To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Holmes on Homes

tdkkart

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 17, 2006
Messages
6,887
Location
Eastern Iowa
1) I don't trust contractors, no one should. When investing a large portion of money into a property you should always be on guard and make sure that everything is done to your satisfaction... after all, you're paying for the job. With a lot of contractors if you do not babysit them they WILL cut corners.


The problem here is that the general population has no flippin' idea what's right and wrong when it comes to construction. How are they supposed to know what is satisfactory and what they have to babysit??
99% of homeowners wouldn't know a bad tile job unless the tile was installed upside down, and sure as hell wouldn't know that you can't use 14ga wire on a 20amp breaker or that junction boxes are not supposed to be hidden inside walls.
As nit-picky as Mike Holmes is, probably more than 1/2 of what he says goes right over the heads of the average homeowner.

If you don't intuitively know these things, how the hell are you supposed to protect yourself??

The one thing I've learned is that I will never have a tiled shower in my house. At some point is gonna leak no matter how you do it.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

sunshineFC3s

Well-known member
Joined
May 2, 2007
Messages
103
Location
MN
I love the show, appreciate what Holmes does, and have learned a lot from it. I dont care if he postures or has made a ton of money from the show. Good for him. Finally, someone making money for the right reasons!

As far as the contractor bashing on the show...I'm all for it. I've met more than my fair share of them, and my general impression is that they are no better than used car salesman. Its seems modern contractors suffer the same problem doctors and lawyers suffered from before the internet age...the do as I say, and dont ask questions mentality. Seems like lawyers and doctors have adapted to dealing with a more educated consumer, but contractors have not.
-a
 

Big N8

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 5, 2007
Messages
99
Location
**** Rapids MN
Great point. I have had window and siding contractor strait lie to me. Holmes pulls out some good tools and shows what is what. He even tells you take time and chose a contractor that you trust not just the cheapest guy out there.
 

Frank The Plumber

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2011
Messages
2,644
Location
Chicago.
Not A one of you hooray guys would pay the top dollar price for one of these dream and smoke high quality jobs.
The factor in getting a **** job done is the customer 9 times out of 10.
The customer being cheap is almost always a factor in poor quality work.
The guy who smells like rotten garbage and pickled *** that is 10% cheaper than everyone else is cheaper for a reason. As a customer you just feel that you are smarter than him and can coax quality out of him. You think you can baby sit this guy into submission, really?
You can't make a boar hound out of a 4 pound Chihauha, and you are not getting Park Avenue quality out of a half sober guy who pulls up to the job opens his truck door and 14 pounds of fast food trash falls out of his truck and scratches and violently adjusts Mr. Johnson vigorously, publicly, in your driveway.

If you choose someone who really looks unable to exist within the confines of modern society, Guess what?

This has spawned a whole new series of inspector shows on cable TV, it's gonna give comedy central a real run for the money.
 

dirttracker18

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 10, 2009
Messages
3,191
Location
Slate River, ON
Not A one of you hooray guys would pay the top dollar price for one of these dream and smoke high quality jobs.
The factor in getting a **** job done is the customer 9 times out of 10.
The customer being cheap is almost always a factor in poor quality work.
The guy who smells like rotten garbage and pickled *** that is 10% cheaper than everyone else is cheaper for a reason. As a customer you just feel that you are smarter than him and can coax quality out of him. You think you can baby sit this guy into submission, really?
You can't make a boar hound out of a 4 pound Chihauha, and you are not getting Park Avenue quality out of a half sober guy who pulls up to the job opens his truck door and 14 pounds of fast food trash falls out of his truck and scratches and violently adjusts Mr. Johnson vigorously, publicly, in your driveway.

If you choose someone who really looks unable to exist within the confines of modern society, Guess what?

This has spawned a whole new series of inspector shows on cable TV, it's gonna give comedy central a real run for the money.

But Frank,

MANY of the customers on HoH did not use the lowest bid, many got references and many did have permits.

They still got shafted. As for the high end materials, if the customer requests it, price accordingly and explain why.

Holmes does not promote high end products without education. Educate your customers as to why this product or procedure is better then another, price accordingly and do a good job.

I just don't understand why some contractors think Holmes is such a bad guy or the show is bad. They explain why **** is **** and only call out the real bad guys. I just don't see what is wrong with that.
 

Grinder Bill

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 11, 2011
Messages
217
I just don't understand why some contractors think Holmes is such a bad guy or the show is bad. They explain why **** is **** and only call out the real bad guys. I just don't see what is wrong with that.

Kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight...
 

tdkkart

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 17, 2006
Messages
6,887
Location
Eastern Iowa
Not A one of you hooray guys would pay the top dollar price for one of these dream and smoke high quality jobs.
The factor in getting a **** job done is the customer 9 times out of 10.
The customer being cheap is almost always a factor in poor quality work.
The guy who smells like rotten garbage and pickled *** that is 10% cheaper than everyone else is cheaper for a reason. As a customer you just feel that you are smarter than him and can coax quality out of him. You think you can baby sit this guy into submission, really?
You can't make a boar hound out of a 4 pound Chihauha, and you are not getting Park Avenue quality out of a half sober guy who pulls up to the job opens his truck door and 14 pounds of fast food trash falls out of his truck and scratches and violently adjusts Mr. Johnson vigorously, publicly, in your driveway.

If you choose someone who really looks unable to exist within the confines of modern society, Guess what?

This has spawned a whole new series of inspector shows on cable TV, it's gonna give comedy central a real run for the money.


Wow, what'd you have for lunch???
 

walrus

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 12, 2008
Messages
11,672
Location
Maine
I've noticed no more Dewalt tools, all Milwaukee tools now, even some 28v stuff. About time he figured it out:D
 

sneezer41

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2007
Messages
407
Location
People's Republic of Mass
Frank

He is never there because the work was not 'Park Avenue"

unless working plumbing is considered high end.

Most have said, he goes overboard, but what is there when he starts there is no excuse for, and many if not all the jobs are done by licensed pros.

You make an assumption that all **** work is done by slovenly hicks, this is not even close to true. Much of the worst work in your profession is done by guys in shiny trucks with nationally known names on the side. Am I right?
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Frank The Plumber

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2011
Messages
2,644
Location
Chicago.
Frank

He is never there because the work was not 'Park Avenue"

unless working plumbing is considered high end.

Most have said, he goes overboard, but what is there when he starts there is no excuse for, and many if not all the jobs are done by licensed pros.

You make an assumption that all **** work is done by slovenly hicks, this is not even close to true. Much of the worst work in your profession is done by guys in shiny trucks with nationally known names on the side. Am I right?

No, not hicks. Around here....Did you ever see Borat?
How about this gem? Quackser Fortune has a cousin in the Bronx.:)
 

scarrylarry

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 26, 2010
Messages
494
Location
West Coast of Canada
WOW!
I've made a couple of posts on this thread and I think Mike H. would be pleased at how much air time he is getting on here.
For my American friends who might not know we are having an election soon up in Canada,we have a parliamentary system here as apposed to a republic.If we voted for a Prime Minster like you down south vote for a president I would say Mike Holmes for Prime Minister he's better than the candidates that are in place here now,LOL!
scarrylarry
 

frankkl

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2009
Messages
68
I like the show and I must say I learned a lot from it.
Holmes is not a show that teaches you how to do reno but opens your eyes on the fact there are buildings codes to follow.
Further more, I learned that if your going to do a job, its nice when it done right. In most of the renos I did, I try to see what my limitations are and hire a pro for some stuff. In most cases, I don't stop at the minimum code requirement or the cheapest option; I calculate the difference for the upgrade. Most times, its no that more expensive to do better and the advantages are worth it.

For the TV show, never expect a TV show to inform you on the building code, go to the source, your local building code.
 

baubau

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 1, 2009
Messages
98
i have watched this show from the first episode...it is very informative, full of ideas and general guidelines.....Holmes strives for strict adherence to the building code....he explains his "gold standard", benchmarks in building process and how to evaluate materials, contractors and general questions to ask...

yes, he can be "preachy",tough, critical but what is great about that is that you can learn something...and since you have an idea how a great job should be done and cost surrounding it, now you can easily relate to that standard and decide what limitations , costs and time guidelines are..it is viewers decision how to accept his educational points..


the drywall is the great equalizer between ****** and great job, it covers tracks..but mike holmes takes it apart and shows the bones...
 

scott37300

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2010
Messages
3,450
Location
Wisconsin
I like the show, it shows how to do things in the ideal situation. Although it's rare that an ideal situation every exist.

Now with saying that contractors face a lot of issues with home owners on doing things the best way possible. Most home owners usually want things done the cheapest way possible, a lot(not all) only see dollar signs. So now a contractor that would do the best job and use the best materials available comes along and gives you a quote for 50,000 for a garage. Then the next contractor comes along and says he can do it for 25,000 dollars. 99% of all home owners would go with the cheaper contractor thinking a garage is a garage. Contractor 1 might use 2x6 studs spaced closer, better wall sheathing, better vapor barrier, thicker cement for floor, rebar, trusses rated for higher snow loads, 50 year roof shingles, more nails on the shingles, better siding, etc. Then contractor number 2 shows up and gives his low bid because he is only using 2x4 studs, spaced 24" apart, thinner sheathing, thinner concrete, no rebar, 15 year roof shingles, etc. Both of them can get a garage up and it will probably look alright but which one is better quality and will last longer?

Things that home owners can't see can add up quick, ice and water shield on the roof, proper weather sealing around the windows, rebar in concrete, quality of shingles, etc. A typical home owner will see a garage floor, weather there is rebar in it or not and that floor will probably hold a vehicle just fine. But if you drive a heavy truck in there or after years it will start to crack.

So the quality contractors that would like to do their job with the best materials and the best work and charge for it have to compete against hacks that come in at half the price. Some home owners do realise quality work and materials and are willing to pay the extra when you sit down and talk to them about the benefits of everything. Some aren't, all the see is the price and saving money. Now the biggest problem is the homeowners that expect the best garage for the cheapest price. They don't understand how one guy only charges half the price of the other.

One poster above stated how home owners have to baby sit contractors and tell the contractor exactly what to do since he is paying the bill. This just means he has never worked with a quality contractor before. You should not have to baby sit a quality contractor. The problem is when home owners hire the cheapest guy and expect a perfect job, this is where he has to babysit the contractor.

Bottom line when hiring a contractor is 99% of the time you get what you pay for. Don't expect the best job if you don't go with an experienced contractor and pay for that experience and quality. If you hire the cheapest contractor then expect the cheapest work.
 

Beaumont67

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 10, 2011
Messages
526
Location
St. Thomas, Ontario
In the bible book of "good purchasing" - 3 segments you want to try and maximize on:
a) best or lowest PRICE
b) equal or better QUALITY
c) great SERVICE
All one can usually count on is 2-out-of-3, and still be an acceptable transaction or build.

CBC MarketPlace video with Mike Holmes re. BAIT HOUSE - needing a new roof:

http://www.cbc.ca/marketplace/2011/hittingtheroof/
Very interesting TV segment...Enjoy !!

------------------------------------------------
Beaumont { :>)) www.petperfectexpress.com
1965 Malibu S/S, 1966 Beaumont Custom original paint, 1967 Beaumont Custom, 1967 Beaumont Custom original paint, 1967 Beaumont 396-350HP Sport Deluxe M21-411's - SOLD 1970 Judge
 
Last edited:

dalepres

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 22, 2010
Messages
118
Location
Park Hill, OK
If you don't intuitively know these things, how the hell are you supposed to protect yourself??

I don't think you can ever know what is right or wrong in construction intuitively. The best homeowners can hope for is to do enough research before even looking for bids.

the factor in getting a **** job done is the customer 9 times out of 10.

Getting bad work done is never the fault of the customer alone and always more the fault of the contractor than of the customer. If I ask you to do something that is wrong because I am not a plumber and I don't know what I am talking about, you're willing to do it? If you're willing to do **** work, that is a reflection on you; you're supposed to be the craftsman. At best, **** work is a partnership between the customer and a crappy worker. And it is certainly possible that the crappy worker doesn't know he's a crappy worker so the fault is split evenly - their both stupid, or should I say constructionally challenged. But if a contractor knows the customer is asking for junk and does the work anyway, then he's at fault. All you have to do is say no to customers who ask you to lower your standards, and not saying no simply means you have no standards.

We are building a house and I am my own GC/handyman/general laborer. Watching shows like Holmes on Homes are very helpful. They don't make me an expert plumber or framer but they do demonstrate that I can't trust every plumber or framer to do the job right just because those job names are painted on the side of their trucks.
 
Last edited:

Ign

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,769
Location
Butte Peak ND
In the bible book of "good purchasing" - 3 segments you want to try and maximize on:
a) best or lowest PRICE
b) equal or better QUALITY
c) great SERVICE
All one can usually count on is 2-out-of-3, and still be an acceptable transaction or build.

The first rule in machine shops:

PICK TWO
cheap
fast
high quality

Holmes is fine but I agree his work is top dollar, which is also fine. Even tho I think I already understand it, I'm surprised to learn more and more each day with custom metal fabrication that people want a 30 hour job at a 5 hour rate. Custom is custom.
 

foss

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
423
Location
On. Canada
Sorry but you are wrong on that one.

My buddy just finished his new house with an attahced garage with a door down some stairs into the basement. All done to code. Also has another leading into the main floor. Door must be fire rated and self closing.

They are getting pretty common now in new builds.

Also, welcome neighbour, well about as neighbourly as it gets in NW Ontario :)

I have a door into my basement as well. Very handy.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom