I'll join in hating Sears now

[M. Blue 240]

Can I just point out how ironic it is that a US citizen is complaining about tools not being produced in USA doesn't have $20 to pick up tools! It sounds very "I want the best" but "I can't afford it". Perhaps you're a good example of why the tools are moving overseas?

Not meant to be offensive or critical.

I saved for 2 years to get the tools I wanted. Sadly my money doesn't go to toys, it goes to things my family needs. My full intention is to save and buy tools as I can afford them. I'm not asking them to be produced for cheaper, I'm not asking for discounts, I just want the opprotunity to get them some day.

My Dad and Grandfather saved up and pieced together sets. CM was the best they could hope to afford and its the same for me. I'd love to deck my garage out in SO, but that would cost more then the value of all 3 of my cars.

If your town has an Ace Hardware give them a look.

I know of one 25 minutes away, so I might have to make the drive. Growing up we had a bunch of nice family owned hardware and lumbar places, but they all went out of business when Home Depot and Lowes came into town (I have 3 Home Depots within 10 minutes of me).

BUY USED.

I spent last night on eBay. Hopefully next summer I won't be working 7 days a week and can hit some estate sales.

What's there to be confused?

The 240 was the vintage Craftsman... well-made in Sweden and a quality car for a decent price.

Then, like modern-day Craftsman moving to China, Volvo got bought by Ford, shifted production overseas and turned into Ford Taurus clones for the same higher price.

Well said. I wouldn't touch a new Volvo if you offered to buy it for me. To be fair though there are very few new cars I would want to own.

Growing up in the Republic of Portlandia I didn't see much pride for American made products. Now that I've gained some national pride I have a new eye for old American iron. If I get the funds for another project car I'll find a '65 Mustang to fix up.

So... you bought a set knowing that Craftsman was moving production overseas, admittingly in hopes you'd have time to buy before it was gone... you didn't, and now you hate an entire company for it?

The feeling is mutual... Sears hates you

I actualy had no idea they were leaving the US. I didn't learn about it until I joined on here.

Maybe he only buys used cars so 100% of the money stays in the states...I have a Volvo, VW, and Toyota all gotten used.

I've never owned a new car and will probably never have one. I kind of like it that way though. I once said that each new car I buy has to be older than the last one I bought. I have an '89 and '71, by the end of the summer I'll be adding an '83. I'm really excited about the new (to me) car. Its been sitting in a garage for 10+ years and I was asked if I could save it.

 

[otis66]

I think we all know that Sears has been in trouble for quite a few years now. I wouldn't be surprised if the Craftsman line had the best retail numbers of any Sears products sold. Returns on investment is what I'm talking about. By outsourcing off the US shore and expanding their selling market (Ace Hardware, Menards and Kmart) they are probably hoping to increase market share and sales. If it falls flat, we'll all know about it when Sears goes belly up. It's not just a sign of what Sears has become but it mirrors the USA in general as said many times before.

100% of 0 is 0.

 

[Strouty]

On top of that he has a "Volvo for life" banner

Be nice

 

[cgv69]

More "foreign" cars are built in the US than American cars - VW, Subaru, BMW, Hyundai, Toyota, Kia...

70% of GM cars are made outside the US

I buy US stuff when able but my job is not to buy a new product to give someone a job, sorry, you are way out of line here. I'm not in debt like the majority of Americans because of it.

You think you are telling me something? My wife works at Toyota's North American headquarters so I know all about it but the point is, Volvo isn't one of those companies making cars here or creating much in the way of US jobs.

 

[RedFordTruck]

Volvo is owned by a Chinese company now. Look on their cars and theyre filled with Chinese parts. I know someone who has one and on all the windows it says China in little letters below the number code and other little box of text in the corner of the window.



Sure, my American made Truck has Foreign parts. But I take pride in the fact that it was Built Ford Tough in Kansas City with an American made Engine and Transmission.

And I applaud the Foreign Carmakers for bringing production over here to America.

Toyota makes a good number of their Cars here. Not that I'd ever want a Tundra ( ) But theyre made in Texas for whatever its worth. BMW is making their X series in SC. Mercedes is rolling em out in Alabama. But I have yet to see an American made Volvo.


Damn I got off topic...



F*** Sears.

 

[TSirotock]

Its a Question of Value. A good-natured rant.

Like many I grew up with a Craftsman tool box filled with mostly Craftsman tools that were used to fix things. Cars, toys, bikes, appliances, etc. In keeping with tradition I longed to buy the big box and fill it with every tool, wearing out the pages of my catalogs as I dreamed of tools yet to be owned.

Craftsman was the tool I learned was great quality for a good price, attainable tools for the DIY, shade-tree, handy jack-of-all-trades man. Snap-On and such were the tools the pro's used, great if you could afford or find used, but priced and made for the guys who made a living with their tools.

I add tools for the jobs I do around my house and on my stuff. I have a great collection, but far from the mega-box with every tool in the catalog. I am guilty of collecting too, filling out sets with tools I know I may never once use or buying a tool just because it is on clearance or too cool to not have. I have HF tools too, cheap one-time use tools or acceptable substitutes until I can step-up, and Kobalt and Husky and others that were gifted, acquired in a pinch or just better. Yet I choose Craftsman because for the money I always felt I got more quality than the price tag and it proudly was Made in USA.

I knew Craftsman was under threat when Bankrupt K-Mart bought the company. I was disappointed when things fell out of the line-up and the employees became just cashiers. I got worried when the catalog stopped being offered.

Evolv I assume is taken from the word evolution. Evolution we assume to be improvement, progress. It is a cheaper version of the tools. That is the direction they chose. Management sees cheaper as the standard and given how we Americans seem in love with "New Lower Price" or "Price Roll-back", maybe they are right. But Value is not equal to lower price just as a higher price does not always give greater value.

Moving production to China or elsewhere means lower cost and greater profit, the gold standard of Capitalism. But it is still up to us to use our Dollars to vote. I still buy American when it is up to quality and I have the choice. I still will. It is not simply knee-jerk Nationalism. The closer Dollars stay to home the sooner they return to my wallet.

I will love my Craftsman tools and Sears, but I hope it will not be only for my vintage tools that represent a by-gone era. And if Sears goes the Walmart way, good for them, I will wait to buy at the new company that sees an opportunity to sell Made in USA at a great price with more quality than you expected. Capitalism keeps the wheel turning.

 

[concealer404]

I thought it was pretty obvious but I guess I have to spell it out. In the OP's original post, he states he wants only US made tools but presumably by his avatar, he only buys foreign made cars. I find that to be a funny contradiction.

In reality, he has helped contribute to the very thing he's bitching about! The Economy does not operate in a vacuum. Everything you buy from chewing gum to silverware to tools to cars all have an effect on each other.

In this case the way it works is: the more people buying foreign cars, the less cars Detroit makes. The less cars they make, the fewer employees they need and the fewer parts they need from suppliers. The fewer parts being made by suppliers, the fewer employees those suppliers need and that flows all the way down the supply line.

The fewer skilled tradesman in US factories, the fewer tools being bought in the US. The more people unemployed in the US, the fewer people buying tools in the US. The fewer tools being bought, the more the US tools suppliers have to find ways to cut costs.

So the next time the OP wants to be get mad about Chinese made Craftsman tools he needs to remember he helped play a role in making it happen

Please let us know what car is readily available for the average US citizen to buy that doesn't support any country other than the US.

 

[concealer404]

Apparently

And that's different how? It's not about keeping the money in the US, it's about keeping the American worker working. If you only buy used foreign cars, you're still not buying new American cars. Less American cars bought, less built. Less built, less employees, etc., etc., etc..

I'm so sorry that some of us can't afford new cars. If you'd like to supplement my income, i'd think about it, though!

You think you are telling me something? My wife works at Toyota's North American headquarters so I know all about it but the point is, Volvo isn't one of those companies making cars here or creating much in the way of US jobs.

You should tell her to stop supporting the evil countries that aren't the US and get a job somewhere else. (This is a joke, but surely you can see the humor considering the course of this thread, yes? )

 

[allinon72]

I bought a US made chisel at Sears today. Asked the kid at the checkout if he was Chinese. He just looked at me funny. Then he gave me 10% off. And gave me a coupon for $15 off my next purchase of $100 or more. I'm pretty sure he would have carried the chisel to my car for me if I'd asked.


Lumpy

You Played on Lawrence Welk?
Yes but no blue notes. Just blue hairs.

www.LumpyMusic.com

At this point I'm convinced you have the worlds greatest Sears store.

 

[concealer404]

At this point I'm convinced you have the worlds greatest Sears store.

Ditto.

The cashier at mine would have just looked at my with a blank stare and said "uh...... huh?" while a line of drool traveled from his mouth to his shirt.

 

[BrokewrenchLS1]

Ditto.

The cashier at mine would have just looked at my with a blank stare and said "uh...... huh?" while a line of drool traveled from his mouth to his shirt.

If the cashier at your store can talk and drool at the same time, that's a step up from most of the non-"hometown" ones around here.

 

[concealer404]

If the cashier at your store can talk and drool at the same time, that's a step up from most of the non-"hometown" ones around here.

I think in this case, he drooled first. The drool was just traveling after the fact, while he was speaking.

 

[pipsters]

Volvo is owned by a Chinese company now. Look on their cars and theyre filled with Chinese parts. I know someone who has one and on all the windows it says China in little letters below the number code and other little box of text in the corner of the window.

No Volvo cars yet are made in China. The Chinese components in the Volvo cars now would be the same as any in Ford cars (Geely bought Volvo earlier this year or last year, not long enough to impart any changes in supply lines on current production cars).

Sure, my American made Truck has Foreign parts. But I take pride in the fact that it was Built Ford Tough in Kansas City with an American made Engine and Transmission.

And I applaud the Foreign Carmakers for bringing production over here to America.

Toyota makes a good number of their Cars here. Not that I'd ever want a Tundra ( ) But theyre made in Texas for whatever its worth. BMW is making their X series in SC. Mercedes is rolling em out in Alabama. But I have yet to see an American made Volvo. :dunno

Sadly your F150 doesn't even make the top 10, however the Tundra does:

 

[pipsters]

You think you are telling me something? My wife works at Toyota's North American headquarters so I know all about it but the point is, Volvo isn't one of those companies making cars here or creating much in the way of US jobs.

No they aren't but it doesn't matter when you are talking used cars, are you trying to be difficult?

 

[theoldwizard1]

Its a Question of Value.
...
I will love my Craftsman tools and Sears, but I hope it will not be only for my vintage tools that represent a by-gone era. And if Sears goes the Walmart way, good for them, I will wait to buy at the new company that sees an opportunity to sell Made in USA at a great price with more quality than you expected.

You sound a lot like me. I would be less upset with Craftsman going outside the US if the customer perceived quality had stayed the same. Lower quality and same price just don't cut it.

In the mean time where can I find a brand that "sells Made in USA at a great (I'll take good) price with more quality than you expected" ?

 

[pipsters]

Do you guys really think quality will go DOWN moving to the Chinese production? I do not. I think the biggest issue with the Craftsman stuff was the chroming on them, the new Chinese tools are chromed perfectly with "real" chrome. I would bet quality will actually go up moving to the Chinese product, however it does kind of burn me that prices aren't dropping - they should drop significantly do to the much lower cost of manufacturing over there.

 

[pipsters]

You sound a lot like me. I would be less upset with Craftsman going outside the US if the customer perceived quality had stayed the same. Lower quality and same price just don't cut it.

In the mean time where can I find a brand that "sells Made in USA at a great (I'll take good) price with more quality than you expected" ?

While Craftsman was a single brand they were manufactured by various companies. Western Forge made the screwdrivers, Danaher made the sockets/ratchets/extensions, Mayhew and Wilde made the prybars, Ullman made the picks, the list goes on. You can still get the same products they will just cost you more, and there is no single brand that does one-stop-shopping other than Snap-On.

 

[transittech]

Do you guys really think quality will go DOWN moving to the Chinese production? I do not. I think the biggest issue with the Craftsman stuff was the chroming on them, the new Chinese tools are chromed perfectly with "real" chrome. I would bet quality will actually go up moving to the Chinese product, however it does kind of burn me that prices aren't dropping - they should drop significantly do to the much lower cost of manufacturing over there.

The craftsman CEO needs a new yacht. Prolly got a fat bonus for lowering costs.

 

[Notwerk]

If you really want new USA Craftsman, Armstrong and Matco are probably what you're looking for. It's all Danaher.

As for future purchases, SK and Williams USA could use the support. They make quality tools in the USA, and they make better tools than Craftsman has in a very, very long time. As far as I know, Blackhawk sockets and wrenches are also USA (ratchets are US of global components).

Not sure that I understand the moaning about the demise of Craftsman. Yes, it was convenient, but we all know they had been in a steep decline for some time. Sure, you could easily warranty that inferior tool...or you could just buy SK and Williams USA and not worry so much about having to use that warranty when a crappy RP ratchet free wheels.

There are better USA options out there. Stop throwing your money at Sears and Danaher and support the companies that have committed to keeping their production here at home.

 

[cgv69]

are you trying to be difficult?

No, just the opposite. My original point was pretty simple and true. Why you all are tying to argue it out is beyond me

Let me be as clear as I can....

IMO - Demanding US made tools while flying the flag of a foreign Automaker seems awful hypocritical to me.

 

[pipsters]

No, just the opposite. My original point was pretty simple and true. Why you all are tying to argue it out is beyond me

Let me be as clear as I can....

IMO - Demanding US made tools while flying the flag of a foreign Automaker seems awful hypocritical to me.

Buying US branded imported product is even more hypocritical...but its sold every day.

People like what they like, I grew up on Volvos so I like them as well, but have a toolbox full of US made Craftsman. Can't buy Swedish made hand tools anywhere so its a moot point.

 

[concealer404]

No, just the opposite. My original point was pretty simple and true. Why you all are tying to argue it out is beyond me

Let me be as clear as I can....

IMO - Demanding US made tools while flying the flag of a foreign Automaker seems awful hypocritical to me.

So does demanding US made tools while wearing foreign made clothes.
So does demanding US made tools while driving cars made primarily of parts produced elsewhere.
So does demanding US made tools while having a wife that works for a foreign automaker.


It really all just depends on what you're personally willing to turn a blind eye to. I prefer to turn a blind eye to nothing, and rather just focus on buying the best i can, which supports GOOD manufacturing and helps mankind move forward.

Why for whatever reason tools and cars are the goods that most commonly seem to be affected by these horribly stupid and irrational arguments, i have no idea. It is what it is, i guess.

In the end, Sears doesn't give a **** what you think, or what i think. They're going overseas because it makes more money. You don't like it, don't buy it, and that should have been the end of this dumb thread on the first page. I didn't like it, so i stopped buying Craftsman.

 

[cgv69]

I'm so sorry that some of us can't afford new cars. If you'd like to supplement my income, i'd think about it, though![/quote]
My name ain't Obama. If you can't afford a new car then that your own probably bubba.

You should tell her to stop supporting the evil countries that aren't the US and get a job somewhere else. (This is a joke, but surely you can see the humor considering the course of this thread, yes? )

The problem here is people are taking things out of context or making broad assumptions based on specific comments.

My original comments were directed specifically at the OP for what I consider a hypocritical stance.

Overall I agree that IMO, a Toyota made in my state is more "American" then my Chevy truck that was made in Canada. I will also admit I don't always buy American, even when I have a choice because I believe in buying the best quality products I can afford and more and more, that does not mean made in the USA. I'd say 30-50% of my tool purchases this year have been for German made tools. Then again, I'm not one of the guys here crying about Craftsman production moving to China either.

I honestly have no issue with the OP buying Volvo's (new or used) and I think his demand for US made tools has more to do with his OCD inspired desire to finish out his tool collection with matching tools then anything political but again, I just found those 2 seemingly competing desires hypocritical

 

[cgv69]

I swear you two idiots are fighting with me just for the sake of it!

Look, IMO its hypocritical. If you don't agree so what, I really don't care

ETA For the record -

1. I'm not the one demanding US made tools
2. I'm not the one bitching about Craftsman moving production to China

 

[concealer404]

Fair enough. I'll agree that at its core, it's hypocritical as stated. So's everything else listed here.

My point was that if i can't afford something new and nice made in the US, i'm still going to try to get the best "bang for my buck." And that applies to ALL goods, and it has nothing to do with having pride in my country, and i really shouldn't have to catch any flak over it simply because i desire good products that i can afford.


It sounds like we're on the same page for the most part. Come on up for a beer.

 

[RedFordTruck]

No Volvo cars yet are made in China. The Chinese components in the Volvo cars now would be the same as any in Ford cars (Geely bought Volvo earlier this year or last year, not long enough to impart any changes in supply lines on current production cars).



Sadly your F150 doesn't even make the top 10, however the Tundra does:

I was just referencing the Chinese windshields/windows in a friends 2012 S60.



I saw an article with the most American made cars and you wanna know #1? Lol Ford Econoline van. Apparantly 95 % USA and Canadian Parts.

Im proud of my F150 though. Theres a reason its been the best selling vehicle in America for 34 years running!

But I do applaud Toyota for Building the Tundra in America. Dodge and Chevy both build a good number of Rams and Silverados in Mexico. The Hemi V8 is made in Mexico. But the Tundra and the Nissan Titan are both made in America.

I wouldnt want a Tundra. They've got a decent engine(Good HP, ****** mileage), but Ive seen Tonka Trucks with thicker body metal.

The Best built trucks are built Ford Tough!

Back on subject...I keep American made tools in my Mexican made Toolbox in my American Made Truck.

On another note...I wonder why we dont see many Mexican made Hand tools? Sears has Mexican made plastic tool boxes, and my Kobalt Brand Diamondplate Truck box is Mexican, but You never see Screwdrivers or wrenches or ratchets "Made in Mexico"

 

[mmack66]

Do you guys really think quality will go DOWN moving to the Chinese production? I do not. I think the biggest issue with the Craftsman stuff was the chroming on them, the new Chinese tools are chromed perfectly with "real" chrome. I would bet quality will actually go up moving to the Chinese product, however it does kind of burn me that prices aren't dropping - they should drop significantly do to the much lower cost of manufacturing over there.

I don't know about the quality of the steel, but some of those Chinese Craftsman combination wrenches have an open end that is about 75% bigger than the USA made counterpart.

Why would anyone expect the prices to drop on the Chinese Craftsman tools? Higher profits is the main reason for offshore manufacturing.

 

[cgv69]

My point was that if i can't afford something new and nice made in the US, i'm still going to try to get the best "bang for my buck." And that applies to ALL goods, and it has nothing to do with having pride in my country, and i really shouldn't have to catch any flak over it simply because i desire good products that i can afford.

I guess we do because I pretty much agree with your statement above. My comments about the economy not being a vacuum and that every purchase we make has an effect on the rest or the market is true but that doesn't mean I blindly subscribe to the buy American just because it's made in American theory.

 

[HandyManny]

I was just referencing the Chinese windshields/windows in a friends 2012 S60.



I saw an article with the most American made cars and you wanna know #1? Lol Ford Econoline van. Apparantly 95 % USA and Canadian Parts.

Im proud of my F150 though. Theres a reason its been the best selling vehicle in America for 34 years running!

But I do applaud Toyota for Building the Tundra in America. Dodge and Chevy both build a good number of Rams and Silverados in Mexico. The Hemi V8 is made in Mexico. But the Tundra and the Nissan Titan are both made in America.

I wouldnt want a Tundra. They've got a decent engine(Good HP, ****** mileage), but Ive seen Tonka Trucks with thicker body metal.

The Best built trucks are built Ford Tough!

Back on subject...I keep American made tools in my Mexican made Toolbox in my American Made Truck.

On another note...I wonder why we dont see many Mexican made Hand tools? Sears has Mexican made plastic tool boxes, and my Kobalt Brand Diamondplate Truck box is Mexican, but You never see Screwdrivers or wrenches or ratchets "Made in Mexico"

Proto once had a facility in Mexico for making Proto tools for the Mexican market. Eventually that facility became Mexican owned and they still produce Proto clones of some tools under a different brand name. Right now I think Mexico is making mega $$$$$ from another industry that many Americans are supporting, if you get my drift!

 

[Patrick123]

M. Blue 240 used tools are the way to go if you get the time to go to estate sales etc. And if I was buying new US I would buy SK. If not SK then Kobalt probably since it is easy to find a Lowes to exchange stuff.

 

[Notwerk]

Proto once had a facility in Mexico for making Proto tools for the Mexican market. Eventually that facility became Mexican owned and they still produce Proto clones of some tools under a different brand name. Right now I think Mexico is making mega $$$$$ from another industry that many Americans are supporting, if you get my drift!

You're thinking of Urrea, I believe.

 

[Jure]

I don't know about the quality of the steel, but some of those Chinese Craftsman combination wrenches have an open end that is about 75% bigger than the USA made counterpart.

Why would anyone expect the prices to drop on the Chinese Craftsman tools? Higher profits is the main reason for offshore manufacturing.

its all about steel quality,i dont care if its made in china if steel is same as german,us steel,etc etc... but their steel is junk...weak junk.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Not sure that I understand the moaning about the demise of Craftsman. Yes, it was convenient, but we all know they had been in a steep decline for some time. Sure, you could easily warranty that inferior tool...or you could just buy SK and Williams USA and not worry so much about having to use that warranty when a crappy RP ratchet free wheels.

First, for the homeowner/"shade tree mechanic" cost, quality and convenience (of purchase/replacement) are probably the most important attributes of a tool ! Knowing that I can go to a nearby store and buy a specific, quality tool at a reasonable price is why I choose Craftsman tools.

In 40 years of Craftsman tool use, I have had only a handful of failures. I had to warranty a flex head 3/8 ratchet a few years ago. I wish I had kept it and gotten a repair kit as the replacement, IMHO, is just not as nice (perceived quality).


At my age, new tool purchases are far and few between.

Are Irwin Vise Grips made in the USA ? I just bought a set of 3.

 

[geologist]

Chinese breaker bar???? Really???? I just bought a 3/8" USA made Craftsman breaker. My 1/2" is SK though 8)

 

[RedFordTruck]

First, for the homeowner/"shade tree mechanic" cost, quality and convenience (of purchase/replacement) are probably the most important attributes of a tool ! Knowing that I can go to a nearby store and buy a specific, quality tool at a reasonable price is why I choose Craftsman tools.

In 40 years of Craftsman tool use, I have had only a handful of failures. I had to warranty a flex head 3/8 ratchet a few years ago. I wish I had kept it and gotten a repair kit as the replacement, IMHO, is just not as nice (perceived quality).


At my age, new tool purchases are far and few between.

Are Irwin Vise Grips made in the USA ? I just bought a set of 3.

Newer ones are not as of 2008/2009. Is there a little Hex key slot in the bolt that adjusts them? Is the release lever held in by a little rolled metal pin you can see through or by a solid rivet?

 

[maxspeed96ct]

So does demanding US made tools while wearing foreign made clothes.
So does demanding US made tools while driving cars made primarily of parts produced elsewhere.
So does demanding US made tools while having a wife that works for a foreign automaker.


In the end, Sears doesn't give a **** what you think, or what i think. They're going overseas because it makes more money. You don't like it, don't buy it, and that should have been the end of this dumb thread on the first page. I didn't like it, so i stopped buying Craftsman.

Yup this ^^^^ sums it up, I think any other sears bashing threads should be locked . Because it seems like some guys are just bored an want to beat a dead horse, there's 2-3 threads a day poping up with the same ****.

 

[magova1104]

In every Sears store I visited recently, still have some tools made in USA. It might be a matter of time when they are sold and then everything will be made in China. I don't think buying Chinese tools greatly help the country's economy, maybe help some millionaires out there.
It makes no sense to compare tools with clothes or vehicles. Each country does something good and something good out of the United States were his tools.
I have lucky enough to have many years in my work and I have all the tools I need, all made in USA. If I need something I will not buy a single tool made in China, in which case would look on eBay.
The other day I saw a customer in Sears/Craftsman tools section,he was looking for a ratchet and I told him: "Grab the last one in the row,that one still USA made", he looked at me like WTF! and he said: " I thought all Craftsman tools were USA made".
He grab the ratchet (USA) and thank me for letting him know.

 

[magova1104]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i think that chinise in the near future will rule the word!
__________________

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmhhhhhh...........................no. I won't let that happen! You guys can sleep well. I will watch your dreams.

 

[JerseyBoatBuilder]

So does demanding US made tools while wearing foreign made clothes.
So does demanding US made tools while driving cars made primarily of parts produced elsewhere.

In the end, Sears doesn't give a **** what you think, or what i think. They're going overseas because it makes more money. You don't like it, don't buy it, and that should have been the end of this dumb thread on the first page. I didn't like it, so i stopped buying Craftsman.

The same thought comes to mind every time I waste time for laughs reading these types of threads.

 

[HaroRider]

I have OCD with my sockets as well.. I would like to keep them all American made craftsman if at all possible.