Miss the Pontiacs
Well-known member
I took a one day course to see what welding equipment I would purchase. O/A, stick and mig. Decided I would need all 3. O/A for cutting, stick for heavy/rusty and mig for lighter metal/sheet work.
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I want to learn to weld
- Thread starter Jon_E
- Start date
sberry
Banned
I have been to the school, a couple of them. In general it's pretty easy to spot the self learned types. A of can do the work they do but a good share really never do learn despite their own opinion. An example is here in this thread, experienced hand can weld 16 ga with 1/8 stick, it takes someone really learned and worked on technique.
If these guys went somewhere it had to be done right they couldn't pass the critical testing.
I will agree one doesn't need that for all common work but a lot of people cool themselves to think they really know what they are doing.
If these guys went somewhere it had to be done right they couldn't pass the critical testing.
I will agree one doesn't need that for all common work but a lot of people cool themselves to think they really know what they are doing.
pstnbly
Well-known member
learn to gas weld first.
^^^^^ This If you learn to gas weld first, the other disciplines will be easier. If you just learn mig first you miss a lot of fundamentals (like how to recognize your penetration ).
sberry
Banned
I know guys that mig very well, cant weld anything else, they don't need to though. I know career welders never ran but 2 rods also. I met a few the only thing they could do is a tig root bead. Most of those were younger though.
I know guys that mig very well, cant weld anything else, they don't need to though. I know career welders never ran but 2 rods also. I met a few the only thing they could do is a tig root bead. Most of those were younger though.
That is one of the problems with the internet people tend to focus on the one off and that often becomes the basis for their selection. I find that a well rounded education is more beneficial than a single view.
I just wonder how many newbies weld with bic lighters in the pocket.
sberry
Banned
If a guy wants to do common simple stuff it's fine. If he is looking for a career and has a long way to go it's another story. I know guys get by just fine with a small wire welder. If a guy is 20 yrs old, headed in to the construction industry then he should start with stick welder and be able to pass real tests. I can tig,,, but i dont, just got no real use for it.
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sberry
Banned
If a guy has a burning desire for tig i understand it but since we went to a spool gun I havnt tigged in 20 yrs. I have a lot of aluminum but really make hundreds, maybe more steel for every time I need aluminum.
Ozwelder
Well-known member
Just as someone who taught welding for a long long time ,I would say learn stick first. If considering a purchase of a machine the consideration is to look at what what you are likely to be working on- ie: sheet metal,medium thickness stock or building a battleship as the choices for each are different.
If the answer is sheetmetal & medium stock materials one of the mid range inverter control AC input- DC output,inverter welders is the machine for you. I would choose one of the mid range units say up to 200 amps and that is likely to cover most of your general shop needs.
Couple it it with a good quality brand auto darkening lense helmet and most of the frustration in learning is appreciably lessened. Notice I said most.
While you can start with with a structured night course that option is not always available to some folks.
With mentoring of some type, its quite possible to pick up the rudiments online and from quality sources.Some u tube stuff is good and some is ****. A good source of reliable info is Miller Welding If you go here :
https://www.millerwelds.com/resources/welding-resources/stick-welding-resources
and download and print out the guidelines its a very hand booklet to walk you through the
the basics of stick welding. A draw back is that it is a bit,reading intensive and some would rather learn from a uTube.
If you choose that route please look for someone that has welded for many years and not someone who has only known how to weld for a few years and is using the u tube portal to make money and sell products and yet disseminate very little useful welding information to the viewer. I would recommend, Jodie, the welding tips and tricks guy as being very helpful.
I will say though, if your aspirations run to being a "pro welder" you really must do some structured courses as other have said theres no quick way. You will need equipment and huge amounts of practice to achieve what is considered "Pro Standards". Either way structured courses cannot hurt.
best of luck
Ozwelder
If the answer is sheetmetal & medium stock materials one of the mid range inverter control AC input- DC output,inverter welders is the machine for you. I would choose one of the mid range units say up to 200 amps and that is likely to cover most of your general shop needs.
Couple it it with a good quality brand auto darkening lense helmet and most of the frustration in learning is appreciably lessened. Notice I said most.
While you can start with with a structured night course that option is not always available to some folks.
With mentoring of some type, its quite possible to pick up the rudiments online and from quality sources.Some u tube stuff is good and some is ****. A good source of reliable info is Miller Welding If you go here :
https://www.millerwelds.com/resources/welding-resources/stick-welding-resources
and download and print out the guidelines its a very hand booklet to walk you through the
the basics of stick welding. A draw back is that it is a bit,reading intensive and some would rather learn from a uTube.
If you choose that route please look for someone that has welded for many years and not someone who has only known how to weld for a few years and is using the u tube portal to make money and sell products and yet disseminate very little useful welding information to the viewer. I would recommend, Jodie, the welding tips and tricks guy as being very helpful.
I will say though, if your aspirations run to being a "pro welder" you really must do some structured courses as other have said theres no quick way. You will need equipment and huge amounts of practice to achieve what is considered "Pro Standards". Either way structured courses cannot hurt.
best of luck
Ozwelder
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In 2004 I couldn't weld but I wanted to. In 2005 I bought a MIG and a TIG with money I scraped together by any means necessary. I immediately welded several projects (welding table, seat brackets, stupid stuff), took photos, uploaded them on weld forums, got feedback and improved more and more. In 2006 I started fabricating forced induction systems out of a 1 car garage. In 2007 I started fabricating headers, intake manifolds and more one off forced induction systems and got a 3k sqft shop. In 2010 I obtained a partner, moved to a 12k sqft shop and started fabricating entire car chassis from scratch, doing more forced induction systems and even had the car I fabricated on SPEEDTV Battle of the Supercars that Tanner Foust drove. By 2012 I'd toured the country with 3 prototypes we built and fabricated everything from carbon fiber, to metal, to clay, and I drove a Lamborghini Diablo to work.
No school...just do it.
No school...just do it.
sberry
Banned
There are guys that can do this, for every 1 there is 4 or 5 self learned types not worth a ****. Good share of "auto" mechanics this way too. Same for sitting down with a box of rod, most wont make it thru, not much better than when they started. I have seen guys burn 1000s, never realize theirs do t look like the next guys and they often seem to "know more" about it that other people do. They usually use a lot of statements like,,, that don't matter etc.
There is also 1 rod that is the "best" too and the others are junk.
There is also 1 rod that is the "best" too and the others are junk.
ilovevocs
Well-known member
^^ My welding instructor told me he has never met a bad welder.
When asked for clarification he told me the ones who can't weld think they know it all and that's why they can't learn to improve upon their skill set.
When asked for clarification he told me the ones who can't weld think they know it all and that's why they can't learn to improve upon their skill set.
velocipede
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I agree. Great place to start.
vettex2
Banned
If you don't buy a welder and practice, all the schools in the world won't matter.
Having said that, schools and vids are a good thing.
You need BOTH
Having said that, schools and vids are a good thing.
You need BOTH
Furious Filipino
Well-known member
I really had no interest in welding until last year, when my projects dictated that I be able to fuse metal back together in addition to cutting, machining and bolting.
I'm lucky that I have a community college that is less than 10 minutes away. Being on the Engineering side of alternative fuel projects, I honestly had a vested interest in knowing how.
The course is 45 minutes of classroom and 5 hours of lab/hands-on split over two days for the Stick & Flux Core class last semester, and again for the TIG & MIG class this semester. There's a whole curriculum that can get people out and working in 2 years, and the class track I'm taking is geared for those that want to get certified and pass real weld tests.
I honestly would say that even if I had my own machine, the amount of under hood time and instant feedback from the instructors (all of whom have welded for a lifetime and are inspectors themselves) is invaluable.
You can learn a lot from the internet, but what you don't get is that trained eye telling you that your torch angle is too shallow or your travel speed is too fast, or you are going to warp this plate if you weld continuously, etc.... You can sort of quantify that by trial and error yourself, but having someone there, having an instructor accelerates the process.
When I thought I was "good," then they would have me re-do the project horizontal, then vertical, overhead, then maybe in a cramped spot like under the table...
There were guys that thought they were "good," but none of their test plates passed. None. The guys who only thought they were OK or people who had no experience at all (me), fared much, much better.
The problem with practice on your own is you could be developing bad habits or techniques, and it's harder to un-learn than to learn it right the first time.
I'm lucky that I have a community college that is less than 10 minutes away. Being on the Engineering side of alternative fuel projects, I honestly had a vested interest in knowing how.
The course is 45 minutes of classroom and 5 hours of lab/hands-on split over two days for the Stick & Flux Core class last semester, and again for the TIG & MIG class this semester. There's a whole curriculum that can get people out and working in 2 years, and the class track I'm taking is geared for those that want to get certified and pass real weld tests.
I honestly would say that even if I had my own machine, the amount of under hood time and instant feedback from the instructors (all of whom have welded for a lifetime and are inspectors themselves) is invaluable.
You can learn a lot from the internet, but what you don't get is that trained eye telling you that your torch angle is too shallow or your travel speed is too fast, or you are going to warp this plate if you weld continuously, etc.... You can sort of quantify that by trial and error yourself, but having someone there, having an instructor accelerates the process.
When I thought I was "good," then they would have me re-do the project horizontal, then vertical, overhead, then maybe in a cramped spot like under the table...
There were guys that thought they were "good," but none of their test plates passed. None. The guys who only thought they were OK or people who had no experience at all (me), fared much, much better.
The problem with practice on your own is you could be developing bad habits or techniques, and it's harder to un-learn than to learn it right the first time.
trackwelder
Well-known member
In 2004 I couldn't weld but I wanted to. In 2005 I bought a MIG and a TIG with money I scraped together by any means necessary. I immediately welded several projects (welding table, seat brackets, stupid stuff), took photos, uploaded them on weld forums, got feedback and improved more and more. In 2006 I started fabricating forced induction systems out of a 1 car garage. In 2007 I started fabricating headers, intake manifolds and more one off forced induction systems and got a 3k sqft shop. In 2010 I obtained a partner, moved to a 12k sqft shop and started fabricating entire car chassis from scratch, doing more forced induction systems and even had the car I fabricated on SPEEDTV Battle of the Supercars that Tanner Foust drove. By 2012 I'd toured the country with 3 prototypes we built and fabricated everything from carbon fiber, to metal, to clay, and I drove a Lamborghini Diablo to work.
No school...just do it.
Terrible advice.
marineengineer
Well-known member
Pm sent im in south western Vermont and could give you pointers. I do alot of stick and tig welding at work. Both pipe and structural steel onboard ships. I have tig and stick along with oxy propane at my house i could give you feedback and pointers if you wanted to meet
Terrible advice.
That is one of the issues of the internet you can always find one extreme view and say that is my example.
stsmytherie
Well-known member
@Jon_E I missed that you are in SW VT first time around.
The Stafford Tech course seems on the expensive side per hour (I got twice the class time for half the money down at Bristol TEC in CT). OTOH the max class size is very small so you're going to get good teacher feedback and it seems to be all we have for classroom instruction around here, if that's something that appeals to you. I'd suggest going over and checking it out in person, talking to the instructors if you can and see if it's going to meet your needs.
There used to be a course in Bennington, but I think it was maybe for HS kids. Edit: it's listed here in the SVCDC catalog, but no details. Maybe worth calling: http://www.svcdc.org/index.php
As I mentioned earlier, the school approach worked best for me. Lots of time under the helmet, and a few pointers from the teachers that got me through those Aha! moments to finally laying some decent beads.
marineengineer's offer is very generous and might be what you need to get going. I'm nearby, too, but have nothing in the way of expertise to offer. Still learning myself.
FWIW, both Maine Oxy and Mac Equipment & Steel in Rutland are run by super nice folks. Drop by and ask them for advice. When you get going, return the favor by buying your supplies and steel from them.
Good luck!
The Stafford Tech course seems on the expensive side per hour (I got twice the class time for half the money down at Bristol TEC in CT). OTOH the max class size is very small so you're going to get good teacher feedback and it seems to be all we have for classroom instruction around here, if that's something that appeals to you. I'd suggest going over and checking it out in person, talking to the instructors if you can and see if it's going to meet your needs.
There used to be a course in Bennington, but I think it was maybe for HS kids. Edit: it's listed here in the SVCDC catalog, but no details. Maybe worth calling: http://www.svcdc.org/index.php
As I mentioned earlier, the school approach worked best for me. Lots of time under the helmet, and a few pointers from the teachers that got me through those Aha! moments to finally laying some decent beads.
marineengineer's offer is very generous and might be what you need to get going. I'm nearby, too, but have nothing in the way of expertise to offer. Still learning myself.
FWIW, both Maine Oxy and Mac Equipment & Steel in Rutland are run by super nice folks. Drop by and ask them for advice. When you get going, return the favor by buying your supplies and steel from them.
Good luck!
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