more, do you think that would be enough to pull off 2 bays? Maybe even a 4 post next to the 2 post?

How do you get the diagonal car out around the lift? If it were me, I'd forego the extra 4' setback. A total of 9' for a driveway isn't going to cut it.
 
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onthefence777

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Feb 19, 2012
Messages
404
3K just for the Zone Varience meeting or is that a gaurantee of varience. Just a zoning meeting for 3K would prompt me to hire a cheap lawyer to check into this...actually 3K for any of it would make me pissy........****! I have nothing to do with this and I'm getting all pissy anyways....that's Big Brother for you!


It is $3000 to ASK for the variance, which would take 90-120 days. It really pissed me off too when they told me that.

THEN, I got really pissed off, when another lady who works there, pulled it up and told me that 3 years ago, the fee was only $175!!! How the hell can you justify a 1,600+ % increase in the cost of sending out letters to the neighbor and hold one commission meeting????
 
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onthefence777

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Feb 19, 2012
Messages
404
How do you get the diagonal car out around the lift? If it were me, I'd forego the extra 4' setback. A total of 9' for a driveway isn't going to cut it.

Since I can't squeeze double bays, I would have to get another small bay door in the right side of the plan, which exits to the alley.
 
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