I'm done with HF VS. Others

[King Bojack]

Perhaps we can get a sticky made that is a basic HF vs. The World argument thread for those who find online battles interesting and can simultaneously cordon such activity off from the rest of the board? Best of both worlds? Ban those who don't argue in the correct area and voila.

Perhaps this is a terrible idea. Still quite new here and don't have this place down 100% yet.

 

[GeorgiaHybrid]

Sorry man, wasn't trying to start a war. The original intent was basically; look how much I got for so little. And, it works, not total ****. That's all.

John, a lot of the skepticism about your posts were not about the tools. We just had a member that was caught telling some pretty tall tales about a bunch of stuff he never did. Some of your comments about how much you made and what you did seemed to bring those thoughts back to a lot of people (myself included). Your tools just seemed to be too "clean" to have seen much use.

That would not be a problem if the pictures were taken just after you bought them but just to say you are '****" and keep them wiped down means that they are clean, not spotless. I am about as **** as anyone on this board (except maybe Merk....) about the appearance and arrangement of my tools. When they were new, they looked like yours but given the amount of work that you claimed to do with them, one would expect them to at least look like they have been out of the box. I think that you took the photos right after you bought the tools and that is the reason for their pristine condition but it would help disperse the skepticism if you verified that.

Please understand that it's not that we don't trust people on this board, we do. It is just that recent events have caused a bunch of us to be more of a "doubting Thomas" than a "trusting soul" when it comes to a relatively new member. In case you are wondering, most of my box is SO and SK with some Mac, Matco and other 'known" brands thrown in for good luck. There are also HF, Northern Tool, GRIP and others thrown into the mix as well. A large percentage of us on this board probably have the same HF jack stands as I have and if you look real close, there are some German tools in the box also.

I even have an imported wife (she was born in Illinois...........Yankee land...............) that probably has quite a few of my ancestors rolling over in their moldy graves....

I never got in on the other threads that are closed now as buying tools depend on too many factors; price, ability to pay, how they "feel", service that you need after the sale, country of origin, pride of ownership, how often the tool will be used and warranty service all bring their own problems to the table and those factors will determine what an individual buys. If someone asks for an opinion, and I think that I can help, I will try to give them an informed decision. I think that is all that Ryan is asking out of us, answer a legit question and don't get into an argument if someone disagrees with our observations.

 

[iandh]

I don't see Harbor Freight as the culprit here. It's those that start threads attempting to compare Harbor Freight to Snap On and posit that HF is just as good. That sets off a chain reaction that usually ends up in the thread being closed. Then someone grouses about it in another thread and it starts back up again.

That is part of the problem, but the other part is the people who refuse to admit that import tools are getting better and better by the day.

There was a time that I wouldn't touch an HF ratchet with a 10ft pole, and now there's a couple (such as the composite and roto-head) that are not only good, they're great.

I know premium tools. I love good tools, and I own many... some of them have expensive name brands, and some don't.

Assuming that Name brand A is ALWAYS **** when compared to Name brand B, is just a bad mindset to have... especially on a productive and useful discussion forum like this. Not only is it incorrect in some cases, it's a sure way to start a fight.

I've noticed that since you made your post, it seems that more folks have owned up to owning HF or other import tools. Your posts were what seemed to pushed the most rabid "buy USA or your a douchebag" nut jobs over the edge. Before they were just barely tolerable, but lately it has killed the mood around here. Maybe with Mickey D gone for a few days the mood will kick back up a bit. Oh, and I still like your HF boxes...

I think encouraging people to buy USA tools if possible is a GREAT thing to do... but not at the expense of them missing out on many of the high quality and low priced imports there are to be had.

Also, taking a militant approach about ANYTHING, whether it be buying USA, or whether it be not "wasting" money on truck brands, is just a guaranteed way to start a flamewar.

I think that is the main problem here... people like Mickey KNOW that their attitude starts flamewars, and instead of recognizing that fact and adjusting their attitude accordingly, they continue to rudely drag the forum across their personal opinions with little respect for other's valid opinions.

I don't have any disrespect for Mickey or his mindset, but I do wish that he would have been a little less militant in sharing that mindset... he may even have had more success turning people to his cause if he had.

 

[hguerrero]

i wonder if this new "negativity" has to do with "new" members? meaning, they haven't posted enough or lurked enough to know the culture on this site...

 

[chevy302dz]

That is part of the problem, but the other part is the people who refuse to admit that import tools are getting better and better by the day.

There was a time that I wouldn't touch an HF ratchet with a 10ft pole, and now there's a couple (such as the composite and roto-head) that are not only good, they're great.

I know premium tools. I love good tools, and I own many... some of them have expensive name brands, and some don't.

Assuming that Name brand A is ALWAYS **** when compared to Name brand B, is just a bad mindset to have... especially on a productive and useful discussion forum like this. Not only is it incorrect in some cases, it's a sure way to start a fight.



I think encouraging people to buy USA tools if possible is a GREAT thing to do... but not at the expense of them missing out on many of the high quality and low priced imports there are to be had.

Also, taking a militant approach about ANYTHING, whether it be buying USA, or whether it be not "wasting" money on truck brands, is just a guaranteed way to start a flamewar.

I think that is the main problem here... people like Mickey KNOW that their attitude starts flamewars, and instead of recognizing that fact and adjusting their attitude accordingly, they continue to rudely drag the forum across their personal opinions with little respect for other's valid opinions.

I don't have any disrespect for Mickey or his mindset, but I do wish that he would have been a little less militant in sharing that mindset... he may even have had more success turning people to his cause if he had.

I think you just summed things up perfectly.

 

[t100]

I'm with Ryan, just tired of it. haters will be haters(both ways). it's like the gun vs. murder.

sometimes it's the tool, sometime it's the one who buys the tool, it will never end.

 

[MechanicNamedJohn]

John, a lot of the skepticism about your posts were not about the tools. We just had a member that was caught telling some pretty tall tales about a bunch of stuff he never did. Some of your comments about how much you made and what you did seemed to bring those thoughts back to a lot of people (myself included). Your tools just seemed to be too "clean" to have seen much use.

That would not be a problem if the pictures were taken just after you bought them but just to say you are '****" and keep them wiped down means that they are clean, not spotless. I am about as **** as anyone on this board (except maybe Merk....) about the appearance and arrangement of my tools. When they were new, they looked like yours but given the amount of work that you claimed to do with them, one would expect them to at least look like they have been out of the box. I think that you took the photos right after you bought the tools and that is the reason for their pristine condition but it would help disperse the skepticism if you verified that.

Please understand that it's not that we don't trust people on this board, we do. It is just that recent events have caused a bunch of us to be more of a "doubting Thomas" than a "trusting soul" when it comes to a relatively new member. In case you are wondering, most of my box is SO and SK with some Mac, Matco and other 'known" brands thrown in for good luck. There are also HF, Northern Tool, GRIP and others thrown into the mix as well. A large percentage of us on this board probably have the same HF jack stands as I have and if you look real close, there are some German tools in the box also.

I even have an imported wife (she was born in Illinois...........Yankee land...............) that probably has quite a few of my ancestors rolling over in their moldy graves....

I never got in on the other threads that are closed now as buying tools depend on too many factors; price, ability to pay, how they "feel", service that you need after the sale, country of origin, pride of ownership, how often the tool will be used and warranty service all bring their own problems to the table and those factors will determine what an individual buys. If someone asks for an opinion, and I think that I can help, I will try to give them an informed decision. I think that is all that Ryan is asking out of us, answer a legit question and don't get into an argument if someone disagrees with our observations.

I can agree with the skepticism. But, all of what I said is true, and in time I should be able to prove myself. Bare with me and have some patience.


The pics are current "I reposted new clearer pics." Some of the tools are slightly scratched and scuffed; the camera flash kinda "blinged them up." And, I will exchange them when the appearance no longer becomes tolerable. This has also been covered "minor case of OCD."


I like this site, the last I want to do is get banned, so I will do my best to behave.

 

[iandh]

I think you just summed things up perfectly.

Yeah, I think some people just have a "me against the world" mentality.

I just did a bit of searching through post histories of a few people that come to mind, and it seems like 90% of all of their posts are negative/argumentative, my way is right and yours is wrong.

It's really a shame because these people go through the forum doing nothing but stirring up ****. Even worse, in their own little world they think that they are contributing by providing their "correct" opinion to all of the "idiots" that surround them.

You really have to wonder what it would be like to occupy the brain case of some of these folks.

FYI it wasn't Mickey or anyone I'll name, I just had a few people come to mind, and got curious once I was rereading this thread. It isn't as I'm some little angel, I have my bad moments just like anyone else... but when your bad moments start to outweigh your good ones, you become a burden to the forum, not an addition.

As I said above, I just can't wrap my head around the fact that some of these people can continue this behavoir for their entire lives, and never correct it even though it's probably been pointed out to them both directly and indirectly by hundreds or even thousands of people.

 

[dlwilson]

...

As I said above, I just can't wrap my head around the fact that some of these people can continue this behavoir for their entire lives, and never correct it even though it's probably been pointed out to them both directly and indirectly by hundreds or even thousands of people.

A bit off-topic, but I have a friend I've known for nearly 20 years, who is always right and will always tell you why. A few years ago he was in his house drinking beer, when a police office knocked on his door and asked him to move the boat trailer temporarily parked in the driveway, as it was extending onto the sidewalk. Things ended with him facedown in the grass with a gun to his head, followed by a night in jail, lawyers, court, anger management, fines, community service, etc.

I don't think what happened was right, but he is a lot less vocal now.

 

[Ryan]

report the argumentative and I"ll handle it... For now, back to tools.