Gfci?

[Ramper]

I am continuing to wire my shop. I have shelving (2 x 4 and plywood) that has covering the back wall of the shop. I put some outlets in the front of the shevles. All of the wires are rum in flexible metal conduit. Does this circuit need a GFCI?

The last circuit I put in, I put a GFCI, but it often trips (weather/dampness?)

Is there a GFCI that mount as an outlet without the actual outlets?

 

[dscheidt]

Assuming you're talking about a garage, all the 120 outlets need to be GFCI.

A GFCI without outlets is called a 'deadfront' gfci, and are readily available. They're used for things like what you're doing, where the outlets aren't readily accessible, but you don't want another outlet on that circuit, and for dedicated circuits for appliances (think dishwasher, for instance.)

 

[CJ7VFR]

I am continuing to wire my shop. I have shelving (2 x 4 and plywood) that has covering the back wall of the shop. I put some outlets in the front of the shevles. All of the wires are rum in flexible metal conduit. Does this circuit need a GFCI?

The last circuit I put in, I put a GFCI, but it often trips (weather/dampness?)

Is there a GFCI that mount as an outlet without the actual outlets?

If your shop is in your garage, then I do believe all the receptacles you put in there need to be GFCI protected except for individual receptacles run on their own circuit. Like a receptacle for a compressor that is on its own circuit. But someone who is a sparky here will verify that.

And what do you mean by your last statement? How can you have an outlet without there being an actual outlet? If you want a receptacle somewhere, then you have to put a receptacle there.

I don't get the last statement.

Ok, I see that dscheidt answered that. Never mind.

Jim

 

[Ramper]

I just found those "faceless" outlets. This is a 30x40 shed (seperate from house)

Any opinion on these?
https://www.amazon.com/Hubbell-GFM20-GFCI-Module-Yellow/dp/B00NFKTMGK/ref=sr_1_1?m=A2L77EE7U53NWQ&s=warehouse-deals&ie=UTF8&qid=1502459813&sr=8-1&keywords=faceless+gfci

I just order 2 from AWD for $25 total

 

[mm08822]

I am continuing to wire my shop. I have shelving (2 x 4 and plywood) that has covering the back wall of the shop. I put some outlets in the front of the shevles. All of the wires are rum in flexible metal conduit. Does this circuit need a GFCI?

The last circuit I put in, I put a GFCI, but it often trips (weather/dampness?)

Is there a GFCI that mount as an outlet without the actual outlets?

Yes, Garages and accessory buildings in residential settings require GFCI protection for 15 & 20A 120vac recepts.

Describe the trip scenario.
Does it trip with particular equipment plugged in and/or running?
Are there any recepts as part of that circuit on the shop exterior where water may be getting in?

There are faceless GFCI devices. It is just and much effort to put that in as a gfci recept. Recepts are cheaper. Why do you want that - you are spending more and getting less?

 

[Ramper]

The OLD circuit:
12/2 NM run to a GFCI
Three switches controlling outlets that controlled lights (MH lights)

Often we would go the shop and the CFCI would be tripped. It often did not reset vert well.

I "think" the issue is that the GFCI is close toone of the garage doors and the weather is getting in. I plan to install a cover on the outlet as part of this next phase of electrical.

 

[sberry]

Hard wired lights do not need gfci but,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, I would be very curious and isolate what is causing them to trip.

 

[dscheidt]

If your shop is in your garage, then I do believe all the receptacles you put in there need to be GFCI protected except for individual receptacles run on their own circuit. Like a receptacle for a compressor that is on its own circuit. But someone who is a sparky here will verify that.

The single outlet exception went away a few code cycles ago. All 120 V 15 and 20A receptacles need to be GFCI protected. The GFCI needs to be readily accessible, as well. That means that if you have a circuit just for your garage door opener, it needs to have either a GFCI breaker or deadfront GFCI reachable from the ground without a ladder, it can't be the thing on the ceiling.

 

[Shiftless]

The single outlet exception went away a few code cycles ago. All 120 V 15 and 20A receptacles need to be GFCI protected. The GFCI needs to be readily accessible, as well. That means that if you have a circuit just for your garage door opener, it needs to have either a GFCI breaker or deadfront GFCI reachable from the ground without a ladder, it can't be the thing on the ceiling.

What if as in my case, the garage ceiling is only 7 feet above the floor? Would most inspectors consider that a "readily accessible" place to mount a GFCI receptacle? I have one mounted on the side of an I-beam supporting the ceiling rafters. (EMT installation)
IMHO, it is.

 

[dscheidt]

What if as in my case, the garage ceiling is only 7 feet above the floor? Would most inspectors consider that a "readily accessible" place to mount a GFCI receptacle? I have one mounted on the side of an I-beam supporting the ceiling rafters. (EMT installation)
IMHO, it is.

I suspect no one would care, but I don't know if there's a height definition for readily accessible. (There isn't where it's defined) There is a requirement for breakers to be no more than 2 m from the gound, which could reasonably be applied to other readily accessible stuff. I have a GFCI in my garage that's about 7 feet off the ground, because that's where the box is, and the only other outlet on the circuit is outside, 10 feet up.

 

[ard]

I have had multiple GFCIs go bad over the years.. They would just keep tripping. Replaced and all is good.

 

[6768rogues]

In a training course our Department of State once described "readily accessible" as where you would want it if it was a real emergency and you had to put your hand on it NOW.

 

[Marctrees]

Ramper - WHY are you interested in the blank GFI's ??

I cannot even imagine where in a garage shop one would want those.

I worked as a residential Elect Contractor for years.. don't recall ever needing one.

Better check your thinking on those.

Very odd.

Marc

 

[JKJEFF]

Ramper - WHY are you interested in the blank GFI's ??

I cannot even imagine where in a garage shop one would want those.

I worked as a residential Elect Contractor for years.. don't recall ever needing one.

Better check your thinking on those.

Very odd.

Marc

I was going to post the same reply. You beat me to it.

 

[Bretny]

Cant you gfci protect every circuit after the gfci outlet by connecting it to the "load" terminals? This is how i did most of mine.

So even a 30a 240v welding outlet needs gfci protection?

 

[850xpeps]

Gfi are sickening to try and work with. Between those an those crappy plugs that kids can't stick their fingers in I don't want to have to wire anything new. Bs if you ask me. If been shocked using gfi breakers numerous times while vibrating with the concrete ********.

 

[Ramper]

I have the outlets I want/need installed. Yes it would work if I was to use a GFCI as the first outlet and then run the rest. What I did (right or wrong) was to run 12/2 line to the rear "bays" and then drop off the "main line" with another 12/2 wired into 2 duplex outlets (4 total) at each post. So what I have is 3 sets of 4 outlets on the three rear posts in my shop. Adding a GFCI before the 1st "drop" would then protect the entire circuit (my understanding).

It would be easier/cheaper to replace one of the current duplex outlets with a GFCI or to place a GFCI "upstream" from the current drops. I think I am going to add a blank GFCI closer to the panel and thereby have ALL of the GFCIs close to the panel (as the other 2 are there now). Yes it means that I will need to walk (30 feet) if it trips, but it also keeps the look/function I am after.

 

[Norcal]

Cant you gfci protect every circuit after the gfci outlet by connecting it to the "load" terminals? This is how i did most of mine.

So even a 30a 240v welding outlet needs gfci protection?

At this time, GFCI not required for 240V circuits.