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How did you wire your shop for easy mod's

mebedave

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Atlantic county area, New Jersey USA
How did you wire your shop so you have flexibility to modify/add outlets,lights,switches later ? 120v outlets are easy, just wire the first time with lots of them, but still show off how you did it anyways for possible additions. My dilemma is the 220-230-240 v outlets.Show off how you did it. PICTURES PICTURES PLEASE!!!!
 
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Thruxton

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Virginia
OK, no pics yet - I've just finished sheetrock and lighting and wiring is next. It will all be surface mount (EMT) because I think a) it's more flexible, and I wanted to get everything in the way of cabinets and benches in place before I decided where to put outlets; b) it's safer, no worries about nails or screws hitting wiring; and c) i like the looks of it in a shop. I'm hooking up the panel next week so I'll start putting in outlets then. One of the things I'm thinking about is using blue painter's tape on the walls to plan the layout- there is some dust collector and airline piping to work around/over, and I want to make sure I do it the easiest way. As you can tell, I'm a bit of a planning freak. Maybe I'll get some blue tape up today and get a pic to give you an idea of what I'm talking about (and I'm way overdue on an update to my thread, anyway). I know this wasn't too helpful, but it's just a topic currently on my mind.
 

trbomax

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starvation lake,mi.
120 in the walls,240 in pipe on the surface. To simplify it for later expansion,I ran out of the flush panel to a 100a surface panel (as a sub panel). All the 240 is tapped there.

edit) since the 240v sub panel is 4 wire,I CAN if I have to, add 120v surface fixtures to it as well.
 

colt340

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illinois
I ran everything on the surface. I can access any of it at anytime.
DSCF0065.jpg

DSCF0062.jpg

DSCF0064.jpg
 

kbs2244

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Surface mount.
3/4 or even 1 inch EMT and the deepest boxs available.
It gives you room to pull more wire later.
 

Falcon67

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Merkel, TX
I plan to build a cable run across the joists from the panel on that side of the shop. Runs can turn off that and run down the side of a joist. For 240V runs, those will be point-to-point because those machines typically don't move. #10 is too expensive right now to allow much flexibility. Everything 240v that I run now uses #12 except for the heater.

For plug drops, I'll probably do a mix like I did in the old shop. I had one outlet box at the end of a circuit run for a section of wall real estate. That flush (in wall) box got an metal extension box on top of it and conduit runs from there to other outlets surface mounted on the wall - typically quads. Easy to add more to the end or just take the whole thing off the wall and do something different. Drops in some areas may be a surface mount conduit drop out of the ceiling. These would likely be a small stand alone bench or 110V machine. If that item moved, it would be easy to pull back the wire and move the outlet(s), leaving only a small 1" hole to patch in the ceiling. I'd use 3/4 EMT with a plastic bushing in the top for those drops.

Light circuits will be run to 4" boxes located between the fixture runs, with MN cable looped from the 4" box to the fixture(s). Fixture mounting will be layed out well ahead of time so I can build in mounting surfaces to leave behind the drywall.
 
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Charles (in GA)

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50 mi south of Atlanta
Surface mount your panel and build a chase with removable front covers over it, or recess in the wall, again with removable front covers, makes it easy to add to the panel.

Charles
 

sberry

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Yup, no better way to do it. In some sense you don't have to do it all at once. Kind of design and build, if you don't like it, change the thing, some changes involve only few minutes. As always there is some advantage to pre planning, ideal to get the service in where its convenient and large loads are near it if possible.
Often as needed a few ft of pipe, wire box and breaker and new equipment can have a home. I still move the occasional thing. Built some shelves a while back and tailor the wiring for convenience when they were finished. Took the devices out of existing box, made in to jbox with blank cover, added a pipe and new box, relocate the outlets and switches where they sposed to be. Most of it was pretty good, move 2 or 3 things.
 
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larry_g

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oregon
If you look at post 29 in my build thread you can see hoe I built a chase along the top of the wall to run wireing. It is about 1 1/2" deep and will soon have a cover over it. I placed the panel in the interior dividing wall and the stud bay that it is in has a removable wall section so that I have full access to the bay and the chase above.

lg
no neat sig line
 

ForceFed70

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BC, Canada
I've just finished the rough-in wiring for my shop and I did 2 things to improve flexibility.

- I placed removeable panels instead of drywall above my electrical panel. This way if I want to add a circuit, I can run it up into the attic and through my garage. I'd still have to do something to bring it down (probably surface mount).

- For 240V I did something unique. I used 20A circuits for my plugs and each plug is a split-recepticle. (top plug is on a different phase and circuit from thg bottom plug). Every 2nd plug box I installed a double box. One side will be used for the split recepticle, the other side will be a 240V 20A plug. This will allow my to install 240V equipment (20A or less however) at pretty much any spot in my garage.

I also put in 30A 240V welder plugs every 20', a 240V 50A range plug, a 30A 240/120V RV plug/circuit, and a dedicated 30A 240V compressor circuit. So I tired to really cover my bases with regard to 240V plugs.
 

rwreuter

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Feb 21, 2011
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Mulvane, Kansas
First....

1. sub panel in garage

2. pvc from basement to attic (future circuits)

3. 2 20amp circuits in garage (15 outlets)

4. 1 30amp 220v in garage for air compressor

5. all walls in garage have 4x8 sheets of plywood (easy access to add or move)

6. 1 20amp 220v circuit for space heater
 

sberry

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Houses have spacing dictated by codes, garages don't always work out that way, seems the place you had envisioned something isn't the way it turns out. I kind of worked on a traffic flow chart and there were things from previous buildings and shops that I knew I wanted. People put office in the back out of the way, mine with public bathroom is right off the entrance. I put utility sink backed up to bathroom sink on shop side. Its really natural moves to go where a human goes, ergonomic foot traffic. Its super easy to wash up as you go one place to another, phones, etc, desk, notes.
 

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sberry

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Houses have spacing dictated by codes, garages don't always work out that way, seems the place you had envisioned something isn't the way it turns out. I kind of worked on a traffic flow chart and there were things from previous buildings and shops that I knew I wanted. People put office in the back out of the way, mine with public bathroom is right off the entrance. I put utility sink backed up to bathroom sink on shop side. Its really natural moves to go where a human goes, ergonomic foot traffic. Its super easy to wash up as you go one place to another, phones, etc, desk, notes.
These pics are old, there have been changes but the locations were great. In the summer the side door is open, can come from both directions.. Only reason I have a switch for light on entrance is other people. Dont have a light switch entering my office, have 13 watt lamp that burns 24/7, got a couple of those, can walk in, get coffee, sit here minute never touch a switch or reach task lights if needed.
As nights become longer and I need to heat I turn on additional 9 watts hanging over stove , for about 25 watts I can see aorund till I get to specific lights.
 

5lima30

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Mountains of Western NC
I put outlets every 4 feet in my garage on multiple circuits. (I try to avoid extension cords.) I put a dedicated circuit for my air compressor. I also ran 240v outlests for a welder and a heater. I also ran a separate circuit in the attic for future ceiling outlets and an attic fan.
 

PCO6

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Dec 25, 2008
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Newmarket, Ontario
I have a 2' wide plywood panel traversing my ceiling that I attached my elctrical and air lines to. Here is an "in progress" shot of it ...

DSC_0099.jpg
 

bluesman2a

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Aug 16, 2005
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Atlanta, Ga.
I have 15' walls. When I laid out my electrical, I put all my boxes 52" off the floor. That puts it above the level of a 48" sheet of plywood/steel. That also gives me some room to put a "chair rail" up later if I want some finish work. I also have NO electrical below 52" so it's easy to avoid it in the wall. When I sheathed the interior walls I went with one 48" sheet laid down, and one standing tall up top. This left me a "chase" I put all my electrical into. The top/bottom sheets are nailed in. The middle chase is screwed in so I can remove it later if I need to.

DSCF0466.jpg


This is in a lower ceiling'd section, but same idea. The "chase" is painted grey.
DSCF0496.jpg


In my machine-shop, I had to deal with an odd multiple 2X12 header that would have been a ***** to drill through and weakened things considerably. Did the same panel/chase on the lower section of the wall, then up top built a bulkhead out of 2X3 to run the chase along. This keeps everything OFF the walls, but keeps key components accessible.

DSCF1131.jpg
 
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gumbudah

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Northern Wisconsin
I have good attic access, so wires can go anywhere around garage. I'm also building in a shelf around 2 sides of garage. This will have a wire chase in it. Should be covered!
 

mtne

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Denver
- For 240V I did something unique. I used 20A circuits for my plugs and each plug is a split-recepticle. (top plug is on a different phase and circuit from thg bottom plug). Every 2nd plug box I installed a double box. One side will be used for the split recepticle, the other side will be a 240V 20A plug. This will allow my to install 240V equipment (20A or less however) at pretty much any spot in my garage.

I'm curious how you protected these? Single pole 20A breakers or Double pole 20A? Are they multiwire branch sharing a neutral, or does each circuit have it's own neutral?
 

rwreuter

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Mulvane, Kansas
ForceFed70,

i can say that is an interesting way of doing it...but as mtne said, i am a little curious as to you have protected yourself......i guess if you placed a 2 pull 20amp GFCI breaker....

not sure how that would work.....hmm....gives me a headache even thinking about it....
 

ForceFed70

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I'm curious how you protected these? Single pole 20A breakers or Double pole 20A? Are they multiwire branch sharing a neutral, or does each circuit have it's own neutral?

Standard 2 pole 20A breakers.

It's a shared neutral using 12/3 romex so must use 2 pole breaker or ties between breakers so that both phases are cut if a breaker trips.
 

ForceFed70

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ForceFed70,

i can say that is an interesting way of doing it...but as mtne said, i am a little curious as to you have protected yourself......i guess if you placed a 2 pull 20amp GFCI breaker....

not sure how that would work.....hmm....gives me a headache even thinking about it....

It's pretty basic. Just use 12/3 wire and a 2 pole breaker so that both phases are cut if one of the phases is overloaded. No need for GFI as it's perfectly safe.

It's pretty much the same as what current code requires for kitchen plugs in new construction. Except I added a 240V plug to every 2nd outlet.
 

rwreuter

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Mulvane, Kansas
if it is in the garage and you don't have the 120v on a GFCI it is not to code. GFCI's are required in the garage...there are some exclusions, but this isn't one of them.
 

BigJohn20

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Sep 4, 2011
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if it is in the garage and you don't have the 120v on a GFCI it is not to code. GFCI's are required in the garage...there are some exclusions, but this isn't one of them.

Would being in Canada be one of the exclusions? ;)
 

rwreuter

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Mulvane, Kansas
well...........the NEC governs the US as far as i know......does Canada use GFCI's?

there are 4 places that GFCI's are required (others if certain conditions exist)

Bathrooms
Kitchens
Garage
Outdoors
 

Norcal

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well...........the NEC governs the US as far as i know......does Canada use GFCI's?

there are 4 places that GFCI's are required (others if certain conditions exist)

Bathrooms
Kitchens
Garage
Outdoors

And where GFCI's are not required in residential, AFCI's are.............
 

rwreuter

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Mulvane, Kansas
And where GFCI's are not required in residential, AFCI's are.............

close but not entirely true.......lighting circuits don't require them...general rule outlets that run through bedrooms and such require them.

personally, if you ask me (and no one did) i think those AFCI's are retarded, dumb, moronic....did i say stupid.....a waste of money entirely.

i built my house and refused to put them in....along with those new retarded tamper proof duplex receptacles.....someone is bribing the NEC committees to keep adding this trash to residential houses. the benefit is minor compared to the cost....did i say MINOR.

ok, i will get off of my soap box.....just hit a nerve there.
 

mtne

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Denver
close but not entirely true.......lighting circuits don't require them...general rule outlets that run through bedrooms and such require them.

personally, if you ask me (and no one did) i think those AFCI's are retarded, dumb, moronic....did i say stupid.....a waste of money entirely.

i built my house and refused to put them in....along with those new retarded tamper proof duplex receptacles.....someone is bribing the NEC committees to keep adding this trash to residential houses. the benefit is minor compared to the cost....did i say MINOR.

ok, i will get off of my soap box.....just hit a nerve there.

While I agree with how you feel about AFCI and tamper proof stuff your wrong on where they're required. That was the case in 08' but now..........

NEC11' - 210.12(A) says all outlets in a dwelling need AFCI, article 100 definitions, defines an outlet as "a point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment" which is basically anything.

So anything inside needs AFCI, unless it's only supplying devices that require GFCI. And as much as I like GFCI I only use the AFCI's for receptical circuits unless I have to...... I think it's silly for lighting and fire alarm. OH, I'd put them in if they didn't cost 10X more than a regular breaker, and they cured all the nuisance tripping.

My friend just got dinged on not having AFCI on his lighting and FA. That's a serious WTF having your life safety circuit on arcfault. :confused::headscrat:wtf:
 

ForceFed70

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if it is in the garage and you don't have the 120v on a GFCI it is not to code. GFCI's are required in the garage...there are some exclusions, but this isn't one of them.

My inspector told me that only the outside plugs need to be GFCI protected.

It's a detached garage if that makes a difference.

Being in Canada we do have some code differences. I think our code is set to be inline with the NEC, but is a little different. Especially when it comes to recent changes to the NEC... takes a few more years before our local code is updated to match.

AFCI is a good example. Right now, the only place it's required in our code is in bedrooms.

Regardless, you could do the same thing just use a GFCI breaker. Not sure if they make a GFCI split recepticle, it would be another option if they do.
 
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mebedave

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Atlantic county area, New Jersey USA
How did you wire your shop so you have flexibility to modify/add outlets,lights,switches later ? 120v outlets are easy, just wire the first time with lots of them, but still show off how you did it anyways for possible additions. My dilemma is the 220-230-240 v outlets.Show off how you did it. PICTURES PICTURES PLEASE!!!!
 
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mebedave

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Atlantic county area, New Jersey USA
I have 15' walls. When I laid out my electrical, I put all my boxes 52" off the floor. That puts it above the level of a 48" sheet of plywood/steel. That also gives me some room to put a "chair rail" up later if I want some finish work. I also have NO electrical below 52" so it's easy to avoid it in the wall. When I sheathed the interior walls I went with one 48" sheet laid down, and one standing tall up top. This left me a "chase" I put all my electrical into. The top/bottom sheets are nailed in. The middle chase is screwed in so I can remove it later if I need to.

DSCF0466.jpg


This is in a lower ceiling'd section, but same idea. The "chase" is painted grey.
DSCF0496.jpg


In my machine-shop, I had to deal with an odd multiple 2X12 header that would have been a ***** to drill through and weakened things considerably. Did the same panel/chase on the lower section of the wall, then up top built a bulkhead out of 2X3 to run the chase along. This keeps everything OFF the walls, but keeps key components accessible.

DSCF1131.jpg

Bluesman Nice shop!! I think I will highjack your idea with the chase in the wall. I do have attic but its going to have r60 blow in insulation and it will very hard to make mod's from up there,besides one must still some how fish wires down the 12' wall. So your chase idea seems to be the way I go. I'll have all wall outlets just a few inches above the chase to make it easy to add or modify. If I need power up near the ceiling on the wall that could be more of a challenge with vapor barrier and insulation in the way. Most the mod's I think will be down low bench height for 220v outlets. I like to go to auctions and buy tools and power machinery, lots of times the machinery is 220v, so I need an easy way to add 220v. thanks :beer:
 
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MN4x4

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Minnesnowta
Years ago when copper prices weren't SOooo insane, I wired my shop with all 10/3 wire. I placed boxes at about 48" off the floor, and 6' apart all the way around the walls. I ran them home-run style, i.e. the wire from every box goes back to the breaker panel.

In the panel I can simply choose a breaker and connect any box for either 240 volts /30 amps or 120 volts /20 amps. (I could also connect it for 120 volts /30 amps if I wanted, but I've never done that). If I move machines around and need to change the voltage at a particular box, I pop off the breaker panel cover, remove the old breaker(s), install the new breaker(s), swap out the receptacle at the wall box, and turn the breaker back on when I'm done. I keep spare receptacles and covers around so I don't have to run to the hardware store. Usually does't take me more than 20-30 minutes to change a box from dual 120 volt outlets to a single 240/30 amp receptacle, or vice-versa.

I have been very happy with this arrangement for 20 years, and would do it again without hesitation - unless I had a heart attack at the price of copper now!
 
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mebedave

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Atlantic county area, New Jersey USA
Years ago when copper prices weren't SOooo insane, I wired my shop with all 10/3 wire. I placed boxes at about 48" off the floor, and 6' apart all the way around the walls. I ran them home-run style, i.e. the wire from every box goes back to the breaker panel.

In the panel I can simply choose a breaker and connect any box for either 240 volts /30 amps or 120 volts /20 amps. (I could also connect it for 120 volts /30 amps if I wanted, but I've never done that). If I move machines around and need to change the voltage at a particular box, I pop off the breaker panel cover, remove the old breaker(s), install the new breaker(s), swap out the receptacle at the wall box, and turn the breaker back on when I'm done. I keep spare receptacles and covers around so I don't have to run to the hardware store. Usually does't take me more than 20-30 minutes to change a box from dual 120 volt outlets to a single 240/30 amp receptacle, or vice-versa.

I have been very happy with this arrangement for 20 years, and would do it again without hesitation - unless I had a heart attack at the price of copper now!


Hmmm Very smart way to do it !! I may highjack your idea for some outlets
 

bluesman2a

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Atlanta, Ga.
Bluesman Nice shop!! I think I will highjack your idea with the chase in the wall. I do have attic but its going to have r60 blow in insulation and it will very hard to make mod's from up there,besides one must still some how fish wires down the 12' wall. So your chase idea seems to be the way I go. I'll have all wall outlets just a few inches above the chase to make it easy to add or modify. If I need power up near the ceiling on the wall that could be more of a challenge with vapor barrier and insulation in the way. Most the mod's I think will be down low bench height for 220v outlets. I like to go to auctions and buy tools and power machinery, lots of times the machinery is 220v, so I need an easy way to add 220v. thanks :beer:

Thanks for the kind words mebedave, I think this will serve you well. Two other points here:
1) you WILL get sick of cutting outlet holes in your wall/chase panels. I FINALLY cut my last one for the downstairs shop this weekend. Locating them properly and tight so there are no gaps on your faceplates can be a HUGE PITA.

2) on some of the key junctions, I dropped in larger 6X6 or 8X8 NEMA indoor enclosures, so I had more room to make splices for things like a 3-way junction for 6 or 8 gauge welding outlets.

Years ago when copper prices weren't SOooo insane, I wired my shop with all 10/3 wire. I placed boxes at about 48" off the floor, and 6' apart all the way around the walls. I ran them home-run style, i.e. the wire from every box goes back to the breaker panel.
<snip>
I have been very happy with this arrangement for 20 years, and would do it again without hesitation - unless I had a heart attack at the price of copper now!

You, sir are a WISE man. I started out this way, but just didn't go far enough. Many of my outlets are home-runs, but that stopped as I got further from the panel, and I didn't even THINK of going 10-3 until you mentioned it here, that's an AWESOME solution (if you can afford it these days).
 

DoyleDee

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Jun 17, 2007
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North Texas
I ran metal conduit in my shop with 4x boxes at each rafter (6 rafters in my pole building) with mc cable to each outlet-also 1 per pole. I have 2 circuits of 10 guage for my runs (1 side has 6 outlets and the other has 5). I have a run on the east wall with 2 quad boxes (which I will add one more quad to) on another seperate circuit. I have my compressor (220- which is not completed yet) also in metal conduit on its own run that I will also add 1 outlet to- possible stick welder- who knows..
I have a seperate circuit for my exhaust fan (whole house fan mounted in the high west eave) and one for my a/c unit or heater.
Since I used metal conduit and alot of 4x boxes I have plenty of room for additional recepticals.
 
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