Index 40 mill DRO install

[larry_g]

Here last month when Enco had their 30% off sale I grabbed a DRO to install on my little mill. The Mill is one I have had for quite a few years and it came out of a lab setting and spent a lot of its life cutting carbon for the nuclear industry. It was black when I got it and is still giving up black carbon as you can see in some of the pictures.

The mill when I started the project;

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It looks perty much like when I got it. It has the factory X axis drive and the power quill. The one feature this machine does not have is the drop spindle. It has a 17" x 9" travel.

The power drive and old scale;

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To engage the power feed the handle is lifted and it engages a worm drive on the lead screw. The rod across the front of the table has stop collars on it for setting the disengagement points. It can be manually disengaged by pushing on the triangle on top of the box. Also show in this picture is the factory scale and vernier pointer from the factory. It works in conjunction with graduated dials on the lead screws.

Under the table where the Y axis scale will mount

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The 2 machined flats on the knee are where the old Y axis rule was mounted. I will use those to mount the read head from the new system Also notice that there is nothing flat on the saddle to mount the new scale.

To be continued.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[larry_g]

A bit different view of the front of the table, table lock, rule and pointer, and the other stuff that dictated the mounting of the new scale on the back of the table.

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Since I had never had the machine apart I thought this would be a good time to check and clean as well

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I did find the lead screw nut hold down bolts loose. There was a reason that I will address later.

To be continued.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[larry_g]

Once the table and saddle were off I set up the saddle on the big mill to machine a flat where I could mount the Y axis scale. In the scrap box I had a 1" square aluminium bar that would work the make this happen.

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Cutting the flat
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The flat is cut

to be continued

lg
no neat sig line

 

[larry_g]

Once the saddle was cut fo the Y axis scale I mocked up the X axis scale and reader. The back of the table is milled flat so that was easy but where the reader had to mount the saddle was ~.220" proud of the table surface.

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So reset the saddle on the big mill to machine a pocket for the read head.

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To be continued

lg
no neat sig line

 

[larry_g]

The pocket and table surface now on the same plane

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Mocked things up again and spotted the hole for mounting the scale and reader. Notice the red clips on the reader head? They are there to hold the reader in alignment withthe scale till everythingis mounted.

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The Kant twist is there to hold a bar along the way surface for alignment purposes. The scale MUST be parallel to the ways.

Drilling and tapping the holes

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to be continued

lg
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[larry_g]

Once the holes were in I mounted the 1" bar and checked it for parallelism.

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It was out ~.003" over the travel length. Spec is less than .010" so it's good.

Working on the Y axis reader head mount that will screw to the existing holes on the knee pointed out above.

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Finish tapping at the bench. I grabbed this shop made vise at the swapmeet this last summer.

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To be continued

lg
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[larry_g]

So the Y axis reader is mounted with a couple of the supplied brackets (black) that came with the kit.

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A view with both scales mounted

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And finally the readout mounted
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There are other pictures in the my album here if you want to look. This is not finished yet as I still have to dress in the wires, confirm if I like the readout on the left. I have the readout on the left as that is the where the handwheel is for the X axis is and I don't want to have to look around the machine to see it. However I an right handed and it may be that it will work better if I have to do a lot of interfacing with the buttons. These new readouts have a lot more in them that the old ones that mainly displayed the position and little else. So stay tuned more to come though it may be awhile.

lg
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[kazlx]

Nice job....DRO makes such a big difference. Looks like an Accurite? What did you end up paying for it?

 

[larry_g]

Nice job....DRO makes such a big difference. Looks like an Accurite? What did you end up paying for it?

It was just over $600. Spent some time with it today and still have a bit of a learning curve to find and use all its features.

lg
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[jon72vega]

Nice work!

 

[macgyver37]

Larry, that looks great. You will really like the features of the unit. Makes bolt patterns and finding center very quick and almost fun. I may have to break down and sell off something to buy one to put on my Index.

Thanks for showing.

What did you do on the lose lead screw nut?

Jason

 

[larry_g]

What did you do on the lose lead screw nut?

Jason

I believe that the lead screw nut was loose because there is no good locating of the nut. So all location is held just by the 5/16 screw that goes through a very loose hole in the nut. With no way to tighten the nut with the table and lead screw in position. I eyeballed it a couple of times with no luck. Here I assume the previous person in there gave up and left it loose to allow it to self center. What I did was install the end plates and leadscrew on the table while it was still off the machine and did some measuring. Made up a spacer block to locate off the rear way of the saddle and hold the leadscrew/nut assembly in position relative to the rear way of the saddle and tightened it down. It now travels smooth end to end of the X table movement.

lg
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[larry_g]

Today I got back to the setup on the DRO and in checking the Y axis I found the ~.003" of hysteresis in the reading the dro was supplying. In the setup below I would crank the table +.100" per the dial indicator and the dro concurred. Bring the table -y.100" and the readout would be at .003" +

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So I went through the drill checking the scale and readhead, as you see with the indicator below the table. I could find no reason there. I moved the dial indicator to the right so it would read just above the DRO scale. The hysteresis diminished to tenths. pushed and pulled on the table and the backlash in the table would agree on the DI and the DRO. Move the DI back to the left position shown and repeated the push/pull and the backlash on the DRO was ~.003" but the DI it was near .008". AH HAH , the table was loose.

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As seen above the Y axis adjustment is a bit different than some. The Y axis gib is bolted on from the bottom and has 3 adjustment screws from the side. To adjust, one has to loosen the bottom screws, move the adjusters and then retighten the bottom screws. The tightening of the lower screws tightens the clearance a bit so it takes a few iterations to get it right.

I was able to get it down to a couple of thousands difference from one end to the other. I consider this perty good for a near 60 year old machine.

lg
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[dozerbuilder01]

Is that a sheldon lathe in the background?


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[larry_g]

Is that a sheldon lathe in the background?


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Actually there are two of them. I thought I would keep the best one when I ended up with two but so far I've held on to both of them. One is a 13" and the smaller a 10". They each seem to have their strong points and both get used.

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lg
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[dozerbuilder01]

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack your thread. That's a nice shop you have. Pretty unique mill you put that DRO on. The reason I was asking if it was a Sheldon was because I'm trying to find one with a DRO on it. Didn't know if you had a DRO on yours. I've been wanting to put one on mine but haven't thought of a good way to mount the cross slide scale. I picked up an EXL-46-P a few months ago but it was used fairly hard. I was going to have the bed reground but a few weeks ago I picked up an EXL-56-B. It was missing the tailstock and one fiber gear but it had a L00 spindle, taper attachment and a bed with the majority of the original flaking still intact. Looks like it was barely used. It was sitting in the basement of a college. Drove 9 hours each way to get it but very happy with it. And the price was right. I also have a soft spot for them because they were made in Chicago.

 

[larry_g]

I don't have a DRO on either of mine. I did some looking with the scales that came with the mill kit and they did not look as they would be an easy fit. The scale is .800 wide and 1.12" tall. Do you know there is a Sheldon lathe group on Yahoo? You might find information there on a DRO retrofit.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[fnieto]

Nice DRO install. The older my eyes get the more I appreciate using DRO's.

 

[nine4gmc]

Great job, thanks for posting the link!

 

[superskaterxes]

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack your thread. That's a nice shop you have. Pretty unique mill you put that DRO on. The reason I was asking if it was a Sheldon was because I'm trying to find one with a DRO on it. Didn't know if you had a DRO on yours. I've been wanting to put one on mine but haven't thought of a good way to mount the cross slide scale. I picked up an EXL-46-P a few months ago but it was used fairly hard. I was going to have the bed reground but a few weeks ago I picked up an EXL-56-B. It was missing the tailstock and one fiber gear but it had a L00 spindle, taper attachment and a bed with the majority of the original flaking still intact. Looks like it was barely used. It was sitting in the basement of a college. Drove 9 hours each way to get it but very happy with it. And the price was right. I also have a soft spot for them because they were made in Chicago.

you can also go with a magnetic DRO which is infinitely smaller and almost always easier to mount.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Thanks for posting. I just recently watched a 3 part series of videos posted by Adam Booth (Abom79) on Youtube where he installed a Newall DRO system on his DoAll Mill so it was interesting to compare the two:

 

[larry_g]

Thanks for posting. I just recently watched a 3 part series of videos posted by Adam Booth (Abom79) on Youtube where he installed a Newall DRO system on his DoAll Mill so it was interesting to compare the two:

Thanks for the link to Adams install. What I notice is different is that he mostly flat planer surfaces to attach to. The old machine I was working on had only a couple surfaces that worked for me and thus the machining to get parts afixed.

lg
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[Daveo]

Nice job!

Here is my Wells 55 after I went thru the whole machine and added a dro....

 

[larry_g]

Nice job!

Here is my Wells 55 after I went thru the whole machine and added a dro....

Very nice looking machine. Do you have the retaining cap for the drawbar? I find that it makes life so much easier to remove collets, no more hammering on the drawbar to remove the collet.

lg
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[Daveo]

I had the spindle re ground from b&s9 to r8. And wells made the drawbar while they did it....

Im interested to know what your talking about though....

 

[larry_g]

I had the spindle re ground from b&s9 to r8. And wells made the drawbar while they did it....

Im interested to know what your talking about though....

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I also had Wells regrind mine. These mills, as well as Bridgeports with the B&S taper, came with a threaded portion just above the splines on the spindle. There is a nut that threads on here and captures the drawbar just above the shoulder on it. There is a smaller hole in the top of the nut that just the square on the top of the drawbar pokes through allowing wrench access. When you unscrew the drawbar it backs out a couple of turns and hits the retaining nut, forcing the collet to unseat. NO more pounding on the DB to unseat the collet. It was much more important on the B&S taper than it is on the R8. You can just see the nut in black on mine above.

lg
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[Daveo]

I always wondered what those threads were for! Now it all makes since!

Mine have been deformed from the previous owner pounding on it, but I may have to try and fix it!!!


Rick at wells bent over backwards to help me. Totally satisfied with their service! If I am ever rich enough to buy a new mill, I will be looking at theirs....

 

[larry_g]

Rick at wells bent over backwards to help me. Totally satisfied with their service! If I am ever rich enough to buy a new mill, I will be looking at theirs....

I concur....

If you need measurements or pictures let me know.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Daveo]

I concur....

If you need measurements or pictures let me know.

lg
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Some close up pics would be awesome! Maybe help understand it a little better...

What oil are you using to oil the spindle bearings?

 

[larry_g]

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Here ya go. I think, if memory serves me right, that I may have bought the nut when I had the spindle reground. I know I didn't make it but it may have come on the machine when I bought it.

I use a Velocite spindle oil.

lg
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[Daveo]

Awesome! Thank you very much! When I get some time back in the shop,I will be making one of these.

 

[nine4gmc]

Hold on, can they grind(reground?) a M head MT2 spindle to R8? Sorry to **** in. My DRO should be here by the 18th and I may have some more questions for you guys!

 

[larry_g]

Hold on, can they grind(reground?) a M head MT2 spindle to R8? Sorry to **** in. My DRO should be here by the 18th and I may have some more questions for you guys!

The spindles we had reground were B&S 7 or 9, I forget which one. However It may be worth a call to Wells-Index and talk to Rick. I do know that they do other brands besides Index. I just don't know if the MT2 has enough meat in the spindle to go out that far. Quick check on your part is measure, or look up, the diameter of the R8 big end. Then check if your spindle would have enough meat left for strength after opening it up to that dia. I costs ~$225 to regrind.

http://wells-index.com/machine-rebuild-and-maintenance.php


lg
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[Daveo]

They work on any machines.Great people to work with

 

[Hchrist]

Old thread but I figured it's worth a shot.
I am trying to remove the quill from my Model 40 and I haven't figured it out yet. Any help on this is appreciated.
Thanks

 

[larry_g]

Old thread but I figured it's worth a shot.
I am trying to remove the quill from my Model 40 and I haven't figured it out yet. Any help on this is appreciated.
Thanks

I'm going to have to go look at the machine. I've done it but it's been years ago and the memory is gone. It seems to me that the hand wheel has to come out and it drops out the bottom. Is there a pin or setscrew that holds the gear to the handwheel shaft?

on edit

There are 4 socket head screws on the handwheel housing that allows you to remove the handwheel assy and then the spindle should drop out the bottom of the housing.

That being said there are a couple of different versions of the machine and this may not apply to yours. Do you have any pictures of yours that show the area in question?

lg
no neat sig line