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How clean does concrete need to be for epoxy?

Homerr

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I'm going to do my garage floor this summer, but in the meantime my basement flooded. I figured I'd epoxy it. And then I'll know what to expect for my garage.

I removed all the vinyl tiles and the black 1950's glue residue is there. I've been using a Diamabrush Coating Removal Tool from Home Depot. I went over these areas 3 times to get it this clean. Here's a pic showing an area of before and after, but showing some areas of residue left in the 'after' area:

20170304_144007.jpg


Do I need to get rid of 100% of the black glue?

Will the HD Concrete Prep Tool take care of the rest?
http://www.homedepot.com/c/floor_care_and_refinishing_equipment_rental#coating-removal

I have the Rustoelum Epoxyshield Professional 2-part epoxy to put on the floor when the prep is done.
 
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theoldwizard1

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Diamabrush is the best tool. Don't worry about the little bit of "cutback" adhesive that is left. I used Sentinel 747 (also available at HD) adhesive remover (the ONLY remover that will cut that stuff) and had more black stains left than you do !

Do the acid treatment and apply the epoxy. I used the Rustoleum product in a laundry room after a flood loosened most of the tile. It worked well. You need to decide ahead of time if your are going to apply the "chips". Follow he directions.
 
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Homerr

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Thanks for the replies! My wife and I don't like the chips so we're going to skip that part.

I'll spend this weekend finishing using the Diamabrush Coating Removal Tool and then over everything with the Concrete Prep Tool and if anything is left I'll try the Sentinel 747.

Yes, I have the Rustoleum product for filling the crack and the acid etch. I also got the anti-skid granules. There seem to be varying thoughts about mixing it or broadcasting it after rolling on the epoxy. I'm leaning toward mixing it in. This is a basement and I don't want the floor feeling too 'sandpapery', just have some slight texture to it.
 

James-W

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You may want to reconsider the chips. I have no experience in doing an epoxy floor, but from reading about it I have learned that the chips can "hide" minor imperfections and thereby make the floor look nicer. Of course, if you take your time and do a perfect job, you won't have any imperfections and it won't matter.
 

theoldwizard1

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I'll spend this weekend finishing using the Diamabrush Coating Removal Tool and then over everything with the Concrete Prep Tool and if anything is left I'll try the Sentinel 747.
Probably not required. Your floor looks better than the one I did. Make sure to do the acid etch.

I also got the anti-skid granules. There seem to be varying thoughts about mixing it or broadcasting it after rolling on the epoxy. I'm leaning toward mixing it in. This is a basement and I don't want the floor feeling too 'sandpapery', just have some slight texture to it.
The chips give you a small amount of texture without feeling too chunky. I was hesitant about the look but it turned nice (the wife did the sprinkling; She good a sprinkling cookies also !)
 
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Homerr

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I thought I'd give an update with the prep of 1,100 sf in my basement. I'll add a little more info and pics of the whole process so far in this post. It had 12"x12" vinyl tiles that were coming up after we had an overflow in the basement. House was built in 1955 and tiles were set with black hard tar type glue.

I used the HD Coating Removal Tool, probably about 20 hours of this. I used water in a sprayer to get things started. The first room I used a lot of water and it was like smearing doggie doo everywhere. Here's a pic after a lot of cleanup. I had to hose out the shop vac it was so bad. The hose only had about a 3/4" hole down the middle of it, the rest was gunked up.
20170304_112031.jpg


After that, just wet, not soaking to start and a quick spritz before the next pass and no water on the final pass, and that worked really well. The black gunk would 'booger up' and about 3 passes would get to fairly clean. Successive shots showing the 'boogering' with less water to start and then dry getting to dust.
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So I rented the HD Concrete Prep Tool to clean up some of the scunge still left, maybe 12 hours with this tool. This worked sort of so-so. While it did take off another level and smoothed some of the previous tools swirl marks it still left a lot of discreet gunky areas:
20170514_065058.jpg


And the edges and corners were still to be done. This took about 20 hours of fairly intense work (4 rooms, 3 closets, hall, powder room).

Here's is the winning formula for edges, corners, and spots the other two grinders weren't able to get: I used a 4.5" Milwaukee angle grinder, dust shroud, adapter hose to shop vac, Dust Deputy, and a DEWALT DW4774 diamond cup grinding wheel.
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I'd venture that the brand of the grinder, dust shroud, and diamond cup grinding wheel aren't all that important. I got the Milwaukee brand shroud and it's the same thing as the pic above, just black plastic instead. The diamond cup wheels are $30-80 and most places sell them. These wheels are pretty awesome and I think everyone should own one! Only negligible wear on the wheel even after all this work. Make sure your grinder has a spot to put the handle on the 'top', i.e. vertical when grinding the floor. It makes life much easier to keep the wheel flat on the floor.

Here's an example of edging where I started, the edging is right up to the sheetrock. The gouges can be seen, the diamond cup wheel is pretty aggressive and it is important to keep it flat on the floor! After this I got better with it. It is really tiring to use, but the payoff is worth it.
20170514_065207.jpg



So the shroud - 99% of the dust is captured, it works! Use this even if you are in a 'dirty' area just so you can see. The way the shroud part that is removable for edging works on the the grinder means that corners are left with a bit of unground area. After I had done everything else I put the stock Milwaukee shroud on with the diamond cup wheel so I could get the corners and around door jambs a bit better. This worked well, but just 2-3 seconds and there was a giant dust plume. I even had the shop vac running with the hose just a couple of inches away. Didn't matter. Really showed how well the dust shroud worked.

20170514_065231.jpg

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Props to the Dust Deputy as well, it was capturing about 75% of the fine concrete dust before it got to the shop vac.


In hindsight, I think a better order would have been:
1. Coating Removal Tool
2. Edging, corners, and larger swatches in field with angle grinder
3. Concrete Prep Tool
4. Use angle grinder to clean up any areas in the field.

This would allow the Concrete Prep Tool to work down most of the angle grinder marks.

And one last note - I had a 4.5" grinder so that's what I used. I would have been tempted to go 7" if I would have had to buy one. But I'm glad I had the 4.5" one, it was able to get in a lot of tight areas a larger one would have had trouble with (behind the toilet flange and under the toilet water supply, for example). If you only have a larger area with no obstructions a 7" grinder would work great.
 
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Homerr

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p.s. I did get some Rustoleum acid etch but won't be using it on this project as LegacyIndustrial noted. I'm cleaning up the dust today. This will probably take a few moppings to get all of it up. Then drying and epoxy. I'll post some more pics when it is done.
 
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Garage Flooring

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I read through this real quick. May be I missed something. Have you done a moisture test? If not, please STOP and get one done... This is essential for basements.
 

FJ4FUN

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Looking good!

Justin brings up a great point, make sure to test for moisture before applying one drop of any coating!

Also, I prefer an Edco type diamond grinder for picking up mastic/coatings as it probably would've saved you some time. Of course, it's also considerably heavier and loading it into and out of the basement may introduce additional challenges....





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Homerr

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I did do the moisture test a couple of months ago, bone dry.

Last weekend I did apply the epoxy to half the basement.

To answer the title of this thread - here's generally how clean I had gotten the concrete before application. A little schmutz here and there in low divots in the slab.
2017-05-14%2015.07.39%20(Small).jpg


First room done:
2017-05-14%2019.21.15%20(Small).jpg



I have the other half to do and am going to touch up some thin spots when I do that. I did have a work light as it was getting dark toward the end, but I still couldn't see those areas with thin coverage.

I had turned off the furnace and taped the ducts to the upstairs. But the fumes had really permeated the house. I put a fan in a basement window blowing outward and the house was okay in about 15 minutes, I should have done this before starting! I kept the basement cocooned for 36 hours and the fan going and then it smelled like it had 99% cleared.

The finish is good overall, but I do have a few spots where the gray finish looks a bit cloudy, or maybe slightly chalky. There isn't anything to wipe off, it is embedded. I'm wondering it it was a mixing issue. I did use a mixing bit in a drill and followed all the directions. I'll add a pic.
 
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Homerr

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Here is the spot I mentioned. There is one other spot in a closet about half this size too.

20170522_172815.jpg


I'll go over this area again when I do the other half.
 
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Homerr

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Just another update - the 'just the floor' has become a refresh of everything in the basement. But it is looking really nice.

I did do a second coat of epoxy everywhere and I'm glad I did. It cleared up everything and met expectations. I got a coil of rubber base and installed it in a day. The trim, painting doors, new toilet, and fixing fiddly little things have taken a fair amount of time.

The products I've used are Rustoleum Epoxyshield Professional 203373 Silver Gray and Roppe 700 series rubber base (much better than the vinyl stuff imo), color 175 Slate. The colors in the pics I have here make the grays look slightly brownish, but it's the crummy lights I have - another project! In reality the match in tone is okay and they are both neutral gray colors.

20170606_170625.jpg


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