High Output Smart Three Way Switch

[foolio]

Does anyone know what I can get for a three-way smart switch that will handle high output? I have nine 110 W LED high bay lights In my garage. I ordered a three-way smart switch from Amazon but when I got it I saw it could only handle 200 W. so far in my searching I have come up empty-handed.

 

[wssix99]

I doubt you will find one. You could use the smart switch to drive an electrical contactor that isolates the switch from the load.

 

[billconner]

This one states 15 amps. Limited-time deal: Kasa Smart 3 Way Switch HS210 KIT, Needs Neutral Wire, 2.4GHz Wi-Fi Light Switch works with Alexa and Google Home, UL Certified, No Hub Required, 2-Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07724HNTX/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Not well versed in smart switch tech.

Many LED high bays have 0-10 control built in. That might be an option.

 

[Skooterj]

9x110 Watt bulbs is only 8.25 Amps at 120 Volts. Any 15 Amp switch should work.

 

[billconner]

I don't know how the inrush current of the LED driver will affect a smart switch. When I was designing lighting, I never loaded up a breaker or relay above 50% if the load was LED. The switch I linked, made in Viet Nam, may or may not be robust enough for the load. You're probably fine with it.

Were I doing this professionally, I'd be calling engineers at domestic manufactures to find out.

 

[foolio]

This one states 15 amps. Limited-time deal: Kasa Smart 3 Way Switch HS210 KIT, Needs Neutral Wire, 2.4GHz Wi-Fi Light Switch works with Alexa and Google Home, UL Certified, No Hub Required, 2-Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07724HNTX/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Not well versed in smart switch tech.

Many LED high bays have 0-10 control built in. That might be an option.

Hey thanks for the reply! I did some digging on the one you suggested. In the spec sheet, it mentions 600W incandescent. Not sure how that translates to LED. I think I will see if I can get a response from the manufacturer.

 

[foolio]

9x110 Watt bulbs is only 8.25 Amps at 120 Volts. Any 15 Amp switch should work.

Unfortunately, the ones I am finding specify a specific max output in watts. Not sure how that figures since normal dumb switches seem to only care about amps. Must be something specific to the brains inside the switch.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

I doubt you will find one. You could use the smart switch to drive an electrical contactor that isolates the switch from the load.

what he said

 

[billconner]

Hey thanks for the reply! I did some digging on the one you suggested. In the spec sheet, it mentions 600W incandescent. Not sure how that translates to LED. I think I will see if I can get a response from the manufacturer.

Sorry. I guess device is 15 amps but output less.

Probably reasons to object like price and form factor but should do it: https://thesmartcave.com/best-heavy-duty-smart-switch/

Also, Google "20 amp smart switch". I thought a "GE ZigBee" one did it.

 

[foolio]

Sorry. I guess device is 15 amps but output less.

Probably reasons to object like price and form factor but should do it: https://thesmartcave.com/best-heavy-duty-smart-switch/

Also, Google "20 amp smart switch". I thought a "GE ZigBee" one did it.

I actually found that exact site but alas not really what I am looking for.

 

[yugami]

I would use a Shelly myself and hook the dumb switches to it. That's how a bunch of my the way switches are hooked into my home automation.

 

[Skooterj]

This makes NO sense. If it is rated for 15 Amp, how does it know if those 15 amps are LED, CFL, Incandescent, a vacuum cleaner, electric blanket, George Forman Grill?????

 

[Skooterj]

Anyway, I found this one rated for 1000 watts LED

DW1KD-1BZ

Leviton Decora Smart Wi-Fi 1000W Universal LED/Incandescent Dimmer. Works with Amazon Alexa and Google Assistant, No Hub Required.

www.leviton.com

 

[Skooterj]

Or this one rated for the full 1800 Watts. It is not a dimmer, just on/off.

Amazon.com

 

[foolio]

Scooterj, my man (or woman) , I think you found me a winner! And a fellow Hoosier too

 

[Skooterj]

I am NOT a Hoosier. Boiler UP!!!!

 

[billconner]

This makes NO sense. If it is rated for 15 Amp, how does it know if those 15 amps are LED, CFL, Incandescent, a vacuum cleaner, electric blanket, George Forman Grill?????

Inrush current. LED driver inrush can be double and on barely minimally rated triacs, they won't take it.

 

[Skooterj]

So in my research, it appears the wattage limitation has something to do with the dimmer function being different for LED/CFL/Incandescent??

 

[Skooterj]

Inrush current. LED driver inrush can be double and on barely minimally rated triacs, they won't take it.

Inrush on a incandescent can be 14 times normal current.

Starting Characteristics

I really think it has to do with dimmer technology of the bulb types.

 

[billconner]

In my field, circuits with incandescent are routinely fully loaded. The same circuits with LED fixtures are kept around 50% capacity because the breaker will trip, even if a dimming driver set to 0.

 

[Skooterj]

I read that switch manufacturers don't worry about inrush current because switches hardly ever fail while being energized. If they fail, it is while being de-energized. But smart switches may be different.

 

[billconner]

A common switch uses physical contacts to make or break a circuit. So does a non-solid state relay. The typical smart switch uses a triac or SSR. In short, that physical switch and incandescent inrush cirrent is all quite sinusoidal. The output of triacs or SSRs is far from that, and the harmonics from drivers and ballasts are quite a different load than incandescent loads.

 

[SlappyWhite]

Of course there is always the question, does it really need to be on a smart switch? The old tech worked for a good century plus... place them by the doors you use....

 

[yugami]

Of course there is always the question, does it really need to be on a smart switch? The old tech worked for a good century plus...

Is that why you still use a horse?

 

[exmaxima1]

Double check your wifi router frequencies before purchasing a 2.4ghz switch. Virtually none of them will operate with the higher 5ghz freq, and many routers (such as my Xfinity modem/router) automatically select frequencies and do not allow you to manually select 2.4ghz. I've got a drawer full of switches and smart bulbs that will not work in my home anymore.

 

[SlappyWhite]

Is that why you still use a horse?

Why, ICE and EV have also been around for > a century just like light switches?

There are times smart devices and IoT in general provide value. More times than not it is a complicatorian's solution to a problem that does not actually exist beyond maybe pure laziness.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

Double check your wifi router frequencies before purchasing a 2.4ghz switch. Virtually none of them will operate with the higher 5ghz freq, and many routers (such as my Xfinity modem/router) automatically select frequencies and do not allow you to manually select 2.4ghz. I've got a drawer full of switches and smart bulbs that will not work in my home anymore.

you don't have to use their wifi - you can put your own in behind theirs. set it up as an AP and you won't have the "double router" quirks, either.

 

[yugami]

Why, ICE and EV have also been around for > a century just like light switches?

There are times smart devices and IoT in general provide value. More times than not it is a complicatorian's solution to a problem that does not actually exist beyond maybe pure laziness.

So no lithium battery tools then, just Yankee screwdrivers and bit and brace. No actual need besides laziness (I actually use both, but 90% of my house it automated and the shop will be too, its very nice)

 

[exmaxima1]

you don't have to use their wifi - you can put your own in behind theirs. set it up as an AP and you won't have the "double router" quirks, either.

We originally had a separate modem with pair of Asus routers set up in mesh but one day Xfinity had an update or something and neither router no longer worked. We needed to have wifi immediately so we ran to the Xfinity store and now rent their fancy all-in-one modem/router. I wish I knew what happened to the Asus routers because they had much better coverage thru the house and worked with all our smart devices.

 

[cybrdyke]

Anyway, I found this one rated for 1000 watts LED

DW1KD-1BZ

Leviton Decora Smart Wi-Fi 1000W Universal LED/Incandescent Dimmer. Works with Amazon Alexa and Google Assistant, No Hub Required.

www.leviton.com

450w Max LED load on that one.
Incandescent is a resistive load. LED is a capacitive load. They require different things. I've seen 20w of LED lamps blow black smoke out of a 1000w Lutron dimmer.
CD

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Double check your wifi router frequencies before purchasing a 2.4ghz switch. Virtually none of them will operate with the higher 5ghz freq, and many routers (such as my Xfinity modem/router) automatically select frequencies and do not allow you to manually select 2.4ghz. I've got a drawer full of switches and smart bulbs that will not work in my home anymore.

Thats because theyre setup to use a single SSID & allow the router to select which band the device should operate on.

Easy fix. log into the gateway & change the settings. Ive done it before for concraptic gateways.

Or make it simple & easy- stop renting their garbage equipment, save on rental fees, & use your own modem & router.... thats what i do.

you don't have to use their wifi - you can put your own in behind theirs. set it up as an AP and you won't have the "double router" quirks, either.

Make sure to setup IP pass-through(some companies incorrectly call it bridge mode) & turn off wifi on the concraptic gateway. this way the concraptic gateway merely acts as a cable modem.... or just do what i do as said above & make it a lot simpler....

We originally had a separate modem with pair of Asus routers set up in mesh but one day Xfinity had an update or something and neither router no longer worked. We needed to have wifi immediately so we ran to the Xfinity store and now rent their fancy all-in-one modem/router. I wish I knew what happened to the Asus routers because they had much better coverage thru the house and worked with all our smart devices.

That doesnt make any sense. Concraptic wouldnt have a way to update your routers behind your own cable modem. The only thing i can think of is they refreshed your dynamic public address & your router was bound to the old public address. It didnt request a new IP address so you lost internet. Its an easy fix. just have your router request a new public address.

Or your modem was old/outdated & you needed a new one. That happened to me recently. so i bought a new modem. but that issue had ZERO effect on my SD-WAN router....

I would verify whether your modem is still compatible w/ their network (they have a list online), get a new modem if not, setup your new modem, connect your routers to it, then return their garbage equipment & save the rental fees.

 

[exmaxima1]

Thats because theyre setup to use a single SSID & allow the router to select which band the device should operate on.

Easy fix. log into the gateway & change the settings. Ive done it before for concraptic gateways.

Or make it simple & easy- stop renting their garbage equipment, save on rental fees, & use your own modem & router.... thats what i do.

Make sure to setup IP pass-through(some companies incorrectly call it bridge mode) & turn off wifi on the concraptic gateway. this way the concraptic gateway merely acts as a cable modem.... or just do what i do as said above & make it a lot simpler....

That doesnt make any sense. Concraptic wouldnt have a way to update your routers behind your own cable modem. The only thing i can think of is they refreshed your dynamic public address & your router was bound to the old public address. It didnt request a new IP address so you lost internet. Its an easy fix. just have your router request a new public address.

Or your modem was old/outdated & you needed a new one. That happened to me recently. so i bought a new modem. but that issue had ZERO effect on my SD-WAN router....

I would verify whether your modem is still compatible w/ their network (they have a list online), get a new modem if not, setup your new modem, connect your routers to it, then return their garbage equipment & save the rental fees.

I was able to get internet directly off the modem, but when I would connect the primary router nothing would pass thru and no wifi. I assume that my router is the issue. If I can't get any pass-thru I'm not sure how I could re-configure it.

 

[yugami]

I was able to get internet directly off the modem, but when I would connect the primary router nothing would pass thru and no wifi. I assume that my router is the issue. If I can't get any pass-thru I'm not sure how I could re-configure it.

You might need a cross over cable, or of you're using one you might need a regular cable. Cables that come with services that are yellow are typically cross over

 

[exmaxima1]

You might need a cross over cable, or of you're using one you might need a regular cable. Cables that come with services that are yellow are typically cross over

The setup worked for over a year and then just one morning the internet went down in our area. A few hours later service was up again (if connected directly to the modem), but my routers no longer worked. I can't see how that would be a cable issue.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I was able to get internet directly off the modem, but when I would connect the primary router nothing would pass thru and no wifi. I assume that my router is the issue. If I can't get any pass-thru I'm not sure how I could re-configure it.

as i previously said, your router was most likely locked onto an old dynamic public IP and didnt request a new one from concraptics headend router via DHCP, so you lost internet access.

I've seen this happen before.... nothing was wrong with your router in that case. Did you even log into your router to see what error message it was giving? that wouldve been the first step instead of just tossing them aside and wasting time and money on concraptics junk equipment rentals...

Concraptic periodically changes the public IPs on accounts with dynamic addresses. they do so on my service a couple times per year.

your laptop was a new device plugged into the modem and requested DHCP address and got it. thus was able to surf

You might need a cross over cable, or of you're using one you might need a regular cable. Cables that come with services that are yellow are typically cross over

that makes no sense at all since his routers previously worked without any change to the cabling

furthermore, most devices nowadays are auto-mdix and thus dont need crossover cables..... those cables are really a thing of the past...

 

[u3b3rg33k]

You might need a cross over cable, or of you're using one you might need a regular cable. Cables that come with services that are yellow are typically cross over

Working in the field, I haven't encountered a machine built in the last decade that needed a crossover cable. i'm sure someone out there can find ONE example here or there, but everything went auto-MDIX a long, long time ago. even 3com did it. anything gigabit or better MUST do it, per the spec & method of operation.