Recoil Rob
Well-known member
Anyone know where I can a 3/8" drive JIS -3 impact bit? Honda rotors are held to the hub with JIS screws and regular Philips #3 bits torque out and strip the head (found out the hard way...)
JIS Impact bits?
- Thread starter Recoil Rob
- Start date
greasemonkey44
Well-known member
ive been using milwalkee shockwave phillips #3 bits; they have held up to alot of abuse
havent killed it in a year either
havent killed it in a year either
OP
Recoil Rob
Well-known member
Yes, but I need a JIS (Japanese Industrial Standard) bit, not a Philips.
V70R
Well-known member
http://www.vesseltools.com/hand-tools/screwdrivers/impact/431801/flypage.tpl.html
Hope that helps, Rob!
Hope that helps, Rob!
ajchien
Well-known member
Thanks for the link. I'm running into more and more JIS screws too.
TwoInch
Well-known member
if you take the tip of a phillips bit, and grind off just a touch from the tip, then use an impact driver you will be set. hs never failed me on honda rotors(way to many)
or you can go to an RC airplane/helicopter shop, they have em.
or you can go to an RC airplane/helicopter shop, they have em.
OP
Recoil Rob
Well-known member
Thanks for the leads and the grinding tip, will try.
5mall5nail5
Well-known member
Before you try, torque rotor with wheel bolts. That will release tension from this unfortunate screw.
That's actually a really good suggestion!
mlittle29
Well-known member
I just ordered a few bits and a couple of screwdriver sets for the shop. I didn't even realize, but all the bolts on our Japanese Equipment are JIS. we ahve been using the screwdriver that came with the unit for a while....always wondered why it worked better than a #2 Philips. Now I know!
Went to replace the pads and rotors on my newly acquired Santa Fe a while back, only to find out one of those screws was stripped, from the last place that serviced the brakes. (the dealer). After I drilled it out, I went to a different dealer for replacements and he gave me a pile of them for free.
Asian cars have JIS Crosshead screws, not to be confused with the conventional American Philips screws. With the billion or so Japanese vehicles on the road, you would think that one could fit a set of JIS screwdrivers and bits at every auto parts shop in the US.
American Philips screws were designed to be installed without overtightening as the Philips screwdriver will cam out after tightening. Ever try leaning all of your weight into a Phillips driver trying to really tighten a Philips screw? Don't try it again! You'll likely damage both your screwhead and driver.
JIS Crosshead screws, on the other hand, were designed to be torqued by retaining the JIS driver in the crosshead slot during tightening.
There are plenty of videos on Youtube showing idiots bitching and hollering over being unable to remove what they thought were Philips screws holding their Honda rotors on, and usually resulting in their ruining the screw heads and drilling them out. Kudos to Honda and others for failing to sell the JIS bits or drivers at their counters.
Vessel seems to be one of the few marketers of JIS bits. Their impact bits will fit a 8mm or 5/16" hex socket and are available on eBay now as item #153114282398 for about $10 for a set of four slotted and crosshead bits. They ship from Japan and may take about 10 days to receive them in the mail.
Vessel also has standard (non-impact) JIS bits for the more common 6.35mm or 1/4" hex socket. These are available from Motion Pro on Amazon.
American Philips screws were designed to be installed without overtightening as the Philips screwdriver will cam out after tightening. Ever try leaning all of your weight into a Phillips driver trying to really tighten a Philips screw? Don't try it again! You'll likely damage both your screwhead and driver.
JIS Crosshead screws, on the other hand, were designed to be torqued by retaining the JIS driver in the crosshead slot during tightening.
There are plenty of videos on Youtube showing idiots bitching and hollering over being unable to remove what they thought were Philips screws holding their Honda rotors on, and usually resulting in their ruining the screw heads and drilling them out. Kudos to Honda and others for failing to sell the JIS bits or drivers at their counters.
Vessel seems to be one of the few marketers of JIS bits. Their impact bits will fit a 8mm or 5/16" hex socket and are available on eBay now as item #153114282398 for about $10 for a set of four slotted and crosshead bits. They ship from Japan and may take about 10 days to receive them in the mail.
Vessel also has standard (non-impact) JIS bits for the more common 6.35mm or 1/4" hex socket. These are available from Motion Pro on Amazon.
J.C.
Well-known member
There's some more info on JIS here with images of the differences:
https://motofaction.org/mechanical-...arbs-cross-head-japanese-industrial-standard/
https://motofaction.org/mechanical-...arbs-cross-head-japanese-industrial-standard/
JIS police here. Nee-nah nee-nah. It's quoted a lot here but there has so far been nothing to backup the claim that Phillips was designed to cam out. The Phillips patent suggests the opposite to be true.
40+ countries in Asia. Not just Japan.
40+ countries in Asia. Not just Japan.
J.C.
Well-known member
Colour me interested! Is that the 1936 patent application you're referring to?
californiaHank
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2015
- Messages
- 487
For your first post you re-open a seven-year-old dead thread?
1. Yes, Vessel screwdrivers and bits are good. JDV stocks Vessel screwdrivers and bits in the US - www.vesseltools.com.
2. You don't need to buy Japanese drivers for your JIS cross point screws - You just need to avoid the (mostly US) brands that make their drivers to the specs in the original (American) Phillips patent. European manufacturers generally make their cross point screwdrivers to meet the German DIN5260 standard and these fit both American Phillips and Japanese JIS screws fine. My favourite impact bits are Wera. KC Tools stocks Wera and a bunch of other German bits in the US, both in 1/4" and 5/16" (8mm) drive sizes - www.kctoolco.com
Yes. The patent states that the older slotted design fails to retain a screw which can be dangerous and that Phillips was designed to negate this, especially in power driven operation. There was a revision of the patent that does mention 'cam out' but not as a design goal. I'm in no way an expert, just going off the patent and previous discussions here.
Sorry didn't notice this was an old thread.
_brian_
Well-known member
I am using this thread vs opening a new one as it has already recently been brought back from the dead.
I am looking to source some JIS #3 impact bits. This would mean DIN 5260-PH / ISO 8764-1 or JIS B 4633 impact bits in a size #3. I am well aware that the JIS standard is obsolete, but that seems the only way I can attempt to get the proper bits. Those listed under the Phillips standard rarely ever state which standard they are actually made to.
I found some from the brand Motion Pro, but reviews seem to agree that they break easily and do not work well. I am looking for an actual retailer in the US vs a product page on a manufacturer web site as I actually need to buy them, not just know they exist if that makes sense. I would prefer a pack of them vs just one or two. Maybe 5 or even 10.
Has anyone found a source for this?
I am looking to source some JIS #3 impact bits. This would mean DIN 5260-PH / ISO 8764-1 or JIS B 4633 impact bits in a size #3. I am well aware that the JIS standard is obsolete, but that seems the only way I can attempt to get the proper bits. Those listed under the Phillips standard rarely ever state which standard they are actually made to.
I found some from the brand Motion Pro, but reviews seem to agree that they break easily and do not work well. I am looking for an actual retailer in the US vs a product page on a manufacturer web site as I actually need to buy them, not just know they exist if that makes sense. I would prefer a pack of them vs just one or two. Maybe 5 or even 10.
Has anyone found a source for this?
1foxracing
Well-known member
Just buy one of these and be done with it;
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003BGTTSE/?tag=atomicindustr-21
Not that expensive, a bit of antiseize on the screw will make it easy to get out the next time.
Torque on them is around 5nm max, barely tight.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003BGTTSE/?tag=atomicindustr-21
Not that expensive, a bit of antiseize on the screw will make it easy to get out the next time.
Torque on them is around 5nm max, barely tight.
_brian_
Well-known member
Thanks for the reply. I found this set on some other sites too, but I only need 1 of the three, as only one is a JIS #3. If that were 4 of the JIS #3, that would be great, but I have no need for the other bits in that set.
visionguru
Well-known member
By "impact bits", do you mean "impact driver bits" or bits that can be used by power tools?
I bought some Makita gold impact bits from Menards, they were made in Japan.
_brian_
Well-known member
My specific use / need is to use them on a manual impact driver. I personally tend to avoid such things on air/battery/AC power impact drivers since the point is to remove the fastener slowly without stripping.
measuredtwice
Well-known member
They are sold individually on Amazon.co.jp but it's probably a better value to buy them in a set rather than individually.
Search for Vessel C513036. It's an individual #3 on a card.
https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/B002RDDK7S/
The bit by Anex looks like it might be cheaper on Amazon.co.jp ... I think the number is 3 X 36 AK – 21P ... that's for a single. Here's a pack of 10...
https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/B002SQL814/
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1foxracing
Well-known member
Just contact them and tell them what you want and I'm sure they will take of it.
visionguru
Well-known member
I bought this impact driver:
specifically dealing with Honda rotor screws.
Last time, I was able to remove the front rotor screws without even hitting. The rear ones, this screwdriver or regular impact driver all didn't work. I had to drill them out.
rijndael
Well-known member
I also use the Vessel impact driver listed above. It's handy on the interior too, you often find the JIS screws on the trim pieces of the Odyssey floor, around the center row seats.
_brian_
Well-known member
In reply to this specifically, I have thought of this option. However, I use this JIS #3 mostly on Honda/Accord rotors. Sometimes, it takes quite a beating with a manual impact driver to remove the screws. I am unsure that a screwdriver as a whole unit would be a one and done solution.
Can anyone respond to that specifically? I am more than happy to try it out, but if I end up abusing an impact driver and bits, I fail to understand how a screwdriver form of the impact driver will be that much stronger.
Can anyone respond to that specifically? I am more than happy to try it out, but if I end up abusing an impact driver and bits, I fail to understand how a screwdriver form of the impact driver will be that much stronger.
measuredtwice
Well-known member
I have the driver. It's neat--strike the cap and the mechanism inside turns. But I don't think it is a full replacement for an impact. Vessel makes impacts too.
I linked exactly what you asked for in my prior post.