Heating Check

[matvoz]

Good morning. I am in the final stretch of design and was thinking of how I am going to heat my shop. I live on a sloped lot so it will be a walkout basement shop. The shop will be 32' x 32'. I live in western Oregon where the winters are fairly mild. In the winter my garage gets into the very low 40's. I am planning hydronic radiant floor for the downstairs 4" concrete slab and a Mr. Cool DIY ductless for the upstairs. I am not sure on insulation yet, but will probably do either Rockwool or Fiberglass. Each floor will be 9' tall with 2 x 6 studs for framing. The intent is to spend time out there everyday after work and more on the weekends.

Do you think my heating plan is a good one or should I be doing something else?

Thanks in advance.

Matt

 

[lockhart3]

Your idea sounds good to me, I’ve been involved in hydronics industry many years by the way. And radiant heated a couple if my personal homes and garages in past.

A major issue is to have proper design to minimize heat costs and install issues.

First and foremost is perimeter and slab insulation. I’ve seen far too many folks skip that in preliminary design and install.

Also wise to get install and layout design figured out before starting. Hydronics is a forgiving system but costs and how it works varies greatly. Everything in the design should work well together.

Mini split for upstairs nowadays is good idea. Works well and cost efficient for upper floor. Radiant would work well too though and may be less costly if that’s important to you.


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[matvoz]

Cost is always a concern. What would you recommend for a hydronic system in the upstairs.

 

[ambenz]

I am of the Kiss method and do it so if it fails, you are not spending high dollars to fix...or replace it. Simple enough for a dingbat to be able to turn it on and set the temperature.
Might want to consider rebound if the garage door cycles, how long before the room gets back to temperature?

 

[HoosierBuddy]

What fuel sources are available? Do you have natural gas?

If no natural gas, what are you paying for power and what would you have to pay for propane?

Depending on your answers you may have a great plan or you may have a terrible plan.

Phil

 

[nadogail]

Is wood an option for fuel?

 

[matvoz]

I am planning on natural gas. Wood is not really an option. At some point in the future I would like to put in a woodstove, but that is down the road and dependent on insurance requirements.

Does having natural gas make this a great plan?

 

[lockhart3]

Cost is always a concern. What would you recommend for a hydronic system in the upstairs.

If cost is the main driver, consider radiant or a fan coil unit maybe.


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[HoosierBuddy]

I am planning on natural gas. Wood is not really an option. At some point in the future I would like to put in a woodstove, but that is down the road and dependent on insurance requirements.

Does having natural gas make this a great plan?

Yes. Natural gas as a fuel source is about 1/4 to 1/5 the price of power. If power were your only option, and you had to go with an electric resistance heat source for your hydronic heat, it would be too expensive to be a good option and in that case a heat pump (while not hydronic) would be a better answer.

Since you have NG...my advice is to spend the money up front for a good hot water boiler that's designed for hydronic along with a zone controller so you can set up different t-stats in your different areas.

When faced with the same choice I went with a 150,000 BTU modulating (it throttles up or down as needed) fully condensing high efficiency wall boiler from NTI....but there are many similar units. My NTI has run since 2006 with no issues.

For the slab, you'll have it insulated underneath with pex coils that will work great.

If you want to use hydronic heat upstairs, I would highly recommend a solution like lite-crete or special subfloor where your pex ends up built into the floor. Some people recommend just looping it between the floor joists underneath and stapling it up to the floor....and I can tell you for a fact, that doesn't' work very well. I had to go back where I did that and install heat transfer plates AND insulate under the pex. If I would have known then what I do now, I'd have used litecrete and installed above the subfloor.

None of it is cheap. Also...you won't have the ducts for A/C if that matters.

If you want cheap? A hanging natural gas unit heater (hot dawg or similar) would be a fraction of the cost. To me, hydronic was worth it because comfort matters and it only added maybe 2 to 5% to the cost of my project, but there's no question it was more expensive up front then other solutions and for heating, it is not likely to be noticably cheaper to operate than a natural gas furnace or unit heater of similar plated efficiency.

Phil