Homeowner electrical work license

[MerlinsBeard]

Just looking to see if anyone who's had experience getting a homeowner's license to do electrical work. I know several here do electrical contracting as their career, but I don't have time or resources to become a full-pledge licensed electrician.

I think I'm going to take the plunge and try it out and see how it goes. Looks like I need to take a test 1 1/2 hours long, based on NEC and basic electrical calculations. Any good resources for studying?

My current project is to get LED strip lights installed in garage. But I also want to be able to do some of the electrical work for finishing a basement and potentially build and trench power for a shed in the next year or two.

Any one out there been through this experience (homeowner license with the county to do their own home's electrical work)? I'd still defer to a licensed electrician for all the service work, and maybe the panel work.

Thanks in advance.

 

[larry_g]

Each state is different. Here in OR we can do electrical work on our own property. So I'd advise that you make sure you are getting responses that are applicable to your state.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Which county and state? This varies widely...

 

[MerlinsBeard]

St Mary's county MD. I've been looking through their website https://www.stmarysmd.com/lugm/ and sent an email to their electric examiner trying to learn more about the process getting county permission to do my own home electrical work.

 

[4xdog]

I did it here in Saint Louis County, Missouri, for a project to run new underground service to my garage from a new subpanel.

I studied for some time, took the test, and got the needed permit to do the work. I talked to the inspector several times beforehand as I was figuring out the process, as did my brother.

My brother, who did most of the thinking and helped a LOT with the work, was an electrical engineer who'd lived with the NEC for decades. The inspector knew he was going to be helping, and I suspect that helped me "pass". I really don't know if my scores were good enough on their own.

It's not an impossible test out here, just lots and lots of details around the NEC sections applicable to home work. Perfectly fair. One just has to remember a number of facts and figures in a fairly short time. And probably for a fairly short time!

 

[nadogail]

Some of us are of the opinion that we don't need any stinking licenses and avoid as many inspectors as possible.

 

[Innovate1]

Each state is different. Here in OR we can do electrical work on our own property. So I'd advise that you make sure you are getting responses that are applicable to your state.

lg
no neat sig line

^^ This. Even varies from county to county and sometimes city to city. Varies widely from homeowner can do anything to homeowner is only allowed to do branch circuits after a test. Probably some places don't allow a homeowner to do anything. Got to check with the local AHJ which you are already doing. The inspectors often take into account how involved the project is. Most are reasonable if you show you know what you are doing. Occasionally some seem set against the homeowner doing anything. I have dealt with places that don't even have a permit or inspection process to ones that are fairly tight. Talking to the inspection group can get you some tips on what they are looking for as some of the details may not be obvious. "Courtesy loops" come to mind. In my location I am allowed to do anything myself as the homeowner but they want courtesy loops even though the version of the NEC they are on doesn't contain any such requirement. Bottom line is that the local AHJ can add or subtract from the NEC requirements.

 

[BillK]

St Mary's county MD.

I am next door in Charles County and when I built my detached garage it was an open book test on the NEC. That was quite a few years ago so I am sure it might have changed. I am pretty sure Charles and St Mary's use the same group for inspections or at least they did back then.

 

[Bretny]

Everything your saying dosnt need a licence in NY. I even did my own service upgrade, had it inspected and the power company came over to switch to the new service.

To regional to give you any better awnser.

 

[Ralf11]

make friends with a licensed electrician

invite him over for dinner and talk; show him what you want to do; then you drill all the studs, and pull the cables; set up outlets, lights whatever

at the next dinner invite, he looks it all over and does the hook up into the panel

 

[alfredeneuman]

make friends with a licensed electrician invite him over for dinner
and talk; show him what you want to do; then you drill all the studs, and pull the cables; set up outlets, lights whatever
at the next dinner invite, he looks it all over and does the hook up into the panel

Most electricians understand the old "spaghetti" trick and see it coming. It's one of the oldest in the book. He might as well hold up a sign that says "Will work for food"

 

[PugetDude]

Most electricians understand the old "spaghetti" trick and see it coming. It's one of the oldest in the book. He might as well hold up a sign that says "Will work for food"

Spaghetti is sending him subliminal hints about wiring.
Try steak instead...

 

[u2slow]

This varies widely...

Agreed. Can't license a homeowner for electrical work here. But the homeowner can take out the permit and do the work on his/her own residence - subject to inspection.

Some of us are of the opinion that we don't need any stinking licenses and avoid as many inspectors as possible.

^ That's another popular route...

 

[slow]

Spaghetti is sending him subliminal hints about wiring.
Try steak instead...

Agreed, I do not want an electrician if his work looks like spaghetti. Steak is a common form to repayment for lots of help.

 

[MrSurly]

Just curious, from an outsider; If you are doing simple branch work inside your home, and no-one will even *know* unless you go tell them...what prevents you from just doing the install? Is there a mechanism, say, at the Home depot where you can't buy a fixture or wire without a license?

 

[Zeke]

The typical answer is that if you don't do everything by the book and there's insurance involved because of an 'event', the ins co is going to be looking for the cause. If a fire, the FD is also going to be looking for a cause.

So, you don't want to do wiring that can electrocute someone or burn the place down. You'll be up **** creek.

Conversely, if you are allowed to do the work AND it's inspected, I don't see the point of any test unless it's just to save inspector time. They aren't teachers, for sure.

 

[PNWguy]

Each state is different. Here in OR we can do electrical work on our own property. So I'd advise that you make sure you are getting responses that are applicable to your state.

lg

I'm in Oregon, and the building department has made it clear to me that the only thing I can't do is run my own propane lines. This must be on my personal house that I don't plan to sell or rent.

I've never heard of a "homeowner's license" before now.

 

[sberry]

Some of us are of the opinion that we don't need any stinking licenses and avoid as many inspectors as possible.

I wouldn't have made so many mistakes for so long had I had work other than service entrance inspected. I was the avoider. I still am. There is always a certain amount of human error but I an not a hider, not scrared to redo something to get it right. I have seen some dandy stuff but the worse thing he can say about mine is I didn't get a permit.

 

[sberry]

I never wanted to be an electrician or a welder for that matter. It was really more of a case of what it could do for me and I am a utility guy, couldn't call someone for every install I was gonna do for decades. Same for weld and auto/truck/tractor and plumbing.

 

[dcg9381]

getting county permission to do my own home electrical work.

Does you county require a permit to do low-voltage electrical work (I assume strip LEDs are low voltage, but could be alternate)?

As a good builder friend of mine said, if an inspection is necessary, that necessitates a permit. In very few circumstances do we apply for permits that don't require inspection, as we just call that "taxation".

Even in jurisdictions that do require a permit pull to move an outlet, I wonder how many people actually do that? Where I am - which is county, there is no such thing as an electrical permit. The POC has inspections for certain things (solar/service entrance) and the county requires alignment with building and NEC code, but no one is around to inspect your work... Which of course results in some really interesting structures.

Note, I'm not a fan of uneducated electrical work (bad idea) and if you're doing a basement or running a new circuit, having a licensed electrician to inspect and / or do the final connection is a great idea. If you want some real criticism (and over-inspection) post a photo up here! This is one of the few forums that supports owner-electrical and although you'll need a stiff upper lip, you'll learn a lot.

Your state allows home owners to do how much work with a "homeowner" license? Or is this a city thing? (we don't have this here)

To pass a test, I'd start studying copies of the test - perhaps whatever study guide or topic guide your state has available.

I'd love to go after a license, but the required number of hours (years) in my state and the pay rate is prohibitive...

 

[Baydog]

Just curious, from an outsider; If you are doing simple branch work inside your home, and no-one will even *know* unless you go tell them...what prevents you from just doing the install? Is there a mechanism, say, at the Home depot where you can't buy a fixture or wire without a license?

All is well and good until you get ready to sell the home and the home inspect notes electrical work has been done without any evidence of an inspection (ie the inspection sticker at the panel).

Several times each month we get invited out to look over this unlicensed work and get it inspected so the sale can go through. It's often not done to code and requires correction. We have to have it inspected to current code, even though it may have been done decades ago. So it may have been to code when it was done, but no longer is.

The real problem come in with concealed work, when there is evidence that whoever did it either cut corners or didn't know what they were doing. Inspectors have required drywall to be opened up so they can see the work. That's the last thing you want to deal with during a home sale.

So if you live in a jurisdiction requiring inspections, make sure you get them, either as a homeowner or by requiring your contractor to do so. Some kitchen remodeling outfits are notorious for doing unlicensed electrical work. You're paying them, make them do it right.

 

[PNWguy]

This will depend on the area and the sales climate. I have purchased 3 houses and sold 2 of them. I know there was unpermitted work on each house, for each transaction.

Nobody even mentioned it. When I sold the last place, the agent put in an inspection clause (and I provided an inspection to the buyers). If they didn't like the fact that somewhere along the line an owner didn't pull a permit, they were free to walk away from the sale.

Perhaps if you're in an area where it's a buyers' market it's a different story.

The house I grew up in was started in 1972, and permits weren't required until '73. If your rules were true, I'd be unable to sell my parents' house when they no longer live in it.

I am not suggesting sub-standard work; just saying that in my experience, permits are meaningless at time of sale.

All is well and good until you get ready to sell the home and the home inspect notes electrical work has been done without any evidence of an inspection (ie the inspection sticker at the panel).

Several times each month we get invited out to look over this unlicensed work and get it inspected so the sale can go through. It's often not done to code and requires correction. We have to have it inspected to current code, even though it may have been done decades ago. So it may have been to code when it was done, but no longer is.

The real problem come in with concealed work, when there is evidence that whoever did it either cut corners or didn't know what they were doing. Inspectors have required drywall to be opened up so they can see the work. That's the last thing you want to deal with during a home sale.

So if you live in a jurisdiction requiring inspections, make sure you get them, either as a homeowner or by requiring your contractor to do so. Some kitchen remodeling outfits are notorious for doing unlicensed electrical work. You're paying them, make them do it right.

 

[MrSurly]

All is well and good until you get ready to sell the home and the home inspect notes electrical work has been done without any evidence of an inspection (ie the inspection sticker at the panel).



Several times each month we get invited out to look over this unlicensed work and get it inspected so the sale can go through. It's often not done to code and requires correction. We have to have it inspected to current code, even though it may have been done decades ago. So it may have been to code when it was done, but no longer is.

I’m sorry but that’s nonsensical.
You are implying that every home sold has to be updated to NEC2017-NEC 2020. Oh, and nothing previously inspected can be grandfathered.
That is not neither practical nor practicable.




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[MrSurly]

If the homeowner is capable and knowledgeable enough to install some additional circuits and lighting while doing it effectively to code, again, how will anyone *know* that the homeowner has done this?
I’m not talking about *bad* work, sloppy work, I’m talking about proper installs.

I was wondering if you have a situation where the materials needed are treated like a controlled substance, “you can’t buy that size of wire, sir, without a license”.
If that’s NOT the case, why would a homeowner seek a license just to hang a few light fixtures ?


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[Baydog]

I’m sorry but that’s nonsensical.
You are implying that every home sold has to be updated to NEC2017-NEC 2020. Oh, and nothing previously inspected can be grandfathered.
That is not neither practical nor practicable.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sorry I may not have been clear. IF you live somewhere that requires electrical inspections of all work, regardless of who performs it. And IF work gets done without an inspection and IF you are later called out on it by a knowledgeable home inspector who can tell that the updated kitchen or addition wasn't done when the house was built and there is no inspection sticker on the panel for it and IF you are later required to get it inspected you will have to use the code as currently adopted in your jurisdiction at time of inspection. You won't be able to say "Oh we built the addition in '84, lets use that code" It doesn't work that way unless you get a gift from the inspector.

How big a problem this will be will depend on if the work was done correctly, and if not the electrical inspector and the day he is having.

This likely doesn't matter for things that are not obvious, like adding a receptacle, ceiling fans etc.. A home inspector won't catch that. But a new addition or even a enclosed porch is easy to flag.

So if you're doing your own work, and you can pull a homeowners permit and get it inspected, it's cheap insurance. If you're paying someone else to do it, require they get an inspections. If they balk at that you may want to consider why. It could be they are really really good at electrical work but for some reason unlicensed, or it could be they know they can't pass an inspection or have been sanctioned and had their licensed pulled.

You can look at inspections as in interfering government overreach or a tool to protect your safety and financial well being. Give some of the really dangerous work we come across, I'm a fan or inspections. They help prevent fires and electrocutions.

 

[75gmck25]

First, I completely agree that the only good answer will come from your local permit/inspection authority in your city or county.

I am in the city of Alexandria, VA and have done quite a bit of permitted work on my house. As a homeowner I was allowed to do anything, including electrical, plumbing, HVAC, and gas lines, as long as I had a permit and it was inspected and approved. The key is that I am the homeowner, and based on that I did not need a license.

If you pull a permit for new work you will usually need to comply with the applicable code at the time of the permit. There are no physical stickers or marking on any of my devices (electrical panel, etc.) to indicate they were inspected, so the only way a purchaser could verify the permits would be to go to the city. I know that many inspectors hired by buyers will come up with "problems" to be fixed, but the reality is that most of the inspectors don't really understand the code very well and can only identify major problems. I don't expect any future properly sales to fall through because they can't find a permit for some of my home improvements, but you never know.

Another myth is that doing your own work might lead to future insurance problems. In general, homeowners insurance still covers you if you screw up (ever leave a candle burning?). Making a code compliance error in doing permitted work yourself is much different than knowing there is a serious problem and overtly ignoring it to gain some advantage.

Bruce

 

[u2slow]

All is well and good until you get ready to sell the home and the home inspect notes electrical work has been done without any evidence of an inspection (ie the inspection sticker at the panel).

Several times each month we get invited out to look over this unlicensed work and get it inspected so the sale can go through. It's often not done to code and requires correction. We have to have it inspected to current code, even though it may have been done decades ago. So it may have been to code when it was done, but no longer is.

The real problem come in with concealed work, when there is evidence that whoever did it either cut corners or didn't know what they were doing. Inspectors have required drywall to be opened up so they can see the work. That's the last thing you want to deal with during a home sale.

So if you live in a jurisdiction requiring inspections, make sure you get them, either as a homeowner or by requiring your contractor to do so. Some kitchen remodeling outfits are notorious for doing unlicensed electrical work. You're paying them, make them do it right.

I'm interested to know what the real driver or requirement is for legitimacy?

Potential buyers hire these home inspectors because average folks basically don't have a clue. The home inspector writes a report (non-binding, they don't open walls, no liability for things not found) and the would-be buyer takes the findings into consideration for their offer. It may have conditions attached. (i.e. fix this and that). Or it might not. The seller can accept the offer or not. If sold, house insurance asks you 40 questions or so - and they may ask for a few house pictures, or they do their own drive-by. If the house uses breakers and has at least a 100A panel, they stop asking about electrical.

When does this permit and/or code-compliancy enter the picture?

 

[sberry]

I saw one recent where the home inspector told the guy the electric was good, I should have got a pic of this mess.

 

[Jagmandave]

In Kansas you can do electrical work in your own home without a permit or inspection. If you're building a new home or an addition, the new work will be inspected as part of the general construction permit.

The only way to get an accurate answer is to visit your county permitting office - they'll know. Otherwise if you're competent, go ahead and do the work and just keep yer mout shut.

 

[MerlinsBeard]

Got a helpful response from the electric examiners. Here's the basic outline.

Submit application by Jan 1/Jul 1, Take homeowner exam 4th Thursday of month ($25.00), If you pass apply for your Homeowners license ($150.00), Once license is issued apply for your permit, Apply for inspection, perform rough-in, call for inspection, complete final, call for an inspection

I think this is on a per year basis since they only give you a year to complete the work, so if I want to run shed power or finish a basement at separate times, I would repeat the process.

It's not much overhead for finishing a basement, but for this relative small job the percentage is a bit higher. Six months ago, I wouldn't have bothered with this investigation and just got 'er done, but since we've had two total loss house fires in my neighborhood this year, I guess it's got me more concerned.

 

[Jagmandave]

House fires due to homeowners doing their own electric work?

 

[MerlinsBeard]

Not to my knowledge. Most of the houses had the same electric contractor. 2 contractors, but one did the majority of the houses.

First house fire came from the outside front porch area, crawled up the siding to 2nd floor awning, then burned into a large portion of 2nd floor and roof. Not sure if cigarette thrown in mulch or something else started it. Didn't appear to be electrical caused.

Second house fire the owners smelled something weird in the house the night before, fire seemed to originate from the kitchen/back deck area, traveled up the wall/siding to the roof, then burned the roof completely off. They had a grill that caught fire but I don't think the grill was the culprit. Still haven't heard anything official from fire marshall yet, since it was 4th of July it happened. It was lucky that the adjacent houses didn't catch fire, both houses' siding facing the house fire was completely warped by the heat. 3-4 firefighters went to hospital for burns.

I think it's pretty unlikely that either of these were caused by homeowners doing electric work. I didn't see anything out of the ordinary from what the contractor installed, but didn't get a close look of kitchen with the 2nd fire. The 1st house was still owned by original owner, but 2nd house had a few more owners rotate through.

Local PoCo seemed to indicate that they'd investigate their infrastructure on their end in the neighborhood. I don't anticipate that they'd find anything though.

 

[ducatithunder]

Here in Anne Arundel (Maryland) all electrical work needs to be permitted and completed by a Maser Electrician. I had to call the county office in regards to pulling a permit to install a sub panel on a garage Im building. Just about to finish the final inspection. I can design and stick build a house or garage, from concrete to roofing as a homeowner no questions asked ... but cant pull wire, install a panel, and some outlets. Everything is inspected for code regardless of who is pulling the permit. Just pushes people to not pull the permits and DIY the work without any inspections. Its a joke.

 

[Innovate1]

Here in Anne Arundel (Maryland) all electrical work needs to be permitted and completed by a Maser Electrician. I had to call the county office in regards to pulling a permit to install a sub panel on a garage Im building. Just about to finish the final inspection. I can design and stick build a house or garage, from concrete to roofing as a homeowner no questions asked ... but cant pull wire, install a panel, and some outlets. Everything is inspected for code regardless of who is pulling the permit. Just pushes people to not pull the permits and DIY the work without any inspections. Its a joke.

St. Louis county near here has a similar system although the homeowner can do everything except the panels if they pass a test. I think it does encourage people to just do things without a permit. But the only place I have seen this really mess with sales is when people finish a basement or such big project without a permit, especially if they add a bathroom. Most things that get flagged during inspections just have to be fixed (or sometimes just agreed that it won't get fixed) and aren't a huge deal.

I am fairly knowledgeable about construction including plumbing and electrical but don't keep up with the current code. So I get a home inspector involved in a house purchase. Figure it's always good to have an extra set of eyes. Some are really good and go up in the attic and such and look at things carefully. Others don't really know that much and just look for their favorite issues. Had one miss a large hole from a limb in the roof of a detached 1 car garage - they must not have even gone in there as there was no ceiling and it was very obvious but on the back side toward the woods so not visible from the house side. So I have an inspector and also do my own, with them if possible.

Not electrical, but when I sold one house the inspector noted some minor surface rust on the water heater shell near the bottom in the basement. I forget if they recommended replacement but the buyer asked for replacement. I countered with it wasn't leaking (noted in the report) and that it was cosmetic and not to replace it. They did find a minor leak in the basement below a shower that I was unaware of and I did fix that.

 

[AMFJ]

Got a helpful response from the electric examiners. Here's the basic outline.

Submit application by Jan 1/Jul 1, Take homeowner exam 4th Thursday of month ($25.00), If you pass apply for your Homeowners license ($150.00), Once license is issued apply for your permit, Apply for inspection, perform rough-in, call for inspection, complete final, call for an inspection

Are they currently allowing homeowner's to take tests? In Memphis, it is a similar system, but currently they are not allowing any homeowner to take tests. So it leaves you with the option of paying an electrician or doing it without the permit.

 

[MerlinsBeard]

In my county they are still offering the test. Been talking to a couple building contractors I know that have been in the business a long time. They seemed to think that the job like adding or changing light fixtures for a educated homeowner was simple enough not to bother with permits. They both would change fixtures in their house without permits without hesitation.

 

[Innovate1]

Some places get a bit crazy about what a permit is needed for. I think a permit for changing a light fixture is nuts. Where I am they don't require permits for such things but even if they did I doubt I would worry about it. Here they seem to be more worried about the roofers having a license than the homeowner doing electrical work - that's pretty nuts too. ADDING a fixture is a bit more involved...

 

[bigdav160]

Sooooooooo glad I live in an area without all the heavy restrictions.

 

[nh_yota]

In my city all electrical work must be permitted and inspected but a homeowner can do their own work on their own single-family house. Homeowners can't do their own work on rentals or multi-family houses even if they live in them.

Honestly I've never seen non-permitted electrical work affect the sale of a house. Nobody bothers to review old permits unless it's something big or questionable like an addition, ADU/apartment or a deck that can been seen from outside the house.

On the other hand, if the home inspection reveals electrical work that's not to code (which often goes unnoticed unless it's obvious) the seller may use it as leverage and ask the buyer to have it fixed as a condition of sale. Smart buyers will use it as leverage to lower the price and then have it fixed on their own.

 

[sberry]

I doubt it's really a license. Probably a certification.