Got back my first estimate today

[bdodson89]

I'm looking to build a 40x30 garage apartment in southeastern Virginia. I'm in the process of buying just under 3 acres of land on my family's farm. I met with a contractor a few weeks ago and finally got an estimate back today. What was quoted was a 40x30 2 story 3 car garage, 10' ceilings (wanted 12' for possible future car lift) on 1st floor, 8' ceilings on 2nd floor, half bath in garage, 2 bed 1 bath in living area with kitchen and living room. 3ton HVAC unit for 2nd floor only, insulated and finished drywall in garage. 100 amp electric (was told today to go 200amp), middle of the road appliances and finishes, laminate wood floors in living space and carpet in bedrooms, and vinyl siding. 3 9x9 doors and one regular man door. No well, septic or driveway. I'm assuming he quoted on 4" of concrete but forgot to ask. I was quoted $160k base, going up from there if i decide to add or change anything. About 30-$60k more than i was hoping, I thought this was a little high. Took my plans to another builder today to get another estimate, he seemed more interested in where I work than building me something. I plan on getting at least 4 estimates. What do ya'll think? I know there are a lot of variables but based on the description does $160k sound close or no? Thanks for any input!

 

[jd_1138]

Does sound a little high to me. 130k seems better, but I am a lay person. I'd get the hardwood laminate throughout the house even the bedrooms. I ripped up our carpet, and the nasties that live under there. Ick. My allergies are better now. Also, pre-wire for internet. Lots of outlets.

There are some brands of flooring that are toxic, so be careful what flooring that goes in.

 

[Kaizen]

If I were you I would be calling prefab places.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[matt_i]

Do you have actual plans or just the above specs and builder also has to design it as well?

 

[rburke65]

At 2400 sq. ft. 2 bedroom, 1 1/2 bath, carpet, hardwood floors, heat and air......I'll bet that price isn't too far from crazy. But what the hell do I know.

 

[Dirtydan69]

I would say it depends on where you're located also.

 

[555]

I don't know in your area, but $67.00 a square foot is very reasonable here.
Regards,
John

 

[rsanter]

How about going some of the finish work ypurself? Can you
You can lay the flooring? Perhaps install the cabinets? Or any other upgrades.
How about you supply the appliances so you don't have to incur his markup.

There are ways to save a few bucks

Bob

 

[BillK]

Why did he quote you 10 ft walls when you asked for 12 ft ?? That would turn me off right away.

 

[bdodson89]

Do you have actual plans or just the above specs and builder also has to design it as well?

I have blueprints from a friend's similar garage apartment which I gave the builder, also gave him a floor plan of pretty much exactly what I want that I found online. I can't figure out how to attach a picture of either on here yet. I'm new to the forum.

How about going some of the finish work yourself? Can you
You can lay the flooring? Perhaps install the cabinets? Or any other upgrades.
How about you supply the appliances so you don't have to incur his markup.

There are ways to save a few bucks

Bob

I could probably do some of the finishes myself. I've done laminate floors before but I'm far from being a carpenter. I have a good chunk of money saved up, but it's going quickly with the land purchase and county fees and rezoning. I could probably purchase appliances out of pocket.

My current situation is I live in a house that I don't pay rent or mortgage on, luckily. Not married and no kids. I don't have to go anywhere anytime soon, but I'm ready to build on the farm. I was hoping to build a garage apartment for a little over $100k and later if/when I have a family build a house in front of the garage. But for $160k I might as well save some more cash and build a house. Whatever I build I HAVE to have a garage. I've run out of room now for my toys and tools in a single car garage and shed.

 

[bdodson89]

Why did he quote you 10 ft walls when you asked for 12 ft ?? That would turn me off right away.

Hopefully just miscommunication. He's the one that recommended 12' instead of 10' though. This builder is one that just put up a modular home for a friend of mine. Very nice guy and was highly recommended by my friend. Giving him the benefit of the doubt but definitely getting at least 4 estimates regardless.

 

[RVDan]

For a finished building that's not out of line but I certainly wouldn't do it that way.

Act as your own general contractor. Perhaps get this guy to do the concrete and structure for you. Hire your own electrician, roofer, plumber, drywallers, etc to avoid the markup.

What are you going to do for a well and septic? That could end up being a hundred grand in it's own

 

[bdodson89]

For a finished building that's not out of line but I certainly wouldn't do it that way.

Act as your own general contractor. Perhaps get this guy to do the concrete and structure for you. Hire your own electrician, roofer, plumber, drywallers, etc to avoid the markup.

What are you going to do for a well and septic? That could end up being a hundred grand in it's own

I've pondered being my own GC, but have been told not many banks will give a loan that way. Well will be a deep well estimated at 5-$7k. County has approved me for a conventional septic system but I will potentially have to have a lift pump in the septic tank due to the garage being slightly below the drain field. Contractor does septic as well and said it could be anywhere from 8-$30k depending on what type of system I have to have.

 

[Radix2]

Sounds pretty reasonable to me. Don't be afraid to talk with the builders on what the cost drivers are if you think it is high. See where 10k could be found, if nothing else you will get a better idea of how each builder looks at things.

Fill out your profile a bit so we can tell where you are, prices are very regional and people will give you better feedback.

 

[matt_i]

I think the problem is, the time the GC is going to spend on your house he might be able to build a 2000sf house of the same size and get $100k more. Granted the garage isn't finished living space but the thing has to be built like a house (footings, etc) due to the 2nd floor loads. if you do end up doing this I would pay close attention to heavy insulation under the floor, since that's a potentially unheated space. If it gets overlooked the floors will be noticeably cold in the winter (had a part of my house when I lived in Atl built over the garage and it had these exact issues...beautiful drywall ceiling but no insulation......)

 

[bdodson89]

I think the problem is, the time the GC is going to spend on your house he might be able to build a 2000sf house of the same size and get $100k more. Granted the garage isn't finished living space but the thing has to be built like a house (footings, etc) due to the 2nd floor loads. if you do end up doing this I would pay close attention to heavy insulation under the floor, since that's a potentially unheated space. If it gets overlooked the floors will be noticeably cold in the winter (had a part of my house when I lived in Atl built over the garage and it had these exact issues...beautiful drywall ceiling but no insulation......)

Good point about the price. I know the GC said had a developer that wanted a price on 30 modulars built soon, so you could be right. I told him on the first floor I wanted R19 in the walls and R30 in the ceiling.

 

[Certified Drunk]

I was quoted about $67sf for a garage in Seattle..
No drywall, electrical or insulation.
I was told that the shop was about an hour away and would have to pay travel time each way.
GOOD-BYE!

 

[tarmy]

You better think about fees. My garage / shop here in Kamifornia was almost 40k for county fees and inspections.
View attachment 623438

The hit me for review fees, inspection fees, sewer fees, park fees, taxes (don't even get me started on the additional property tax they add), meter fees, transformer installation, fire district fees...you frigggin' name it, these a**holes will charge you for it.

And before you ask why take it here from these clowns...this is my view...
View attachment 623439

Nough said...

 

[glentre]

I'm also in Eastern Va in Gloucester, building a garage very close to your spec. Based on the quotes I received, your contractor's estimate seems very good for what you are getting. Prices will vary considerably depending on where you live, however, so input from others around the country may not apply to your area. If you are getting four estimates, they should be representative of what the cost is where you are located.

Some savings could come from how you construct the roof. We looked at stick built with steel girder, engineered joists, and trusses. For our 30 ft span, going with trusses was much cheaper than any other method and has the added benefit of having a flat 13 ft ceiling, and no columns. Our roof is 12/12 which gives us a good size future apartment on the second floor. At this point, the building is in its final stages of framing.

One caution, the Gloucester building dept which uses the state code rejected the use of 12 ft 2x6 studs. We got an approval by having a structural engineer certify that the 12 footers would be ok.

Glen

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

And before you ask why take it here from these clowns...this is my view...
View attachment 623439

Nough said...

Shasta lake?

 

[kj_mustang]

I would get other bids. I probably have about $75,000-$85,000 in my 32 x 52 that we just finished living in for 1.5 years.

 

[APEowner]

You're doing the right thing by getting multiple bids. That's really the only way to determine what a reasonable price is in your area.

You really should put together a real bid package with actual plans and a spec book so that all of the contractors know what they're bidding on and so that they're bidding on the same thing. The more detail you have the more accurate the bid, the less questions there will be during the build and the more leverage you have if things go sideways.

 

[Voi]

What was quoted was a 40x30 2 story 3 car garage.

I was quoted $160k base, going up from there if i decide to add or change anything.

What do ya'll think? I know there are a lot of variables but based on the description does $160k sound close or no? Thanks for any input!

A two story, 40x30 rectangular footprint with gable truss roof is a pretty simple structure to build. Make sure you find a contractor who isn't throwing out an estimate based on price per square foot of some of these more convoluted homes with multiple bump-outs and roof valley's etc.

But with that said, you could say at $160,000 you're paying $33 per square foot for the garage and $100 per square foot for the apartment. That wouldn't be bad at all in my area.

For what it is worth, a friend of mine just finished building a 40x30 house. He regrets a few things but one big one is not going 32'x40' to keep things at a multiple of 4'.

The extra concrete and longer trusses would not have been much more and he would have had less waste with wall and roof sheathing.

 

[bdodson89]

You're doing the right thing by getting multiple bids.
You really should put together a real bid package with actual plans and a spec book so that all of the contractors know what they're bidding on and so that they're bidding on the same thing. The more detail you have the more accurate the bid, the less questions there will be during the build and the more leverage you have if things go sideways.

I just realized that today actually. That's the only fair way to compare contractor estimates. Even then I'm sure there are many variables, i.e. quality of materials etc. I plan on writing up a spec sheet tomorrow to give every contractor to make it more specific and easier for them. Thanks.

 

[jd_1138]

Could even skip the apartment on top idea, and just have a garage built. Then buy a nice little trailer to live in next to the garage. You mention in case you have a family, surely, you'll find a beautiful woman to marry and then you can get a house built. If you build it with the apartment now, that space will be largely wasted if you build a house in the future.

Unless you were to use it as a mancave, I guess, or rent it out to someone for some rental income, but a lot of people don't want to be landlords and put up with that hassle.

I'm just throwing out some ideas. Brainstorming. Lots of variables.

 

[tarmy]

Shasta lake?

Almanor...

 

[WhiffySpark]

I would look at a modular home and just build a pole barn. That's my plan one day

Combining the shop and living space sounds like a great idea for a gear head, but idk how a significant other would take it

 

[jd_1138]

I would look at a modular home and just build a pole barn. That's my plan one day

Combining the shop and living space sounds like a great idea for a gear head, but idk how a significant other would take it

Not too well.

 

[swharris]

I know there are a lot of variables but based on the description does $160k sound close or no? Thanks for any input!

I'm in the O.C./L.A. Metro area and I'm about 2.5 times that for a 40x60 with ground floor 1 bedroom apt.(attached additional space) Double height garage section with mezzanine storage. Lots of additional costs for sewer out to main street from back of property, STUPID fire sprinkler/alarm mandate(don't ask) and a **** ton of other CA BS.

You guys out in the sticks have no idea how cheap you have it. Here in the metro area costs are very very high and almost no way around it sadly Very jealous of you folks. For many reason we are settled here and can't just "move out of that state".

 

[larry_g]

Personally I'd suggest that you compare the cost of a separate 1200' house, modular if you want and the separate 1200' garage/shop. It might be to your advantage dollar wise

lg
no neat sig line

 

[rburke65]

Aa said....a better idea just might be a ? 40' x 60'x 12' shop and then just park a trailer either inside or next to the shop. Bigger building....shop....and then take your time with the house. Good luck.

 

[jetnow1]

I am just finishing the build of my garage, acted as my own builder so the only subcontracting was the foundation and slab. (24 by 30) the bids varied by almost
100% from low to high. Check references and be sure to see some work done by the
contractor before you sign. Get lien releases.

 

[jd_1138]

I am just finishing the build of my garage, acted as my own builder so the only subcontracting was the foundation and slab. (24 by 30) the bids varied by almost
100% from low to high. Check references and be sure to see some work done by the
contractor before you sign. Get lien releases.

So you did all carpentry/roofing/siding yourself? As you know, that's quite a bit different than the OP's situation. If he acted as his own GC, he'd be subcontracting out everything pretty much as he said he doesn't do carpentry/framing.

Sometimes the 20% you save by acting as your own GC gets eaten up by hassles, delays, problems, getting jerked around by a sub (who may try to take advantage of the OP's lack of experience). Whereas the GC can smooth most of that out and he has his own crew and/or subs that he uses.

I have a friend who has a portfolio of about a dozen rental houses. He acts as his own GC. He has a subcontractor that he always uses who is licensed in electrical, plumbing, and HVAC. So this guy comes in and makes sure the houses are up to code in terms of HVAC, electrical, plumbing. And then he has an Amish crew come in to do the general carpentry, walls, flooring, roofing, siding, etc..

His homes are all flips. He buys distressed houses that are in foreclosure, tax lien, needing work, etc.. Not new construction.

Not that it's out of the realm of possibility for the OP to act as his own GC. He can get the foundation poured, then hire carpenters to build the garage, then electrical/HVAC/plumbing. Would certainly be a learning experience.

 

[FearTheH]

Here in southwest Virginia, not too far from you, it's approximately 100 bucks per square foot finished(flooring,trim, vanities, counters, etc) putting you at about 120k for the apartment, and 40k($33.33 per square foot) for your garage. Which is about average for our areas.

The best way to cut your costs is to act as the general contractor and sub out your concrete, framing, electrical, mechanical and plumbing yourself. In doing so, you can make some connections(unless you already have some) with people that do these types of work and ask them(the actual laborers and not the business owners) to do your project as side work. This will save you a ton of money.

 

[APEowner]

I just realized that today actually. That's the only fair way to compare contractor estimates. Even then I'm sure there are many variables, i.e. quality of materials etc. I plan on writing up a spec sheet tomorrow to give every contractor to make it more specific and easier for them. Thanks.

You're welcome. It's always a challenge to decide how much to specify on smaller projects like yours but on big commercial projects the spec book covers pretty much everything including details like the make and model of lock sets and electrical outlets.

In most of the threads on here where there is some question about the legitimacy of a construction technique or some kind of building disaster the problem centers around something that wasn't specified on the plans.

Of course is also possible to have the builder follow a stupid but fully detailed plan and still end up with a problem but in my experience if everyone knows what the plan is there's a higher likely hood of problems being caught early.

 

[bdodson89]

Help! I'm trying to make up a spec sheet for contractors to base estimates on. Again I have close to zero construction experience so I'm not sure where to even begin or what to ask for. Does anyone have access to a template to help guide me? I don't need anything over the top or particular as far as specs but definitely need help. Figuring on 4" concrete slab, 2 or 3ton hvac, vinyl double hung gas filled windows, R19 exterior insulation, R30 ceiling insulation, 200amp electrical, 12' ceilings first floor, 8 foot 2nd floor, 30 year architectural roof etc. etc. There are so many details, I don't know where to start.

A few people have told me consider being my own GC and sub everything out to save money but I see this being a problem based on my lack of construction background. I don't have to move, specially no time soon if I don't want to, so I'm not in a hurry, this could be a good thing to help me learn some skills, but could also be a disaster. I work for a fire department and there are a lot of guys that do trades part time i.e. hvac, carpentry, electrical etc. so I'm sure I could find help when I needed it.

 

[James-W]

Being your own general contractor only works if you have the time and the knowledge it takes to do the job properly. If you are busy working and/or don't really know who to get for sub contractors, then I would suggest that you don't do it.

 

[joes169]

Being your own general contractor only works if you have the time and the knowledge it takes to do the job properly. If you are busy working and/or don't really know who to get for sub contractors, then I would suggest that you don't do it.

Thank you for bringing this up. As a subcontractor, I'm reading all these posts about "save 20% by GC'ing yourself" and am wondering if I live in a bubble.

First, anything near 20% OH for a GC is outrageous, especially for plain vanilla construction like this. Most GC's I work with are between 3-8% OH. That said, a good GC can save all of that and more when they know what they're doing vs. an average homeowner.

Second, most subs have been burned several times by homeowners acting as GC's, and don't ever forget that lesson. I bid higher to homeowners acting as their own GC that I have little or no experience with, for the simple reason that the odds are much higher that the job will take longer for us to complete vs. through an experienced GC. The GC will take care of alot of the legwork for us, so we can spend much more time on the job at hand vs. "hand-holding". Of course, I'm talking about larger jobs with several trades involved, not a simple driveway or sidewalk, etc..

OP, keep looking around for the right GC, you'll be gald you spent the time finding the right one that you're comfortable with.

 

[bdodson89]

Being your own general contractor only works if you have the time and the knowledge it takes to do the job properly. If you are busy working and/or don't really know who to get for sub contractors, then I would suggest that you don't do it.

I only work 10 days a month so time isn't an issue. And I have access to friends at work that are either contractors or have a connection/recommendation to contractors.

 

[joes169]

A few people have told me consider being my own GC and sub everything out to save money but I see this being a problem based on my lack of construction background. I don't have to move, specially no time soon if I don't want to, so I'm not in a hurry, this could be a good thing to help me learn some skills, but could also be a disaster. I work for a fire department and there are a lot of guys that do trades part time i.e. hvac, carpentry, electrical etc. so I'm sure I could find help when I needed it.

This is likely to be the biggest investment you'll make in your life up to this point, why take the risk of going into blindly? I understand the desire to learn, but there's plenty of easier, safer, and more productive ways to do that than building your own place.

This may not sit well with some here, but I have to admit, some of the biggest hackery I've seen done in the trades is by guy's who don't do the work for a living, but "moonlight" for extra cash. It's one thing to hire a journeyman electrician/plumber/HVAC guy that does it day in and day out to do it on the side after work, it's a whole 'nother to get a firefighter to do it that "thinks" he knows the current code.

Good luck to you.