Hardinge turret lathe?

[930dreamer]

I see these are both turret lathes but other then that, what's the difference from one with a tail stock setup? Does it have threading capabilities?

 

[Jswain]

Deleted

 

[paulsomlo]

Nope, no threading capability, as it doesn't have a leadscrew. But you can use a threading die in the turret - it's commonly done. These lathes are great for multiple runs of small parts. There are lots of videos on Youtube that show operation of a turret lathe, that'll give you a good idea of what they're capable of. But if you're looking for a general purpose lathe for one off jobs and repairs, you should be looking for something with a leadscrew and tailstock.

 

[dutchgray]

The one with the tailstock also has a standard saddle, cross slide and compound set up, it is what you would call a plain lathe.
If you were after a small capacity lathe and if it were in good condition it would be worth buying in my opinion.

You would still want to pair it with a larger fully equipped engine lathe to get threading and power feed capability and for larger work, though I'm not sure what that machine is or if it's available.

Hardinge lathes are really meant for collet work.
If you were to buy one, buy both if you have the space, the turrets will fit on either machine so you may as well rob that and any other useful parts, make one the best machine you can, the other lathe could also be sold as a bare machine, broken for spares, or just kept.

The question is do you want to be making small production runs of relatively simple parts, as that's what they are for.

 

[DocsMachine]

The one showing a tailstock and carriage is not a Hardinge.

The one with the turret is a Hardinge DV-59, or one of several very similar versions. They're extremely common, Hardinge sold hundreds of thousands of them, if not millions, because prior to the advent of CNC (and even for decades afterward) small turrets and specialty machines like that was how people manufactured things. Any given factory might have anything from half a dozen to a hundred of those things.

As noted, they're mainly for 5C collets, but you can get chucks, faceplates, dog drivers, and for that matter, Hardinge has collets (of a sort) that can go up to 6".

As such, those are pretty versatile- parts and accessories are common, though not always cheap. You can take the turret and lever cross slide off, and put an X/Y assembly on there that lets you do conventional turning and facing, but no, as noted, you don't get any power feeds.

My general opinion of them (as a small job shop) is they make a great second lathe, something to help boost the shop's capabilities, or something to pop out a quick bushing when you have a job in the main lathe, etc. But they're not the best choice for an only lathe.

Doc.

 

[dutchgray]

My general opinion of them (as a small job shop) is they make a great second lathe, something to help boost the shop's capabilities, or something to pop out a quick bushing when you have a job in the main lathe, etc. But they're not the best choice for an only lathe.

Doc.

But also the general rule, any lathe is better than no lathe.

I don't know what these Hardinge turrets go for in the USA but in the UK where I am a bare machine is just a few hundred £ and they go up depending on what tooling and accessories it comes with, they never seem to be expensive though.

But yes definitely a "second lathe" to partner a decent engine or toolroom lathe.

 

[DocsMachine]

But also the general rule, any lathe is better than no lathe.

-Entirely true, and there was a time not all that long ago, I'd have killed and helped hide the body for one of those.

But the OP didn't sound like he was desperate for "any" lathe, it sounded more like "these are available locally, what do you think?"

I mean, heck, I have eight lathes, and if one of those appeared within 200 miles of me, for less than $3k (in good condition) I'd buy it in a heartbeat. But at the same time, if I had no lathe, and was looking for a first, the only way I'd consider a DV-59 would be if it was already close by, and dirt cheap.

Doc.

 

[dutchgray]

-Entirely true, and there was a time not all that long ago, I'd have killed and helped hide the body for one of those.

But the OP didn't sound like he was desperate for "any" lathe, it sounded more like "these are available locally, what do you think?"

I mean, heck, I have eight lathes, and if one of those appeared within 200 miles of me, for less than $3k (in good condition) I'd buy it in a heartbeat. But at the same time, if I had no lathe, and was looking for a first, the only way I'd consider a DV-59 would be if it was already close by, and dirt cheap.

Doc.

I'm collecting a new to me Dean Smith and Grace 1307 by 40" tomorrow, 1972 machine, in about a 9.5 out of 10 condition, still in factory paint, still turns to factory specs which is 0.0004" over 9" from chuck unsupported.
Has most of the desirable features you'd want, 2240rpm max spindle speed, 18 in total, clutch driven fwd or reverse with brake, it will be a 7.5 or 10 hp motor, has a hydraulic copier with it, can do about a 4 tenths on the fine feed, Norton box has 45 options, 2" spindle bore, has a nearly brand new Pratt Burnerd 10" 3 jaw chuck which is good to about a half thou runout, plus a good 4 jaw.
2.5 tons of some of the best English made machine there ever was.
£3,000
Good manual lathes are so cheap here it's almost criminal.
The thing was almost certainly more than £3k when it was new and my house was only £4,400 new built in 74.

 

[LopezBart]

Good manual lathes are so cheap here it's almost criminal.

The same thing is true here in the USA for larger manual machines... too big for 95% of folks for personal use, and model shops, etc. already have them if they need 'em.

 

[mark-NJ]

Wow! Memories! I spent the summer of '79 sitting on one of those in a factory that made electric clutches. I thinned brass flange faces down to 0.022" Must have faced 10 thousand of them...

Why/how I remember that is beyond me.

 

[DocsMachine]

The thing was almost certainly more than £3k when it was new and my house was only £4,400 new built in 74.

-I seem to recall my big Springfield, when new in 1943, was something like $5,500 new. That's the equivalent today of just over $100,000.

(And you know the funny thing? I did that same calculation a few years ago, and it was the equivalent of 'only' $80K.)

The same thing is true here in the USA for larger manual machines... too big for 95% of folks for personal use, and model shops, etc. already have them if they need 'em.

-Yep. "Home shop" sized machines command a premium, but the bigger machines have to be priced at near scrap rate in order to sell. Lots of reasons for that- power and space requirements for one, ease of moving (it's lots easier to bring an SB9 home than a 20" LeBlond) ease of operation (making model train parts on that 20" LeBlond is a bit tricky) and cost of tooling (a since Aloris CXA tool block goes for more than a full set of import AXA blocks and the toolpost. Same goes for 6" chucks vs. 10" or 11" ones, an MT2 live center vs, an MT4 or MT5, etc.)

Doc.

 

[930dreamer]

These are six hours away, I should just bite the bullet and get a 10EE.

• Condition
  Used - Good

Both lathes for 2200. Come with collets, one has a belt that’s getting weak the other needs a transformer.

 

[DocsMachine]

Belts require dismantling the spindle to replace. Not a huge job, but not like a GM fanbelt either.

And a transformer simply means it's a 380 or 440V machine. Not really an issue, you can get a decent transformer that'll work just fine for maybe $100.

(One thing on the Hardinges- all their high and low range switching, and foreard/reverse, is all electrical, with a two-speed motor and external drum switches. As such, they're tough to wire for a VFD- generally you'd have to choose high or low range, and use the VFD for reversing- it can be done, but it's tricky. Better is to go with a rotary converter and keep the onboard switching.)

The option to a 10EE is a Hardinge HLV or HLV-H. They're maybe a little lighter in 'beef' than the 10EE, but considerably simpler (especially the older motor-generator 10EEs) and considered "superprecision". (Assuming, of course, you get one in good shape.)

Doc.

 

[LopezBart]

-I seem to recall my big Springfield, when new in 1943, was something like $5,500 new. That's the equivalent today of just over $100,000.

(And you know the funny thing? I did that same calculation a few years ago, and it was the equivalent of 'only' $80K.)



-Yep. "Home shop" sized machines command a premium, but the bigger machines have to be priced at near scrap rate in order to sell. Lots of reasons for that- power and space requirements for one, ease of moving (it's lots easier to bring an SB9 home than a 20" LeBlond) ease of operation (making model train parts on that 20" LeBlond is a bit tricky) and cost of tooling (a since Aloris CXA tool block goes for more than a full set of import AXA blocks and the toolpost. Same goes for 6" chucks vs. 10" or 11" ones, an MT2 live center vs, an MT4 or MT5, etc.)

Doc.

A friend just drove from (near) Portland Oregon to Colorado to pick up a 7 ton Rockford 72" planer, complete with tracing attachment. He wanted the jig borer as well, but he needs to befriend someone w/ a bigger truck for that.