I have an idea for a new tool, what do I do?

[fasteddie313]

I have an Idea for a new tool, what do I do?

I can make a prototype in my own shop first, or post a drawn diagram of it for proof of concept.. Or patent first???

What steps should I take?

I think this is a great idea, its a stud extraction concept, or grabbing a bolt by the threads with better purchase than anything on the market with zero damage.

I have never heard of or scene anything like this concept before..

Won't be a super expencive tool either, maybe $75 tops, idk..

Who knows about the legalities of intellectual property or whatever its called?

 

[ssdave]

Whatever you do, don't post it out on a public forum. Don't describe how it works, take pictures, run the concept out there for critique and suggestions. If you do, your intellectual property rights have been compromised.

If you draw anything, put your name, date, and the word copyright on it. That will give you some small protection against it being copied. However, if you put it out in the public realm before it is patented, that can be justification for denying or breaking the patent. You also run the risk of someone else running with it and applying for patent first, and then you'd be in the position of challenging their patent, but your best defense would be that it was in the public realm because of your posted information. Either way, you'd lose out; you'd have no patent, whether you won or lost.

I'd build prototypes, and refine them to know it works. If you have a lot of faith in it as a potential seller, then invest the money in patenting it. Then, either set up to make it and sell it, or try to sell the concept to a tool company.

Another route to take, more risky in terms of theft of the intellectual property, but less money up front is to take the tool you have prototyped to tool companies and try to get them to buy it and agree to patent it for you. You can see the things that could go wrong there, no?

Good Luck!

 

[thurman.]

If you need investors. Be careful they are snakes too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

Patents are only as good as they are written and even then only if you can afford the lawyers to defend them.
First you need to decide if you want to sell the idea or sell the tool. Are you going to do all the work with designing/engineering and manufacturing?

Have anyone you talk to sign a non-disclosure agreement before you talk to them or show them anything.

 

[colin39]

Send it to me here in the y-uk ill look it over, and retire early

 

[Davefr]

Focus on marketing vs legal.

 

[gdocktor3]

Did you get the idea from one of winlinmac's posts??


Just kidding

 

[orca8589]

Be very careful how you go about revealing the details to anyone. I'd say that if you have a serious idea that has even a small chance of being marketed, get a patent lawyer to help with development, or at least have a consultation up front about protecting your interests during the process.

Here's a cautionary tale for you:

Back in the 80's, there was a guy named Charles Kelsey who had a company called Devel Corporation. They customized pistols like Smith & Wesson, Colt, etc. Look them up - they're ingenious designs. (I drooled over these things when I was a kid.)

Kelsey was asked to develop a firing pin block safety for the then-issued Browning Hi-Power pistols for a govt. agency. Kelsey developed it, and made the modifications to an agent's pistol. However, before Kelsey could talk to FN/Browning about an agreement to incorporate the safety into their hi-Power design, Browning saw the agent's pistol, copied the safety design, patented it, and shut Kelsey out entirely. Kelsey didn't have the money or legal ability to fight a big company like FN-Herstal (owns Browning.)

He was never credited with the design, although many high-level people in the shooting industry knew about it. FN was confronted more than once over the issue and steadfastly (some would say very rudely) refused to talk to anyone about it. Kelsey never got a penny from them for his idea.

~Chris

 

[Superbec]

Did you get the idea from one of winlinmac's posts??


Just kidding

I was thinking the exact same thing

I would first look if your new ideea is in fact not that new

Many years ago I was thinking about a CVT trans , after 2 years Honda put it on some cars with no luck...

The ideea was in fact not that new but the internets was small back then...google ran on desktop pc's

 

[boosteddsm92]

I think this is a great idea, its a stud extraction concept, or grabbing a bolt by the threads with better purchase than anything on the market with zero damage.

I have never heard of or scene anything like this concept before..

Like this? I have these sets and they work great and I've never damaged threads w/it. I mainly use it on exhaust manifold and turbo studs.

 

[MShaw]

Or this, https://store.snapon.com/Stud-Remov...Remover-and-Dowel-Pin-Puller-Set-P637128.aspx , by snap on. Uses collets to grip the stud by the threads. It has been around for over 50 years.

 

[fasteddie313]

Like this?

Nope, not at all like that..

Those will damage threads if you put too much torque on it, maybe 40 ft/lbs is all those are good for..

My design would be good for easily 100 ft/lbs as standard and could be modified to "stronger than any bolt"(stahlwille fan) and snap your best fasteners off by grabbing the threads and never damage a thread..

 

[fasteddie313]

Or this, https://store.snapon.com/Stud-Remov...Remover-and-Dowel-Pin-Puller-Set-P637128.aspx , by snap on. Uses collets to grip the stud by the threads. It has been around for over 50 years.

Nope!!!

Not the same, what a premium tool though thats ****..

Mine would easily be 1/10 the cost of that too..

Seriously I could make one for $20.. (not including my time like machine time)

 

[fasteddie313]

If you need investors. Be careful they are snakes too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

IDK...

I can make a prototype no problem.. I probably have everything laying around for 4 of em or so..

I could probably make 50 a week.. like next week, if I wanted to..

 

[engineer2]

Document everything with dates and have it notarized
Familiarize yourself with non-disclosure agreements.
A patent search needs to be done to see if there is "prior art". Did something like this get patented before? Patent searches can be tedious.
US patent system is "first to file".
You can file a provisional patent yourself, but you have to study up at uspto.gov to figure out how to write it correctly. Study other similar patents.
Your idea can usually be patented if it is an improvement on an existing patent.
We were once quoted $20,000 by an attorney to file a patent.
The real cost I heard is around half that if you do much of the work yourself.
A patent can open the doors to lawsuits and foreign imitators. Keep a lawyer handy.
A patent doesn't mean anyone will buy your product. It still has to be manufactured and marketed.

 

[fasteddie313]

Document everything with dates and have it notarized
Familiarize yourself with non-disclosure agreements.
A patent search needs to be done to see if there is "prior art". Did something like this get patented before? Patent searches can be tedious.
US patent system is "first to file".
You can file a provisional patent yourself, but you have to study up at uspto.gov to figure out how to write it correctly. Study other similar patents.
Your idea can usually be patented if it is an improvement on an existing patent.
We were once quoted $20,000 by an attorney to file a patent.
The real cost I heard is around half that if you do much of the work yourself.
A patent can open the doors to lawsuits and foreign imitators. Keep a lawyer handy.
A patent doesn't mean anyone will buy your product. It still has to be manufactured and marketed.

Look how much they are trying to hold the little man down..

I don't have that kind of money.. But I have the tools and machines


""A patent doesn't mean anyone will buy your product. It still has to be manufactured and marketed.""

What if I just skip all that and just manufacture and market them right now?

 

[jd_1138]

What if I just skip all that and just manufacture and market them right now?

You could. You can make them and sell directly to buyers on the internet. You could advertise on tool websites (maybe buy a $20 banner ad or something). Could even do a Kickstarter to raise money/awareness. If they donate a certain amount that you decide, they will be given one of the devices after you start making them.

But without a patent, a co. can come along, rip you off, and patent the idea themselves and then make you stop making the widget. I just Googled the cost of a patent and saw this:

The filing fee is $130 for a small entity and drawings typically cost $100 to $125 per page, so a high quality provisional patent application for a mechanical or electrical device can typically be prepared and filed for $2,500 to $3,000.Apr 4, 2015

For this device, I am sure you'll probably only need 3 or 4 pages of drawings. So it could be $1,000 or less.

 

[TK-421]

A patent is only good if you have the bankroll to defend it.

Patent it if you can defend, but I wouldn't stress about a patent too much if you can't defend it.

That said, if you can afford to patent it, go ahead and do it anyways. Might make some of the more honest people leery of stealing your idea.

 

[Astro_Pneumatic_Tools]

A patent helps to sell it to a bigger name manufacturer. They will pay you more, or more per tool, on something they can defend the design on.

A patent held by yourself is about as good as your lawyer is, or your wallet is deep. We have patents on some pretty significant items, and were the first to introduce them into the market. Then we got patents in Europe and Asia, but when X company comes along that is a billion $ company and makes the same thing - you send a cease and desist and they are happy to arrange a court date to give their in house lawyers something to do.

The next thing I would be weary of, is companies that "help" with this sort of thing. Couldn't tell you how many times a guy comes up to us at SEMA, or drops me a line with X idea. We like it, start talking to our factories, draw up an agreement only to learn he owes X% of gross, or a certain $ per tool to this company who "helped" him either patent the idea, or market it to MFG's or do not much of anything. Those deals pretty much go into the trash bin.

Lastly, make everyone sign simple NDA's (you can find forms online) when talking about your tool. First thing I make someone do when they are about to tell me an idea of their is sign one. Protects both parties.

 

[woody 73]

I know that the patent lawyer does the search for you and that can be time consuming you would not believe how many ideas have been tried before. If no other patents crop up, then your lawyer starts the paperwork, but like others have said be prepared to spend a lot of money.

After reading enough horror stories and then on top of that reading about trying to defend your idea from Chinese knock off products it is enough to make a person very sick.

But I would say your first step is finding a good patent lawyer in your area and start asking a ton of questions.

 

[Davefr]

What if I just skip all that and just manufacture and market them right now?

That's what you should do!! 100% of your effort should be marketing, manufacturing and inventing rev. 2 of your widget.

All the legal **** does is drain your resources so you can't do the above. It also makes lawyers rich in the process. In addition by the time all the T's are crossed and I's dotted in the patent process you're widget should be obsolete and ready for it's next generation. Your goal is to obsolete your widget before a competitor does by having the next generation widget ready.

All a competitor has to do is change a couple things and you'll be hard pressed to defend your idea. You need to stay one step ahead of any competitor.

 

[notlob]

Don't sell it through sears:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/MadeInAmerica/wrench-inventor-claims-sears-stole-idea-china/story?id=17720122

 

[rslaback]

I'd suggest that you focus on selling the idea. There are companies like Lisle and FastCap that will purchase the rights to an idea from entrepreneurs and enter into profit sharing with them. Like it or not, the world is getting to be too big of a place for individuals to start companies with an idea. You need a brand, not a product to be successful.

 

[RStewart]

I'm I I want one.

 

[ssdave]

There's some merit to producing a product yourself, and just keeping ahead of the competition if it's a niche market that won't be dominated by the big players that can outspend and outlawyer you. However, in a competitive market, you won't be able to out compete them, and the last suggestion to sell the idea is a good one.

I make a specialty part, that is very much a niche market. I had a competitor a few years ago start a business that competed with mine, but he didn't make the part I do. I looked at his prices and what he was willing to work for, and thought "this is stupid, why compete with him, both of us will make less money and quit the business eventually"?

I contacted him, and he was a real nice guy, just trying to make some retirement funds from a specialized interest he had and also help out a widowed friend of his wife get rid of some inventory from her late husbands business. I offered to sell him part of my inventory to grow his business, refer all my customers to him, and give him exclusive sales on the part I invented and make. It's been the start of a great business relationship; for several years now he's increased his business to be much better than mine was, he sells my part for me, and I've gone on to other stuff instead. Win-win for both of us. What I have done is keep the cost of the part low. The demand is small, and the price low, so it is not worthwhile for someone to come in and develop the process to make the part and compete against me. I make really good money on the part, but if you had to tool up and figure out how to make it to compete against me, there'd be no profit for a long time. So, no-one has competed with me.

Not an apt comparison to your idea, which should have much wider buyer appeal. Just one example of the dynamics in manufacturing/sales.

 

[engineer2]

Some great advice here from everybody.
It is difficult to build a business being a "one-trick pony". If it's the only product you have, you might be better off licensing it to a bigger company.
As ssdave illustrated, it is better to make your competitor your ally rather than your enemy.

 

[fasteddie313]

OK...

I am going to make a simple bare bones prototype of my thread grabber for testing..

If it works to my satisfaction as I anticipate it will I will post a diagram of my tool and see if anyone here wants one..

 

[kctyphoon]

One step you can take.. Is draw up a detailed design, explain what it is, how it works, why it's better ect.. - date it and make a copy. Send the original to yourself in a SEALED envelope, inside a sealed post office envelope/ letter carrier package via certified mail.. When you get it, don't open it. Put both copies aside in a safe place... it's a simple way to help establish proof of concept and a date. It's a not a patent, but it's something to have in case it gets to that point.

 

[Roddyo]

You should take a look at Lisle if you don't have the money to do it right. A guy on another forum sent in pictures of a tool years ago. At the time it was probably ground breaking and should have been patented. Other manufactures started making the same tool. Lisle finally started making it and gives him a little off of each tool.

 

[rick carpenter]

There's a GJ-er named Shaun_Logica who just recently went through something possibly similar to what you might have to do. Search for the Hextension thread(s) on here, and maybe visit with him on the process they went through. I don't know if talking to GJ-er Dave R. who is a CS rep for Tekton would do you any good, but I congratulate Shaun_Logica and Dave R. for having the nads to directly engage with people like us on Garage Journal forum. Never hurts to ask! Good luck!

 

[AffableCurmudgeon]

What if I just skip all that and just manufacture and market them right now?

Don't!!!!!
The minute you offer it for sale, the clock starts ticking to get any patent protection on it.

As a patent lawyer, I would suggest that you talk to a patent lawyer first. Once the invention is offered for sale, you may lose some protection.

Nothing I said above should be taken as legal advice.

 

[AffableCurmudgeon]

That's what you should do!! 100% of your effort should be marketing, manufacturing and inventing rev. 2 of your widget.

All the legal **** does is drain your resources so you can't do the above. It also makes lawyers rich in the process. In addition by the time all the T's are crossed and I's dotted in the patent process you're widget should be obsolete and ready for it's next generation. Your goal is to obsolete your widget before a competitor does by having the next generation widget ready.

All a competitor has to do is change a couple things and you'll be hard pressed to defend your idea. You need to stay one step ahead of any competitor.

WOW! So wrong! OP, please consult a patent attorney.

 

[kctyphoon]

If you can manage to get a patent, you can try to to just liscence the design to manufacturer to make it easier on yourself.. Up to you if all the trouble is worth it.