Grounding antenna

[matt151617]

I just ditched DirecTV, and attached a small OTA antenna to the dish mount. When I checked the wiring, there is a ground block installed near the wire's entrance to the house, but the ground wire is not attached to anything. Inside the basement I attached a coax surge protector with a #10 wire and a splitter with a #12 wire to the #6 ground wire coming off of the panel, and going to the water line.

Obviously the antenna/mount need to be grounded, but they're on the complete opposite end of the house from the main panel/mast. Do I have to run a wire from the ground block all the way to the #6 ground? Can I attach it to a water pipe? Or should install a ground rod specifically for the antenna? I also have 2 buried ground rods for a detached garage within 20 feet, if that's an option to tie in to.

 

[DonPowers]

I would go with the shortest path and put a new rod as close as possible to the mast.

Local electrical codes typically cover antenna grounding, you might want to look there if you are not inclined to put in a new rod.

 

[sberry]

Run it 20 ft to the rods

 

[rockwithjason]

is this a ground mount antenna mast or is it roof mounted? if it's a ground mount, drive a rod at the antenna mast and run a #6 solid bare copper wire to the existing ground rods. you want to create a straight down into the ground path for lighting to travel on. if it's a roof mount, bond the conductor to the mast and run straight down the shortest path to the ground and then bury the wire in a trench to the ground rods. it would be even better if you drove another rod where the wire comes straight down from the roof and contacts the ground as this is the most likely path for lightning.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

If u put a new grounding electrode in it needs to be tied to the existing GES.

Check to make sure your plumbing is bonded.

 

[matt151617]

Roof mount antenna. Since the ground is frozen, is there anything I should do now, or wait till spring? Lightning isn't a concern in the winter, but the mast is ungrounded at this point.

 

[Bondo]

Since the ground is frozen, is there anything I should do now, or wait till spring?

Ayuh,.... A ground rod driver in a hammer drill will drive the rod through frozen ground like a hot knife in butter,....

 

[matt151617]

Ayuh,.... A ground rod driver in a hammer drill will drive the rod through frozen ground like a hot knife in butter,....

I'm sure it would... I need to dig up the other 2 existing ground rods to clamp the wire onto them however...

 

[sberry]

Is this a small antenna, a satellite thing? They use a number 14 coated wire and simply bug it on the wire going to the ground rods if they are local.

 

[matt151617]

Yes, very small. Maybe 18" long and 3" wide. There's already a ground wire (probably #14) that runs from the mount to a ground block but it's not attached to anything else.

 

[sberry]

Ya, no good if its not hooked up. I watched an installer that was a contractor do some work, he had to take about 10 pics of the grounding and change a couple minor issues they wanted that didn't mean squat but they were super fussy.

 

[matt151617]

Is the ground block still required if I run #6 wire directly from the mast to the rods?

 

[sberry]

Is the ground block still required if I run #6 wire directly from the mast to the rods?

The ground block grounds the shield in the coax. You could run one from each. For this bitty antenna it only needs 14 insulated.

 

[APEowner]

You need to use the ground block, #14 is fine and it needs to go to wherever everything else is grounded in your house. It all needs to run to a common spot to be effective.

 

[timgr]

As above, the antenna ground needs to be bonded to the building ground.

Don't depend on a ground rod. The resistance between an isolated ground rod and building ground can be many ohms, resulting in a dangerous potential difference in case of a lighting strike. It's not as much a matter of protecting the equipment in the house, as of safety. You want the outlet grounds and grounded appliances to be at the same potential as the antenna ground in case of a strike. Run a substantial ground wire from the antenna mast and the grounding block to the building ground, preferably outdoors until as close as possible to the building ground. You can buy #10 solid wire in a coil fairly cheaply on ebay.

http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=901

 

[matt151617]

So a #10 wire is sufficent to ground the mast and for the grounding block?

 

[timgr]

That's how I grounded mine. I followed the advice I got on the tvfool site. See post #20 in this thread http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=901

If you want to run larger wire, do so if you feel more secure. If you run your ground directly to an isolated ground rod, by code you must connect that rod to your building ground with a #6 wire. There are rules in the NEC for how the #6 wire must be run. One source says to use #8 solid aluminum from the mast to the isolated ground rod. The CATV and TEL are typically bonded to the panel ground with 14 ga wire. Again, it's important that there is no resistance between the antenna mast and coax and the building ground.

There is lots of conflicting advice on this topic. I'm not an electrician, but if you are unsure, I suggest you research the NEC or consult an electrician.

 

[larry4406]

Waking up this thread.

I am planning on installing an antenna on an existing chimney mount from a prior satellite dish. All wiring from this mount is gone.

I have an intersystem bonding bridge similar to this installed on the house exterior below the meter can. It is connected to the panel ground via #6 copper.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/BURNDY-I...idge-Aluminum-Wire-Connector-RACIBB/202941379

From the antenna, can I use an RG6 with messenger cable to ground the mast to the bonding bridge along with a ground block block for the RG6 connecting it to the bonding bridge? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001I5610E/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I read that the antenna mast is supposed to be grounded by #10 copper but this linked thread indicates that the #17 copper clad steel or bronze messenger cable on the RG6 will suffice.
https://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsar...ingSatelliteDishandLead-InCables~20020303.htm

It is clearly easier to use an RG6 with messenger cable vs running an RG6 and a separate ground wire.

 

[matt151617]

That link is from 2003... I'm guessing #17 wire won't cut it anymore. Running a separate ground wire really isn't bad, just get a pack of small zip ties and a roll of THHN.

My understanding is the messaging wire is for stuff like adjusting a power antenna and/or supporting the coax between structures, not for grounding.

 

[larry4406]

That link is from 2003... I'm guessing #17 wire won't cut it anymore. Running a separate ground wire really isn't bad, just get a pack of small zip ties and a roll of THHN.

My understanding is the messaging wire is for stuff like adjusting a power antenna and/or supporting the coax between structures, not for grounding.

Good catch on the 2003 date of that link! The zip tie approach of the THHN seems reasonable.

Edit
Some of the sites I've looked at say to use solid wire not stranded for the ground. In my ignorance 10g stranded or solid is the same. This wire will be exposed to UV as the antenna will be chimney mounted.

 

[Stuff]

I've seen that stranded copper corrodes faster so prefer solid when exposed to the elements.

 

[larry4406]

How are you guys running the wire along the roof and securing it to the roof? My house has a hip roof, asphalt shingles, with central chimney. I will be mounting the antenna on the chimney thus the wire will follow the ridge for about 30', then down the hip for about 15' where I can then jump over the gutter and create a drip loop to the ground block before entering the attic via a hole in the soffit. I intend to run the coax wire with ground adjacent the cap shingles to be less noticeable.

This guys solution is pretty clever except I would use zip ties.
http://w5jgv.com/tie-downs/tie-downs.htm

 

[dscheidt]

This guys solution is pretty clever except I would use zip ties.
http://w5jgv.com/tie-downs/tie-downs.htm

Zip ties, even good quality, carbon black filled ones, do not hold up well in direct sunlight. On a roof, I'd expect them to be brittle and failing in less than five years. You could use a stainless steel zip tie, but a piece of copper wire is cheap and easy. Even if the PVC jacket fails, the solid wire will hold the cables in place.

 

[6768rogues]

If you do use a water pipe, make sure there is not something nonmetalic in the system and make sure there is a jumper wire over the meter. My son owns 7 rental properties in a nearby village and their 3-year C of O inspections check for a jumper wire at the water meter. Many do not have it and I have installed them, so they are not a given. My uncle worked for the gas company and he repeatedly found gas pipes used for grounding, another big no-no.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

If you do use a water pipe, make sure there is not something nonmetalic in the system and make sure there is a jumper wire over the meter. My son owns 7 rental properties in a nearby village and their 3-year C of O inspections check for a jumper wire at the water meter. Many do not have it and I have installed them, so they are not a given. My uncle worked for the gas company and he repeatedly found gas pipes used for grounding, another big no-no.

And the water pipe needs to be bonded to the GES of the electrical system otherwise its pointless because it could be at a different potential and compromise and lightning protection...

 

[sberry]

What is the code section for antenna? I know the phones have an allowance if there is a quite a distance to the service ground and allow a stake. I have read the antenna section but its been a while, they have some specific wire routing methods.

 

[DonPowers]

Ran across this link.

http://www.reeve.com/Documents/Articles Papers/AntennaSystemGroundingRequirements_Reeve.pdf