How long should it take compressor to fill?

[Compact]

I just acquired and installed this unit:

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200455338_200455338

I have never owned an air compressor before, and thus I am apprehensive about operating it for the first time. How long should it take to fill and shut down? The manual that came with it is pretty useless on this matter. In fact, it doesn't even specify at what point the shutdown should happen. I assume it would shut down at its "max psi" which is 150. I just ran it from empty up to about 110psi, but it seemed to take awhile. I should have timed it. Anyhow, how long should I let it run for?

In the meantime, after cutting the power at 110 its holding steady there, so I don't think I have any leaks.

Thanks guys- I promise eventually I will get a clue. I'm trying.

PS. In other news the lighting is installed, and its quite impressive.

 

[tonydanzah]

pretty quick to 90psi then slow from there

 

[Compact]

Yeah, it didn't seem to take too long for the lower stuff. I guess I just don't know what normal is. If it is at 125 right now, how long should it take to get to 150. 5 minutes, or 20 minutes? I need to be sure the shutoff valve thingy works, but I get concerned about the pressures involved.

 

[larry_g]

Most single stage compressors operate at a max of 125 psi as beyond that the compressor is not capable of efficient operation. I would let it run to shutoff could be better than 5 minutes but not much more. If it gets above 10 minutes and is hung at 135-140 psi then your not going any further. Let it cool and try again. Just like any piston/cylinder it is going to have to break in.

If it were mine I would back off the pressure switch to 110-115 psi cutoff. If you want to get **** about this plot a time to pressure graph and you'll see that it will almost level out at 125. If you extraploate out to 150 you'll find you may never make it.

lg
no neaqt sig line

 

[Compact]

Thanks Larry- I put it back on and it got to 125, but its been hung up there for about 10 minutes now. So let me ask this- if while it is running, I slowly move that red lever (the cutoff switch) will it shut down on at that level?

I notice that in my very useless manual, it states not to mess with this switch, but I assume that this is to prevent people from trying to get MORE than the max PSI out of the machine. I assume I would be ok to move it in a direction that made it shut down at 125psi, right?

So lets say the compressor never gets above 125. Did I get a bad unit, or is it typical for them to not reach their stated max level?

 

[larry_g]

Thanks Larry- I put it back on and it got to 125, but its been hung up there for about 10 minutes now. So let me ask this- if while it is running, I slowly move that red lever (the cutoff switch) will it shut down on at that level?

I notice that in my very useless manual, it states not to mess with this switch, but I assume that this is to prevent people from trying to get MORE than the max PSI out of the machine. I assume I would be ok to move it in a direction that made it shut down at 125psi, right?

So lets say the compressor never gets above 125. Did I get a bad unit, or is it typical for them to not reach their stated max level?

Moving the red lever will shut down the pump but have nothing to do with the automatic cutoff. To adjust the cutoff you have to open the pressure switch and back off the adjustment screw if it can be. Some pressure switches are not easily adjustable.

I believe that if you really read the fine print you'll fine the tank is rated for 150, and not the compressor. Like I said in opening of first post most single stage pumps will max out at just above 125.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Compact]

Thanks. ***** that it didn't come properly set then. So can I actually move the adjustment screw while the unit is running to get the cutoff point right?

 

[Skin]

do not mess with the pressure switch while its getting power. There are live leads in it.

Unplug it, back the screw off a turn or two, turn it back on. Wash rinse repeat until you get to the desired pressure.

For what its worth it wont blow up in your face so stop worrying. It has relief valves for a reason and i'd be willing to bet the pump wouldnt be able to generate enough pressure to cause the tank to fail in any normal amount of time [e.g. the point where you go "its been okay its been running for 45 minutes... what the hell?]. Should take about 5 minutes to fill to 125-135psi.

I believe that if you really read the fine print you'll fine the tank is rated for 150, and not the compressor. Like I said in opening of first post most single stage pumps will max out at just above 125.

lg
no neat sig line

i've never seen a compresser using the max tank PSI as the advert for the capabilties of the unit. Its always by the capabilities of the pump. Though it may take a bit longer 150psi is well within the realm of possabilities for a single stage 2 cyl 2hp unit. Hell most crappy direct drive electrics are 125-135. The silver tag to the bottom left of the pump will state with absolute certainty though.

 

[ishiboo]

Thanks. ***** that it didn't come properly set then. So can I actually move the adjustment screw while the unit is running to get the cutoff point right?

You're over-thinking this. Plug it in and turn it on. When it's full, it will shut off. If there's something wrong and it builds too much pressure, the release will pop off and there's no harm done.

They're automatic, no need to babysit it.

 

[nehog]

Some pressure switches have two adjustments, one which controls when the motor is shut off when the pressure is enough, and the other controls at what pressure the motor comes back on. (Typically off at 120 and on at 105, for example.)

So you must make sure you are adjusting the correct screw, and realize there is a bit of interaction between the two, if it is this type of pressure switch.

 

[Zeke]

No need to baby sit it but no need to continue to use something that is not working properly and using up electricity. The unit should not run for 10 minutes continuously. I wouldn't let mine run that long using tools. I have when painting, but it doesn't do them any good to get that hot.

Check for air leaks with soapy water before tearing into the adjustment. Then return the unit before messing around with it or your warranty is gonna be void.

FWIW, I adjust mine down to 110 and they last longer.

 

[e-tek]

If you haven't dicked with it too much yet, turn it on and leave it on until it stops - or it runs for 15 mins solid - which is more than enough time to reach max/shut-off pressure. Having said that, sometimes it does seem to take a while to shut off when it gets close to it's max-set pressure and I understand your apprehension!

Contrary to what someone said above, on mine anyway, the pressure shut-off adjuster CAN be adjusted while it's running and WILL shut it down if adjusted downward while pressurizing. I've done it.

My 2-stage machine has a max of 175psi but was factory-set to shut off at 150psi. I played with it and set it at 140psi - just because. I'd be VERY surprised if yours wasn't set properly from the factory - maybe you got trust issues!

 

[Torque1st]

Don't mess with the factory pressure settings. Sorry, but you obviously are way beyond your skill and knowledge levels here.

Contact the factory or distributor if you have concerns about the pumping time.

 

[Skin]

Contrary to what someone said above, on mine anyway, the pressure shut-off adjuster CAN be adjusted while it's running and WILL shut it down if adjusted downward while pressurizing. I've done it.

Its not that i said it cant be done, i just wasnt going to tell him to stick a wrench or nut driver into it while it was on as the terminals are usually right next to the nut.

 

[tdkkart]

Did you do the 20 minute run-in procedure as specified on page 8 of your manual??
This run-in period ensures proper break-in, including mating the pistn rings to the cylinder so that they have minimal leakage and the pump will reach max pressure.

That said, there's no reason to run that compressor to 150psi, 125-130 is more than enough, and if you find the pressure switch is ajustable I would adjust it down some.

 

[Compact]

Thanks for all the responses. I called the tech support and they confirmed what everyone here is saying- that it should only run to about 125psi.

The problem is that it took awhile to get up to 125, and it never shut down. Somehow it could run on and on at 125psi without shutting down or building additional pressure. Turning it off manually, it held pressure for quite awhile, so I don't think there is a leak happening.

Anyhow, the guy gave me some instructions on what to test tonight when I get home. I am going to turn the unit on and time it to 125. It should take about 5:15 according to him. Also, when it gets there he said to unscrew the air filters and put my hand over them and see if there is suction or not. If there is none, then something is wrong. At that point, he can either send out valve plates/gaskets and see if that works, or I can send the darn thing back for another one. Bummer.

I did follow the instructions for the break-in. It was 20 minutes with the tank open. The only other thing I noticed is that the oil level is a bit high, so I will also drain out a few drops, altough I don't anticipate that helping anything.

 

[REAL HOT SCHITT]

Hi, i hve a ingersoll rand 15 cfm...a little bigger than yours.
It takes 2.5 minutes for full pressure at 100 psi.

Note; do not operate tools over 100 psi as tools are only guaranteed to work at 90... So i gave extra 10 psi for line frictional losses etc.

Install a automatic inline water / moisture trap...ie; any german brand or ampro, will do.

Make sure to drain twice a day as trap only rid moisture from the line. If u down t corrosion will rust internals of tank split explode and may kill.

- owner of atlas copco xas series diesel compressor, ingersoll rand comps,shinano-ingersoll rand-fuji-atlas copco air tools and contruction equipment.

 

[Compact]

UPDATE:

Using a stopwatch, I tested it.

0-50PSI - 2 minutes. Not Bad
0-100 - 6.5 minutes.
0-125 - 13 minutes.

I ran it for another 5 minutes, all the way to 18 minutes, and it held at 125psi. I checked for suction on the intakes using my hand as the tech support guy suggested, and I could not detect a change from the initial pressurizing and the point at which it gets hung up. I don't know what the course of action is gonna be. If I have to remove the unit to return it, that means getting it back out of the ceiling of my garage. Not a fun task, and not one that makes me very happy with the compressor. Unfortunately, its the biggest I could fit in there, so I may just have to give these guys another shot. Ugh... this project is at a bad point now. Getting frustrated. Time for a drink.

P.S. Thanks for all the help fellas. I'll let you know what the guy says tomorrow. At a minimum, he spoke like a professional and told me to ask for him, so as far as their customer service goes to this point its alright.

 

[ZRX61]

Those pumps take a while to bed in, it should get better. When I bought my 60gal Devilbiss it said the break it in by running it with the drain valve open for 30-40 minutes.

 

[Alaric.H]

There is some thing wrong it is taking to long.

 

[isaac338]

UPDATE:

Using a stopwatch, I tested it.

0-50PSI - 2 minutes. Not Bad
0-100 - 6.5 minutes.
0-125 - 13 minutes.

I ran it for another 5 minutes, all the way to 18 minutes, and it held at 125psi. I checked for suction on the intakes using my hand as the tech support guy suggested, and I could not detect a change from the initial pressurizing and the point at which it gets hung up. I don't know what the course of action is gonna be. If I have to remove the unit to return it, that means getting it back out of the ceiling of my garage. Not a fun task, and not one that makes me very happy with the compressor. Unfortunately, its the biggest I could fit in there, so I may just have to give these guys another shot. Ugh... this project is at a bad point now. Getting frustrated. Time for a drink.

P.S. Thanks for all the help fellas. I'll let you know what the guy says tomorrow. At a minimum, he spoke like a professional and told me to ask for him, so as far as their customer service goes to this point its alright.

Check for leaks around the discharge line and the unloader valve - if there's a leak here it'll pump forever trying to charge the receiver (which has now become the entire room).

And, if you do decide to adjust the pressure switch, look for specific instructions - some of them have adjustments for cut in and cut out, and some have adjustments for cut out and differential, or some other combination. No point adjusting it if you don't know what the adjustments so. (and you probably shouldn't need to adjust it.. something's leaking!)

 

[70chevellegsp]

UPDATE:

Using a stopwatch, I tested it.

0-50PSI - 2 minutes. Not Bad
0-100 - 6.5 minutes.
0-125 - 13 minutes.

I ran it for another 5 minutes, all the way to 18 minutes, and it held at 125psi. I checked for suction on the intakes using my hand as the tech support guy suggested, and I could not detect a change from the initial pressurizing and the point at which it gets hung up. I don't know what the course of action is gonna be. If I have to remove the unit to return it, that means getting it back out of the ceiling of my garage. Not a fun task, and not one that makes me very happy with the compressor. Unfortunately, its the biggest I could fit in there, so I may just have to give these guys another shot. Ugh... this project is at a bad point now. Getting frustrated. Time for a drink.

P.S. Thanks for all the help fellas. I'll let you know what the guy says tomorrow. At a minimum, he spoke like a professional and told me to ask for him, so as far as their customer service goes to this point its alright.

Somethings wrong, send it back and get another. Northern has done well by me in the past with their Customer Service. At least it's not an 80 gallon, 500# behmoth. I found this calc somewhere to gauge your compressor's performance. It tells you, based on your compressors specs, how long it should take to fill.

1 Atmosphere = 14.7 psi
7.1 cfm (your compressor cfm)
125 psi (your cutoff)/14.7 = 8.57 atmospheres
20 gallon (your tank) = 2.5 cu ft
8.57 atomspheres x 2.5 cu ft = 21.26 cu ft
Cu ft/ minutes to refill = cfm
21.26 cu ft/ x (minutes to refill) = 7.1 cfm
x (minutes to refill) = 3 minutes. 21.26/3=7.1

 

[sberry]

The factorty tech said 5:15, sounds about right. Most common 2 stage units take 5 to 6 to fill from empty.

 

[Compact]

UPDATE:

I spoke with the guy at PUMA again. I told him my findings. I am now going to send back the pump for a replacement. Kind of a hassle, but stuff happens sometimes I guess. Here is what he said to do:
1. Remove Belt Guard.
2. Remove Belt.
3. Unbolt pump.
4. Remove discharge tube.
5. Drain oil.
6. Put in box and give to UPS man.
7. Cry.
8. Hopefully 1 week later get replacement unit.
9. Reconnect everything.
10. Have a compressed air party?

 

[isaac338]

UPDATE:

I spoke with the guy at PUMA again. I told him my findings. I am now going to send back the pump for a replacement. Kind of a hassle, but stuff happens sometimes I guess. Here is what he said to do:
1. Remove Belt Guard.
2. Remove Belt.
3. Unbolt pump.
4. Remove discharge tube.
5. Drain oil.
6. Put in box and give to UPS man.
7. Cry.
8. Hopefully 1 week later get replacement unit.
9. Reconnect everything.
10. Have a compressed air party?

Have you checked for leaks in the places where it's liable to leak, like around the discharge pipe and unloader valve?

No point in returning the pump if it's just a loose fitting.

 

[nickleone]

Here is a FYI
http://www.truetex.com/aircompressors.htm

Nick

 

[Compact]

UPDATE:

Finally got new pump in the mail on Friday. Got it all bolted up last night and...
SUCCESS. Now it fills properly. About 6 minutes from empty to around 130psi. Shuts down as it should, and comes back on once it drains to a certain point. There was significant bloodshed during reinstallation. There's a lot of sharp nails and stuff in the rafters where it resides. As I sit at my desk at work, my hands are cut up, but man, it reminds me that I got that thing working, and I am all smiles.

This afternoon, I shall order the lift. Garage is getting very close to complete. VERY close.

 

[bazzateer]

Good news!

 

[Compact]

I know- everyone should get good news at least once a year