Help: Did builder leave new construction garage floor unfinished?

[LCD]

The floor looks to be covered in laitenance rather than efflorescence. Likely the batch was already setting and the finishers sprayed the surface with water to be able to work it resulting in the scaley white powder residue and the course textured surface.


Laitenance: A weak layer of cement and aggregate fins on a concrete surface that is usually caused by an overwet mixture, overworking the mixture, improper or excessive finishing or combination thereof.

 

[cowboyjosh]

The more I think about this; I give the floor less then another year and it will be spalling. I'd have the entire floor removed and replaced. Epoxy and other flooring finishes will just mask the real problem of a poorly installed floor and I doubt any adhesive or epoxy would bond to the floor as such.

 

[Accel Junky]

Thanks for the additional comments and advice everyone. Rebecca works nights and hasn't had time to look this thread over yet, but I think this will help in talking with the builder.

 

[Accel Junky]

OK, just an update here:

Called an NACHI inspector (actually, co-founder and president of the Atlanta chapter) out to take a look over the house and garage floor. He did find a few minor-moderate things on the house for his report, so it was worth it there. As for the garage, he definitely knew that something was not right. His knowledge of concrete was not enough to note exactly what had happened but he talked to a concrete pourer and a builder friend who both independantly stated that the concrete sounded like it was poured with too much water to make it easier to level out. They said that it will flake and chip indefinitely.

The inspector then said that he recommended Rebecca have a concrete specialist/contractor come out and do an assessment and quote to see what the repair would cost or what was needed. Also he recommended having the county or city code department come out and make an assessment.

I'm working on both of these now. I found someone at the county and city and contacted them (waiting to hear back) and I'm now seeking help from a local GA board for finding a reputable concrete contractor to come out.

For kicks, I was asked by the inspector to try and drive a nail into an inconspicuous corner of the garage slab. The nail bent with gentle force but not before it created a divot that I wouldn't expect to happen on a normally poured floor:

Thanks,

-Daniel

 

[Bevis]

if the garage foor is that bad, what about the rest of the house ?

 

[Accel Junky]

if the garage foor is that bad, what about the rest of the house ?

The rest of the house looks good cosmetically and the second inspector only found a couple small things that he advised be fixed. Now, the rest of the slab/foundation concrete? That is something to be concerned about now. Hopefully we will be able to get some more insight into that.

 

[dodgepolara500]

you need to add some more screws to your drywall. Easy enough to do and then finish it with a couple of coats of mud. Primer with PVA sealer and a finish coat.
The concrete does look like heck. Mine looked like that as it was too hot and the load of cement wouldn't work with a trowel. They jackhammered it out and started over.

 

[rancheroxl]

OK, just an update here:


For kicks, I was asked by the inspector to try and drive a nail into an inconspicuous corner of the garage slab. The nail bent with gentle force but not before it created a divot that I wouldn't expect to happen on a normally poured floor:


Thanks,

-Daniel

Hmm, I would think that that is what would happen on my garage floor...

 

[rwhite692]

There are topping compounds that can be applied in order to achieve a smooth uniform surface after the proper preparation, talk to your concrete guy.

Alternatively, you could throw down plastic tiles like racedeck, and be done with it.

 

[Accel Junky]

There are topping compounds that can be applied in order to achieve a smooth uniform surface after the proper preparation, talk to your concrete guy.

Alternatively, you could throw down plastic tiles like racedeck, and be done with it.

Would the topping compound ever have the same strength of a properly done slab?

Also, I appreciate the tip on the Race Deck, but shouldn't the owner of a brand new house have the ability to choose any floor finish type that is reasonable for applying after the builder? The reason I say this, if for example, the shoddy floor work results in the inability to do acid stain with a clear epoxy finish, would the owner not be limited compared to what a reasonable garage floor in the majority of other new construction homes would be capable of? It seems so wrong that someone has to be forced into finishing the floor a certain way because the prep job was not up to reasonable standards.

 

[rwhite692]

Just my guess, but, unless there was a surface finish specification of some sort in effect to address the quality characteristics of the garage floor slab (such as smoothness) when the house was constructed, (doubtful) then you probably don't have any recourse with the builder.

Of course, if there was some way you could establish that a structural deficiency exists, then you may have some leverage there. Good luck!

 

[Accel Junky]

Just my guess, but, unless there was a surface finish specification of some sort in effect to address the quality characteristics of the garage floor slab (such as smoothness) when the house was constructed, (doubtful) then you probably don't have any recourse with the builder.

Of course, if there was some way you could establish that a structural deficiency exists, then you may have some leverage there. Good luck!

I do see your point. I think there is probably a reasonable standard for residential unsealed garage floors though.

Question is, since no special finish was discussed should the concrete's surface still be permitting to dust and flake indefinitely? I think that part at least has recourse. It's unmaintainable without some sort of correctional work. The driveway concrete doesn't even do that (and I've never seen any that did).

I talked to the county code folks and they said that the address falls out of their qualification to inspect because the certificate of occupancy is over 1 year old (even though that was apparently issued long before the house was sold). They also mentioned that the city code folks wouldn't be able to help because the address is unincorporated, which gives county jurisdiction. The city folks apparently are getting back with me so maybe they can still help.

I contacted 3 concrete slab companies and 1 has responded. They said to contact the original concrete pourer to test the mix. They also mentioned a core sample taken and independently tested for compression would be worth trying. I found a core tool that will go down 6" from Sunbelt to rent. $63 for a half day, but this measure seems a bit extreme for something that seems obvious to the naked eye. I was hoping they would be willing to come assess and give an estimate or two on resolving the problem on the chance they might be hired.

 

[Daniel Dudley]

Did you power wash that floor ? For all you know, that is drywall dust, which is incredibly hard to get off of rough concrete. I have seen lots of crappy looking concrete that is hard as heck.

It is really easy to assume the worst. Don't jump to conclusions.

 

[Justanoldguy]

For kicks, I was asked by the inspector to try and drive a nail into an inconspicuous corner of the garage slab. The nail bent with gentle force but not before it created a divot that I wouldn't expect to happen on a normally poured floor:

Thanks,

-Daniel

That is exactly what would happen on practically every floor.

 

[Accel Junky]

Maybe so, but I was very gentle and the nail was not sharp. I will try it on my own garage floor (which is super smooth) and see what happens.

The builder/warrantyco opted not to even come out and look at the floor. They stated that they would just come out and seal it.

However, if I'm not mistaken, when the floor is sealed it can never be expoxied, painted or acid stained...correct? Could it even be tiled after that (would the tile adhesive stick?).

 

[dirttracker18]

I would not let them off the hook with sealing it until you get a concrete professional (not the guy that did it) to tell you that you will not have any long term problems. Teh warranty co will try to do the least possible to shut you up. Tell them no deal, redo the floor. That's why you have a warranty. Usually a letter from a lawyer will get the ball rolling.

 

[Accel Junky]

Ok, here's an update.

Called several concrete companies. Nobody will come out to look at it. They said to take a core sample and send it off for analysis. County and city won't come out to look at it as the cert of occupancy passed it's 1 year mark before she even moved in (house sat on market).

Builder said they would seal it. I know that won't do ****, so we said they needed to diamond grind or otherwise smooth the floor out first. They won't do that either. Just seal it. Rebecca pointed out some of the neighboring houses with smooth floors, just as I expect every new construction home floor to look like. Builder's project manager says "I can't get it to look like that" which in my opinion is admitting that they did a ****** job.

So, they will just seal it and that's it. I can't help but expect the guys they send over to do it to chuckle as they put the stuff on that crappy job of a floor. Surely they would question the project manager as to why they were even doing it?

SOL now?

 

[copterdoctor]

I would call the Better Business Bureau, and any other entity that regulates or has an effect, on builders in your area.... I'm absolutely amazed noone will come look at your floor for you, ie, an independent company... so if it's not city, or county, who do you turn to now? did the reps from city/county, give you any advice???
I just had a house built, and my builder was great to deal with while having the house built..... now that it's done, it's next to impossible to get him over to fix the little things that need finished.
I'm about a split minute away from ripping him a new @hole and calling the BBB if he doesn't get it fixed. So I can relate to your frustrations.
good luck man.

 

[mo2872]

Lawyer up?

 

[6768rogues]

A code inspector looks for code violations, not shoddy workmanship that meets minimum standards.
It does not look like efflorescence. That is salts bleeding out due to a number of reasons.
It looks like chalking from a poor concrete job. Maybe the concrete rode around in the truck too long, too much time passed between screeding and troweling, or the troweling was minimal or nonexistent. Maybe they added tons of water to the mix.
If there is enough height, an additional slab could be poured on top. I prefer to jackhammer it out and start again. No telling what they did with that type of job and I would not want it for a base.

 

[anna_starr82]

I believe the concrete was soaked after being poured.

 

[rsanter]

is the builder still in business and active trying to build or sell houses?

keep picking at them, dont just go away.
one time when I had a problem with a builder of a previous house I told them that I was going to cut a big piece of plywood in the shape of a lemon and mount it in the back of 4x4 and then leave the truck in front of their models.
they went from saying they wont come look at the problem to coming out and fixing it about 15 min later

bob

 

[Accel Junky]

To finish this story, we eventually convinced the builder to come out and diamond grind it. The workers doing the grinding worked for hours and eventually they came and told us that they couldn't do much more because the concrete was basically crumbling as they got it smooth. Definitely a better texture than before though.

Then the builder sent out a guy to apply a "densifier". After that they came out to use a concrete stain in the color of our choice which ended up being the color of their choice so we did our own stain over it and it has done fairly well so far. Using my jackstands has caused a large but shallow chip so I'll have to get pads for them.

So from the first post here is now how it looks:

 

[brslk]

Not to go off topic but nice car man.

 

[NUTTSGT]

It does look better.

 

[welder4956]

I like the workbench. Did you build that or is it store bought? Nice.

 

[1948]

it chips with a jackstand....?! i would sue the **** out of them. im not much for suing but that needs to be re-poured to me, and they should pay for it. did they hire a truck to pour it? it seems like the totally wrong mixture altogether, as if they mixed the batch themselves. also i dont see an expansion pad in the middle of the floor, which at least around here they usually have. nor do i see one on the front between the driveway and the garage.

 

[admranger]

Something is clearly not right with the concrete. Is there a city/county code for what the floor should be? No way that floor meets the spec.

As for the ledge and the slope of the garage floor, that's exactly how my garage looks in Vegas (though my floor is solid).

I see you have the tire racks that I am not fond of due to the sharp corners. Your tire racks look like they are out of the head banging zone.

Nice NSX too. Love those things. Steering is awesome.

 

[6768rogues]

If that floor were mine, I would want some testing to be done. A concrete testing company can take core samples and do tests. Resurfacing sometimes does not work well, especially if the underlying concrete is substandard. Numbers on paper carry a lot of weight if you to into battle with a builder. I would have testing done and if it is deficient, I would consult with an engineer who is a concrete designer. Then I would go after the builder armed with proof and an expert for testimony and for a remedial design.
If it falls apart, spalls, checks, chalks, whatever, you have a repair that was not designed by an expert and you are stuck with it.

 

[Delta74]

thats Bull ****, after the contractor basically screwed me, I would have called the media, its usually slow and they need a story for filler, you may not get your floor fixed but you will likely not give them a good day, and possibly really hurt there wallet.

 

[glider]

Looks good, sounds like the builder did step up. You pick and choose your battles in life. Nice clean garage with a nice ride.

 

[logical]

Speaking of unfinished stuff..............now would be a good time to paint those walls before even more stuff gets boltred to them. They are throwing off more dust than you realized and eventually will need to be re-mudded if you don't get some paint on them. It will also make a night and day difference in lighting the place.

 

[dodgepolara500]

Speaking of unfinished stuff..............now would be a good time to paint those walls before even more stuff gets boltred to them. They are throwing off more dust than you realized and eventually will need to be re-mudded if you don't get some paint on them. It will also make a night and day difference in lighting the place.

I agree. It will start to darken and the mud will shrink. Put some PVA sealer down first and a coat of finish latex on top of that before you get too much on the walls.
You can get it done in a couple of days easy