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Heat advice

Marcmcm

Active member
Joined
Apr 9, 2007
Messages
40
Location
State College PA
This spring I'm starting a garage renovation and need to get some heat in there for winter projects. The garage is 13x24 and used mostly for motorcycle work. Currently the walls are insulated with R13 batt insulation and part of the project will be to install a ceiling with R30 above. I'll also be installing a man door in a side wall and a window in the rear wall since the only way in now is the overhead door. I need some advice on which way to go on a heater. Natural gas is not available in my 'hood so that's out of the question. Propane makes me a little nervous because of the ignition source and threat of fire. I would also need a propane tank installed. I don't think I need a lot of btu's since the space is small and will be fairly well insulated. I live in PA with pretty cold winters and plan on keeping the garage around 45 degrees during the winter and bumping it up when I go out to work.

I do have 100 amp service to the garage as a subfeed from my 200 amp main panel.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
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kb2tha

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Oct 4, 2010
Messages
495
Location
Delaware County, NYS
Sounds like the Dayton G73 electric is made for your application. a search of G73 on this forum will shoe tons of information on this unit.
Ken
 

Jackfre

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Joined
Dec 26, 2010
Messages
4,411
Location
N CA
Rinnai EX22C. 82% eff. Net to the space. modulating burner/blower/programmable stat built in. Best for your use, it is sealed combustion. Check Rinnai.us for details.

I have to offer this disclaimer. I represent Rinnai so my bias is noted. having said that, in 46 yrs in the business, I heat my garage/homes with them and consider them the best heating appliance I've ever dealt with. :thumbup:
 

hueyguns

New member
Joined
Feb 8, 2009
Messages
2
Go wood/coal stove or a pellet stove. 13x24= easy to get up to 80 degrees without even working the stove. You will be working out there in shorts. www.nepacrossroads.com , check it. I run a U.S Stove 1557m in a 30x40 shop with 15 foot high ceilings and I am doors up with the stove idling.
 
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jvitez

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Joined
Nov 30, 2009
Messages
2,429
Location
Big Sky Country, Canada
13x24? For that small space all you really need is two 1500w electric heaters which would be 9.6 watts/ft2 0r 32.7 btu/ft2. How often would you be opening the main garage door? If not often, I'm sure this would work, and be really cheap too. I've seen fan forced plug in heaters for $15.

I'd try this method first. If it takes too long to warm up, you're only out maybe $40, and you can always install an electric unit heater and keep the plug in heaters to fast warm up in addition if you'd like.

Actually, you could even buy 3 plug in heaters. 4500W would heat up very quickly in that small space.
 
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Marcmcm

Active member
Joined
Apr 9, 2007
Messages
40
Location
State College PA
Rinnai EX22C. 82% eff. Net to the space. modulating burner/blower/programmable stat built in. Best for your use, it is sealed combustion. Check Rinnai.us for details.

I have to offer this disclaimer. I represent Rinnai so my bias is noted. having said that, in 46 yrs in the business, I heat my garage/homes with them and consider them the best heating appliance I've ever dealt with. :thumbup:

That thing looks awesome but it's about 5 times what I'm looking to spend. THanks for the input though.

A wood or coal stove wouldn't allow me a thermostat control for keeping the temps in the 40s when I'm not out there and takes up too much space in an already small space with combustible clearance, etc. I have a woodstove in my house and it definitely puts out some heat! As long as I get a mna door put in I shouldn't have to open the overhead door at all in the winter, no bikes going in and out at that time for sure.
 

z28snksknr

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 8, 2009
Messages
1,827
Location
Turnersville, NJ
I use a small kerosene heater - turn it on before I go out to there and it's 50+ in an hour or less. I usually end up turning it off shortly after I go in because it gets too warm when I'm working. I have a 24' x 24' two car garage without any ceiling insulation and it works great.

$10 in kero has lasted me 1.5 winters so far. A little goea a long way.
 

redsky49

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Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Messages
582
Location
near the coast in eastern North Carolina
This spring I'm starting a garage renovation and need to get some heat in there for winter projects. The garage is 13x24 and used mostly for motorcycle work. Currently the walls are insulated with R13 batt insulation As you are likely aware, this is somewhat less than ideal. I am guessing that it would be difficult to easily improve this.and part of the project will be to install a ceiling with R30 above R-30 would be adequate. I'll also be installing a man door in a side wall and a window Windows are one of the main sources of heat loss. Consider the size of the window and get a good performing version.in the rear wall since the only way in now is the overhead door. I need some advice on which way to go on a heater. Natural gas is not available in my 'hood so that's out of the question. Propane makes me a little nervous because of the ignition source and threat of fire. I think you are overstating the potential danger of propane. Tanks can generally be rented if you do not wish to purchase. I would also need a propane tank installed. I don't think I need a lot of btu's since the space is small and will be fairly well insulated. I live in PA with pretty cold winters and plan on keeping the garage around 45 degrees during the winter and bumping it up when I go out to work.

I do have 100 amp service to the garage as a subfeed from my 200 amp main panel. How much amperage is actually available from your shared 200A total capacity?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

For a continuously conditioned space, I would not consider any solid fueled devices, or kerosene units. Given your circumstances, I would limit myself to either electric or propane. Within that range however, are several alternatives.

Jackfre (above) suggests a direct-vented propane wall heater. A quick look at the cut sheets for that unit suggest an easy install, modulating output (which is not typical by the way), an "off hours" setback temperature of 38 degrees F which would meet your requirements, etc. The only questionable spec was for the "convection fan" (actually this appears to be just a squirrel cage fan - convection occurs due temperature gradients) which doesn't indicate much 'throw' for the unit, as well as relatively high leaving temperatures when the unit is on high fire. If placed on the short wall of your space, you will likely encounter some temperature difference at the far end of your shop.

This is just one propane choice. Many others are out there to consider.

As for electric, basic resistance heat is going to be an expensive proposition, especially with your current insulation, overhead door, etc. For discussion's sake, lets look at a 5KW heater for your application.

Using a common electric rate, $0.11/kwh, you are spending $0.55 for each hour operation of the heater. If we consider only the four coldest heating months (November thru February), and if we figure that the heater on average only operates 30% of the time ( a conservative number - likely to be higher), you will have spent about $480 in electricity, or $120 per month to heat the space. In my mind, this is excessive. [Disclaimer: This is a not a substitute for an actual energy analysis. The example given is merely for an illustration to prompt discussion]

As an alternative I would propose a thru-wall heat pump, particularly one that will function well at low outdoor temperatures. My shoot-from-the-hip guess is that the electric consumption would be less than half of the resistance heater, plus you would have the summertime advantage of cooling and de-humidification that you would not have with the other choices.

There are of course other considerations - how long you intend to utilize the space, utility costs for your particular area, energy rebates, your particular design conditions, requirements for air filtration, operations to be performed in the garage, etc.

Just something for you to consider.

Good luck with your project.

As always, offered only as opinion
 
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