Insulation purchased with building or direct from supplier

[Usafexplorer]

Curious if anyone compared buying insulation from an insulation supplier vs the steel building supplier?

I was provided a quote using Silvercote R-19 on the roof and R-13 in the walls for our 40x65' building. Knowing that this is likely a pass through item in the sale of the building I might be better off sourcing the insulation on my own.

Any thoughts or feedback?

 

[jack stand]

Well worth a couple of phone calls to find out!
Just have you sq/ft of each ready to go for them.

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

I found that companies that specialize in insulation were cheaper (with installation) than I could buy the insulation myself.

 

[Usafexplorer]

Thanks for the replies, I'll make a couple calls on Monday.

 

[larry_g]

When comparing make sure that you compare apples to apples. The builder has the cost of delivery and installation built into his quote. Make sure that you account for all your time and pickup/delivery costs.

 

[Usafexplorer]

We are buying the building without erection, the building manufacturer is selling insulation as an add-on accessory, nowhere in that cost is installation.

 

[jjbereal]

Bay insulation is also a good supplier

 

[Usafexplorer]

I contacted several sources that sell Therm-All, Silvercote and a few unnamed vinyl backed products with the same R values. It is surely possible to save going through another distributor vs the metal building supplier. One quote was even $1000 cheaper for the same product. So here is my dilemma, how much is really enough when it comes to insulation? There must be a point where you reach diminishing returns as we are not heating or cooling the entire space. For example here are some of the quotes I received with their respective R value:

R13 Walls
R19 Roof
Total approx. $6,000 delivered

R25 Walls
R30 Roof
Total approx. 12,000 delivered


Any thoughts or feedback?

 

[GrayFlattop]

Without knowing your location, or your intended use for the building it's difficult to provide thoughtful feedback.

 

[Usafexplorer]

Primary use of the building is a shop, occasional projects and storing of vehicles.

 

[GrayFlattop]

Would you be heating / cooling this building? In general, more insulation is better, but without AC there come a point where you end up trapping the heat. Particularly when you bring a hot vehicle inside.

If you aren’t planning on climate control, I’d go with less insulation- in general.

Will you have operable windows or other means of ventilation?

I think there are a lot of variables - you know how you plan to use the space and you know your budget constraints.

 

[jjbereal]

Have you looked into spray foam? R-25/R-30 is the best r value that you can get with the fiberglass rolls. Over time it settles, vinyl gets ripped and after years of getting wet from condensation, isn’t as efficient. As a MBS erector, I be seen the huge difference in heating and cooling costs when closeed cell is used. I know it’s a little more expensive up front, but it will pay for itself if you plan on being there a while! Hope this helps

 

[Usafexplorer]

Have you looked into spray foam? R-25/R-30 is the best r value that you can get with the fiberglass rolls. Over time it settles, vinyl gets ripped and after years of getting wet from condensation, isn’t as efficient. As a MBS erector, I be seen the huge difference in heating and cooling costs when closeed cell is used. I know it’s a little more expensive up front, but it will pay for itself if you plan on being there a while! Hope this helps

Thanks for the reply. The longevity of spray foam and its impact on steel are a concern for us. The are unexplained premature rust through conditions on some buildings and some manufacturers are voiding warranties with the use of spray foam. I get it, lots of people use it and are very happy with it, just not a risk of trapping moisture on steel I want to take.

 

[dcg9381]

The longevity of spray foam and its impact on steel are a concern for us.

IMHO, these are exacerbated by building manufacturers who want to sell you additional "accessories". Accessories being defined as inferior insulation products.

The are unexplained premature rust through conditions on some buildings and some manufacturers are voiding warranties with the use of spray foam.

Have you even seen one of these cases first hand? Because I haven't. It's commonly pointed out that foam over steel will void the warranty. But you know what else voids warranties on steel? Leaks. Any leak. With any insulation type.

Likely the warranty covers the cost of the steel panel anyway, not the removal or re-install.

I've seen foam used on hangers (aircraft) here for going on 2 decades. I have yet to see one building with major issues that were factually attributed to foam. Now if your building leaks and closed cell holds that water on a panel, that's a thing... But again, that's not a foam failure.

What is factual is that if you damage or have to replace steel siding that has foam insulation on it, you're going to be re-doing the insulation too. That's one down side. The other mistake that I've seen is using lighter gauge steel and I've seen some foam applications that are capable of displacing that light steel enough that you can see it... then you end up with mess.

I get it, lots of people use it and are very happy with it, just not a risk of trapping moisture on steel I want to take.

Then use open cell, which will leak just like regular old insulation does.

Clearly I'm a fan, but I've also got no reason to steer you wrong on this.. I'm on my 3rd structure with foam (open cell) and have seen tons of buildings built this way.

For the dollar, I'm actually a fan of "hybrid" insulation. Spray foam the roof deck - it really cuts the labor and use traditional on the vertical walls (I assume there is framing).

BTW, for "sometimes cooled" shops, I don't go the full recommended R value on insulation... Those values assume full time heat/cooling use with climate zone.

 

[Mike65]

When we had our steel garage/shop put up 2 years ago we had it insulated with 2" of spray foam on the underside of the roof, & the on the walls.. No complaints.

 

[Greg9504]

With exposed fastener roof, a single layer of insulation is basically a noise reducer and the vapour barrier helps with condensation.

Note his response, "not good". R19 with exposed fasteners and no thermal break works out to R10 (R = 1/U).



If you are only going to occasionally heat/cool, it's probably not worth the 2x material cost (plus the additional labour).

To get "good" insulation values you need 1" to 1.5" thermal breaks and standing seam roofs.