I don't get it

[WWheeler]

I see plenty of tools on channellock.com that are not made in the usa.

Example?

Was news to me too but had a look and there are Channellock screwdrivers, adjustable wrenches and tool sets etc that do not have the 'Made In USA' logo that all of their pliers do. It doesn't say what the COO is on them though that I saw.

 

[kythri]

Interesting.

A quick perusal myself (thanks for the info!) shows that the Code Blue screwdrivers appear to be imports, the adjustables are imported from Spain (IREGA?) and yeah, those tool sets look like the Asian-manufactured stuff that Do it Best was having produced.

 

[GophersGarage]

forsure not all items are usa from CL I have some say spain

 

[Cfendrick]

If you buy on price alone that’s one thing but other people like complete sets/brands or have brand loyalty or appreciate warranty and after sale service.

I’ve personally never hand warranty or service issues with Crescent(Apex Tools) or Channellock. If I needed pliers and those were my only two option it would have come down to price. I already have and know a bit about both. Sometimes pricing doesn’t always make sense, bit our money does the talking.

Based on your example I hope they sell more Channellock.

 

[ARFLY]

I also hope they sell more Channellock.

 

[woodturner9]

All Channellocks are 'made in USA' still.

Technically, maybe, but when they are simply assembling foreign-made parts, is that really "made in USA" in the way most of us think about that? I understand it meets the FTC requirements for that labeling, but if I were looking for US-made product I would want something entirely made in the US.

Having said that, COO is a poor indicator of quality, and it's better to buy based on the quality of a particular product. There are some products that only China can make well enough that people will buy them, the US cannot match their quality level. Certain machine tools, etc.

 

[kythri]

Technically, maybe, but when they are simply assembling foreign-made parts, is that really "made in USA" in the way most of us think about that? I understand it meets the FTC requirements for that labeling, but if I were looking for US-made product I would want something entirely made in the US.

Yeah, that's not happening here, and no, that doesn't meet FTC requirements.

 

[dogdog]

Probably more likely they would just send out a whole new ratchet, have you tried just telling them that the ratchet is defective and that you would like a new one?

, the selector lever was made out of plastic of sort.... It snaps off, making selecting directions ... well difficult... who made these things out of plastic... let me look up that thread, I have pics of it...

Anyways I tried to tell F-ing "George" if I can send him a pic of the selector and see if he can just send me that, so we can all save on some postage... not cheap. Kinda get that demeaning conversation that says the ratchet is too complicated to be disassembled by end users and they say they have many versions ...... well even if that MOFO sends me every selector level he got it would have only costed $1.99 instead of 12.99 for me to send it in and they paid for the postage to send it back to me....BTW I called twice as suggested by some members but nope each time my luck I got whorehay.... so just f-it... I can do without them.

This thread...
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=291962

 

[bczygan]

 

[dogdog]

I am confused about your confusion.

 

[bczygan]

I am confused about your confusion.

All this tool talk. COO, quality, jobs, what they're made of, color of handles, packaging, changes............It hurts my head!


Bill

 

[dogdog]

All this tool talk. COO, quality, jobs, what they're made of, color of handles, packaging, changes............It hurts my head!


Bill

I just enjoy reading it Makes me alive reading some delusions... but sure, just blame it on dogdog, for not liking ChannelLock... It's not the COO I don't like, It's the Fracking warranty Customer Services.... and Snub *** George...

then again so far, I have 0.5 out of so many luck in warranty my stuff... .

 

[southpier]

why is soda $1.00 per can and water $1.50?

no one said life was fair!

 

[1982fxr]

Technically, maybe, but when they are simply assembling foreign-made parts, is that really "made in USA" in the way most of us think about that? I understand it meets the FTC requirements for that labeling, but if I were looking for US-made product I would want something entirely made in the US.

Having said that, COO is a poor indicator of quality, and it's better to buy based on the quality of a particular product. There are some products that only China can make well enough that people will buy them, the US cannot match their quality level. Certain machine tools, etc.

CL pliers are not assembled foreign parts. They are American made.

That last paragraph lol.

 

[dogdog]

why is soda $1.00 per can and water $1.50?

no one said life was fair!

yes I stopped drinking bottle water and costed me only $.02 a gallon for tap, except if I go visit some where in Flint Michigan, and I stopped buying ChannelLick, Solved both Soda and water problem and I am still alive. Life is not fair, but you have a choice. and my Choice is Frack Channel Lick.

 

[woodturner9]

Yeah, that's not happening here, and no, that doesn't meet FTC requirements.

My point was that Channelock does assemble tools from overseas components and label them "made in USA" and that it is compliant with FTC regulations. The requirement is that more than a certain percentage of the price of the tool was added in the US - and labor costs in the US are high enough relative to overseas costs that it may only take assembling two pieces to hit the threshold.

 

[woodturner9]

CL pliers are not assembled foreign parts. They are American made.

Many of their products are actually assembled from foreign components. Have you toured their factory? It was a real eye-opener for me.

They are technically "American made" because enough assembly value is added in the US to meet FTC requirements.

That last paragraph lol.

I'm guessing you were not aware that China's manufacturing capability exceeds US abilities in some area? Facts are facts, whether one is aware of the truth or not.

A lot of people think buying US-made products helps the US economy, and it may help a little, locally, but it overall harms our economy and costs jobs. Look at the US automakers in the 1980's - as a result of not keeping up, they essentially lost out. Now pretty much the only US-made cars you can buy are Honda Accords and Toyota Camrys, and most US brand cars are owned by foreign automakers and made overseas.

 

[Tonyuk]

I wouldn't be surprised if many of the machines and other bits of kit channellock, snap-on, facom etc.. use to make there tools are actually made in china or some other eastern country.

 

[kythri]

My point was that Channelock does assemble tools from overseas components and label them "made in USA" and that it is compliant with FTC regulations. The requirement is that more than a certain percentage of the price of the tool was added in the US - and labor costs in the US are high enough relative to overseas costs that it may only take assembling two pieces to hit the threshold.

That is in no way compliant with the FTC ruling on "Made in USA". "All or virtually all" of the components (FTC's words, not mine) must be made in the USA.

There's no way Channellock could get away with using imported parts in their hand tools and claim such.

Many of their products are actually assembled from foreign components. Have you toured their factory? It was a real eye-opener for me.

They are technically "American made" because enough assembly value is added in the US to meet FTC requirements.

Quite frankly, I don't believe you.

Were your assertions accurate, the only way Channellock could get away with something like that would be if, for example, the rivet holding their pliers together was the only imported component.

I'm guessing you were not aware that China's manufacturing capability exceeds US abilities in some area? Facts are facts, whether one is aware of the truth or not.

Back at'cha.

A lot of people think buying US-made products helps the US economy, and it may help a little, locally, but it overall harms our economy and costs jobs.

Wow, what?! Oh, pray tell, expound on that one.

Look at the US automakers in the 1980's - as a result of not keeping up, they essentially lost out. Now pretty much the only US-made cars you can buy are Honda Accords and Toyota Camrys, and most US brand cars are owned by foreign automakers and made overseas.

That's rather inaccurate.

The vast majority of the Big 3 domestic auto manufacturers factories and assembly lines are in North America, and there's still a TON of that in the USA. Last time I checked, Canada and Mexico aren't overseas.

 

[southpier]

wow; dodged that bullet . . .

 

[1982fxr]

So when do we find out what tools are assembled from Chinese parts and labeled made in USA?

Somehow we’re short on specifics here...

 

[WWheeler]

My point was that Channelock does assemble tools from overseas components and label them "made in USA" and that it is compliant with FTC regulations. The requirement is that more than a certain percentage of the price of the tool was added in the US - and labor costs in the US are high enough relative to overseas costs that it may only take assembling two pieces to hit the threshold.

I have a bit of a hard time believing all of Chanellock's pliers, or for that matter ALL of the products labeled 'Made in the USA' are not 100% US made or at least "all significant parts and processing that go into the product" (see FTC regs below) are made in the US. We've already determined there are a number of Channellock branded products that are not labeled 'Made in the USA', ...

Was news to me too but had a look and there are Channellock screwdrivers, adjustable wrenches and tool sets etc that do not have the 'Made In USA' logo that, for example, all of their pliers do. It doesn't say what the COO is on them though that I saw.

... BUT all of the ones that are labeled 'Made in the USA' it's a pretty safe bet actually do meet the FTC regs, and no, "it may only take assembling two pieces to hit the threshold" is total BS.

There's what, 3 parts to the pliers, and if you count the grips there's 5 (I could be convinced the grips are made elsewhere, but I doubt it too). Sorry, but it would take more than just someone's word on this forum to make me believe different.

https://www.channellock.com/made-in-the-usa/

Not the Easiest Way. But the Right Way.

American manufacturing is becoming more and more scarce every day. But we at Channellock, Inc. continue our tradition of manufacturing high-quality pliers on American soil in Meadville, Pennsylvania. We're proud to put Americans to work and we employ over 350 associates who contribute to our local, state and U.S. economy. Is it the easiest way? Probably not. But, American manufacturing is the right way.

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-made-usa-standard

What is the standard for a product to be called Made in USA without qualification?

For a product to be called Made in USA, or claimed to be of domestic origin without qualifications or limits on the claim, the product must be "all or virtually all" made in the U.S. The term "United States," as referred to in the Enforcement Policy Statement, includes the 50 states, the District of Columbia, and the U.S. territories and possessions.

What does "all or virtually all" mean?

"All or virtually all" means that all significant parts and processing that go into the product must be of U.S. origin. That is, the product should contain no — or negligible — foreign content.

What substantiation is required for a Made in USA claim?

When a manufacturer or marketer makes an unqualified claim that a product is Made in USA, it should have — and rely on — a "reasonable basis" to support the claim at the time it is made. This means a manufacturer or marketer needs competent and reliable evidence to back up the claim that its product is "all or virtually all" made in the U.S.

 

[yamaha0343]

adjustable wrenches

Last I checked the only adjustable wrenches made in the USA were Western Forge. Most higher end adjustables are made in Spain. Irega makes great adjustables.

 

[rossomania]

Proto makes excellent adjustable wrenches right here in the USA.

 

[woodturner9]

That is in no way compliant with the FTC ruling on "Made in USA". "All or virtually all" of the components (FTC's words, not mine) must be made in the USA.

There's no way Channellock could get away with using imported parts in their hand tools and claim such.

It is compliant, FTC has repeatedly ruled in the manufacturer's favor. If you read the regulations it may be more clear.

Were your assertions accurate, the only way Channellock could get away with something like that would be if, for example, the rivet holding their pliers together was the only imported component.

Sort of, the metal pieces are made overseas, then assembled in the US.

The vast majority of the Big 3 domestic auto manufacturers factories and assembly lines are in North America, and there's still a TON of that in the USA. Last time I checked, Canada and Mexico aren't overseas.

I'll grant that Canada and Mexico aren't overseas, but they are still "foreign" and not "made in the US". It appears that there are currently no "US made" cars available in the US from US brands, only from foreign brands.

 

[woodturner9]

I have a bit of a hard time believing all of Chanellock's pliers, or for that matter ALL of the products labeled 'Made in the USA' are not 100% US made

I don't think anyone said "all", I said "some". The FTC regulations are based on cost, when they buy $2 worth of parts overseas and spend $5 assembling in the US, that meets the requirement.

As a practical matter, as your quote implies, it's self regulated and many companies label inaccurately. In those rare instances where they are caught, usually due to a large number of consumer complaints, they pay a tiny fine and change the labeling. Very low risk.

 

[1982fxr]

An awful lot of words and still not naming specific tools.

 

[1982fxr]

Also I think they did an announcement a couple years ago that their dip/handles were being brought back to the USA. I believe for a time they didn’t have a domestic supplier. Would bet that the epa had something to do with that situation but that’s just speculation on my part.

 

[kythri]

Sort of, the metal pieces are made overseas, then assembled in the US.

********.

I'll grant that Canada and Mexico aren't overseas, but they are still "foreign" and not "made in the US". It appears that there are currently no "US made" cars available in the US from US brands, only from foreign brands.

Ford Mustang - Flat Rock, Michigan
Chevrolet Camaro - Lansing, Michigan
Jeep Wrangler - Toledo, Ohio
Ford F-150 - Dearborn, MI and Kansas City, MO
Ford Super-Duty - Louisville, KY
Dodge Durango - Detroit, MI

Just to name a few right offhand.

I'll grant that there's a lot of foreign production, but those examples above took me less than 2 minutes to source.

So, again, I call ********.

 

[woodturner9]

<inappropriate content redacted>

Have you toured their factory? Might want to see for yourself before contradicting what the company says.

Ford Mustang - Flat Rock, Michigan
Chevrolet Camaro - Lansing, Michigan
Jeep Wrangler - Toledo, Ohio
Ford F-150 - Dearborn, MI and Kansas City, MO
Ford Super-Duty - Louisville, KY
Dodge Durango - Detroit, MI

Please cite support for those claims, since various trade and government resources - AutoNews, FTC, etc. - does not list those as US made. Even Consumer Reports disagrees with you.

By "US brands" I also meant companies actually US-owned rather than traditionally US brands that are now owned by foreign entities.

The FTC threshold for cars is 75% - so 75% of the value of the vehicle has to be sourced in the US. It's a difficult standard to meet, though the foreign brands like Toyota, Honda, and Hyundai achieve it.

You are entitled to your opinions, I'm just posting the objective facts. May not be much value in discussing further unless there is interest in doing some research and learning facts.

 

[Bockscar]

Please cite support for those claims, since various trade and government resources - AutoNews, FTC, etc. - lists all those vehicles as foreign-made.

You are entitled to your opinions, I'm just posting the objective facts.

Chevrolet trucks - Fort Wayne, Indiana

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[Tonyuk]

I know they're locking pliers and adjustable spanners are from Spain, not a bad thing really.

I don't have any issue with a company outsorceing products to competent manufacturers. It undoubtabley keeps the cost down compared to them going out and buying the kit etc.... and making them themselves.

People place too much emphasis on the place the tools or whatever else are made.

 

[1982fxr]

Woodyurner is a complete troll.

Been asked several times for specific examples of his accusations.

 

[WWheeler]

Woodyurner is a complete troll.

 

[kythri]

facts

I do not think that word means what you think it does.

 

[ChaseDE]

Chevrolet trucks - Fort Wayne, Indiana

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

lol, can confirm, my mom works there doing logistics for Ryder.

 

[Ryan]

Hey fellas... I almost cleaned this thread up, but decided to leave it. If you are arguing with people over tools on the internet, you need to really rethink your values. Seriously. I mean, start posting as if you were channeling someone like John Wayne.

Would John Wayne argue with some guy he didn't know... on the internet?

Would John Wayne call someone a troll?

Would John Wayne be a troll?

How would your father feel about your post?

Know what I mean? There really is no rational excuse for arguing with someone on a forum about tools and garages. And if you've found one in your head, you have problems. Please go somewhere else.