Hardinge HLV-H Rebuild Thread

[Hephaestus29]

Please, Hardinge HLV-H rebuild material only Thanks.

I picked up this 1972 HLV-H early this year and finally
started tearing it down for a rebuild about mid summer.

A little background, I have about 20 years experience
running a Mill, and Lathe, 10 weeks to go in my
apprenticeship in Machine Repair and this will be my
first complete teardown and rebuild of any machine.
With that being said: I’m obviously no
expert on rebuilds but I’m doing this for myself and
anyone that wants to read, follow along or contribute
helpful information. If you have rebuild pics. of an HLV-H
that “you” rebuilt or are in the process of rebuilding I
welcome those too.
I’m starting this thread here on GJ for
another option besides P.M. and
Hardinge lathe forums.

Remember, I may have a different point
of view than you do, and if I mention a
part it will be one that I got out of the
parts list/manual or service manual.
For instance:
The bed of the Lathe and the Bed Plate
are two different things and are listed
separately in the parts manual and would
be sold separately.

 

[Hephaestus29]

The first thing to come apart was the tailstock.
I noticed it felt kind of rough and when I got it
apart I found a broken race.

I also found another worn piece in the
tailstock and I’ll have to edit this later
as I forgot the name of the part.

I also milled some off the face of the
tailstock because there was a chipped
place I wanted to clean up.

 

[matt_i]

Very cool! does the HLV_H have the I/M inch-metric threading capability "built-in"? Seems like there's an HLV lathe that doesn't have the -H suffix but I'm not really sure what that difference is...the term "single dog clutch" is floating around in my brain somewhere as a part of the system that keeps the operator from "splitting the lead" but I'm not sure if that applies.

Also curious if you had dimensional issues/machine alignments like turning a taper which you intend to correct?

 

[Hephaestus29]

I know you can get metric gears for it but it’s an english machine
as far as I can tell, at least from looking at the dials anyway.
I’m not sure if it has metric gears in it yet or not because I was
told when I bought it that it was a Metric Machine but the dials did
Not indicate that, so I took a chance on it being an English Machine
that a dealer had advertised as a metric machine.
It was running when I bought it, but I had to take it apart to fix some
issues anyway so I figured why not paint it too.
I had to take it apart to fix a broken shifter fork in the gear
box.
As far as dimensional issues I never ran any parts on it unless
you’re talking about wear on the dovetails or the thickness of the
bed plate itself.

 

[cmandp]

These Hardinge HLV and TFB lathes are my favorite. They are so smooth and well made.

Main difference between the HLV and HLV-H is the bed width, being they made it wider on the H.

Hephaestus here's some more info on Hardinge and the HLV lathes you may find interesting. http://www.lathes.co.uk/hardinge/

Good luck on the refresh.

 

[zmotorsports]

Awesome project. I love the Hardinge HLV lathes. My very first experience with any lathe or machining tools was my buddy's Hardinge toolroom lathe and I was hooked instantly and wanted to develop some machining skills.

 

[rmack898]

I never ran a Hardinge but I get to run a Victor clone for an afternoon.

A very nice machine and I'm along for the ride, now get busy.

 

[dkmc]

Subscribed.
Maybe this thread will inspire me to get going on the one I picked up at the scrap yard 15+ years ago. It's not in as good a shape as yours.

 

[Hephaestus29]

Subscribed.
Maybe this thread will inspire me to get going on the one I picked up at the scrap yard 15+ years ago. It's not in as good a shape as yours.

Well it looks like your machine has quite
a bit more rust, but mechanically how is it?

My compound is all busted up, bearing
race in the tailstock was busted, and the
shifter fork in the gearbox was broke.

 

[Hephaestus29]

Here’s a picture of Two control boxes
and the gear box door stripped for new
paint.
As nice and easy to run as the Hardinge
lathes are, they sure didn’t spend
enough time on parts of the castings in
my opinion smoothing out imperfections
from the casting process.
As I cleaned up 48 years of grime over
several weeks and stripped the paint off
in the process I noticed this and took a
file to any high places along the way to
help ease any paint issues.

 

[humpty]

I have "refreshed" a few HLVs in my career, truly a great machine.

As a very young CNC maintenance guy I destroyed a HLV's main spindle bearings through overwork and abuse. Thus began my repair history with Hardinge. I have had one in or around my life ever since. I will find one of mine own someday, I miss them.

humpty

 

[dkmc]

I powered it up when I got it, but that was so long ago, I don't really remember. But I also don't remember any major problems. The pictures don't show a compound, it is missing. But.....I have a brand new never used one waiting.

Well it looks like your machine has quite
a bit more rust, but mechanically how is it?

My compound is all busted up, bearing
race in the tailstock was busted, and the
shifter fork in the gearbox was broke.

I worked at Hardinge several years in the late '70's. At that time, the paint process was a heated epoxy that went over a thick layer of fill. I think that was why less time was spent on casting prep. Just slather on the filler and sand it smooth.

Not the subject of this thread, but as a comparison, I'd say a Monarch 10EE is an all around far superior Lathe to the HLV-H. But probably for fine or light work, the HLV-H is handier to use. I have and have used both, if I had to pick one it'd be the 10EE hands down.

Here’s a picture of Two control boxes
and the gear box door stripped for new
paint.
As nice and easy to run as the Hardinge
lathes are, they sure didn’t spend
enough time on parts of the castings in
my opinion smoothing out imperfections
from the casting process.
As I cleaned up 48 years of grime over
several weeks and stripped the paint off
in the process I noticed this and took a
file to any high places along the way to
help ease any paint issues.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I powered it up when I got it, but that was so long ago, I don't really remember. But I also don't remember any major problems. The pictures don't show a compound, it is missing. But.....I have a brand new never used one waiting.



I worked at Hardinge several years in the late '70's. At that time, the paint process was a heated epoxy that went over a thick layer of fill. I think that was why less time was spent on casting prep. Just slather on the filler and sand it smooth.

Not the subject of this thread, but as a comparison, I'd say a Monarch 10EE is an all around far superior Lathe to the HLV-H. But probably for fine or light work, the HLV-H is handier to use. I have and have used both, if I had to pick one it'd be the 10EE hands down.

The Monarch 10EE definitely looks like a Beefy
Lathe.

 

[rmack898]

Not the subject of this thread, but as a comparison, I'd say a Monarch 10EE is an all around far superior Lathe to the HLV-H. But probably for fine or light work, the HLV-H is handier to use. I have and have used both, if I had to pick one it'd be the 10EE hands down.

I don't want to press the off topic tangent too far. Having owned a 10EE for many years and my very limited experience with an HLV-H, I think if all of my work could be done in a collet, the HLV-H would be the machine to have.
Sorry for the brief diversion.

 

[dkmc]

I don't want to press the off topic tangent too far. Having owned a 10EE for many years and my very limited experience with an HLV-H, I think if all of my work could be done in a collet, the HLV-H would be the machine to have.
Sorry for the brief diversion.

Agree completely. My EE is well used and even somewhat abused, and it still gives this finish....and holds tenths....

Back to the HLV-H

 

[crerus75]

I ran across this thread years ago and remembered it when you posted. It has some parts lists and diagrams linked. Dunno if they'll help you, but they probably can't hurt.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I don't want to press the off topic tangent too far. Having owned a 10EE for many years and my very limited experience with an HLV-H, I think if all of my work could be done in a collet, the HLV-H would be the machine to have.
Sorry for the brief diversion.

No biggie, My only experience running
an HLV-H was at work and I felt like it
was a Rolls Royce compared to my
other unmentionable machine I sold.
I was hooked and had to have one.
Having only ran two other lathes in 20
years, I was hooked on the Hardinge
and I now have two, both needing work.

 

[Hephaestus29]

When I unbolted the Headstock and went
to remove it, I tried tapping it back with a
deadblow hammer but that did NOT work
at all and it was probably putting it in a
bind also.
I ended up just putting a piece of 2x6
between the headstock and the carriage
and turned the handle on the carriage
and it pushed the headstock back evenly
and effortlessly.

To remove the headstock I made a lifting
device out of a Tow hook that is very
similar to how Hardinge shows how to
lift the headstock, with that and a sling
anyway.

 

[Hephaestus29]

Here’s a couple tools I made.
One I needed to remove the pins from
the tailstock, the small one was bent
and I wanted to take them out for paint
anyway.
It’s just a piece of scrap I had laying
around that I clamped to the pin and
then I screwed in my bearing puller to
it to remove the pins.

The other is my version of a face pin
spanner needed to remove the bearings
on the headstock end for the lead screw.

 

[Firebrick43]

I prefer an Hvl-h if using the 5c collet closer. A 10ee is superior if doing larger work in a chuck.

A 10ee variable speed drive system are quite complicated and parts are obsolete. Spindle bearings are special order as well and I am not sure if they are even available any more. Last monarch part I ordered was a nylon escapement for the gear selector on a 14” servoshift and it was 984$.

Parts for the Hardinge are still readily available and not cheap but not outrageous either. We rebuilt
2 of them recently and neither had anything so crazy that I can recall a price. One even got a new way as it wasn’t that much more than having the old one ground to the same precision and accounting for the metal taken off.

The only thing that has been discontinue that I recalled is hardinge excellent cut knurling tool

 

[Hephaestus29]

I bought this cart at Horrible Freight to
mount the Lathe Bed to for the painter.
I drilled two holes at one end and welded
a small extension at the other end for the
third mount. I also turned the handle
around so the tailstock end would have
room to go up and down in the center of
the handle.

 

[dkmc]

I bought one of those a number of years ago to use as a welding cart. Very handy, however I found it will leak down over time, so I have a piece of 1/2 x 1" alu. bar that I lay in the bottom to stop the roller wheel and prevent lowering with load on.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I bought one of those a number of years ago to use as a welding cart. Very handy, however I found it will leak down over time, so I have a piece of 1/2 x 1" alu. bar that I lay in the bottom to stop the roller wheel and prevent lowering with load on.

I did notice the Rod was not really polished.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I spent today mapping out the bed and machining the tailstock end cover to help protect the machined and scraped surfaces from blasting.
I’ve spent a lot of time doing something some may say is unnecessary or a waste of time but I think will pay off in the long run if I get into rebuilding Hardinge Lathes. I plan to do the other one I have anyway so I know it will be quicker.
I still have to drill some through holes in the top plate to make sure it doesn’t lift, it’s just pinned in place for now.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I guess my other pic wouldn’t load
because it was a panoramic view.

 

[dkmc]

I spent today mapping out the bed and machining the tailstock end cover to help protect the machined and scraped surfaces from blasting.

I wonder if you made several 1/8" air ports along that cover, and bled in a few PSI (CFM) of compressed air, if that would assure no dust or blasting grit would get in.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I wonder if you made several 1/8" air ports along that cover, and bled in a few PSI (CFM) of compressed air, if that would assure no dust or blasting grit would get in.

Well my main concern was to keep the sandblasting from tearing
up the machined and or scraped surfaces. I know what you’re
saying but the plastic/Nylon I’m using usn’t perfectly smooth
anyway. It’s the same stuff as commercial stall walls in restrooms.

 

[Hephaestus29]

Tore the gear box down today, still have
The idler and bearings to pull out yet
but it’s almost ready for paint.

 

[MushCreek]

Those are wonderful machines. Recently, there was an odd machinery auction near here. They had about 20 Hardinge lathes, but most of them had no carriage or tailstock! They also had pallets of parts. I suppose I could have gone and previewed the sale and tried to match up a lathe with the appropriate pallets of parts. Other than a couple complete machines, they sold for less than scrap value. My only guess is that this was some kind of repair facility, as they had lots of incomplete machines, such as bandsaws without the tables.

 

[Hephaestus29]

The parts can be sold on ebay or wherever.

 

[Hephaestus29]

I made a Spindle Nut Wrench to remove
the spindle nut.

The ring is a piece if DOM, that’s
Drawn over Mandrel.
I cut it off a bigger piece I had, milled flat, since I don’t have a working lathe at the moment, drilled two holes the right size for the pin holes in the nut, then pressed in a gage pin that I cut in half with a die grinder, they aren’t that expensive”, then I bolted on a piece of 3/4 rod stock that I milled two flats on after I drilled and tapped two holes. It actually has to be bolted on after the ring is slipped over the spindle.

I had a 14” piece of 2x4 that I drilled and bored a hole in to clamp down on the gear teeth that are on the spindle.

The nut came off without too much trouble, I did have to re-position the 2x4 a few times since it did slip some. One thing is for sure I didn’t damage the teeth.
H.H.

 

[Hephaestus29]

Forgot the pictures

 

[Hephaestus29]

I’ve had to make several tools and things
to take the lathe apart.

The smaller dia. Piece of aluminum goes
in the end of the spindle on the headstock
end to assist in removal of the
Spindle Drive Gear. The pointed part of
The puller goes into the threaded hole
and then the jaws go on the back side
of the drive gear flange for removal.
The larger piece of Aluminum then gets
bolted to the smaller one for removal of
the drive pulley. The Small piece also
has a step so that it rides inside the
spindle shaft and doesn’t just fall down
when you’re trying to use the puller.
Standard grade washers were welded
on to threaded rod to remove the pulley.
It came off without a hitch really, you
just have to take it slow and work each
Side a little at a time.
The last picture shows why washers
were needed to remove the pulley.

 

[RoninB4]

Have spent many hours on this and other Hardinge models. It's the lathe I always preferred to use if the shop had one and the work would fit. Passed on purchasing an HLV-H with a partially (?) reground bed for a Weiler just to have a working machine. I've already got enough projects.

The tooling you've made for the rebuild might be valuable to someone seeking to rebuild one. All the tooling I've made for repairing/rebuilding things isn't doing me any good sitting on the shelf. Just a thought.

Good luck with the rebuild, looking forward to seeing you fire it up.

 

[Hephaestus29]

Here’s a couple pics of the paint. Looks
good overall but there’s a few blems
here and there. One piece didn’t get
paint on the face where it should have,
and another piece fell to the floor when
I went to pick up the tailstock because
he had everything piled on top of the bed.
The gearbox cover was sitting on a piece
of cardboard on top of the lathe bed and
when I picked up the tailstock it fell to
the floor because it wasn’t sitting centered
on the bed, the tailstock was holding
down the cardboard, when I lifted it, the
cardboard tipped and dumped the cover.

 

[dkmc]

Is that a metallic gray? Looks VERY nice!

 

[Hephaestus29]

Is that a metallic gray? Looks VERY nice!

It’s called: Glacier Gray, looks more like
a light blue to me but it kind of depends
on how the light hits it. It’s a fine metallic.

I’d say it’s probably not too far off from
Chryslers early B5 Blue or Ice Blue if you’re familiar with that.

 

[dkmc]

It's been over a year now. Did this lathe project ever get completed?

 

[Valentine1]

Hi,
I bought a lathe under HLV-H name. When it arrived I realized it is a K-1 , apparently a British version of HLV-H.
It is a metric only. No specified year of manufacture. Serial No is KL1. 1425.
Chuck (mounted on tapered holder) has runout of about 3 microns (0.118 thou)

How do these machines compare to HLV-H quality wise?
Can anyone figure out the YOM from the Serial Number?
Does anybody know RAL number of the original HLV-H grey colour?
I plan to rebuild it myself (I am a retired pharmacist ) with the help of a few professionals who are occasionally available.
Does Hardinge supply spare parts for this model?
Is this a good place for getting advice on rebuilding? I am sure I will have tons more questions.
Thanks

 

[dkmc]

Hi,
I bought a lathe under HLV-H name. When it arrived I realized it is a K-1 , apparently a British version of HLV-H.
It is a metric only. No specified year of manufacture. Serial No is KL1. 1425.
Chuck (mounted on tapered holder) has runout of about 3 microns (0.118 thou)

How do these machines compare to HLV-H quality wise?
Can anyone figure out the YOM from the Serial Number?
Does anybody know RAL number of the original HLV-H grey colour?
I plan to rebuild it myself (I am a retired pharmacist ) with the help of a few professionals who are occasionally available.
Does Hardinge supply spare parts for this model?
Is this a good place for getting advice on rebuilding? I am sure I will have tons more questions.
Thanks

I suggest you go over to Practical Machinist and post your story on the Hardinge lathe forum.