Heating your garage, what's your setup.

[thammel]

I have a 28x32 garage with second floor via attic trusses

1) Reznor UDAS 60k btu propane
2) 18kbtu mitsubishi heat pump mini split on 1st floor
3) 9kbtu mitsubishi heat pump in attic room
4) pex embedded in concrete but have not yet gone beyond that.

All works great....I can work out there anytime of the year and be perfectly comfy!!

 

[Mike65]

Yeah that is a good point, I'm sure I will learn many lessons- i've lived in NYC for the last 15 years and am finally going to the suburbs- this forum will be my bible and i couldn't be more excited!

Congrats on moving out of the city. Where are you moving too? I see your profile says Essex County, NJ, I grew up in Newark just before South Orange in the 60's & 70's. I also lived in Morris County, Warren County, Ocean County, & my wife is from Somerset County..

 

[PassnThru]

I run one of those much maligned unvented natural gas heaters in a 24X32 that's pretty well closed up. I work from home out of the garage so it's running every day. Claims of greatly increased humidity are greatly exaggerated. If you have a humidity problem to begin with it will add a few percent - not much more. If you are parking wet cars in there and it's sealed up decently then you need to buy a dehumidifier anyway. This morning it was 51 when I came out to work - in less than an hour it was 70. I don't leave it on at night since it recovers so quickly.
I haven't really found a downside to it even though they have such a bad rap.
Consider these two things though - they are 100% efficient - all the heat they produce stays in the building. Number two - they require no electricity to run.

 

[racecougar]

Air sealing plays a big role when it comes to the increased humidity from unvented combustion. I ran a dual head tank top propane heater in my very well sealed and insulated 30x60x13 building for a couple of Winters prior to installing a mini-split. Mean humidity levels inside the building at this time of year (sans unvented combustion) are in the mid-40's. After running the propane heater for one hour, that would climb to high-70's. By the math, it should have risen significantly more than that, but a shop isn't an empty/sterile environment.

On the other hand, the mini-split rapidly drops the humidity level in the Summer (which is fantastic) and it still pulls humidity down to the low-40's/high-30's in Winter.

 

[ecwilson4]

Congrats on moving out of the city. Where are you moving too? I see your profile says Essex County, NJ, I grew up in Newark just before South Orange in the 60's & 70's. I also lived in Morris County, Warren County, Ocean County, & my wife is from Somerset County..

Thank you! We almost got a house in South Orange- we are right by Brookdale Park in Montclair. You lived all over the state! i'm from Long Island, my mother is very upset we are moving to Jersey

 

[Sumboodie]

Natural gas boiler and eventually a used oil boiler as well.

Heat has been on for 4+ months.

 

[niget2002]

1300sq/ft shop.

My only option is electric. I have a 16 seer heat pump with backup strips I use to heat the shop when I'm working out there. It's also used to keep the shop above freezing so non of my chemicals go bad.

 

[hmbemis]

2 x 24K mini-splits.. which start losing the battle around freezing point.

I've been looking at the low cost DIY heat pumps, a lot of them have claims for heating to outside temperatures below 0F. For example I see the Pioneer Diamante claims it will heat to -13F outside temperatures, but they also have this feature listed:

All systems in this series come equipped with an auxiliary strip heater in the condensing unit, to provide hyper-heating even in frigid -13°F temperatures

In the A/C word I think the condensor is outside and the evaporator is inside... but when it's a heat pump I'm not sure if those terms reverse during heating... if they do, then that means they have a resistance heater in the indoor unit which can provide some heat even when the outdoor unit is below the point it can produce it... if the terms don't reverse then I guess you have a ridiculously inefficient system in low temperatures where you're applying resistance heating to the outdoor unit so that it can then pump that heat inside...

 

[dcg9381]

I've been looking at the low cost DIY heat pumps, a lot of them have claims for heating to outside temperatures below 0F. For example I see the Pioneer Diamante claims it will heat to -13F outside temperatures, but they also have this feature listed.

You need to look at their performance curve. When a 24k BTU unit will only do 5K worth of heat at 12F, that might not be what you want. There are some units that are designed for cold weather use... And they will work well into below 0F range.

All systems in this series come equipped with an auxiliary strip heater in the condensing unit

I'm unsure.. I'd assume like "ducted HVAC" this is a heat strip inside the structure. I'd expect this type of unit to have a substantial power draw. Aux strips on a ductless unit isn't something I've seen before, but doesn't surprise me as new feature.

 

[kwb]

200k BTU Natural Gas Unit Heater.

Only turn it on when I am working or we are looking at the teens for overnight lows - which is rare.

 

[Who_Dey_Beanie]

Marketplace pellet stove in Ohio. Matches the model I use in my house. Only use it when needed. Love it!

 

[bobg03]

Coastal Carolina I get by with a 24K mini-split. Cools and heats great in my 3 car garage for our weather. 100+ and humid for a good portion of the year, lows into the 30's in the cooler months.

My brother in New England has a 3 car carriage barn that he built to be a woodworking shop in the late 70's. He started with a double barrel wood stove set up and still uses that style today. He tried a couple of wall mounted propane furnaces years ago but found the wood did better.

He has now converted a large portion of a barn, that was a Ceramic Store that was a warm weather business only when his parents were alive into a mechanical area for cars and such. He went with the same double steel barrel set up.

 

[rsparks64]

I heat mine with this:

6.2L space heater keeps it tolerable in my mild N. Carolina climate.

I have a red one of those 6.2 L space heaters and it is hotter.

 

[the shifty jesus]

Less money now, but it will cost you more in the long term.

Insulation is an investment, every time you heat or cool your shop, it's a ROI.

Truth. But I just have to make it a couple more years to tear the thing down and build one bigger and right the first time. The Mrs. has requested that after 20 years she would like to park her vehicle in the garage

 

[JackOfDiamonds]

My Pioneer is covered with ice right now, including some of the coils, but it still seems to be working fine, even with morning temperatures down to 10 degrees F. It's not drawing a lot more power than usual either.

 

[racecougar]

Looks like this was lost in the server upgrade this morning, so reposting:

30'x60'x13' building near St. Louis, MO. R-19 walls and R-55 ceiling. Two 16'x8' insulated sectional overhead doors, one 9-lite steel man door, and six low-e 3'x4' windows. I used a 220V 5kW Dayton heater and a dual head tank-top propane heater for the first few winters, only heating the space when I was out there. That was marginal, and the propane increased the humidity in the building. I also cooled the building with two 5K BTU window AC units.

I installed a 24K Gree mini-split this past Spring. It was phenomenal in the Summer, and thus far has been just as great at providing heat. The real test will be in January/February, but I sincerely expect it will not have trouble keeping the place warm.

A little follow-up:

I am still blown away by the performance of this thing. It was absolutely excellent all Summer. Even on the cooler days, it was nice to be able to kick on dry mode to control the humidity.

Yesterday was a great opportunity to test its heat capabilities. It was -6F outside and 44F inside the shop at 8AM yesterday morning when I kicked it on (set to 61F). It brought the shop temp up to 55F by 10AM and hit 60F just before noon. Considering the ambient temp outside reached a high of just 1F in the afternoon, that this 24K unit is well undersized for this 30'x60'x13' shop, and that it had to bring all of the thermal mass (cars, equipment, etc.) within the shop up 16 degrees, color me thoroughly impressed.

 

[Oregon rock crusher]

I've struggled with heat for quite a few years now. Barely getting by with a couple 220v heaters which really didn't do much unless I could work right in front of one. I wanted a wood stove but no good place to put one. This year I fixed that by adding a small alcove for the stove to fit in. Steel framing with rock wool insulation and hardi backer interior walls. The CL find stove has a glass door so I can keep an eye on the fire and I fabbed up a shroud with fan to force air around the back and sides. Another fan to get heat off the pipe and a ceiling fan to move the air around has worked wonders.

What a difference it made. My 3000' space with high ceilings was always well insulated and even had tight door seals so it seldom would freeze in there but it would get close. Now after tending a fire until evening I can go out the next morning and the shop will still be in the 50's even when it's in the low teens outside. Getting it up to the low 60's is plenty for me to be comfortable and even paint. I added some hanging bars and hooks over the stove for quick drying small projects. The wood stove addition has been a game changer for me. Ed.

 

[LukeOresk]

I have an oil burning furnace that I added to the duct work. It used to just point straight at the ground below it. My buddy have to replace all his duct work so i was able to do for the cost of a T and tin tape. If this ever dies I’ll look at a natural gas space heater. I’m currently looking to put my furnace on a smart switch to turn it on from in the house.

 

[nicholsmf]

Looks like this was lost in the server upgrade this morning, so reposting:




A little follow-up:

I am still blown away by the performance of this thing. It was absolutely excellent all Summer. Even on the cooler days, it was nice to be able to kick on dry mode to control the humidity.

Yesterday was a great opportunity to test its heat capabilities. It was -6F outside and 44F inside the shop at 8AM yesterday morning when I kicked it on (set to 61F). It brought the shop temp up to 55F by 10AM and hit 60F just before noon. Considering the ambient temp outside reached a high of just 1F in the afternoon, that this 24K unit is well undersized for this 30'x60'x13' shop, and that it had to bring all of the thermal mass (cars, equipment, etc.) within the shop up 16 degrees, color me thoroughly impressed.

Instead of turning it off and on, up and down, etc. have you considered just leaving it on? When I installed my Mitsubishi Mini-Split in my 30' X 46' shop, I spent a few months playing around with it and monitoring my energy consumption. I found the cheapest way to use it was to just set it to a temp and leave it that way. In the winter I keep mine of 60 and, in the summer, I keep it on 70.

 

[racecougar]

Instead of turning it off and on, up and down, etc. have you considered just leaving it on? When I installed my Mitsubishi Mini-Split in my 30' X 46' shop, I spent a few months playing around with it and monitoring my energy consumption. I found the cheapest way to use it was to just set it to a temp and leave it that way. In the winter I keep mine of 60 and, in the summer, I keep it on 70.

I have, but I wanted to really test it out with the low outdoor temps. I have it set to "freeze protection" mode (46F) now through the week and turn on the lowest heating mode temp, 61F, an hour before I head out to work in the shop on the weekends. I wish I could set it to 55F for working, as I'm working in a T-shirt at 61F, but oh well.

 

[Notgrownup]

Now that I do some woodwork I buy some pretty expensive wood. My mini split has been great, it keeps my humidity in check. It actually makes it a lot more sense in the summer here. I keep the A/C on 80, in this Brutal heat and humidity. It is nice in the winter, I keep the shop on 63 bump it up if I need .

 

[cannuck]

oops, double post

 

[cannuck]

My backyard shop (25 x 39 x 8/12) was originally built around a single nat gas IR tube 20' long down the center. 39 years later, had to pull it out (no longer meets code) and had to build a new one in place with exhaust out opposite wall. About 50k from this one (last 60k) as I went from 6" glass rolls all around to 5 1/2" closed cell foam on ceiling. We just went through a week of -40 (C&F same-same) with thermostat at 55F and heater ran maybe 10 minutes once an hour at worst, so declaring upgrades successful. Only problem is with exhaust now on house side we can hear it run.

Side note: heat pumps don't work worth a **** at these temps - but in a brash and incredibly insulting move the Eastern fed gov't will subsidize the **** out of heat pumps (since they know we don't have any).

 

[racecougar]

Side note: heat pumps don't work worth a **** at these temps - but in a brash and incredibly insulting move the Eastern fed gov't will subsidize the **** out of heat pumps (since they know we don't have any).

They could be trying to push the use of newer inverter pumps when temps are appropriate (including Summer) to reduce overall energy consumption.

 

[Innovate1]

When I moved to this part of the country many years ago the house I bought had a horizontal furnace the previous owner had hung from the ceiling. Was told he worked on cars. No insulation but it would heat the place fine so I just turned it on when I was working on something. Now I have an insulated garage with floor heat which is REALLY nice. The 30 x 40 shop is well insulated and has a condensing furnace w/AC.

 

[aka Larry]

I have a 1600 SF all metal shop with roof-only insulation. I use a double-barrel stove for heat, which works quite well for our climate. I can heat the shop from 40 degrees to 70 in about 2 hours. I have to replace the barrels about every 5 years due to them rusting away, but they only cost about $20 each.

 

[Sturgeon]

Envious about you guys with your wood stoves, great. Please don't post any more.

 

[HogDude]

Instead of turning it off and on, up and down, etc. have you considered just leaving it on? When I installed my Mitsubishi Mini-Split in my 30' X 46' shop, I spent a few months playing around with it and monitoring my energy consumption. I found the cheapest way to use it was to just set it to a temp and leave it that way. In the winter I keep mine of 60 and, in the summer, I keep it on 70.

70 degrees indoor temp is impressive for the humid Tennessee summers.

 

[aka Larry]

No woodstoves?
I’ve heard all the many reasons not to use a wood stove, but I figured there’d be at least 1 rebel in the group.

I'm your Huckleberry.

 

[aka Larry]

The candle is like a 4-6 oz size. As it warms up, the wax melts. When the wax starts to harden back up, I know it's time to add wood. It's like a visual thermostat.

I have this magnetic indicator on mine that works quite well. I monitor it often to control the burn rate via the intake air flow.

 

[Skellyii]

Looks like this was lost in the server upgrade this morning, so reposting:




A little follow-up:

I am still blown away by the performance of this thing. It was absolutely excellent all Summer. Even on the cooler days, it was nice to be able to kick on dry mode to control the humidity.

Yesterday was a great opportunity to test its heat capabilities. It was -6F outside and 44F inside the shop at 8AM yesterday morning when I kicked it on (set to 61F). It brought the shop temp up to 55F by 10AM and hit 60F just before noon. Considering the ambient temp outside reached a high of just 1F in the afternoon, that this 24K unit is well undersized for this 30'x60'x13' shop, and that it had to bring all of the thermal mass (cars, equipment, etc.) within the shop up 16 degrees, color me thoroughly impressed.

Hey @racecougar , I'm at the other end of the state 34'x28'x11.5'. My HVAC buddy wants me to put in this GRE 24K Unit, is this the one you have, or do you have one of the high dollar units?

 

[35k0]

Looks like this was lost in the server upgrade this morning, so reposting:




A little follow-up:

I am still blown away by the performance of this thing. It was absolutely excellent all Summer. Even on the cooler days, it was nice to be able to kick on dry mode to control the humidity.

Yesterday was a great opportunity to test its heat capabilities. It was -6F outside and 44F inside the shop at 8AM yesterday morning when I kicked it on (set to 61F). It brought the shop temp up to 55F by 10AM and hit 60F just before noon. Considering the ambient temp outside reached a high of just 1F in the afternoon, that this 24K unit is well undersized for this 30'x60'x13' shop, and that it had to bring all of the thermal mass (cars, equipment, etc.) within the shop up 16 degrees, color me thoroughly impressed.

Ho much do you think it cost to run monthly?

 

[racecougar]

I have the Vireo Gen 3 unit. 3VIR24HP230V1A. I wouldn't call it a high dollar unit. It was less than $1900 with shipping. It has an excellent COP & SEER rating for it's price.

 

[racecougar]

Ho much do you think it cost to run monthly?

Thus far, since I installed it in May, it has cost LESS to run than the two 5k window units and the 220V 5K BTU heater it replaced, and it completely outperforms them in the process.

 

[35k0]

Thus far, since I installed it in May, it has cost LESS to run than the two 5k window units and the 220V 5K BTU heater it replaced, and it completely outperforms them in the process.

Thanks! I have in-floor with an electric 10kwh boiler and I am always curious what is out there that may be more efficient, cost less to operate. The issue for me, in Northern MN is the temps get so cold, these mini splits wouldn't work many days.

 

[racecougar]

Thanks! I have in-floor with an electric 10kwh boiler and I am always curious what is out there that may be more efficient, cost less to operate. The issue for me, in Northern MN is the temps get so cold, these mini splits wouldn't work many days.

A mini-split or inverter heat pump could be considered as an energy efficient means of heating/cooling on the not so cold (above 0F) days though, with resistance or alternate fuel heating to be used on the sub-zero days.

 

[phred]

2500 sf shop with 12’ ceiling. using 3 zone 5 ton mini split. Works great. Temps right now are low teens at night and mid 30’s daytime. Set at 70 degrees. It works well. Simple and low maintenance

 

[shaune]

Late to the party but here are my heaters. 220 volt construction heater hanging on wall, set to maintain 5 degrees about freezing. This keeps the frost off things and fluids still fluidy. Then when I am planning on being out there for a project the wood stove gets it heated up comfortable. I have 2 ceiling fans that are variable speed to keep circulation. All of this is in the 16 x 24 garage but on occasion I can open the door to the 22 x 24 garage and it will warm that one up as well but not to the same temp, enough to melt off stuff and work in.

 

[jmarkwolf]

I run one of those much maligned unvented natural gas heaters in a 24X32 that's pretty well closed up. I work from home out of the garage so it's running every day. Claims of greatly increased humidity are greatly exaggerated. If you have a humidity problem to begin with it will add a few percent - not much more. If you are parking wet cars in there and it's sealed up decently then you need to buy a dehumidifier anyway. This morning it was 51 when I came out to work - in less than an hour it was 70. I don't leave it on at night since it recovers so quickly.
I haven't really found a downside to it even though they have such a bad rap.
Consider these two things though - they are 100% efficient - all the heat they produce stays in the building. Number two - they require no electricity to run.

This has been my experience also.

I've run a natural gas ventless heater in my attached garage for 25 years with no discernible increase in humidity. For the first decade or so, I also ran a carbon monoxide detector that never showed anything above zero point zero except after pulling the car in.

 

[chris142]

The Sun