Honda crank bolt wont come off???

[oldtools]

Do the 2135TI/TIMAX or Nitrocats have enough power to do one of these? What impact were you running that didn't? In addition to turning the pressure up running high volume fittings makes a big difference on air tools.

I use the IR impact with lots of wd40. I pounded the bolt with the IR many many times before it come loose. Have anybody try putting a hydraulic Jack underneath the breaker bar and Jack it loose.

 

[solo20]

will a bluepoint 1/2 work on a honda year model 2000
here are the spec
reverse torque 50-450 working
forward torque 50-350 working

 

[SpiderGearsMan]

use my 36 in snapper breaker bar

 

[Yoke]

I just did this very job and let me tell you the $25-$35 bucks I spent at Canadian tire for the honda crank bolt tool was well worth the money even if I only use it once.

 

[krusty the clown]

I just did this very job and let me tell you the $25-$35 bucks I spent at Canadian tire for the honda crank bolt tool was well worth the money even if I only use it once.

yep.........

i bought one AFTER i did my first honda.

 

[Moose-LandTran]

This?

 

[krusty the clown]

thats the one.....

 

[caper]

I've never done one of these but one of my buddies does them fairly regularly(former Honda tech).He always comes over and borrows my 3/4" impact before the car comes in.He hasn't ever had to use anything else so I guess if I do ever do one I'm prepared.

 

[G1GRANDEUR]

iam not gonna lie. i had to replace 00 accord t-belt. i used snap-on xt1000? 1/2 impact gun and it came right off. maybe i got lucky?

 

[boogerboy72]

you did, its the late 90's ones that are a *****.

 

[psychoclaw84]

Sorry, an 1/2 impact wrench will not turn the bolt.

I have used a Mac/Nitrocat & Snap on MG725 impact wrench and it would not remove the bolt.

Also I have used the Honda/Acura pulley holder tool and it also slipped when additional torque was applied using a cheater bar.

Also not able to use the starter/engine rotation to remove the crank bolt, because the engine rotation would tighten the crank bolt.

I do not have access to a torch, but heating it up will allow removal with a 1/2 impact wrench.

Removal method is to spray the bolt with penetrating oil, I used PB Blaster, and let it sit overnight. The next morning the 1/2 impact wrench removed the bolt w/o any issues. The car had 224,000 miles and it was long overdue for timing belt replacement and I personally know that the belt was never changed.

Best of luck on your efforts.

 

[Marlin]

Sorry, an 1/2 impact wrench will not turn the bolt.

I have used a Mac/Nitrocat & Snap on MG725 impact wrench and it would not remove the bolt.

The right 1/2" impact with sufficient air pressure will do the job.

 

[z28snksknr]

I'll just sum it up for you:

I bought Advance Auto Parts' best IR impact gun ($120). I was using a 2 gal Porter Cable compressor my friend let me borrow to to trim work with my finish nail gun. I put that gun on the hose that came with the compressor, cranked up the pressure regulator to 125 psi, put the gun on the bolt, squeezed the trigger, and in about 2 seconds, depleted the tank enough to make the compressor turn on. The bolt gave me the finger.

In summary, It was IR's cheapest gun, Home Depot's cheapest, smallest compressor, and apparently I was using that fantastic combination on the world's tightest bolt.

I need a "grown-up" compressor. As for the IR gun, i was going to return it but it's "heavy duty aluminum body" scratched from lightly touching the concrete, so its mine now, good or bad.

 

[Scotto]

This?

That, plus a 18" 1/2" breaker bar from HF, plus a 24" 1/2" HF breaker bar for the bolt, plus a 5' pipe to fit over the breaker bar is what worked for me. It was so tight I began with the pipe over my head and had pulled it down within 4" of the ground when it finally popped. Scary ****, lol. I was thoroughly impressed with the HF breaker bars.

 

[psychoclaw84]

The right 1/2" impact with sufficient air pressure will do the job.

Air compressor used is a Chicago Pneumatic (26 Gallon Tank) RCP-226VP with a Max Pressure: 130 PSI and 7.10 CFM @ 90 PSI.

The hose assembly is: 25 foot 3/8" Legacy Flexzilla Hose and Legacy ColorConnex Type D (industrial fittings) with a 1/4 in NPT.

Impact Wrench used, both 1/2": Mac Tools AW480Q & Snap On MG725.

The impact wrench instructions state to use at 90psi in operating mode. I used both at 90 psi and full open at 130 psi, the Impact wrench is getting enough air to work correctly.

What is sufficient air pressure? 130 plus???

 

[Marlin]

Air compressor used is a Chicago Pneumatic (26 Gallon Tank) RCP-226VP with a Max Pressure: 130 PSI and 7.10 CFM @ 90 PSI.

The hose assembly is: 25 foot 3/8" Legacy Flexzilla Hose and Legacy ColorConnex Type D (industrial fittings) with a 1/4 in NPT.

Impact Wrench used, both 1/2": Mac Tools AW480Q & Snap On MG725.

The impact wrench instructions state to use at 90psi in operating mode. I used both at 90 psi and full open at 130 psi, the Impact wrench is getting enough air to work correctly.

What is sufficient air pressure? 130 plus???

By sufficient air pressure I mean 90 psig at the inlet of the gun measured after the quick disconnect while the tool is running at free speed. With 25 ft of hose and 1/4" quick disconnects you are probably struggling to get 90 at the tool even with 130 at the source. I'm sure that some crank bolts are tougher than others, but I know most of the time a 2135TiMAX will take them off.

 

[fordbroncodave]

just took the crank bolt off a 99 honda accord the other day.

oxy acetylene and a impact wrench. they used lock tight on there

 

[volvo420coupe]

Lots of good info, and techniques, but as a Honda tech at 2 different dealers, I can say this.

Sometimes an impact gets them, sometimes it doesn't. The different techs I have worked with, and myself have found no relationships between different models and one being more difficult than the other. However, they do seem to get proportionately harder the older they get. (go figure, with the michigan rust)

My trusty 24" MIT breaker bar that served me well for 10 years bit the dust on a honda crank bolt.

 

[Backyard Mechanic]

Just did this job last night...Went back to the hand tools and found the magical geometry that would hold the crank holder on while I was JUMPING (200 lbs.) on the breaker bar handle while pulling myself down (holding the frame). The noise was so loud, my wife woke up from napping inside and came to check on me.

I apologize for replying to this post, but I just had to laugh at the imagery of the situation.

 

[Moose-LandTran]

Lots of good info, and techniques, but as a Honda tech at 2 different dealers, I can say this.

Sometimes an impact gets them, sometimes it doesn't. The different techs I have worked with, and myself have found no relationships between different models and one being more difficult than the other. However, they do seem to get proportionately harder the older they get. (go figure, with the michigan rust)

My trusty 24" MIT breaker bar that served me well for 10 years bit the dust on a honda crank bolt.

I asked a friend of mine about this, as i knew he'd done a couple of them. He told me after a couple tries with various impact guns, the pulley holder, breaker bars, cheater pipes etc.. He went to the diesel shop next door, grabbed a 1" impact off one of the guys there and with a big airline hooked up to two smaller ones it came right off. (It should, since those guns run up to 1,800lb/ft..)


Apparently you can also remove the starter and jam the flywheel with a screwdriver too?

 

[snorky18]

I asked a friend of mine about this, as i knew he'd done a couple of them. He told me after a couple tries with various impact guns, the pulley holder, breaker bars, cheater pipes etc.. He went to the diesel shop next door, grabbed a 1" impact off one of the guys there and with a big airline hooked up to two smaller ones it came right off. (It should, since those guns run up to 1,800lb/ft..)

I hand calculated that mine took about 1200 FT-LB. But an 1800 FT LBS gun. good gravy! At some point the whole car rotates around the gun, right

Apparently you can also remove the starter and jam the flywheel with a screwdriver too?

That's one option, the tool shown previously is another, but I did something else. It's been several years so it's a bit vague, but I believe I removed some small cover and was granted access to some area around the flywheel, and there where 3(?) small holes around the circumference of something, and I made a small steel rod of the proper diameter to go in the hole which kept the motor from rotating. I still have the steel rod in my box.

 

[superautobacs]

yeah, you can place a jammer (pry bar or screwdriver) after removing the starter or the service plate that covers the lower portion of the flywheel.

You can also get the fancy Moroso pulley holder:

or...

devise your own pulley holder by utilizing the many holes on the pulley inself, some bolts'nuts, and flat bar stock/angle iron:

 

[snorky18]

devise your own pulley holder by utilizing the many holes on the pulley inself, some bolts'nuts, and flat bar stock/angle iron:

Yeah, that may work OK, but personally, I don't want to be anywhere near it when you start cranking on it with an impact wrench.

 

[ManicMechanic]

I've done lots of honda timing belt replacements, always used a torch and my 1/2 impact. Heat around the bolt on the pully face, but get it hot fast before anything else gets too hot. I've never had a problem doing it this way

 

[gravygrabber]

I've been a Honda tech at the dealer level for 12+ yrs. and I've done 1000's of Honda t-belt jobs. The right impact gun makes a difference. I use a newer IR TI 1/2 gun and 98% of the crank bolts come off without a problem. No idea what pressure my shop is using but it's probably right at 120 psi.
We have the factory tool to hold all the different crank pulleys and I never use them. I find a little PB blaster on the bolt and a few smacks with a hammer (not enough to flatten the bolt head though) usually works it loose enough to get it with my gun. Sometimes in a hurry I just hit it with my gun and usually I don't have a problem. Hondas are very simple to work on. If you think replacing a Honda timing belt is hard you probably shouldn't work on cars. I watched a newbie guy that used to work in aerospace fight a lower timing cover once when he started working at our dealer. The guy was really a backyard mechanic and blamed Honda cars for being too complicated. I used to laugh at him watching him fight cars all the time. Some people just get too comfortable with old Chevy's or something I don't get it. The guy's first timing belt job he tried to use an electric impact gun on the crank bolt?!?

 

[volvo420coupe]

I've been a Honda tech at the dealer level for 12+ yrs. and I've done 1000's of Honda t-belt jobs. The right impact gun makes a difference. I use a newer IR TI 1/2 gun and 98% of the crank bolts come off without a problem. No idea what pressure my shop is using but it's probably right at 120 psi.
We have the factory tool to hold all the different crank pulleys and I never use them. I find a little PB blaster on the bolt and a few smacks with a hammer (not enough to flatten the bolt head though) usually works it loose enough to get it with my gun. Sometimes in a hurry I just hit it with my gun and usually I don't have a problem. Hondas are very simple to work on. If you think replacing a Honda timing belt is hard you probably shouldn't work on cars. I watched a newbie guy that used to work in aerospace fight a lower timing cover once when he started working at our dealer. The guy was really a backyard mechanic and blamed Honda cars for being too complicated. I used to laugh at him watching him fight cars all the time. Some people just get too comfortable with old Chevy's or something I don't get it. The guy's first timing belt job he tried to use an electric impact gun on the crank bolt?!?

What dealer do you work for?

I am not trying to defend idiots, but a rear wheel drive Volvo timing belt is simple, Honda's are moderate. After you do hundreds of anything it becomes simple to you. And I would never give anyone grief about fighting with those plastic covers, on some of the accords you have to tweak it just right, and if the little rubber gasket strip on the outside gets oily and wants to fall out then its really fun.

My favorite ones were the accord V6's, I think anyone named gravy grabber would probably agree.

 

[Backyard Mechanic]

...The guy was really a backyard mechanic and blamed Honda cars for being too complicated. I used to laugh at him watching him fight cars all the time.

Hey! I resemble that comment!

 

[ohmfab]

I love this forum. Man I wish I had seen this thread a week ago! As many timing belt jobs I've done I had never come across one as tight as the 01 Accord I worked. I tried the heat method, I bought a new impact gun. Nothing. No budge.

Then I noticed the pipe arm on my floor jack was 5 feet long. The car was an automatic so taking the lower access panel off allowed me to get to the flywheel. I used a 4 foot breaker bar on the flywheel teeth and wedged it to the ground to keep the crank from turning. I then put my breaker bar in from the top and then slid the jack's 5 foot pipe on the end and still had to put in a large amount of force to crack it loose. It did make a loud pop and I was then able to spin it off by hand.

I thought about using the starter early on but when I saw which way it turned the engine I was convinced that it would just tighten it more. I never thought that it would get jammed and transfer the energy the other way and crack it loose. Lesson learned. The next one will be easy.

Thanks for the tip!

 

[Beerman]

Did a Civic timing belt a few years back. In my drive-way. Crank bolt on it was a bear. Broke a SK 1/2 drive extension and C'man socket over the course of a week-end (2 of the 4 American made tools I EVER broken myself on a job). Outfit in town called "Mobile Mechanic". Gave them a call. They weren't mobile any more-guy said business got so good he rented a brick and motor location-just never changed the name of the business. I explained the situation and he asked where I lived. I told him and he called out to the techs in his shop if anyone was interested in helping me out. One guy was and I told him I'd give him $40 cash and all he had to do is break the bolt free. He comes that afternoon and spends a hour or so trying to get it free. Finally puts a 1/2 drive long handled Snappy ratchet on it, grabs the bumper of my car as it sits on the jack stands and uses his feet to break torque. I gave him his money and we drank a beer in my yard as he told me he thought he was going to make an easy $40. Said he was joking with it with the guys at the shop at lunch. I told him it was money well-spent on my end. .

 

[Michael owens]

Got it and it was a breeze I used a star wrench for taking off a tire one of the ends fits perfictly then I slid one end of it in a pipe 4 foot long and I spotted the other end of the star wrench with my floor jack to keep it stedy removed my coil pack wires and hit the key and it popped loselike it was nothing

 

[mark#3]

My honda has 300K+ miles on it, I've R&R the timing belt 2 times.I am doing it for the 3rd time.The 1st 2 times I put a wrench on the bolt, hit the starter, bolt came loose.This last time, it didn't, so I got a 3/4" breaker bar/socket/extenson manually pulled/kicked it, it came loose.I am slow in putting it together as it is winter, my desire to work outside in the cold is nil.Must be my age as I worked 35 years as a power lineman in very cold weather and now I just won't do it.It will be a wonder in remembering how to assembly together!!!
PS I will add also replace the bolt too

 

[richfinn]

I know this thread is over 10 years old and most of these engines are probably in junk yards by now!!!

You can buy special 1/2" drive impact sockets for this job now, they have an enormous amount of mass added to the socket by either making the wall of the socket really thick and heavy or in IRs case they added a heavy flywheel thing on the rear of the socket

It might help some poor soul in the future

I used to get a piece of rag and soak it in cold water and then push it inside the front crank pulley/damper to protect the rubber from getting too hot, then I would hit the bolt with the Oxy/Acetylene torch and get it hot and zip the bolt out with the impact wrench and quickly throw the pulley in the bucket of water.

This always worked and I never had a pulley fail after a belt replacement

 

[joe_pinehill1]

I just did my Subaru timing belt, and the crank came off with a breaker bar and holding tool. Here's a video of you might like.

 

[Eric29]

There are a surprising number of these cars still on the road. My brother still drives one and I see others driving around; so thanks for your suggestions.

I know this thread is over 10 years old and most of these engines are probably in junk yards by now!!!

You can buy special 1/2" drive impact sockets for this job now, they have an enormous amount of mass added to the socket by either making the wall of the socket really thick and heavy or in IRs case they added a heavy flywheel thing on the rear of the socket

It might help some poor soul in the future

I used to get a piece of rag and soak it in cold water and then push it inside the front crank pulley/damper to protect the rubber from getting too hot, then I would hit the bolt with the Oxy/Acetylene torch and get it hot and zip the bolt out with the impact wrench and quickly throw the pulley in the bucket of water.

This always worked and I never had a pulley fail after a belt replacement

 

[driftpin]

I used-to do much of my work on cars, but my wife said, "we make $ now, let someone-else get dirty." She had an Acura Integra GS-R she used to get serviced at a Miami FL area Honda dealer, so when we bought a used '94 Accord 5-speed from the original owner, and it needed the timing belt/seals/H2O pump changed, I took it to the Honda dealer she had used previously.

The job was done, and we had a happy family event, our son graduated from U of Florida law school in Tampa, so we loaded up my elderly in-laws and travelled from Miami to Gainesville FL for the commencement.

On very-busy Archer Rd in Gainesville, the not-torqued-down crank pulley bolt finally backed-out and fell-off, leaving us with a dead car on a sweltering summer afternoon, and two elderly relatives soon overheated. (it had been about 500 miles since the dealership timing belt replacement. I had the car towed to a Firestone auto repair shop to have them try to fix it, but they couldn't do anything then. I rented a car and we got back to south Florida.

That was the start of a 2 month debacle of botched repairs by two Honda dealers, before the cylinder head was replaced, I kept all the receipts, it was over $7,000 total for the work on a car that was worth maybe $3500 (this was years-ago). I had asked the Honda dealer who had botched the original repairs to give me a decent trade-in value on the car and we would buy a used car from them, they refused. The last time they fixed the car (new cyl head), I immediately sold it. We bought a 59K miles Camry w/the 3 liter V6. It now has about 260,000 miles on it, and no issues.

The dealer in Miami also sells Rolls-Royce, AUDI, Bugatti, Bentley, and BMW. I was told they fired the tech who failed to torque the crank bolt properly. FYI, something to check if you have someone-else do your work.

 

[jacked_72]

Got it and it was a breeze I used a star wrench for taking off a tire one of the ends fits perfictly then I slid one end of it in a pipe 4 foot long and I spotted the other end of the star wrench with my floor jack to keep it stedy removed my coil pack wires and hit the key and it popped loselike it was nothing

First post in response to an 11 year old thread! Love it!

 

[jgromada]

i had to do this on my wife's Sonata (V-6). i only had a corded HF impact and it definitely didn't work. I eventually got it off by keeping harmonic balancer fixed by wedging a wrench between the harmonic balancer (has open sprocket) and the control arm. I then used a 1/2 breaker bar with a 5 ft pipe over the bar. LOTS of leverage. Got it off.

 

[fsae0607]

This reminds me of when my dad and I did the timing belt on our '91 Accord. Of course, our 1/2 inch impact couldn't do it. My dad brought his 3/4" impact home from work (diesel mechanic) and we had full compressor pressure (135 psi) to the gun. Took it off in three blows from the impact.

 

[hoo rider]

I did the timing belt on my accord (v6) myself, and had to use the starter method to get it off. Some 4 years and 50,000 miles later the same starter is just fine.

 

[Eric29]

People always say to use the search function. I love these old threads.

First post in response to an 11 year old thread! Love it!