Knife making steels

[MichaelBikel]

What steel would you guys recommend to someone who wants to build a knife?
I don't want to spend TOO much money but I am also looking to make something that will last as long as I take care of it. I am also looking for something that has some rust resistance. What do you guys think??

 

[Stuey]

Make one out of a file?

Steel is half the equation, a good heat treat the other.

 

[astroracer]

Many knife makers use leaf springs. Broken ones are cheap at the junk yard.

 

[dkroth]

http://greenvalleyforge.com/

This guy who's been making knives for years says:

52-100
This steel holds a sharper edge longer, making it ideal for skinning or cooking.

51-60
This steel is tougher and withstands impact better. Ideal for boning, chopping, and more high impact uses.

 

[BuffettFan]

Definitely NOT an expert, so take this with a grain of sand, but the heat treatment is just as important as the raw material.
I've seen knives made from leaf springs, files, drive chains forged into a Damascus type of steel, you name it.
The carbon content of the steel is what enables hardening. Depending on the intent of the knife will determine what steel alloy you need to start with. Carbon is also what makes steel brittle, so you'll need to find the right balance for your particular knives. Heat treating and oil quenching does give some limited rust resistance as well.
Looking forward to seeing your creations!

 

[matt_i]

The 52100 is a bearing race steel.

I would personally use A2 since its easy to work with soft, you heat treat it with a torch, let it air cool, and can temper in a kitchen oven. Also stable since the quench process to freeze the microstructure (air cool) is a very gentle removal of heat, it doesn't invite distortion or warping.

To get the stainless steel property I think you have to use the 400 series, its not something I've worked with, I would guess the heat treatment is more exotic.

 

[jumbojak]

If you want rust resistance, get a piece of 440c stainless, grind it to shape and send it out for heat treatment.

 

[outlawz2004]

mower blades, hand files, leaf springs, coil springs, railroad spikes

 

[MoonRise]

Scrounged metal, or going out and buying something specifically to make a knife out of?

What specific knife and tasks are you trying to do here? Skinning knife, rough chopper, surgical tool, what? Are you looking for edge holding, or 'toughness', or what?

Rust resistance usually means using something more than a 'plain' carbon (1095, etc) or carbon alloy steel (4340, 5160, A2, W2, O1, etc).

At the 'lowest' level of rust resistance, you might look into something like D2. Nice steel, when heat treated right. It is usually considered 'semi' stainless, as it does not have quite enough chromium (12%) to be considered stainless steel (usual cut off point for a steel to be considered 'stainless' is more like 14%+).

Just how 'crazy' do you want to go with this knife project? Using BG42, or S90V?

There is no one-material-to-do-it-all. Choose among the trade-offs of price, availability, ease of machining, heat treatment, corrosion resistance, hardness, edge holding, toughness, etc.

 

[MichaelBikel]

Scrounged metal, or going out and buying something specifically to make a knife out of?

What specific knife and tasks are you trying to do here? Skinning knife, rough chopper, surgical tool, what? Are you looking for edge holding, or 'toughness', or what?

Rust resistance usually means using something more than a 'plain' carbon (1095, etc) or carbon alloy steel (4340, 5160, A2, W2, O1, etc).

At the 'lowest' level of rust resistance, you might look into something like D2. Nice steel, when heat treated right. It is usually considered 'semi' stainless, as it does not have quite enough chromium (12%) to be considered stainless steel (usual cut off point for a steel to be considered 'stainless' is more like 14%+).

Just how 'crazy' do you want to go with this knife project? Using BG42, or S90V?

There is no one-material-to-do-it-all. Choose among the trade-offs of price, availability, ease of machining, heat treatment, corrosion resistance, hardness, edge holding, toughness, etc.

Thank you to everyone for your response. I continued to do some searching and began to see that the more complex the material, the more complex the heat treat and so on. I have blanked a few from wrenches but I was hoping to try for something stainless, I guess that would really be less likely for me.

To give some insight into what I am looking to make: I guess at this point I just want something that won't be too hard to work with, has good edge retention, and something I could potentially beat on. Not being too difficult to sharpen would be a bonus. This would be more of a bushcraft knife, possibly used for splitting wood, debarking, cutting line/rope, use with fire steel, making tent pegs, pretty general stuff.

 

[555]

You might consider getting a copy of Wayne Goddard's $50 Knife Shop book.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0896892956/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[PugetDude]

A2 is a great knife steel. D2 is better, IMO if you can find it.

A2 is tougher but harder to sharpen.

D2 is slightly more brittle than A2 (no significant difference for a knife, but it does matter if you making industrial shear blades for cutting steel) but is much easier to sharpen.

Both take and hold an edge well.

 

[Stuey]

I have A2 woodworking tool blades, but I don't think I've used an A2 knife.

Esee Izula knives are made from 1095, and with a little care they hold up quite well.

D2 is used in some knives, but doesn't seem be as popular as basic and intermediate SS alloys.

 

[MichaelBikel]

So I bought a torch drilled through a cinder block that i closed up and tried hammering out a file. Didn't work out so great as after about 20-30 minutes it split in half, not sure what exactly went wrong but you could call it a learning experience. I bought a peice of steel that I am going to grind out but I am going to try forging from another file again at some point, just need to come up with a proper anvil as I cracked my vise (whoops)

 

[dogdog]

Most of the files / hacksaw blades / spring steel, if you were to use them, you have to anneal them first....


If you are referring to your cinder block that split.... I think they are not made for high temp applications.... you can look up "Coffee Can Forge" in youtube using coffee can , perlite, and sodium silicate..... I think he also have a video on how to made your own sodium silicate.... simple to made. For larger forge I think some one here have made it out of portable air tank and kao wool, fire bricks .... pretty sure you can use large batches of perlite and sodium silicate.

 

[gungatim]

I've used circular saw blades, mower blades, and files. by far, the easiest to use and get started with is circular saw blades. cut to shape, sharpen, heat treat, buff and pretty much done.

files are much more work, mower blades a little less...

Do you have a forge?

 

[flyingblind]

I buy steel from newjerseysteelbaron and once finished I have dholder heat treat it. But I have made some from O1 tool, W2, D2, Files, Springs, Lots of 30" circular saw blades, Band saw blades and re-purposed cleavers. Not used any stainless specifically, just high polish well oiled steel.. It can be an addictive hobby.. I started with a file as my first, a giant mill *******.

 

[PugetDude]

So I bought a torch drilled through a cinder block that i closed up and tried hammering out a file. Didn't work out so great as after about 20-30 minutes it split in half, not sure what exactly went wrong but you could call it a learning experience. I bought a peice of steel that I am going to grind out but I am going to try forging from another file again at some point, just need to come up with a proper anvil as I cracked my vise (whoops)

A vise is not an anvil. Find a chunk of railroad rail and spend the difference between it and a "real anvil" on a proper forge.... you can cut and shape the rail to make a nice knife anvil. Being able to control the heat in your work is more important than what you beat it on.
Good luck!

 

[scooternut]

My research taught me that a large number of makers recommend 1084 as it is the most forgiving when doing a "backyard" heat treat. That is what I have been using exclusively.

If you are going to pay a heat treater, then consult with them about steels. If you are doing this yourself, then dont waste your time with scrap, use a known steel.

 

[dr_clyde]

I made some kitchen knives from 154CM in college. It's a modified stainless made by Crucible Steel. Grinds nice, pretty easy to work with. It has a really thick mill scale that will need to be ground completely off before heat treat or it will cause problems.

I did the heat treat myself, using lab grade furnaces at the school. They turned out ok, they were my first knives so I didn't expect perfection. I've been meaning to make some more knives recently but I haven't had much time.

If I didn't have access to the school's furnaces, I'd have sent the blades out for heat treat. Unless you have a good knowledge of metallurgy, heat treating is a science and art best left to the professionals. It blows when you hear the "tink" of the blade cracking after a bad quench.

 

[PT Doc]

Leaf springs and saw blades and lawn mower blades with repost in some type of pointy knife shaped object. If you want to make a knife and have it heat treated so that it will hold an edge and last then do not use the above mentioned materials. A good piece of steel will cost $20.

Bladeforums.com is a great resource but don't just post that you went to make a knife. There are stickies on the forum and read those first. Stacey and the Count will eat you for lunch if you don't read that first.

 

[MichaelBikel]

Thanks guys. Long story short, a while back I attempted to shape a blade from my grandpas old wrench and got frustrated halfway through. I got the nerve to try it again, so I changed the design and made a grinding jig to work with a file. I will be attempting the grind again soon, and if that goes well, also the heat treat.

I did also order some 01 tool steel in case I feel like going for another one. I see a lot of good answers in regards to which steel to use, I may try a few different things at some point.

My next question is probably best saved for blade forums, but some of those members are a bit touchy about people posting questions. Anyway, I saw a video of the fellow who runs Jacklore knives, and he was mentioning how he uses some kind of math (trig or calc or something) to figure out his grind or bevel. I am just wondering, does anyone else do this? Is it possible to just eye my grind, or should I stick to some range of degree? I feel like this is where lack of practice is really going to affect the structure and function of the blade.

Sorry for all the questions guys, I do plan on getting a book on the subject eventually, I just have not gotten around to it.

Thanks all

-M

 

[road]

following will update my thoughts on this tonight

 

[Billythekid1]

You might consider getting a copy of Wayne Goddard's $50 Knife Shop book.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0896892956/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Great book you'll love it actually anyone on this site will love it

 

[flyingblind]

Great book you'll love it actually anyone on this site will love it

I started with this book in y2k
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0615116590/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[Matt Matt]

-Any carburized metal that is in the family of mild steel won't last very long unless of course you be carbonize it after grinding
-Most spring steel's or files are pretty good for holding a decent edge. They have been hardened through, but grinding can aneal them. Too much heat is bad when grinding.
-Stainless steel is always a good choice, but it is usually too soft and needs constant resharpening.
-01 is fairly decent, can be he treated in your backyard, and holds a very keen edge.
-A2, is a little bit better then 01, and will hold a sharp edge better, but higher temperatures and slaw or quenching is required.

If you want to spend some money, D2, M2 and HSS a pretty good choices.

Using old HSS planer knives are pretty good.