Large 2- car plus pole barn project

[K-Jet]

In order to keep everything together in one place, let me reintroduce my circumstances. We’ve just moved into a house in a new state after 23 years living overseas. The house that found us has a 1038 square foot attached 2-car, 2-door garage with a 10 foot ceiling, and also a 1029 square foot pole barn. The ideal end state is a nice place to keep tools, cars, and a two-post lift.

So step one will be to figure out what can be done with the pole barn. It's a metal skin with wood framing, about 10 feet tall at the corners and 14 feet at the peak. Because it was set up for horses, it has a loft and what I think are a lot of extra poles (as seen in the pictures) that make the space difficult to use. The loft beams are 2x10s with a maximum span of 12 feet. Do they need further support along those 12 feet, or can all those 4x4s, garden logs, etc. come out?

If they do come out, I have essentially three 12 x 18 bays at right angles to the entry door (bottom left of diagram) along with a 10 x 36 interior "driveway." How difficult would it be to get cars in and out of these spaces?

Martin

 

[K-Jet]

The other side of the project is the attached garage. I originally thought I could make space for a lift in the barn, but with all the polesthe space is too tight, the barn is un-insulated, and I would spend most of my time walking back and forth to get tools from the garage.

Fortunately, I think the attached garage is large enough to serve my purposes. It has a ten foot ceiling, tall enough for a MaxJax or Bendpak GP7 LE (other alternatives?) and I think it is deep enough that I won't have to park my daily between the posts and get out. I'd love some feedback from anyone with experience with that question.



I own old German cars, so probably the longest vehicle I'll have to deal with is sixteen feet long (W108) and < 4000 pounds (W124 wagon). What about putting the lift pads (no lift yet!) in the lower bay (as shown on the diagram) and about fifteen feet in from the door?

Martin

 

[AC-WC]

Pole barn-You're better off adding at least 1 overhead door and then parking 2 deep. You will likely not have enough turning radius to drive the vehicles into their space. I wouldn't chance it with my cars.
You're probably OK to remove the 'loft' supports but should really get a qualified engineer or really good contractor to advise.

I'm biased on lifts but take a look at the Triumph C7000. Lifts higher, more weight than the maxjax and is cheaper.

If you do decide to renovate the pole barn save that lumber! It's not cheap anymore. You will spend a ton to insulate it. I'm spending way too much on the interior of garage and it's about 24X27.

The garage is going to be much less expensive to add a lift. It looks like you have enough room for the post in 1 bay without it creeping into the 2nd bay. Definitely use the bottom bay. You don't want to mess with a car on a lift going in and out of the laundry/bath. You may have to cut the floor and do pads for the columns. Just depends on the floor thickness/rebar. Just did mine 2 yrs ago so if you have more questions just ask.

 

[K-Jet]

Definitely hear you on the lumber. My wife has some ideas on where it could be profitably used.

Regarding opening up the barn, absent any voices of experience I may have to just make some paper cars to scale and see how tightly they fit around those corners. Adding another door means removing a large tree, expanding the driveway, and regrading the front of the building.

 

[K-Jet]

Step 1 is complete- removal of the belt-driven door opener and installation of the jackshaft opener, reprogramming of the remotes, and preparation to install the removed opener in the barn.



The jackshaft opener took about ¼ the effort that a standard opener takes to install. Very easy and straightforward.

 

[K-Jet]

Rumination over the pole barn continues. I did make a scale drawing of barn and cars and tried to get a feel for how uncomfortably tight driving in and turning would be (and then backing out again, of course).

Empty


Doable in a small car, but not entirely comfortable.


Doable in a larger car, but having to back out would definitely be a disincentive to using the car.


Full up. Once in, there is plenty of space. No, I don't own all of these cars. Not yet.



So now I'm considering the suggestion to add an overhead door to the right side of the barn. By my calculation, there should be about 12 feet to the right of the personnel door. And better to do the maneuvering outdoors, right? There's that pesky oak tree just outside....

That reduces barn parking from 5 to 4, but leaves room for other storage down the middle of the space and greatly reduces required maneuvering.




Thoughts? Ideas? Better still, corrections?

 

[AC-WC]

I hear you about the oak tree and that ones a decent size. You'll have to get a backhoe to get the stump out even if you do gravel short term. Is it feasible to put the other door on the back and opposite side? Or is extending the gravel to the back more than you want to spend?

 

[CraigStu]

Could you put another 10ft door so it's left side is where the left side of the man door is now? Maybe a 12ft door? Do some grading to get the ground down to floor level on the outside and throw some gravel for now. You could easily park left side and middle and w/ a 12ft door maybe get a car (the 911 is smallest) to the right also. I may be off on my perception but I don't see the tree as that big a problem.

 

[K-Jet]

]I spent the last several weeks investigating the idea of a right-side entry with sliding doors at the side, but the rules connected to the pipeline right-of-way on that side of the barn makes it impossible. So this is a no.

So easiest would be a double-wide door to replace the single-wide door and the man door. This makes space for two large cars in the side bay and two very small cars (a 911 and a Berlina, just to pick two at random) in the middle bay. Tight, but functional, affordable, and executable in a reasonable amount of time.

Going for a garage door on the right side (leaving the middle bay open) would give a wider bay for cars, but would require removing the oak tree, then re-grading and paving that floor.

 

[K-Jet]

So talk to me about full-rise scissor lifts versus two-post lifts. I said two-post above, but as I think about it a two-post lift in the attached garage is an invitation to trips, scratches, and dents. While I do have good balance, I tend to be clumsy and walking around posts and lifting arms while I do all the other things I do in the garage besides lift cars seems really tiresome.

Any experience with full-rise scissor lifts?

Bend-Pak versus Atlas versus... who?

Flush-mount versus floor mount? Flush mount certainly seems nicer, but what should that cost?

 

[AC-WC]

I have never used a scissor lift. Mainly 2 posts at school or a mechanic friends shop, now my own.
Pluses-you can just drive over the scissor without adjusting anything, even the length. Similar to the 4 post. It pick ups at the rocker.
Easily pull a transmission, suspension, exhaust, rotate tires/brakework.
Minus-You will not likely be able to park another vehicle (assuming you have the ceiling height) underneath the scissor lift. You will not be able to do rocker work on the body.

Too many arguments on this platform for 'brands'. I let my budget and expected quality make my decision. There a several reputable dealers. If you need suggestions just let us know.

You can trip on any lift...

I looked at full rise lifts but the initial cost was prohibitive for me. Minimum $5k up to $10k+ for bendpak. You can make a 'floor' mount into a flush just by cutting the concrete and making a 'pocket' for it. Some designs would be easier to do than others. It really depends on the lift. The one thing I would do different for my 2 post is make a pocket in the concrete for the hydraulic lines. I have the option to hang them overhead like a standard open floor 2 post but for now they are still lying on the floor.