Grounding question re: "floating" steel pipe

[Thruxton]

My second floor bath as a separate vent stack in 2" galvanized, and 1/2" galvanized supply lines to the lav faucets (old work) which are connected to PVC lines in the bath floor, as are the lav, toilet, and tub supplies and drains, so none of the old galvanized is grounded (which is why I called them "floating"). How best to ground these steel pipes? I have been doing some repairs, so I have a section of the wall exposed over these lines, so if those of you who know how to do this correctly would offer solutions your quick input would be very timely! I did look through the '08 NEC (applies in this jurisdiction) but if I found anything I didn't recognize it.

Thanks!

Martin

 

[Zeke]

That would seem to be a 'bonding' issue and for what I've dealt with I used no. 8 bare copper and bonding clamps. When you get to a grounded box, you can terminate it there. AFAIK.

 

[Thruxton]

That would seem to be a 'bonding' issue and for what I've dealt with I used no. 8 bare copper and bonding clamps. When you get to a grounded box, you can terminate it there. AFAIK.

Well, you are one of the guys I hoped would chime in on this! And yes, it is a bonding issue, my bad on the terminology.

One question, by "grounded box" could a grounded outlet box serve? That would solve my problem as there is one within inches of these pipes.

 

[Zeke]

That was what I meant, any box that is grounded back to the panel by way of a sub panel or main panel.

I appreciate your confidence in me but I'm not as knowledgeable as several on this forum.

 

[pattenp]

Bonding attachment points are to be accessible. You aren't to bury the connection in the wall.

 

[Thruxton]

Bonding attachment points are to be accessible. You aren't to bury the connection in the wall.

Would a removable panel that would expose the bonding points be sufficient?

 

[pattenp]

Would a removable panel that would expose the bonding points be sufficient?

I would think so.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

If your electrical service has a ground wire bonding it to water service coming into your house you should be fine already.
No need to bond the dwv/drain waste vent piping.

 

[n8n]

I think the issue is that there are sections of metal piping that aren't continuous back to the bonding point. Those should have been jumpered around when the non-metallic pipe was installed, but that's water under the bridge at this point.

I'm really not sure what the best way to handle this is, I'm not that up on my current codes...

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Either way the dwv piping doesn't need to be bonded.

 

[pattenp]

Either way the dwv piping doesn't need to be bonded.

If the DWV is metal and is in a location where there's a possibility of becoming energized it needs to be bonded. If it's unlikely to become energized then bonding is not needed. NEC 250.104 (B) Other Metal Piping.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

If the DWV is metal and is in a location where there's a possibility of becoming energized it needs to be bonded. If it's unlikely to become energized then bonding is not needed. NEC 250.104 (B) Other Metal Piping.

Ive plumbed everything from anything and everything from 1br shacks to 10 story buildings over the years,Ive never had to bond a dwv system .
I always ground/bond any part of a boiler system that has line voltage running to it.

 

[Aceman]

,Ive never had to bond a dwv system .

Same here, I do electrical for a living and I've never bonded an isolated section of galvanized drain pipe in a home. Of course it doesn't hurt to bond it, but I think it's a waste of time.

 

[Thruxton]

If the DWV is metal and is in a location where there's a possibility of becoming energized it needs to be bonded. If it's unlikely to become energized then bonding is not needed. NEC 250.104 (B) Other Metal Piping.

Same here, I do electrical for a living and I've never bonded an isolated section of galvanized drain pipe in a home. Of course it doesn't hurt to bond it, but I think it's a waste of time.

Gentlemen all, thanks very much! Based on reading your remarks, especially the above, I went back and reread 250.104 (B), and I think these comments are applicable, and there is no need to bond this section.

Of course I am very aware of the famous quote about what the NEC says, "It doesn’t say what you think it says, nor what you remember it to have said, nor what you were told that it says, and certainly not what you want it to say, and if by chance you are its author, it doesn’t say what you intended it to say. Then what does it say? It says what it says. So if you want to know what it says, stop trying to remember what it says, and don’t ask anyone else. Go back and read it, and pay attention as though you were reading it for the first time.
- Charlie Beck's Rule of Technical Reading

 

[Zeke]

I built a room addition many years ago when I was doing that kind of work. There was an aluminum window within 3 feet, measured at grade, from a pool. I had to 'bond' that window to the closest grounded metal box. IIRC, I had to have a metal box for termination whereas other boxes may have been non metallic. It was in the 80's so memories are vague.

 

[C96]

Great point Zeke; many people don’t realize how critical grounding and bonding becomes around swimming pools. Yes, swimming pools are a whole different animal and that window frame today would have been part of what is now called the Equipotential Bonding grid.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

I built a room addition many years ago when I was doing that kind of work. There was an aluminum window within 3 feet, measured at grade, from a pool. I had to 'bond' that window to the closest grounded metal box. IIRC, I had to have a metal box for termination whereas other boxes may have been non metallic. It was in the 80's so memories are vague.

Grounding/bonding around a swimming pool is a whole other bottomless hole in the nec!