Inch and Metric sets that don't duplicate sizes?

[Wes J]

Back in the day, when most mechanics worked with inch tools, you could buy socket and wrench sets from all the big tool companies that had a full set of inch wrenches or sockets and the metric tools were only for the sizes that were not covered by an equal size inch tool. It seems that everyone has done away with this practice. I'm wondering if that bothers anyone else.

I bought a set of Matco Pro Swing ratcheting wrenches. It has 3/8-3/4 in inch sizes and 8, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, and 17 mm in metric. They don't give you a 5/16 because it's the same as 8mm. Same with 11mm and 7/16, 16mm and 5/8, and 19mm and 3/4. Those sizes are are within 1% of each other in inch and metric. That's well within the tolerance of any fastener you might run into.

I have a set of Snap-On 1/2 drive deep impact sockets. The 3/4 is actually labeled 3/4 - 19mm. Same with the 5/8 which is also labeled 16mm. At the time that set was sold, those sizes were covered by one part number.

I understand that today many guys will not have any inch tools and the tool companies should sell a full set of metric tools. However, it kind of bugs me that I have to buy duplicate sizes unless I piece together a set myself in single sizes.

Am I alone in this sentiment?

 

[Rossco]

Well it all depends really. 12pt heads pretty much need the right size.

9/16 and 14mm are close but sometimes not close enough, same with the others sizes that cross over. 12pt heads are another story.

 

[JJThrasher]

I prefer individuals sometimes it just makes a difference. Or sometimes you can get the wrong one on a damaged fastener and still remove it because of that 1% difference.

 

[Greg85mcss]

I would think the mentality is if you're working on something that's just metric you can grab a rail of metric sockets & not worry about having to go back for that one fastener or vice versa. Some sets do have these skips like the wrenches in my craftsman 309 pc set.


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[Wes J]

I prefer individuals sometimes it just makes a difference. Or sometimes you can get the wrong one on a damaged fastener and still remove it because of that 1% difference.

I highly doubt it makes any difference. 16mm and 5/8 differ by only .004". That's the thickness of a hair. I would bet my lunch that the manufacturing tolerance of the wrench or socket is more than +/- .004, so you might actually end up with a 16mm wrench that is actually smaller than your 5/8.

3/4 and 19mm is even closer.

I will bet my lunch that if I gave you a 8mm & 5/16 with the size marking ground off, you would not be able to tell the difference. Same with 7/16 & 11mm, 5/8 & 16mm, 3/4 & 19mm, 13/16 & 21mm, 15/16 & 24mm, 1-1/16 and 27mm, or 1-1/4 and 32mm.

 

[Wes J]

I would think the mentality is if you're working on something that's just metric you can grab a rail of metric sockets & not worry about having to go back for that one fastener or vice versa.

That's a valid point.

 

[ssdave]

I'd much rather have both sets, complete. That way, I don't have to try to remember which sizes interchange. A few minutes wasted here and there trying to figure out which socket make the extra cost for a complete seem pretty cheap after awhile.

 

[dutchgray]

The only time I would be prepared to not have full sets is in a portable kit, then they would have to be dual marked so I wouldn't have to remember.

 

[Wes J]

I work as an engineer/machinist and in our modern world, I work equally in inch and mm. The conversions are totally natural for me.

 

[Wes J]

The only time I would be prepared to not have full sets is in a portable kit, then they would have to be dual marked so I wouldn't have to remember.

I guess I don't see how it's any harder to remember that a fastener takes a certain inch size rather than a certain metric size.

Figuring that 11mm and 16mm are pretty rarely used sizes, it's just the ones from 19mm (3/4) and up that would be dual purpose.

 

[bwringer]

Well, they can sell more sockets by including all of them.

The thing is, normal people would not understand an "overlap" set. We here on GJ understand it, sure, but out of 100 random citizens, you might find one who could easily grasp the concept.


As for me, I get the idea, but it wouldn't be all that useful to me. 99.9% of the stuff I work on is metric, so all the inch **** just gets stuffed in a drawer. If I were headed to outer Mongolia for a year to keep an unknown assortment of WWII surplus US, Russian, and Chinese machinery running, and if space and weight were at an absolute premium... then I might take a set like this with me.

Heck I even separate out my JIS stuff from SAE/DIN, since most of what I work on is Japanese. My main socket racks include 8, 10, 12, 14, 17, 19mm -- the rack with 9, 11, 13, 15, 16, and 18mm is stored separately.

 

[Strouty]

My OCD gets the best of me.

 

[Wes J]

I started working on semi trucks and diesel engines. I never had any metric tools. Pretty much everything was inch. The stuff that was not inch was close enough. Like head bolts and main cap bolts are often 16mm or 19mm so just use a 5/8 or 3/4 and never knew any better.

Then I went to working on cars and had to buy a bunch of metric **** to do anything. No problem. Most of the stuff I worked on was American ******* vehicles with a mix of inch and metric.

Then I started working on CNC machines and other machine tools. Some are all inch like Haas, Fadal, and all the old American stuff. Others are all metric like anything from Japan. So, I still need both.

In my travel too set, I carefully weeded out any overlapping sizes to save weight.

 

[mnoeltne]

Overall I like having complete sets of both SAE and Metric.

I grab the metric stuff when I work on my Honda, the SAE stuff for the old Cub Cadet garden tractor, and BOTH sets for the 2001 Jeep which has some of the weirdest mixes of metric and SAE I've seen.

 

[disston]

I'm also in the complete sets both Metric and Inch camp.

 

[mdtaylorjr]

I used to think the sizes were the same when I was using cheaper sockets. I think all the Chinese sockets are metric they just stamp them inch sizes. When I was using cman the 5/8 and 16 both fit a drain plug the same. When I switched to snap on the 16 is a perfect fit and 5/8th is to small. There's a video on you tube that shows just how much different 19 and 3/4 is. I can't remember the guys name.

 

[Wes J]

When I was using cman the 5/8 and 16 both fit a drain plug the same. When I switched to snap on the 16 is a perfect fit and 5/8th is to small. There's a video on you tube that shows just how much different 19 and 3/4 is. I can't remember the guys name.

Lol. .004". Do you realize how small that is? 3/4 and 19mm are only .002" different. Grab a micrometer (not calipers) and see just how small that is.

Like I said. I own Snap-on sockets that say 3/4-19mm. They made one socket and stamped both sizes on it at that time. They probably still do, they just label them differently so that you will buy both.

The only exception I know of is hex keys. Socket head cap screws are made to much tighter tolerances than hex head fasteners. An 8mm hex key will fit in 95% of cap screws with a 5/16 hex, but 1 in 20 or so will be pretty tight. 5/32 and 4mm will interchange every time though.

 

[Rarified27]

Aside from my vehicles and things around the house, I work on a lot of musical instruments.
Since instruments are made all over the world, especially percussion/drums, I see every size possible.

After decades of repairs, I've settled on nothing but metric, even for the USA-made items.

I'm even looking at this set right now to simplify things.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003L1ZZVY/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[jd_1138]

Yeah, it'd be confusing to be working on a vehicle that normally takes metric and you need a 19mm socket, but the set didn't come with one because it's the same as 3/4. Then you have to remember than 19MM and 3/4 are the same.

We should've gone metric decades ago and put an end to all this nonsense.

 

[shockwave]

This reminds me of the special order snap on 20.6mm 12 point which is essentially a 13/16 in metric form

 

[Wes J]

How do you tackle 3/8, 1/2, 9/16, 11/16, 1 etc if all you have is metric? I think you have to have both 18mm and smaller.

 

[Wes J]

We should've gone metric decades ago and put an end to all this nonsense.

Agreed. If we had been metric at the turn of the 20th century, you'd never see an inch wrench outside guys doing museum restorations.

 

[jt777]

My OCD gets the best of me.

Me and my wallet to