Heating options for a 25'x40' pole barn

[ckpitt55]

Hey gents,

I'm in need of some guidance with heating a 25x40 pole barn. The space will be used as a workshop for doing automotive work / fabrication. I don't need to heat it 24/7 - just primarily on weekends when I'll be working in there.

The building itself is of older construction but still pretty tight from what I can tell. The roof skin has foam board under it and one of the long walls is covered with osb, but other than that it is not insulated. At this point it's not really in the cards to insulate and finish the whole thing.

Due to the lack of insulation, I was not interested in an electric heater since I imagine it costing a small fortune to run. Most seem to be grossly underrated in terms of output - according to online calculators I need about 100,000 btu to get a 50F rise in the building. I don't have any gas drops in there so ng is out. I'm also not a big fan of running kerosene or propane due to cost of fuel (kerosene is $4+/gal around here) and buildup of exhaust fumes that I would be breathing in.

I have a decent supply of seasoned hardwood built up (more than enough for my purposes this winter) and was considering an add-on wood/coal furnace like the Daka 521FB. Doing more research though, I hit a wall when I discovered all the red tape associated with heaters like this in an outbuilding - local ordinances / BOCA bull sh*t / and insurance considerations are leaving me pretty frustrated.

Has anyone else ever been in a similar situation? What did you do? I'm having a hard time determining what type of heat would best fulfill my needs.

Thanks,

 

[DonPowers]

Have you considered a pellet stove? They only require a small exhaust vent straight outside the building and not a stack above the peak like a wood stove. A ton of pellets would most likely last the whole winter if used primarily on the weekends.

There are plenty of stoves in the 50,000 - 60,000 BTU range which won't give you the 50 deg rise unless you partition off a work area.

I am currently working on finishing the upstairs of my garage. I partitioned off the area I'm working with poly and with a small heater can keep it comfortable.

 

[Bondo]

Doing more research though, I hit a wall when I discovered all the red tape associated with heaters like this in an outbuilding - local ordinances / BOCA bull sh*t / and insurance considerations are leaving me pretty frustrated.

Ayuh,..... I built me a wood stove, 'n kept Warm,..... _ _k 'em,....

 

[Highbeam]

I installed a woodstove in my pole barn. Got a permit so it's legal and had to switch insurance companies to one that didn't mind. I love it. I also heat my home with wood so I have plenty of wood on hand to "waste" a bit in the shop.

 

[jvitez]

Highbeam, that picture is worth more than words can say, on many fronts. Well done!

ckpitt55: I can't comment on wood heat as I've never used it, but for your uninsulated space you should not try to heat the air, as the uninsulated walls will quickly **** the heat out by convective and conductive heat loss.

You should try and heat objects, ie you. Here's what I have, and it does a decent though not spectacular job. How cold does it usually get in PA winters?

http://www.mrheater.com/portable-radiant-heater.html

 

[twohawks]

Look up waste oil heat(er). If it suits you to do it that way (to make one), it makes monster heat very economically. Just a thought.

 

[dave67fd]

So If Insulating it is not in the cards why is trying to heat it?

With a "cold" outside ambient you will find it very difficult and costly to stay warm with whatever heat source you choose especially that size area. Try to spend whatever money/time you have to Insulate first.

 

[skipnay]

Highbeam, that picture is worth more than words can say, on many fronts. Well done!

ckpitt55: I can't comment on wood heat as I've never used it, but for your uninsulated space you should not try to heat the air, as the uninsulated walls will quickly **** the heat out by convective and conductive heat loss.

You should try and heat objects, ie you. Here's what I have, and it does a decent though not spectacular job. How cold does it usually get in PA winters?

http://www.mrheater.com/portable-radiant-heater.html

I'm liking this especially since I can use it with a 20 lb or 100 lb bottle!!!

 

[26Red]

I used to have an non insulated 30x24 garage in northern mn. I put in a cheap barrel stove. It warmed things up but we sure went through the wood pile keeping it stoaked. It was okay for the weekends, but the following year we added some batt insulation. That sure made it nice.

 

[jvitez]

I'm liking this especially since I can use it with a 20 lb or 100 lb bottle!!!

Yup. I can't maneuver a 100 lbs tank, so I have one 40 lb tank, and 2x20 lb tanks ganged together on a manifold. Works quite well.

 

[ckpitt55]

So If Insulating it is not in the cards why is trying to heat it?

With a "cold" outside ambient you will find it very difficult and costly to stay warm with whatever heat source you choose especially that size area. Try to spend whatever money/time you have to Insulate first.

I'm renting it from a family member so I'd rather invest the money elsewhere or save it. $5k easy to insulate and finish the interior of that thing. They have no real use for the building so any upgrade costs are mine. If it was my own place or something longer term I'd be singing a different tune. It doesn't have to be 80 degrees in here, I just want to knock the chill off so I can kind of enjoy what I'm doing

We'll see though. I might end up insulating it over time as money allows. Grad school and my car project (LS1 E36 M3) is not leaving me with much available cash at the moment.

Highbeam, that picture is worth more than words can say, on many fronts. Well done!

ckpitt55: I can't comment on wood heat as I've never used it, but for your uninsulated space you should not try to heat the air, as the uninsulated walls will quickly **** the heat out by convective and conductive heat loss.

You should try and heat objects, ie you. Here's what I have, and it does a decent though not spectacular job. How cold does it usually get in PA winters?

http://www.mrheater.com/portable-radiant-heater.html

0 is generally as low as it gets. It's been pretty mild so far this year but last year we had extended periods of time in the single digits.

I was doing some searching around for insulation. Anyone have any experience with these guys and how cost effective (or not) they would be? http://www.steelbuildinginsulation/polebuilding.html.com

 

[ckpitt55]

So I guess my thread title is somewhat misleading - this isn't a pole barn, it's stick built with single layer steel sheet up on the walls.

I took some measurements - the walls are framed with 2x6s at a 40" spacing on center, 38.5" inside dimension. As far as I was able to find, this is not typical (at least judging by the sizes that insulation is offered in).

I did some more reading on insulation and I'm concerned about condensation forming on the steel - if I put fiberglass directly against that it would wick in and cause mold and other problems. Others had recommended putting up foam board against the steel, spray foaming the seams to form a vapor barrier, then put up the fiberglass batts against that.

What is the recommended method for insulating buildings with metal walls to prevent condensation problems? Also, does anyone have any insight on how to handle the stud spacing?

Sorry for the noob questions, this is my first rodeo

 

[Will S.]

Without insulation, condensation occurs due to the warm(er) air inside the building, hitting the cold metal. When you insulate, the warmer air inside, will not be hitting the cold metal. I doubt any condensation would form and wick into the insulation. But if that is a concern, a moisture barrier like Tyvek, could be placed between insulation and the steel.

In any case, money and effort spent insulating that building, and closing up air leaks, will be paid back in fuel savings, so I would do it, even if it's not your building.