Kennedy Kits Discontinued

[DaveAndStuff]

Looks like the machinist chests have been discontinued, end of an era!

Was thinking about a new 52611/ bummer.

 

[Hakeem]

Wow brutal. Looks like they are just making the roll cabs now.

Not that i was planning on buying one but it’s still a bummer. End of an era, like you say.

 

[OccupantRJ]

if you are ok with a used box they are easily available on FB Marketplace in my area. A lot of us older machinists are retiring and selling off their tools and boxes. I have a machining room in my home shop and am seeing the machinist chests as low as $50-200. I gave my son my 7 drawer and bought an 11 drawer for $75 to condense some tool storage after I retired and brought things home.

 

[CHI_Tool&Die]

Damn, I was wondering why all the machinist chests were on the sales special for a bit. Maybe a new model will come out? Cornwell took over Kennedy a bit ago and they have been changing their product line since.

 

[rust in the eye]

Have all the machinists gone away or have imported boxes taken over?


https://buykennedy.com/product/26-11-drawer-machinists-chest-2/

 

[AEAdam]

Sad to see this day, but maybe not for Kennedy.

The 520, 526 were designed as cheap, sheet metal versions of gerstners etc. Wrinkle brown was supposed to be sympathetic with darkened oak etc boxes prevalent in the beginning of the 20th C. Drawer layouts copied earlier wooden boxes which were designed to store and protect precision tools, needed by every machinist.

With the advent of CNC, modern machinists, I believe, don‘t need, use, own (or even know about) the tools these boxes were designed to store. Even inspection is pretty much a CNC process now or digital caliper based.

I’ve watched probably every machinists’ toolbox tour on YouTube. Old boxes typically have the near valueless things that accumulate over a long career, tiny end mills & burrs, Sucrets boxes of worn taps, and drawers of HSS lathe tools. This isn’t how they were during their early career however.

Advice (from Ox tools) is to have a tape measure, digital caliper, allen keys, a hammer and heavy work gloves. Is that what machining has come to? Material handling? Programming? Rough stock checks? I think the answer is yes.

Kennedy chests have been a fixture in every machine shop I’ve been to (many). But I’ve seen them slowly give way to auto mechanic boxes.

Manual machines and the skills needed to use them are a dying skill set, in my mind, not unlike woodworking with hand tools. I think it’s possible some day Kennedy chests and the tools they were designed to hold will be collectible. Until then, manual machinists‘ tools are are nearly valueless. Like old woodworking tools, many owners sellers don’t know what they are let alone how they were used.

Hope @CHI_Tool&Die will respond with his thoughts.

Oh, and to be clear about my first sentence, I have a lot of Kennedys built across a fairly broad timespan. Their quality isn’t impressive. They are so so boxes in my opinion. They are special only in their configurations/drawer layouts.

 

[Outahere]

..........Their quality isn’t impressive. They are so so boxes in my opinion. They are special only in their configurations/drawer layouts.

I would agree with that. I own only 1 Kennedy, a 28" wide 2-drawer intermediate box I bought new around 1980.

 

[tool_scrounge]

Sad but not surprising. In So Cal, used machinist boxes sell for ~10-15% of new as the market is so saturated with them. Interesting, the demand I see for used ones is parents buying them for their budding mechanically inclined kids as their first tool box. I just sold one a few days ago for that purpose.

 

[zendriver]

Have all the machinists gone away or have imported boxes taken over?


https://buykennedy.com/product/26-11-drawer-machinists-chest-2/

yes and yes, are probably the right answers.

 

[MiteyF]

Well I must be the only one who still uses his 11 drawer for his "good" tools.

 

[OzarkMan]

I still have my dad's late 1960's boxes with milling bits and starrett calipers. He used to work at the Ideal Toy factory making the molds for those toys. I was 3 when he brought my brother and I the original Evil Knievel motorcycle jump set. Wish I still had it but this was 50+ some years ago. His boxes are on some high shelf in my small barn. As a kid I used to rummage through the drawers and play with those bits. I have fond memories of that. Something about the smell of that box and tools.

 

[rust in the eye]

A while back I bought a WWII era 520 (which I have zero use for) in a weak moment.
I always liked the look of these and this is a real nice example. Given it's vintage and a few of the previous owner's things left behind I'd guess that it had participated in some manner to the war effort, something that also appealed to me. Soon after buying and the realization that it's small shallow drawers have no practical use here I decided to sell it. Having second thoughts now.

 

[Wamsutta]

I should've got one of these before they got outrageously expensive.

20" 2-Drawer Portable Tool Chest - Kennedy Manufacturing

20" 2-Drawer Portable Tool Chest All Sales Final, No Returns

buykennedy.com

 

[rust in the eye]

I should've got one of these before they got outrageously expensive.

20" 2-Drawer Portable Tool Chest - Kennedy Manufacturing

20" 2-Drawer Portable Tool Chest All Sales Final, No Returns

buykennedy.com

Yeah, that's stupid money. I'm having less sympathy for the good folks at Kennedy after seeing the price of this.

 

[southalabama]

CNC operators don’t need machinists boxes

 

[zendriver]

Yeah, that's stupid money. I'm having less sympathy for the good folks at Kennedy after seeing the price of this.

It’s American made, by Americans.

How much should it cost?

 

[INSP380]

I had a very long and pleasant talk with customer service last year when they announced it. They just can’t compete with the import boxes and people new to the trades don’t have the desire or need for the signature chests anymore. Very sad to see. I own quite a few and am still looking for more. They are built to last and they do survive the decades of use.

Steve

 

[DaveAndStuff]

if you are ok with a used box they are easily available on FB Marketplace in my area. A lot of us older machinists are retiring and selling off their tools and boxes. I have a machining room in my home shop and am seeing the machinist chests as low as $50-200. I gave my son my 7 drawer and bought an 11 drawer for $75 to condense some tool storage after I retired and brought things home.

I might pick a used one up in July when I visit the US.

I saw a new one selling for over $1,900.

 

[CHI_Tool&Die]

Sad to see this day, but maybe not for Kennedy.

The 520, 526 were designed as cheap, sheet metal versions of gerstners etc. Wrinkle brown was supposed to be sympathetic with darkened oak etc boxes prevalent in the beginning of the 20th C. Drawer layouts copied earlier wooden boxes which were designed to store and protect precision tools, needed by every machinist.

With the advent of CNC, modern machinists, I believe, don‘t need, use, own (or even know about) the tools these boxes were designed to store. Even inspection is pretty much a CNC process now or digital caliper based.

I’ve watched probably every machinists’ toolbox tour on YouTube. Old boxes typically have the near valueless things that accumulate over a long career, tiny end mills & burrs, Sucrets boxes of worn taps, and drawers of HSS lathe tools. This isn’t how they were during their early career however.

Advice (from Ox tools) is to have a tape measure, digital caliper, allen keys, a hammer and heavy work gloves. Is that what machining has come to? Material handling? Programming? Rough stock checks? I think the answer is yes.

Kennedy chests have been a fixture in every machine shop I’ve been to (many). But I’ve seen them slowly give way to auto mechanic boxes.

Manual machines and the skills needed to use them are a dying skill set, in my mind, not unlike woodworking with hand tools. I think it’s possible some day Kennedy chests and the tools they were designed to hold will be collectible. Until then, manual machinists‘ tools are are nearly valueless. Like old woodworking tools, many owners sellers don’t know what they are let alone how they were used.

Hope @CHI_Tool&Die will respond with his thoughts.

Oh, and to be clear about my first sentence, I have a lot of Kennedys built across a fairly broad timespan. Their quality isn’t impressive. They are so so boxes in my opinion. They are special only in their configurations/drawer layouts.

Modern CNC machining is kind of messed up because there is so much overlap with positions. Some machinists are really just glorified operators and they can get by with the bare minimum regarding tools, like gloves, a digital caliper, and a mic. Other machinist take on responsibilities well outside of machining and have to have a whole box full of tools from hand tools to precision measuring stuff. I’ve even interviewed at a shop that required the machinists to provide their own cutting end mills, drills, and taps.

Add to that, you have different work environments require different load outs. Indy shops and mom-and-pops will almost always require the machinist to bring their own tools. The really large corporate shops will have tool cribs that loan out any and every tool you could want. There is a whole lot of shops that fall in between where measuring tools will be company provided so calibration can be guaranteed but hand tools will be on the machinist. Of course, if your shop is practicing lean/5S manufacturing or is ISO then that also changes things. Then, you run into box/space requirements. Some places will have limits to the size of the toolbox you can have. Others just will not give you the space for one.

Generally speaking, I used to tell the kids at trade schools and our new hires to avoid buying anything other than a super basic machinist kit that Mitutoyo and Starrett sell which usually has a 6” caliper, a 6” rule and a 0-1” mic in a case. It covers all your bases until you can see what the shop you’re at actually requires. Then move over to tools that are multifunctional (think plier wrench or 6 in 1 screwdriver.

I’m the only guy at work with a machinist chest. Everyone else has a roller cabinet (my machinist chest sits on top of mine). There is no table space so if it isn’t on wheels it won’t be allowed.

CNC operators don’t need machinists boxes

Depends on the work and the shop. Some CNC guys are really just laborers. They come in, push a button and do a spot check every so many dozens, hundreds, or thousands of parts. Other guys will have to do set-ups, maintenance, and prove-outs.

 

[Wamsutta]

Yeah, that's stupid money. I'm having less sympathy for the good folks at Kennedy after seeing the price of this.

https://www.dkhardware.com/kennedy-220b-portable-tool-chests-20-1-8-in-x-8-5-8-in-x-9-3-4-in-1293-cu-in-brown-product-8294532.html

 

[DocsMachine]

Advice (from Ox tools) is to have a tape measure, digital caliper, allen keys, a hammer and heavy work gloves. Is that what machining has come to? Material handling? Programming? Rough stock checks? I think the answer is yes.

-My CNC tool set is a Mitutoyo digital 6" caliper, two Starrett bore gauges (1/2" to 1") a set of allen-drive T-handles, a small selection of Torx wrenches for the inserts, a deburring knife, and a fine file.

Neither the turning center nor the mill need a chest like that to store the cutters, and I rarely use a proper micrometer- most of my parts are fine at +/- .001".

I do have a chest like that- mine's actually a JC Penny, believe it or not- but all I really use it for is 6" scales, the rest of the bore gauges, my now-never-used drill grinding gage, some almost-never-used adjustable parallels, and my small selection of left-hand drills and endmills.

Doc.

 

[DocsMachine]

Oh, and I have what is probably a small Gerstner- wood, likely 60-70 years old at this point, but 80 isn't out of the question. Still has all the tools the original owner had in it, and as I understand it, that old timer retired in the 70s or early 80s.

And there's not a single thing in there I need. The above description of the Sucrets box is spot on, except instead of old taps, it's old hardened dowel pins. There's a 0-1" and a 1-2" mic, antique Starretts, and another adjustable parallel, but the rest is just old taps, miscellaneous unidentifiable machined bits, too-short chunks of HSS and a few other things that me of thirty years ago would have fawned over, but that me today just sees as neat, but clearly bits of a bygone time.

Doc.

 

[DaveAndStuff]

Oh, and I have what is probably a small Gerstner- wood, likely 60-70 years old at this point, but 80 isn't out of the question. Still has all the tools the original owner had in it, and as I understand it, that old timer retired in the 70s or early 80s.

And there's not a single thing in there I need. The above description of the Sucrets box is spot on, except instead of old taps, it's old hardened dowel pins. There's a 0-1" and a 1-2" mic, antique Starretts, and another adjustable parallel, but the rest is just old taps, miscellaneous unidentifiable machined bits, too-short chunks of HSS and a few other things that me of thirty years ago would have fawned over, but that me today just sees as neat, but clearly bits of a bygone time.

Doc.

Or what my dad would call "box-stuffers"

 

[MushCreek]

Who needs a Kennedy when you can pick up a new Gerstner for a mere 2 grand? I paid $225 for mine 26 years ago. TBH, it's never been all that practical, and I spent much of my career as a manual tool maker.

 

[ecotec]

Who needs a Kennedy when you can pick up a new Gerstner for a mere 2 grand? I paid $225 for mine 26 years ago. TBH, it's never been all that practical, and I spent much of my career as a manual tool maker.

I would agree that Kennedy boxes, particularly the middle and top boxes, are not practical.

I have two journeyman top boxes and two middle boxes.

Full depth top boxes and middle boxes would serve the spots that they are in better. They take up the same spot with half the drawer space.

They are ideal for very shallow (front to back) work spaces. Use them on long work benches under upper cabinets allows you to have more storage with less loss of bench worktop.

 

[AEAdam]

I do hand layouts. It’s often the way I design/prototype. So I blue up parts, use my surface gages for actual surface gage work (scribing, not just as indicator bases) in conjunction with my surface plates. I use hss and carbide scribes, various squares, bevels, the protractor heads on combination squares, rulers, then *****, center punch or transfer punch hole centers.

I prefer my old school depth gage for a lot of layout work. I also use my tiny diemakers' double squares. It's good to have more than one for repeated measurements/layout work. Of course, depending on the size of part I have larger versions of all this, 6 and 8” calipers, many sizes of squares, etc.

I'm between metal lathes at the moment, but sometimes turn stuff on my mill. I have beautiful round armed spring calipers (and dividers) I use to check diameters, bores, features in a range of sizes. These look like tools from a bygone era, but are really fast accurate ways to check work on a lathe, even (especially) while turning.

Then there’s all the inspection and measuring tools that I advise are the first tools home shop machinists need, just so they know what they have. So that’s the afore mentioned surface plate(s), master squares, I have a granite square, granite parallels, super good 123 inspection” blocks", then gage blocks. I need a set of gage pins. Then mics in a range of sizes (I have 0-6"), a dizzying array of indicators and their holders, rulers, hole gauges, feeler gages, thread pitch gages, taper gages etc etc.

The Kennedy 520s and 526 boxes were made to store all the hand layout stuff. I'd call this "basic machinist's tools" and I personally think every machinist should know what these tools are, know how to use them, and I think hobby machinists should have all this stuff. And it's cheap to buy second hand. This is the stuff that was in Grandpa's box that was stolen, sold, given away and has left the box only with the random lathe bits.

In addition to these tools are what I would call machinists' "tooling". That list includes (in my mind) tool and work holding fixtures, like drill bits, cutters, taps, sometimes dies, speciality collets, stuff like boring heads & bars, fly cutters, I'd put center finders and edge finders in this pile. Not sure where they belong, but hones, scrapers, de-burring tools I keep with my cutters.

For work holding, manual machinists used a variety of setup tools and a lot of creativity. 123, 456 blocks, vee blocks, parallel clamps, edge clamps), parallels & adjustable parallels. dowels, the ever present copper wire and cigarette rolling papers (for uses only machinists understand).

You can see why machinists might need more than 1 Kennedy box.

Note: The list above doesn’t include the hand tools a machinist needs every day. The base rollers are where machinists might store their wrench and allen wrench sets, screwdrivers, pliers, hammers, punches, drifts, files, hack saw, scrap materials etc.

These aren't recent pics and obviously not my Kennedy boxes but it will hopefully give everyone an idea of the tools Machinists tool boxes were designed to store. These tools aren't special or unique. They would have been pretty typical 50 yrs ago. And while I've polished some, these tools aren't new and weren't expensive:


One reason for tiny layout tools is that I sometimes am doing layout work on workpieces already in the mill vise, possibly already squared up/worked. You can see my depth gage on the left which I really like using. It retains a tiny bit of the original "salt bluing" which produces a psychedelic multi-color pattern that is a corrosion inhibitor. That's a "junior" combination square set which uniquely can interchange its blades with the 4" double square. The normal 6" combination square cannot. That gives me a little more flexibility.


Just a few of my many spring calipers, hole gages, mic standards, then feelers.


Upper right is a Hermann Schmidt grind vise. Below that are a few of my many test indicators. Top center are surface gages. A set of Starrett "inspection" blocks are below them. Top left is a Schmidt angle block and 2 pairs of 123 blocks. Below that are Starrett Vee blocks then obviously sockets. (Hermann Schmidt stuff is really special.)


Including this pic just for you to look at what tap and die handles used to look like. The die handles are from Greenfield Tap & Die, Greenfield Mass and are probably 75 yrs old. These were made by people who really gave a **** about their work, took pride in making fine tools for people who would use these tools professionally. I touch up the bluing using cold blues to keep this sort of stuff looking like this (including the thread pitch gage screws).

A lot of these tools can be found really cheap and often pretty corroded. But this is what they would have looked like in their day and when well cared for. I find stuff like this inspiring. It sets the standard that I strive for in my own machine work. Elegance, superb surface finishes, & beautiful functionality.

 

[dr_clyde]

Wow. I'm kinda surprised by this, to be honest. Given their ubiquity and brand recognition, I would have figured Kennedy would have continued to make these for as long as they were in business. Every shop I've ever been in has had some Kennedy wrinkle brown machinist boxes. If you say "machinist toolbox" the brown Kennedy with the small drawers is what immediately comes to mind for most guys I'd imagine.

I'm glad I have mine that I inherited from my dad. I use them and find them to be very good at what they were designed for, which is holding all the small, fiddly tools that a machinist uses.

Sad news.

 

[AEAdam]

Wow. I'm kinda surprised by this, to be honest. Given their ubiquity and brand recognition, I would have figured Kennedy would have continued to make these for as long as they were in business. Every shop I've ever been in has had some Kennedy wrinkle brown machinist boxes. If you say "machinist toolbox" the brown Kennedy with the small drawers is what immediately comes to mind for most guys I'd imagine.

I'm glad I have mine that I inherited from my dad. I use them and find them to be very good at what they were designed for, which is holding all the small, fiddly tools that a machinist uses.

Sad news.

Were they $800? The one I wanted was the 3611, which was deeper (no front?) and had aluminum pulls that better matched the base units.

But again, the basic design was developed to replicate earlier wooden boxes designed to sit atop factory supplied work benches for early 20th c facilities. Gerstners still include mirrors, which were used by machinists to clean their faces before leaving for the day because there was no mens' rooms with wall length mirrors.

 

[CHI_Tool&Die]

Were they $800? The one I wanted was the 3611, which was deeper (no front?) and had aluminum pulls that better matched the base units.

But again, the basic design was developed to replicate earlier wooden boxes designed to sit atop factory supplied work benches for early 20th c facilities. Gerstners still include mirrors, which were used by machinists to clean their faces before leaving for the day because there was no mens' rooms with wall length mirrors.

I have a 3611. Great box due to the extra depth. I think I paid $500 just before Covid.

 

[Drunkonunleaded]

Off-topic but related: What was the purpose of the large "Whisky Bottle" drawer on these boxes?

 

[MiteyF]

I always saw people put the Machinist Bible in there.

 

[ecotec]

I always saw people put the Machinist Bible in there.

Yes, it is made for the Machinist’s Handbook.

I have one from the era my house (1955) is from and a few others.

 

[Kscardsfan]

Shame, but I guess it's not surprising given how few machinists are entering the work force now with the advent of CNC etc.

 

[dr_clyde]

Were they $800? The one I wanted was the 3611, which was deeper (no front?) and had aluminum pulls that better matched the base units.

But again, the basic design was developed to replicate earlier wooden boxes designed to sit atop factory supplied work benches for early 20th c facilities. Gerstners still include mirrors, which were used by machinists to clean their faces before leaving for the day because there was no mens' rooms with wall length mirrors.

I have no idea what they cost, as I inherited them. My dad bought the box and riser new in the 80's, so I highly doubt they were $800, or whatever the cost would have been factoring in inflation. But that said, I'm sure I would have bought the same setup I have now, as it works very well.

I have never wanted or needed a mirror on my box, as every shop I have worked at had bathrooms and wash sinks with mirrors.

I wonder how much this decision is resulting from Cornwell tool's recent acquisition of Kennedy. Perhaps they intend to make a new line of boxes targeted toward machinists/toolmakers.

 

[MiteyF]

Shame, but I guess it's not surprising given how few machinists are entering the work force now with the advent of CNC etc.

Which is why the "dial indicator and hand wheel" guys make more money than ever. A CNC can't do everything!

 

[Lassen Forge]

The problem is with modern CNC technology and everything cd/cam and downloadable, no one wants to learn the basics of HOW to do what we had to learn to do in school... so all the old tooling we relied on are lost to the "modern generation" and if they had to go back to settings up machinery and doing a job by hand??? Fergeddaboudit. I;m not sure anyone could even teach them how to do it.

 

[liliysdad]

The problem is with modern CNC technology and everything cd/cam and downloadable, no one wants to learn the basics of HOW to do what we had to learn to do in school... so all the old tooling we relied on are lost to the "modern generation" and if they had to go back to settings up machinery and doing a job by hand??? Fergeddaboudit. I;m not sure anyone could even teach them how to do it.

My son is a junior in high school, and he’s in CNC machining class at the Tech Center. The first year of the course is strictly manual machining , they don’t even get to look at a CNC machine until they pass all the manual mill and lathe benchmarks the first year.


Funny enough…upon graduation they a US General box full of Starret and Haas measuring tools.

 

[MiteyF]

As silly as that sounds, I sold all but my 11 drawer and cantilever Kennedy boxes (IE, rolling cabinets) because they're just not very good boxes for the money. My Craftsman, US General, and other boxes are much better rollers, for much less coin.

 

[WildBill]

Off-topic but related: What was the purpose of the large "Whisky Bottle" drawer on these boxes?

My buddy keeps snacks in his.

 

[WildBill]

if you are ok with a used box they are easily available on FB Marketplace in my area. A lot of us older machinists are retiring and selling off their tools and boxes. I have a machining room in my home shop and am seeing the machinist chests as low as $50-200. I gave my son my 7 drawer and bought an 11 drawer for $75 to condense some tool storage after I retired and brought things home.

That's a crazy good deal.