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Is this a miracle?

michael murder

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May 30, 2009
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284
Is this a miracle these two wrenches made it to my house at all or was it just the work of honest postal service employees? I mean I can see all the way through the paper envelope.

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See the wrenches zip tied to cardboard in the background sent by a member? This is the most sensible way to send wrenches. Well, at least they made it I guess and on the plus side I didn't even have to open the envelope to retrieve my merchandise.
 
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Bull

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Yeah, I'd like to know if those came from a member here, too. My guess is "no."

And yeah, that's a miracle delivery right there. You'd think somewhere along the line, some USPS employee would take two seconds to throw some damn tape on the shredded box.
 

Skyline

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I had consistent problems using those envelopes for shipping tools. I ship an average of 60-70 Priority mail packages each month, and I can tell you from past experiences that the lost tool rate per package sent ratio is about 10X the rate for boxes when you use those flat rate envelopes. The lost contents ratio I find for boxes is about one in 300 sent, which is not too bad.

USPS does NOT treat packages with kid gloves. UPS may be even worse. These envelopes are designed for paper.

I once ordered a pair of Recaro BMW seats by UPS. These were not lightweight seats. One was bent in half...halfway up the back. The force needed to do that must have been huge. I still to this day wonder how they managed that. So far, my best guess is that it was thrown out the side door of a 747 when unloading, and dropped 20+ ft to the tarmac.
 

Davefr

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If it were Ebay, I'd be giving the seller getting negative FB for improper packaging.
 

burns334

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Nov 11, 2009
Messages
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Wow, you are lucky, seems impossible that you got them. They look nice, are they Williams?
 
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TJ1200c

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Feb 13, 2009
Messages
9
WOW, you are lucky that you got them. I'm not a fan of the envolopes either for shipping anything other than paper or very light weight objects. Anything with bulk or weight I look for other options.
 

lbgradwell

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Mar 21, 2007
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Oakville, ON
The problem is not so much the paper envelope; it's permitting movement of the tools inside it!

Had the Seller zip-tied them to a piece of cardboard like the other example in Michael's photo, it would have been fine...
 

halfxspaid

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Joined
Dec 21, 2008
Messages
75
Some packing tape around the envelope would have easily and cheaply remedied the possibility of this problem.
 

Stephenw

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Dec 21, 2006
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Utah
If they were Snap-on Flank Drive Plus, I'd call it a miracle.

My call on your level of luck will be based on what brand?
 

Bull

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the lost tool rate per package sent ratio is about 10X the rate for boxes when you use those flat rate envelopes.

I have sent dozens of tools in those envelopes, each time packing them like a paper, tape, and cardboard fortress. The percentages look like this:

Lost or damaged 0%

Delivered in as-shipped condition: 100%
 
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nate379

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Thaht happened to a friend when he worked at a GM dealer. Axle they had gotten shipped for a truck was dropped out of the plane, about 20-25 ft.
UPS had to pay for another one.

I had consistent problems using those envelopes for shipping tools. I ship an average of 60-70 Priority mail packages each month, and I can tell you from past experiences that the lost tool rate per package sent ratio is about 10X the rate for boxes when you use those flat rate envelopes. The lost contents ratio I find for boxes is about one in 300 sent, which is not too bad.

USPS does NOT treat packages with kid gloves. UPS may be even worse. These envelopes are designed for paper.

I once ordered a pair of Recaro BMW seats by UPS. These were not lightweight seats. One was bent in half...halfway up the back. The force needed to do that must have been huge. I still to this day wonder how they managed that. So far, my best guess is that it was thrown out the side door of a 747 when unloading, and dropped 20+ ft to the tarmac.
 

nate379

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Atlanta, GA is the dead letter office that does the auctions I guess... wonder what kind of goodies end up there?
 

Bull

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I did add some extra strips of tape to the faces of the envelopes tonight, for the batch going out tomorrow. I've always done the edges, but a strip or two on the face, front and back, can't hurt!
 

burns334

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Nov 11, 2009
Messages
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I saw those on ebay mostly individual with big shipping charges and nothing about combining costs, how did you work a shipping deal? and then he ships in one crappy letter envelope.
 

Tool Pants

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Oct 4, 2008
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1,249
Location
San Jose CA
I got home early from work one day, and the brown truck pulled up in front of my neighbors house. There is a wrought iron fence in front of the house. The guy took the package and threw it 25 feet over the fence so that it landed on the door stoop. He must have delivered newspapers in his younger days.

Here is a ratchet I almost did not receive.
 

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Skyline

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I have sent dozens of tools in those envelopes, each time packing them like a paper, tape, and cardboard fortress. The percentages look like this:

Lost or damaged 0%

Delivered in as-shipped condition: 100%

Consider yourself lucky then. "Dozens of packages" may not have been a large enough sample for the statistics I've seen to pan out. I used to take all those same precautions, and still had issues once in a while.

I think part of the problem is that the postal wokers know you are scamming the system, and they make an extra effort to destroy your package.
 

Bull

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Consider yourself lucky then. "Dozens of packages" may not have been a large enough sample for the statistics I've seen to pan out. I used to take all those same precautions, and still had issues once in a while.

I think part of the problem is that the postal wokers know you are scamming the system, and they make an extra effort to destroy your package.


I could not disagree more, with either point.

In the first place, this is not luck that I am experiencing. This is the payoff of time spent in careful packaging...very careful packaging. Perhaps you were also careful, and if so, then the damaged packages you experienced are to be taken as a sign of your bad luck. But it is not good luck if someone goes out of their way to package something securely and it arrives as intended. That's earned success. And if one of my packages arrives damaged, then I will have to consider that I had bad luck...the bad luck of the package entering the hands of a particular employee or employees of the system who treated it with more than an average level of carelessness or, as you suggest, malice.

In the second place, it is ridiculous to suggest that using those envelopes to send tools is "scamming the system." If the USPS advertises that whatever you can fit in the envelope without modifying it and while still using the sticky flap-seal to close the package ships for that flat rate, and someone does just that, then it is by definition impossible to be a "scam" of any kind. Furthermore, none of the packages I have sent has apparently even had a rough ride...no one has reported to me a rip, tear, bullet hole etc. of any kind. So, it does not seem that these irate USPS employees are trying to destroy my packages in an effort to retaliate for my "scam."

What do these envelopes shown in these threads of destruction have in common? No tape, no cardboard sandwich inside the envelope holding the contents securely in place, no padding, in short, no care of any kind taken by the shipper. That's the common denominator here.

Perhaps dozens of samples are not enough for you to consider the results valid. Perhaps in the next several dozens, I will experience a failure. Even so, my ratio of successful to unsuccessful package deliveries will still be overwhelmingly favorable. But anyway, I consider the sample to be valid. If someone sinks fifty free-throws in a row, do the critics declare the sample too small to determine the presence of skill?:headscrat
 

rhastings80

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Apr 1, 2009
Messages
636
I wasn't as lucky about 2 weeks ago. I won a vintage 1/2 Snap-On ratchet off of Ebay and all I got was an empty envelop. I contacted the seller and his first response was somebody at my work probably stole it. I basically said do you want negative feedback and me to open a case with pay pal? He did refund my money but I don't understand why people keep using those damn paper envelopes. They are meant for mailing paper documents. I know they are cheaper to send but doesn't save you any money if the items doesn't get there. Or if they really want to use them zip tie the tools to cardboard and tape the hell out of it.

<table style="width:auto;"><tr><td><a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/j3UkycT_9hDd4jBxDQhBiA?authkey=Gv1sRgCMu9ouT95syYpwE&feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh6.ggpht.com/_gyA2MJjiLlg/S1fPV46DQrI/AAAAAAAAANc/pfAQC3I4EKs/s800/IMG_4399.jpg" /></a></td></tr><tr><td style="font-family:arial,sans-serif; font-size:11px; text-align:right">From <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/mike.4324/SnapOn?authkey=Gv1sRgCMu9ouT95syYpwE&feat=embedwebsite">Snap on</a></td></tr></table>

<table style="width:auto;"><tr><td><a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/UWmmnya1eBrhjKk0FB67tA?authkey=Gv1sRgCMu9ouT95syYpwE&feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh5.ggpht.com/_gyA2MJjiLlg/S2w9C2BFRUI/AAAAAAAAAQY/Lr2-nHKlPlM/s800/IMG_4401.jpg" /></a></td></tr><tr><td style="font-family:arial,sans-serif; font-size:11px; text-align:right">From <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/mike.4324/SnapOn?authkey=Gv1sRgCMu9ouT95syYpwE&feat=embedwebsite">Snap on</a></td></tr></table>
 

Bull

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I don't understand why people keep using those damn paper envelopes. They are meant for mailing paper documents.


Where does it say that? I can read the guidelines that are printed right on the envelope itself, in your second picture. :headscrat

I learned about using them from people on here. Between me and others just on this site that use them, how many tools have been sent successfully using these envelopes and appropriate packaging methods? Hundreds? Thousands?

Once again, your picture confirms what I said in the post right above yours. The common denominator for destroyed Priority envelopes is ******, don't-give-a-**** packaging. No tape, no cardboard, no padding...no wonder!!

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</td></tr></tbody></table>

<table style="width: auto;"><tbody><tr><td>
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rhastings80

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Apr 1, 2009
Messages
636
Ok,

Yes I can see you know how to package stuff but there are lots of people not as smart as you and me who just dump the tool in the paper envelope and have no idea when you tell them the tool is missing.
 

Bull

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Yes, I agree. Lots of people who can't be bothered to do a good job packaging the item. That means the flaw is the person and not the envelope. The envelope says that "any mailable material" can be placed into it. This leads me to believe that the USPS consciously intended for them to be used for other than sheets of paper.
 

Busted_Knuckles

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Oct 9, 2009
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Northwest Illinois
I didn't mention it earlier, but I got a air powered tool in the mail a couple weeks back, it was bubble wrapped, came in flat rate envelope, and the side of the envelope was blown open. The tool had left the envelope, and the postal service had re-inserted it. It was not damaged and worked fine, but was way too heavy for the envelope, another tool that passed the "bodies in motion tend to stay in motion test"... and of course the envelope did not! I contacted the seller and made him aware of what happened for his own reference purposes. I don't seem to recall doing a pic of it.. or Id post it.

Is everyone aware you can get boxes for free from the post office, via your computer ? I mail at least 25 packages a week of parts and tools, and never have problems, I also next to never use the flat rate envelopes, my stock are still the old blues ones from years ago, that's how slow I go through them, I use them so infrequently, I cant even tell you what I use them for!
 
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Bull

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Of course, with all this talk, I am practically guaranteeing that Murphy's Law will appear to kick my ***. I am sending two ratchets out today in these envelopes, as I have done dozens of times before. I even put extra extra tape on them because of this thread. Hope I have not jinxed myself.
 

mr2autoxr

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Aug 3, 2005
Messages
83
Location
Michigan
Does anyone ever wonder who the lucky ones are who get all these lost tools and other stuff that falls out of envelopes? I should become an employee, talk about a perk!
 

compman25

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Nov 13, 2009
Messages
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Location
Spokane
I saw those on ebay mostly individual with big shipping charges and nothing about combining costs, how did you work a shipping deal? and then he ships in one crappy letter envelope.

Were they from a seller in Apple Valley CA? ******* said he'd combine shipping but it would cost $18 to ship a 1/2" combo, 1" combo and 2 6" crescents because he had to make money on the tools since I won the 3 auctions at $.99 each.
 
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